Jammu And Kasmir

06-01-2005, 05:23 AM

QUOTEDon't drop guard in Kargil 
Ashok K Mehta
Last week, I revisited Kargil and Leh in Ladakh even as the defence secretaries of India and Pakistan met at Islamabad for the second round of talks on Siachen since the resumption of the composite dialogue in 2004. No breakthrough has been reported.

From Dras, looking at the sheer domination of Tololing, Tiger Hill and Point 5875 (Batra Hill), I marvelled at the stunning feat of our Infantry soldiers who recaptured these hilltops six years ago. I was also struck by the fact that despite four wars, several skirmishes and a year-long military confrontation, we have been unable to undo Pakistani intrusions such as at Dalunang in 1988 and the nibbling over the years in the Dras sector. Our non-action emboldened Pakistan to do a Kargil.

A look at the alignment of NH 1A, the lifeline from Srinagar to Leh across Zojila will show its precarious proximity and parallel alignment to the LoC from Dras to the Kargil town. Yet, nothing was done to remove Pakistan's all-weather domination by observation and fire across several stretches of this road. Nor was any alternative route operationalised (it was conceptualised, though) because Kargil and Leh sectors were not the targets of the proxy war.

Pakistani military analysts admit Kargil was a consummate blunder. But historically India's track record in this sector has not been impressive either. The loss of 516 soldiers and airmen in vacating the aggressors from Kargil could have been minimised with more robust use of IAF as demonstrated during the elimination of Pakistan's Lunda post at Point 3260 (Lunda post) during Operation Parakram. Technology, more than manpower, should have won the war and settled other residual scores.

In the 1947-48 war, for example, we left the famous Point 13620 towering over Kargil town in Pakistani possession. When Pakistan ignited the Rann of Kutch in April 1965, the Army fought and seized Point 13620, a thorn in the side ever since. Unfortunately, it had to be vacated after the British brokered a ceasefire. During the 1965 war that followed, point 13620 was retaken. Tragically, along with Haji Pir, it had to be returned to Pakistan at Tashkent. But Point 13620 was captured a third time in 1971, this time for keeps. Last week it stood out on the Kargil skyline despite its weight of snow.

The anomalies of the LoC in Dras sector-which provide a free view to Pakistan on our side-could have been rectified during Kargil and/or Operation Parakram in 1999 and 2002. But we excel in missing opportunities. Till the November 2003 ceasefire, the Dras and Kargil towns were under daily shelling. Life was completely disrupted, schools dislocated as civilians constructed bunkers worth Rs 8,000 a piece from funds provided by Srinagar. Now they are breathing normally even at those dizzy heights. But peace is temporary as boards reading "you are under or out of enemy observation" or "you are safe now" dot the dozen plus stretches of road seen by Pakistan artillery observers.

Before the 1999 Kargil trauma, one Infantry brigade group of 4 to 5 battalions was responsible for the nearly 180 km LoC from Zojila to Chorbatla. Post Kargil, a Mountain Division took charge. The number of combat troops, logistics force and civilians that support the Siachenised Kargil sector has more than trebled. Of the nearly 250 posts and bases, more than half are cut off in winter for periods from five to seven months. At places, even a helicopter cannot make it. Compared to Siachen, these posts are still unstable and therefore more difficult to sustain.

The Kirloskar or Honda generator at each post is deified and coveted as no other collective valuable on the post. At temperatures of minus 40 degrees centigrade, the connecting rod of the generator frequently snaps and so does life for the platoon of soldiers till it is revived. The EME Major at Dras, whose job it is to keep the machines revving even in 10 to 12 feet of snow told me: "It is so satisfying to repair something that is not working." He reflects the ethos and elan of the several thousand soldiers in the rear who ensure the few hundred on posts are alert, happy and uncomplaining.

But they have reason to complain. Those deployed on the posts in Kargil are not equated with their peers in Siachen inn terms of allowances and perks. These lads do a two-year tenure-two winters-in the wilderness, whereas Siachen time is limited to three months, with another three months for induction and de-induction. There is a strong case for equating certain Kargil sector locations with Siachen. It will provide some cheer to many in the armies across the LoC that Siachen is still considered the test bed of manhood and virility.

The 430-km road from Zojila to Leh is lined with more memorials to soldiers than trees for comfort. Many of these soldiers from the Border Roads Organisation, assisted by thousands of Nepali and Bihari labour with Sherpa dogs, have kept the highway open all these years. Unfortunately, the road is still single-lane and avalanche-prone. The Kargil division is on a big exercise planting trees, which, once having taken root, will make many of the danger signs attributable to the enemy, redundant. The BRO must also be recognised for the hundreds of wise and amusing highway signs for avoiding accidents. "It is better to be Mr Late than Late Mr"; "Drive on engine power, not rum power", etc.

The Dras Saviours Brigade does a presentation on the Kargil war. It is the stuff that must be shown to civilians passing through the area. Including the four epic battles of Tololing, Tiger Hill, Point 4875 and Jubbar Heights, the Army and the Air Force won four PVCs, 6 MVCs and 27 VrCs among numerous lesser awards, making Kargil the highest per capita recipient of gallantry awards ever. The previous record for bravery gongs was held by Bana Post (renamed from Qaid-e-Azam after its capture from Pakistan in 1986). The counter-attack of 1987, which was beaten back, too, earned many medals. The other claimants for distinction in gallantry awards are Point 13620 and OP Hill in Rajauri sector.

You have had it, in the Indian Army, if you fail to observe human rights. I discovered this rule in Kargil where I had gone to attend a workshop on human rights. Justice Shivraj Patil, a member of the National Human Rights Commission, who was the keynote speaker, was extremely impressed with the concern and sensitivity among soldiers for the need to conduct operations within norms of civilised behaviour and the law of the land. Some excellent case studies from the Srinagar valley were discussed. But Kargil and Leh are completely at peace since the ceasefire. There are no terrorists here, so no human rights violations are taking place.

But all that could change this summer. With the fencing on the LoC, north and south of Pir Panjal intact, it is through Dras and Kargil that infiltration may be tried, as in 1993-94. Reports of new terrorist camps in Skardu opposite Kargil indicate this possibility. But unlike in 1999, 8 Mountain Division is ready this time.

The benefits of Operation Sadbhavna-Army schools, women empowerment centres, medical posts-are enormous for the civilians. Except for the elements-the weather and the loneliness-this area is pacified. It is for this reason that the ongoing acts of extended deployment must stop. Neither side can win in Kargil or Siachen or anywhere militarily. Gen Pervez Musharraf has said that Siachen and Sir Creek are solvable problems. The buzz word is 'demilitarisation'.

From India's point of view, there are two issues in Siachen. Demarcation of AGPL and verification of demilitarised zone. Possibly, the third concern of the boundary beyond Point 9842 could be put on the back burner till a final settlement of J&K. Bereft of any strategic and geopolitical value, Siachen followed by Kargil must be selectively demilitarised. Both sides should agree to withdraw to mutually acceptable positions outside the weather-killing zone. Whatever the compulsions, we should not harden our position on Siachen. If Pakistan does not agree to our terms, we should offer to vacate Siachen on the condition that Pakistan deploys a Brigade there permanently. As Rangeen Ali, the owner of the famous Hotel Zojila in Kargil said: "It is senseless making more martyrs out of frostbite."

06-01-2005, 10:44 PM

Talk of self goal
GoI gives in to Hurri-rats <img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif' />
QUOTEDropping its stand that any travel by Hurriyat leaders beyond Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (PoK) would be contrary to the understanding between India and Pakistan, the Government has decided to let the Kashmiri separatist leaders make their own travel plans. 

Of course, any arm-chair analysts can spin it as to how 'chankain' it was of the GoI <!--emo&

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rolleyes.gif' />

06-08-2005, 10:41 PM

Army Major, terrorist killed in J&K gun battle

Naresh · (This post was last modified: 06-09-2005, 02:41 PM by Naresh.)

Bit old news but we seemed to have missed it :

I can understand a Pakistani spew all kinds of trash but this is the first time that an ex âFinanceâ Minister of Pakistan has accepted the fact that the State of Jammu & Kashmir Legally belonged to India and likewise, Pakistan had no legal rights to control what it called Azad Kashmir

Mubashir calls for âwin-winâ solution to Kashmir issue : By Iftikhar Gilani

NEW DELHI: Pakistanâs former finance minister Dr Mubashir Hassan called for working out a âwin-winâ solution to the complex Kashmir issue so that all relevant parties â India, Pakistan and the people of Jammu and Kashmir â are at an advantageous position.

Presenting his paper on âSettling the Kashmir Issueâ at the Observer Research Foundation, an Indian think-tank, before a gathering of Indian intellectuals including academics, former governors, diplomats and defence officials, Dr Hassan advocated giving as much autonomy as possible to the people of both Indian and Pakistani controlled Kashmir.

Many here believe that Dr Hassan reiterated what President General Pervez Musharraf had been saying â that a solution needed to be found that was a compromise to the stated positions of the two countries.

Dr Hasan said that although all of Jammu and Kashmir belonged âlegallyâ to India, in reality it had no control over some parts of the state. Likewise, Pakistan had no legal rights to control what it called Azad Kashmir. And Kashmiris wanted an independent state, which no country in the world was in favour of, Dr Hasan said.

In this scenario, Dr Hasan suggested giving Jammu and Kashmir as much autonomy as possible with India and Pakistan maintaining troops to protect borders and foreign policies and the rest would be taken care of by the Kashmiri people. They could have their own passport and currency too, he said.

Dr Hasan said he was advocating this kind of autonomy to troubled regions in Pakistan like Balochistan, Sindh and the North-West Frontier Province as well.

âWhy should the central forces, either in Pakistan or India, get involved in civil matters in different regions?â he asked. The people should manage their states, he said.

He said that Pakistan had no political interest in the movement in Kashmir initially, but later on some elements had given a religious colour to the movement, culminating in jihadis taking over it. He suggested strengthening the ongoing peace process by creating soft borders and removing restrictions on trade, travel, tourism and other areas. Though the audience expressed mixed reactions, Dr Hassan found strong supporters of his views in former foreign secretary Muchkund Dubey and former governor and Research and Analysis Wing (RAW) chief Girish Chandra Saxena. Others called for treading the path carefully to avoid any assault on the ongoing peace process.

Muchkund Dubey called for urgent steps to resolve the Kashmir issue. âNot only Pakistan, but even India is losing heavily because of Kashmir,â he said. He said Jammu and Kashmir should not be considered as any other state of India and instead be solved as a special case.

âThe solution should be acceptable to the people of Jammu and Kashmir and it should be a realistic solution,â he said.

Dubey said that because of the lingering issue, Indiaâs stature in the world community had gone down to the extent where no Indian could think of becoming the United Nations Secretary General or adorn any other high post in the world.

Former Jammu and Kashmir Governor GC Saxena said that Dr Hassanâs paper was a âcomprehensive, conceptual, timely and worthwhile presentation.â However, he said, there was a need to come up with a solution that was within the realistic parameters of both countries.

Saxena said deviation from the traditional position on Kashmir needed broader national consensus on the Indian side. âI am all for treating Kashmir as a special case. But, it will have a direct impact on other parts of the country, like separatist movements in Nagaland and Manipur,â he said. He appreciated Dr Hassanâs suggestions of providing sub-autonomies and matching democratic space on both sides of the Line of Control.

Another former governor of Jammu and Kashmir, Shri Jagmohan, emphasised on first creating the right atmosphere in the state. âOnce the terror of the gun is removed, the people will start speaking differently,â he said.

Jagmohan stressed on eliminating terrorism and re-orienting the thinking on Kashmir from the religious base to providing effective governance.

âIn the poor state of Jammu and Kashmir, people are not bothered much about religion. What they want is good governance and facilities for leading a decent life,â he said. He said there was a big difference between the religion and culture.

Cheers <img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/cheers.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='cheers.gif' />

**acharya** · 06-13-2005, 09:28 AM

Recently, a friend of mine received the letter below and some
pictures [link below]of Sharda Peeth from his Pakistani
friend.......thought you guys might be interested in seeing how our
[kashmiri] heritage is being protected.

Hi XXXXX

When I wrote to you 3-4 weeks ago, immediately after I set off from
UK
to Pakistan and then Azad Kashmir. It was a quick whistle-stop trip
of
2 weeks to see some relatives and take photos. Since I had made a
promise to you, I had to photograph Sharda even it was just plain
land; I had to keep my promise.

Although I had heard of Sharda, I had no idea where it was. Enquiries
revealed that it was in Muzaffarabd distt. but some 140km from
Muzaffarabad city. Along with some friends, I travelled to
Muzaffarabad and then onto Atthmuqam which is about 70km away. We
stayed there overnight and then hired a jeep to Sharda travelling
another 70 km on a partially metalled road.This part of the journey
was the most interesting. We travelled along the Neelum Valley and
along Neelum river which acts as the LOC. We could see AK settlements
and Pak army on this side and JK houses and Indian army across the
river. Until the recent cease-fire, visitors were not allowed in this
area as there was constant firing and shelling. Now it was quiet and
peaceful. Although the people are not allowed to cross the river/LOC
they can now live in peace and communicate with each other using
sign-language and shouting.

Anyway, we arrived in Sharda to be told that the Sharda temple was
inside Pak army barracks and permission had to be obtained to see it.
Apparently, the Pak army moved there a long time ago, taking over the
temple complex and the surrounding area for their barracks.The upside
of this was that the remains of the temple were being maintained and
protected by Pak army. Anyway, we got permission to see the temple
but
were not allowed to take photographs due to some law (I think it was
more to do with the current political climate etc). Anyway, we talked
to the commanding officer and he gave us permission for photography.
As you can imagine, my camera did not stop clicking for a good 10
minutes. The temple was very much in ruin but some of the walls,
stairs and court yard had been saved. I did not know too much history
about the place so was unable to relate places. Facing Sharda village
was a snow-capped mountain range called Narda which was housed a
shrine visited by people in days gone by. Also below the temple was
the area which was once the university. The university dating back
2-3000 years had been a seat of learning during Budhist, Hindu and
Muslim era. There is not much of it left now.I heard that the AK govt
announced that Pandits would be allowed to visit Sharda sometime in
the future. I also heard on the grapevine that a few Pandit folks had
already submitted applications to travel to AK on the peace bus and
visit Sharda.

I will try to sort out the photos and put them on the web this
weekend
for you to see. [below is the link to the pictures]

Regards.
XXX
http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/setlurbad...lbum?.dir=/e51b

**acharya** · 06-13-2005, 09:58 AM

Dear Shibli,

I'm not saying Urdu is an ugly language. I have nothing against it. But as Kashmiris we should use Kashmiri, just like the Germans use German, the french french and so on.

The medium of instruction in all the schools and colleges of Kashmir valley at least, from 1st to doctoral level should be Kashmiri. There's nothing wrong with people learning English or Urdu as a second language, but they must use Kashmiri in public affairs and not just in the home.

Why should Urdu be the medium of instruction? Why not Kashmiri? There may be many accents in the UK but everyone is taught using English. There's nothing wrong with having different accents or dialects. The days of Queen's English and the snobbery that it brought are over. No one gives a monkey's in Britain about your accent (unless it is South Indian). We Kashmiris, on the other hand, don't have the same degree of variation in accents. But we hardly learn our language the way other nationalities do? We feel ashamed even to speak it.

I'm glad you can read and write Kashmiri. We can do a lot. We can demand that Kashmiri be made the medium of instruction. We should agitate!!!

Dear Kashmann,

I don't agree with you in pointing out your fingure at Urdu. Urdu is a relatively new language and a very beautiful and only language that can bind different cultures and languages of Jammu and Kashmiri - kashmiri, pahari, punjabi, dogri and others. The trouble is the mindset of kashmiris as slaves and the goverment attitudes and apathy towards it.

For centuries Kashmiri has been sidelined and people learned either sanskrit, farsi and urdu at the expense of kashmiri or other regional languages. True, majority of 'upwardly mobile' middle class tend to speak Urdu or 'Wurdu' in local slang with their children, though majority of them make mess of it, both in grammar and pronounciation. Urdu is such a beautiful language, but people do commit a murder by speaking it harshly and badly. Similarly some people now tend to speak english only or they pretend so. But this problem is not unique to kashmiri or pahari. Urdu, Hindi and even english is in decline. Even in UK majority of the kids can't now read or write. Queen's English has been replaced by regge type slangs or 'Usher' ed into a new tribal language of totally different character or undertone.

If you happen to visit Kashmir University in Srinagar, the worst building and location any department can have is Kashmiri and looks like a horse stable. In my various meetings with Kashmiri intellectuals including the present head of the Kashmiri department we have mourned about it and our collective sense of complacency many a time. I finished my master's in media from kashmir university in 1997 and I was the only student in my class who could read and write Kashmiri with ease or shall I say i was the only person. The people or our so-called leaders who hold 'conferences' of international nature about politics of kashmir do not think about it, as it does not fetch money from either pakistan or india. Shame on them all.

But we could do something about it.

kind regards,

Murtaza Shibli

Koshur <the_kashmann@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Dear Mr. Shibli,

The problem has always been Urdu. It's because of Urdu that Kashmiri has decayed and is on the brink of extinction. This bazari language has come as a curse for Kashmir's native languages. It's not really that much of a problem for speakers of Pahari and Gujari which are very close to Urdu and somewhat intelligible to an Urdu speaker. But Kashmir's unique language is being stamped out. It has now become a thing of shame to speak in Kashmiri.

The attempt to assassinate the Kashmiri language is part of the insidious program to hijack Kashmir's identity and dilute it. What would German identity be without German? Tamil identity without Tamil? For centuries Kashmiris have been oppressed and their language has been treated with utter contempt, and when they speak out they are condemned as "linguistic chauvinists".

I am not the only one to have these sentiments. There are thousands in Kashmir who feel the same way. Who feel their language has been neglected and despised enough. They feel their language has had to pay enough for the parasite that Urdu is. And they are not unwilling to follow the example of the Tamil nationalists to bring home the fact that enough is enough!!

Regards

Koshur

--- Murtaza Shibli wrote:
> Dear Zaheemkhan,
>
> Thanks for writing the following:
>
> like koshur mirpuri people think that pahari is outdated and 'language of
> the illiterate' and send their childern to schools
> where urdu (and even english) is the only medium .
>
> Now I know why there is a strong urge to class
> 'mirpuri' or 'pahari' as kashmiri. Just becuase
> people think thier language is outdated and it is
> language of illiterate, it does not allow them to
> steal identity of a different group of nation.
>
> thanks anyway for letting us know the reasons for
> 'kashmiri' identity campaign.
>
> kind regards,
>
> murtaza shibli
>
> ZAHEEMKHAN1@aol.com wrote:
>
> this is point to discuss - i think this is exactly the case with
> Pahari/mirpuri as well, it is disappearing- my 7, 9
> year old cousins came to visit us
> two years ago from mirpur. both of them could no
> speak their mother tongue and
> were very proud to speak urdu- i did not understand
> them because even though
> i was born and brought up in Bradford - i am fluent
> in my mother tongue - thanks to my mum.
>
> I think Kashmiri people on this side also prefer
> urdu for their childern -
> since they read and write in urdu. One man from
> Rawalakot came to stay with us
> and I was surprised to see that he only spoke urdu -
> his pahari dialect was
> complete different and difficult for me to understand.
>
> like koshur mirpuri people think that pahari is
> outdated and 'language of
> the illiterate' and send their childern to schools
> where urdu (and even english) is the only medium .
>
> so just like srinagar, mipur is loosing the cultural
> heritage and with the
> advnet of satelite tv - all urdu and hindi -
> kashmiri generations are in
> danger of forgetting their their history, language and cutlure.
>
> IT HAS TO BE PRESERVED - THAT IS WHY WE NEED INDEPENDENCE
>
> this is an important issue- governments on both
> sides must be urged to
> preseve our language and culture. .....but then as
> my dad would say THEY ARE ONLY
> PUPPETS , WHAT ELSE CAN YOU EXPECT FROM THEM ..?'
>
> In a message dated 18/04/2005 16:21:22 GMT Standard
> Time,
> the_kashmann@yahoo.co.uk writes:
>
>
>
> Without the Kashmiri language, there is no Kashmiri
> identity, not even the smaller "ethnic identity"
> that many of this forum are willing to concede.
>
> Already, Urdu is replacing Kashmiri as the first
> language in Kashmir. Most educated and rich people,
> especially in Srinagar, teach their children Urdu,
> and prohibit them from speaking Kashmiri. It will not be
> long before the Kashmiri language disappears from
> Kashmir, and "Kashmiris" speak Urdu as their first language.
>
> Many elements are acting in concert in bringing
> about the extinction of Kashmiri. Most of these people are
> those who do not speak Kashmiri and bear
> unfathomable hatred towards our language.
>
> Send instant messages to your online friends
> http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

06-13-2005, 07:59 PM

Powerful explosion rocks J&K; 14 killed, 100 injuredQUOTEIn a major strike, terrorists on Monday exploded a car packed with about 40 kg RDX killing at least 14 people, including three CRPF officers, and injuring over 100 others near a CRPF camp in Pulwama town in South Kashmir

Kashmir CBMs during Manmohan's Pak visit: ReportQUOTE

Additional confidence building measures (CBMs) on Kashmir, including a partial reduction of Indian troops, are likely to be announced when Prime Minister Manmohan Singh visits Pakistan in July, according to a media report.
 <img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/devilsmiley.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='devilsmiley.gif' />

India has to vacate aggression on Siachen: Pak

06-14-2005, 02:51 AM

Pak minister ran militant camps: JKLF chief
QUOTEPakistan's Information Minister Sheikh Rashid during the 1980s at militant camps in Peshawar.

Yasin Malik is currently on a visit to Pakistan as part of a delegation of Kashmiri separatist leaders.

When Rashid met Malik in Pakistan, Malik let it slip that he had already been associated with Rashid.

Malik said that it was Sheikh Rashid who used to take militants crossed over from India to these camps for guided tours and sometimes even more detailed briefings. 

The minister who had come to see a signature exhibition displayed by Malik refused to comment and clearly this could be a huge embarrassment for the Pakistani government.

06-14-2005, 09:02 PM

QUOTE(Mudy @ Jun 13 2005, 07:59 PM) Powerful explosion rocks J&K; 14 killed, 100 injured<div class='quotetop'>QUOTEIn a major strike, terrorists on Monday exploded a car packed with about 40 kg RDX killing at least 14 people, including three CRPF officers, and injuring over 100 others near a CRPF camp in Pulwama town in South Kashmir

Kashmir CBMs during Manmohan's Pak visit: ReportQUOTE

Additional confidence building measures (CBMs) on Kashmir, including a partial reduction of Indian troops, are likely to be announced when Prime Minister Manmohan Singh visits Pakistan in July, according to a media report.
 <img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/devilsmiley.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='devilsmiley.gif' />

India has to vacate aggression on Siachen: Pak </div>
india must attack pakistan!!!
this has to end!!

06-16-2005, 09:24 PM

Pioneer
QUOTEIndo-Pak peace: Vajpayee slams UPA policy 
Agencies / New Delhi
Former prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee has raised serious objections to the UPA government's approach towards the Indo-Pak peace process.

In a letter to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, Vajpayee raised a point about the Hurriyat Conference getting prominence over the democratically-elected government of Jammu and Kashmir.

Outlining the contents of the letter, BJP leader Yashwant Sinha also said that the UPA government mishandled the issue of giving passports to the Hurriyat leaders.

06-17-2005, 02:29 AM

QUOTE(Viren @ Jun 1 2005, 01:14 PM) Talk of self goal
GoI gives in to Hurri-ratsÂ <img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif' />
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTEDropping its stand that any travel by Hurriyat leaders beyond Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (PoK) would be contrary to the understanding between India and Pakistan, the Government has decided to let the Kashmiri separatist leaders make their own travel plans. 

Of course, any arm-chair analysts can spin it as to how 'chankain' it was of the GoI <!--emo&

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rolleyes.gif' /> </div>
Look now who's flipping out...

Hurriyat trip to Pakistan was in violation of Indo-Pak understanding: Congress

QUOTEToughening its stand against Pakistan, the ruling Congress party on Thursday said the Hurriyat leaders' trip from occupied Kashmir to other cities of Pakistan was in violation of the understanding between the two countries and that the government should take 'an appropriate view on it'.

"It has been a breach by the Pakistan government and the blame lies on its doorstep. It is for the government to take an appropriate view on it. It is a serious matter," Congress spokesman Anand Sharma told reporters in New Delhi.


Either these people are fools or they think rest of the nation are bunch of fools.

06-17-2005, 02:39 AM

They think Indians are bunch of fools. Why this U-turn now?

06-19-2005, 11:17 AM

QUOTEPM must tell India 
The Pioneer Edit Desk
While it is tempting to dismiss Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's recent remarks on issues as complex as demilitarisation of Siachen glacier which he wants to convert into a "peace mountain" as naÃ¯ve and woolly-headed, they indicate that there is more to his agenda vis-Ã -vis Jammu & Kashmir and India-Pakistan relations than what he has cared to disclose till now.
Â
While his pronouncements may have brought cheer in Washington and Islamabad, they have left the people of India deeply baffled. Obviously the Prime Minister is working towards a closure on the Siachen conflict; it is equally obvious that he is not too eager to share the details of this closure with his fellow citizens.

Given this backdrop, it would not be out of order to suggest that Mr Singh fears unleashing a wave of revulsion and popular anger against his plan and hence his decision not to take the people of India into confidence on an issue that directly impinges on national security. This, of course, is premised on the supposition that the Prime Minister is working to a plan. Those who are aghast at the ineptitude of the Prime Minister and his National Security Adviser in handling terrorism in Jammu & Kashmir and the meek manner in which he has allowed Gen Pervez Musharraf to bamboozle the Government of India, will argue that Mr Singh is merely blundering from one unmitigated disaster to another, conceding ground to Islamabad and weakening New Delhi's position. The events of the past fortnight bear ample evidence to suggest that this argument is not bereft of merit, that the Prime Minister has forced India to adopt the path of least resistance and capitulation at the slightest indication of arm-twisting by Pakistan.

Nothing else explains why leaders of the separatist All-Party Hurriyat Conference were allowed to travel beyond Pakistan Occupied Kashmir without passports. Indeed, the very fact that they were permitted to use the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad route to enter Pakistan renders the agreement between New Delhi and Islamabad, signed with great fanfare, as not worth the paper it is written on. No less astonishing is Gen Musharraf's claim that the UPA Government was complicit in facilitating the Hurriyat leaders' visit to Pakistan, an assertion that has been met with stunning silence by the Prime Minister and his advisers. NDA chairman and former Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee's letter to Mr Singh underscores the ineptness demonstrated by the UPA Government till now.

It also highlights three important points of departure that have resulted in India losing the initiative in its dealings with Pakistan. First, the UPA, and, more specifically, the Prime Minister, have successfully reduced the broad-based India-Pakistan dialogue agenda, forged by the NDA, into a Jammu & Kashmir centric discussion, quietly burying the January 6, 2004 joint declaration that placed the onus of stopping terrorism on Pakistan. Second, Hurriyat leaders, who lack legitimacy, have been allowed to emerge as the sole representatives of multi-religious, multi-cultural Jammu & Kashmir.

Third, Mr Singh has not prevented Pakistan and the Hurriyat from surreptitiously slipping in the need for a "third party" as a guarantor, which suggests he and his Government favour the idea as much as those who have been clamouring for US intervention. Mr Singh must answer the questions raised by Mr Vajpayee. This is not about partisan politics; it is about the future of India's integrity. The people have a right to know what's cooking in the Prime Minister's Office.

06-22-2005, 12:39 AM

QUOTE(Viren @ Jun 16 2005, 04:59 PM) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Viren @ Jun 1 2005, 01:14 PM) Talk of self goal
GoI gives in to Hurri-ratsÂ <img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif' />
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTEDropping its stand that any travel by Hurriyat leaders beyond Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (PoK) would be contrary to the understanding between India and Pakistan, the Government has decided to let the Kashmiri separatist leaders make their own travel plans. 

Of course, any arm-chair analysts can spin it as to how 'chankain' it was of the GoI <!--emo&

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rolleyes.gif' /> </div>
Look now who's flipping out...

Hurriyat trip to Pakistan was in violation of Indo-Pak understanding: Congress

QUOTEToughening its stand against Pakistan, the ruling Congress party on Thursday said the Hurriyat leaders' trip from occupied Kashmir to other cities of Pakistan was in violation of the understanding between the two countries and that the government should take 'an appropriate view on it'.

"It has been a breach by the Pakistan government and the blame lies on its doorstep. It is for the government to take an appropriate view on it. It is a serious matter," Congress spokesman Anand Sharma told reporters in New Delhi.


Either these people are fools or they think rest of the nation are bunch of fools. </div>
Saga continues : <!--emo&

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rolleyes.gif' />
Kashmir: PM replies to Vajpayee's letter

06-22-2005, 12:47 AM

QUOTEKashmir: PM replies to Vajpayee's letter 
Manmohan is useless, his statement or letters are meaningless. It all depends what KGB is telling Sonia to do.

06-22-2005, 08:00 PM

QUOTEWhat about your statement about Sheikh Rashid running terror camps in PoK? 
My speech was recorded by over a hundred journalists and television camerapersons. I never said Sheikh Rashid ran terror camps in PoK or that he gave us training or gave us arms. What I said was he gave me and my 3,500 boys shelter when we were on the roads in his farmhouse.

Former Pakistan army chief General Mirza Aslam Beg says Rashid was running terror camps?
He is saying this because it was Aslam Beg who threw us out on the roads. We had no place to go and it was Sheikh Rashid who gave us shelter.

Malik interview

06-23-2005, 06:52 PM

http://www.india-defence.com/node/302

The recent statement by Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf declaring the visiting leaders of the Hurriyat Conference as the true representatives of the people of Kashmir and the subsequent silence by Indian foreign ministry has once again undermined the importance of the democratically elected government in Jammu and Kashmir. The 2002 Assembly election was hailed as being free and fair by the people of the state and the international community. Many contested the election under grave threat to their lives. The Hurriyat, however, did not participate despite holding two rounds of talks with former Home Minister L K Advani. Municipal elections were successfully conducted this year after 27 years, ushering a positive change in the peoples' attitude towards the state, especially in urban areas where people are increasingly taking part in governance.

Today, there is a three tier representative structure in J&K as in some of the other states - panchayats, municipalities and legislative assemblies. These institutions of governance have surprisingly stayed intact in spite of the militant threat. Hundreds of political workers were killed and continue to be killed for showing faith in Indian democracy. By maintaining silence over Musharraf's statements and by negating the credibility of the 2002 elections, the Kashmiri phrase of "rolling back the carpet to its original position" is being given a true ring by the Indian government. It is true that Hurriyat has a presence in some pockets of the Valley, but to maintain that it alone can participate in the talks with Pakistan as the sole representatives of the people is akin to shooting an arrow in the dark. This is all the more crucial because the Hizbul chief Sala-ud-din has reportedly rejected the Hurriyat's offer of bringing down offensive operations in Kashmir.

Apart from the Kashmir Valley, the Jammu region - which consists of six districts out of the fourteen - has also equally borne the brunt of terrorism, especially in the border districts of Rajouri, Poonch and Doda (which borders Chhamba district in Himachal Pradesh). Any dialogue on Kashmir and the resultant solution should be drawn by keeping in mind the emotions and aspirations of the people of these three regions and after consulting their democratically elected representatives. Two Ladakhi districts - Leh and Kargil - already have a semi-autonomous administrative structure because they are governed by their respective Hill Development Councils.

The Hurriyat Conference, which was initially a conglomerate of 27 political parties and terrorist groups, is now a divided house. The division between the moderate faction led by Moulvi Omar Farooq and the hard-line faction led by Geelani has weakened the Hurriayat's credibility. Geelani, till recently was drawing pension from the J&K exchequer as an ex-member of the J&K Assembly and had also taken an oath of allegiance to the Constitution of the state (J&K has a Constitution of its own that came into force on 26 January, 1957).

More importantly, the blame game between India and Pakistan with regard to the cross over of Hurriyat leaders into Pakistan without valid documents is a serious matter that touches upon not only the sovereignty of India, but also brings to light the disregard that Pakistan has shown to the January 6 joint statement. On the one hand the chairman of J&K People's League Shabir Shah's application for travel to PoK was rejected because he listed Kashmiri as his nationality, but on the other hand the very concept of nationality and international transit laws were disregarded by Hurriyat leaders when they crossed into Pakistan without passports and visas.

Again, the comments of JKLF chairman Yasin Malik in PoK that he had clandestinely crossed over to Pakistan eight times in the past and terming his forays as 'sheer romanticism' should not be taken in a lighter vein. Malik's gratitude towards Pakistan Information Minister Sheikh Rashid for being the patron of militant training camps in Rawalpindi in the early nineties and conformation of the same by former Pakistan Army Chief Mirza Aslam Beg casts a shadow of doubt over Sheikh Rashid's role in the ongoing peace process.

Former Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee's concern over these developments and his charge that India's soft posture is making the peace process Kashmir-centric is a timely warning. Malik's statements are no less than sedition and cannot be brought under the gambit of freedom of expression. Even the freedom of speech and expression guaranteed under Article 19 of the Indian Constitution prohibits an Indian citizen to speak against a friendly country, let alone their own country. Will India still bar Sheikh Rashid to visit India on the bus from Muzaffrabad on 30 June? Or would it once again turn a blind eye to the ground realities in its garb of being a bigger partner in the peace process?

**acharya** · 06-24-2005, 02:30 AM

Hurriyat may join electoral politics

Sidharth Mishra/ New Delhi

The All-Party Hurriyat Conference may join mainstream politics by participating in future elections in Jammu & Kashmir.
Leaders of Hurriyat moderate faction (L-R) Mohammad Abbas Ansari, chairman Mirwaiz Omer Farooq and Bilal Gani Lone during the joint meeting of executive general council and working committee at the partyâs headquarters in Srinagar on Wednesday - PTI

The Hurriyat leaders, during their proposed talks with Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, in all likelihood will express their desire to participate in the electoral process. However, their offer will come attached with the demand that an international body should monitor the polls.

Such a demand would be unacceptable to the Government of India that has not allowed international observers for any elections till now. During the Jammu & Kashmir Assembly elections in October 2002, the Government had allowed accredited foreign diplomats based in Delhi to travel to Jammu & Kashmir. But it has never allowed "foreign observers" or international monitoring of elections in Jammu & Kashmir or anywhere else in the country.

Speaking to mediapersons in Srinagar on Wednesday, Mirwaiz Omer Farooq, leader of the moderate faction of the Hurriyat, said that he and his colleagues want to talk to the Prime Minister and have asked the Union Government to schedule a date for their visit to New Delhi. This was the first media briefing by Mirwaiz Omer Farooq and other moderate leaders after their visit to Pakistan-occupied Kashmir (PoK) and Pakistan.

In the past, Hurriyat leaders have not entertained Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's invitation for talks. Instead, they have insisted that talks with the Government over restoring peace in Jammu & Kashmir could be held only after they have had an interaction with Pakistan President Gen Pervez Musharraf.

The Hurriyat leaders met Gen Musharraf during their recent visit to Pakistan. Sources said that Mirwaiz Omer Farooq made a three-point proposal to him for resolving the Jammu & Kashmir issue.

The Pakistani establishment, sources said, made it abundantly clear to the visiting Hurriyat leaders that given the current international scenario, it was difficult to push the agenda of a group "which does not have the mandate of the people".

Pakistan wanted to get some legitimacy for the Hurriyat in the eyes of the international community, the sources said. Pakistan realises that the best bet for the Hurriyat, having failed to lead a successful secessionist movement, is to join the electoral process.

While the Hurriyat leaders were in Pakistan, that country's Foreign Minister Khurshid Mahmood Kasuri had publicly said that he could not force India's hand to make the separatist group part of the ongoing dialogue process. "It would be foolish of Pakistan to ask for Hurriyat's participation ignoring the claims of legitimate representatives of the Kashmiri people sitting in the Assembly and the Lok Sabha," sources added.

Mirwaiz Omer Farooq clarified in Srinagar on Wednesday that the Hurriyat was not seeking a seat across the negotiating table at this stage. "We have never demanded a seat in the India-Pakistan talks. We appreciate the forward movement in the dialogue process but believe the best possible mechanism is that talks between India and All-Party Hurriyat Conference should go ahead on one hand and talks between Hurriyat and Pakistan on the other," he said.

It may be recalled that Gen Musharraf, during his April visit to New Delhi, had made clear to the various Hurriyat factions that he wanted unity in the umbrella secessionist organisation. He had told the factions of Yasin Malik and Shabbir Shah that they should consider accepting the Mirwaiz as their leader.

During the Hurriyat leaders' visit to PoK and Pakistan, the Pakistani establishment made it clear that the Mirwaiz was the chosen one of Gen Musharraf. The Awami Action Committee leader's malleability is coming in handy for the Pakistanis.

During the visit, the Mirwaiz dropped all pretensions of being "pro-azadi" and constantly pitched a pro-Pakistan line. At Mohammed Ali Jinnah's mausoleum, the Mirwaiz wrote in the visitors' book that he wanted the Jammu & Kashmir issue to be resolved in accordance with the desire of the Quaid-e-Azam of Pakistan.

Mirwaiz Omer Farooq's move proved to be a red rag for Jammu & Kashmir Liberation Front leader Yasin Malik, main proponent of the "azadi agenda". Sources said Malik spoke of Pakistan Information Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmed running a terrorist camp to embarrass the Pakistani leadership.

06-24-2005, 10:14 PM

6 army jawans killed in Srinagar blastQUOTEThe bus was hired by the army and was carrying soldiers to their unit at Mansbal, a health resort 34 km from Srinagar.

Pro-Pakistan militant outfit Hizbul Mujahideen has claimed responsibility for the explosion.

A caller introducing himself as a spokesman of the outfit told news organisations in Srinagar that the explosives-laden vehicle was parked at the site minutes before the army convoy was to pass by.

07-03-2005, 05:16 AM

Mufti Govt. Talibanising everything: BJP QUOTEJammu, July 3 (PTI): Taking exception to Jammu and Kashmir Chief Minister Mufti Mohammad Sayeed describing Hari Parbat as 'Koh-i-Maran', the BJP on Saturday accused the coalition government of tacitly supporting the separatist People's Democratic Party and "talibanisation".

"The BJP is of the considered opinion that the Congress party is giving full support to the PDP (of Shabir Shah) that has been systematically destroying the symbols of historical importance and talibanising everything in Kashmir," its state unit vice-president and spokesman, Hari Om, told reporters here.

It claimed to have "definite information" that a few days ago, officials from the state and New Delhi held a meeting in Srinagar about a proposal to change names of some landmarks in the state.

Sayeed had on June 20 described Hari Parbat as "Koh-i-Maran" and a ministerial colleague of his had called Shankaracharya Hill "Sulaiman Teng", Hari Om said, adding that the BJP rejected outright PCC chief Peerzada Sayeed's assurance that there was no proposal to rename the two hills.

Login




Remember me Lost Password?