11-18-2009, 10:16 PM
Starting a new thread as I thought we have to know the unique features of different regions, their evolution etc. Earlier I thought I should post this in "Bengal History & Origin". But then the essence of discussion will digress.
See the news item from PTI: http://bit.ly/110at8 (http://www.ptinews.com/news/381682_Pass ... tion-in-WB)
We can just dismiss this kind of incidents as mob violence. But I feel we are missing some major feature of the population of Bengal. That is, it is ready to fight for any perceived injustice on its members. I may be wrong also. I think Nandigram, Singur etc give out that unique feature in some way.
The same kind of incident happened in Kerala some years back. There was a railway bridge which collapsed and trains got stopped. As it was major Harbour line, the Railways worked round the clock to get it reparied. The local people didn't protest till the bridge is repaired. When the first train was supposed to move after the bridge repair, people started a dharna in the railway track. They said the compensation has not been fully paid (parts of it were still pending) and the trains can start running once they are fully paid. The entire population of the town was with this dharna. Railway authorities had to make the full payment immediately.
There is some characteristics & unique features of Bengal & Kerala which makes them favor Communist party. May be people like Brihaspati , Ramana can comment on it.
Another example I would like to give is from literature. If you see the literature in Tamil for the last 2000 years the focus is heavily towards Ethics, Morals, righteousness etc. Starting from very first Tamil work available (Tholkapiyam which starts with Vedic invocation), Tirukkural, Agananuru, Purananuru, till 18th century works, the focus is on things like:
i. How should the King rule
ii. conduct of administration
iii. How should society live
iv. What are the family values
v. What is dharma, what is adharma, conduct of seniors
vi. conduct of traders, etc
The single main theme running through various works is Ethics, Morals, values etc. Even though there are lot of religious literature (bhakti, Jnana literature), when compared to this "Ethics" literature, they can be considered small.
The aesthetic sense to an extant is less (or very less) compared to Moral sense. The poems on just nature, pure beauty of landscapes would be less compared to "Ethics".
While in architecture, the Tamils produced wonderful temples, magnificent sculptures (both metals & stone based), in literature there is a paranoid obsession with what is "right & wrong".
Compare this with Kerala literature. My friend told me literature of Kerala has a lot of focus on aesthetic sense, nature etc and not much focused on "ethics". Can somebody with good understanding of Malayalam literature, validate this?
Now the question will be why should we discuss this?
The answer is politics & geopolitics takes a lot of influence from culture, unique features of regions. Former Chief Minister of Tamil Nadu, M.G. Ramachandran was always perceived as "good" man. In all his movies he was a good guy, no villain character at all - even for a change. He never used to drink alcohol or smoke in movies. He always fights against injustice & wrongs in movies. Even today there is big following in Tamil Nadu for M.G.Ramachandran (he is usually referred as MGR) even after his death.
All the new political entrants in Tamil Nadu politics are also following the "goodie goodie" model. Every single film of Vijayakanth is about how he is a good man fighting injustice. Even the new actor Vijay (who is being wooed by Congress Party) has been focusing only on goodie goodie roles for the last 10 years or so.
I feel, the same cannot happen in Kerala. If actors like Mohanlal or Mammooty keep on doing goodie goodie roles in Malayalam films and try to enter politics, they might not succeed. I find that the movies from Kerala focus more on love, relationships, the twists in life etc than on "goodie goodie" stuff.
Dharampal who wrote the wonderful book "The Beautiful Tree" documenting the educational system all over India before British destroyed it, observed some wonderful points. He spent many years researching the archives of India Office in London. He said British studied Indians, their behavior, attitude very well so that they can rule & loot the country. One example Dharampal quotes is British records state how many revolutionaries or people taking to arms were caught. Many Indians in 18th & 19th century were caught before killing British officials, soldiers etc because for a few moments the revolutionaries were dithering whether they were doing the right thing or not. Many revolutionaries left (at least for a few moments) that they are hitting the enemy unseen and not inviting the enemy to a open fight. In the moments of dithering many of them were caught.
Dharampal used to say that British understood, documented some parts of Indian culture so that Britain can find new ways of ruling Indians.
By saying that Tamils have focused more on âEthicsâ and less on âaestheticsâ & Malayalees focused more on âaestheticsâ and less on âEthicsâ, I am not giving a value judgment. My aim is not to put down any region, culture, community, language etc. I am attempting to study the uniqueness of various communities & regions. As Prof. Balagangadhara says we have to study culture to see if the solutions we are proposing to the societies are effective.
Wanted to study unique features of people from Karnataka, Andhra, Orissa, Maharashtra, Punjab etc. This is kind of academic study.
My request:
Please donât bring in straw man arguments & completely unrelated issues. There are people who will say âI put India first, the nation first and all these cultures go to hellâ or âI only care about what is written in constitution and I fight for a India and these are pure bunkumâ
This thread is not for discussing constitution, India as first etc. This is an honest attempt to understand unique features of various regions & their impact of politics, geo-politics etc. So please avoid chest thumping.
My second request would be to avoid the so called âquestioningâ game. Somebody from Bangalore can start questioning like âDefine Tamil Cultureâ, âDefine Malayalam literatureâ , âYou cannot call Tamil Literature has unique focus because Tolkapiyam was written in different date from Tirukkuralâ, âThe Tamil writers for the last 2000 years were born in different areas & times, so you cannot club them togetherâ , âDefine precisely Tamil Hindu literatureâ
I am sure that even with these requests, some people will start the provocations, chest thumping, âQuestioningâ to derail the thread and get it locked. So my request to others is to avoid these provocations whatever they might be and focus on the aim. Baits will be laid & traps will be set, people have to be careful so that they donât fall for them.
See the news item from PTI: http://bit.ly/110at8 (http://www.ptinews.com/news/381682_Pass ... tion-in-WB)
We can just dismiss this kind of incidents as mob violence. But I feel we are missing some major feature of the population of Bengal. That is, it is ready to fight for any perceived injustice on its members. I may be wrong also. I think Nandigram, Singur etc give out that unique feature in some way.
The same kind of incident happened in Kerala some years back. There was a railway bridge which collapsed and trains got stopped. As it was major Harbour line, the Railways worked round the clock to get it reparied. The local people didn't protest till the bridge is repaired. When the first train was supposed to move after the bridge repair, people started a dharna in the railway track. They said the compensation has not been fully paid (parts of it were still pending) and the trains can start running once they are fully paid. The entire population of the town was with this dharna. Railway authorities had to make the full payment immediately.
There is some characteristics & unique features of Bengal & Kerala which makes them favor Communist party. May be people like Brihaspati , Ramana can comment on it.
Another example I would like to give is from literature. If you see the literature in Tamil for the last 2000 years the focus is heavily towards Ethics, Morals, righteousness etc. Starting from very first Tamil work available (Tholkapiyam which starts with Vedic invocation), Tirukkural, Agananuru, Purananuru, till 18th century works, the focus is on things like:
i. How should the King rule
ii. conduct of administration
iii. How should society live
iv. What are the family values
v. What is dharma, what is adharma, conduct of seniors
vi. conduct of traders, etc
The single main theme running through various works is Ethics, Morals, values etc. Even though there are lot of religious literature (bhakti, Jnana literature), when compared to this "Ethics" literature, they can be considered small.
The aesthetic sense to an extant is less (or very less) compared to Moral sense. The poems on just nature, pure beauty of landscapes would be less compared to "Ethics".
While in architecture, the Tamils produced wonderful temples, magnificent sculptures (both metals & stone based), in literature there is a paranoid obsession with what is "right & wrong".
Compare this with Kerala literature. My friend told me literature of Kerala has a lot of focus on aesthetic sense, nature etc and not much focused on "ethics". Can somebody with good understanding of Malayalam literature, validate this?
Now the question will be why should we discuss this?
The answer is politics & geopolitics takes a lot of influence from culture, unique features of regions. Former Chief Minister of Tamil Nadu, M.G. Ramachandran was always perceived as "good" man. In all his movies he was a good guy, no villain character at all - even for a change. He never used to drink alcohol or smoke in movies. He always fights against injustice & wrongs in movies. Even today there is big following in Tamil Nadu for M.G.Ramachandran (he is usually referred as MGR) even after his death.
All the new political entrants in Tamil Nadu politics are also following the "goodie goodie" model. Every single film of Vijayakanth is about how he is a good man fighting injustice. Even the new actor Vijay (who is being wooed by Congress Party) has been focusing only on goodie goodie roles for the last 10 years or so.
I feel, the same cannot happen in Kerala. If actors like Mohanlal or Mammooty keep on doing goodie goodie roles in Malayalam films and try to enter politics, they might not succeed. I find that the movies from Kerala focus more on love, relationships, the twists in life etc than on "goodie goodie" stuff.
Dharampal who wrote the wonderful book "The Beautiful Tree" documenting the educational system all over India before British destroyed it, observed some wonderful points. He spent many years researching the archives of India Office in London. He said British studied Indians, their behavior, attitude very well so that they can rule & loot the country. One example Dharampal quotes is British records state how many revolutionaries or people taking to arms were caught. Many Indians in 18th & 19th century were caught before killing British officials, soldiers etc because for a few moments the revolutionaries were dithering whether they were doing the right thing or not. Many revolutionaries left (at least for a few moments) that they are hitting the enemy unseen and not inviting the enemy to a open fight. In the moments of dithering many of them were caught.
Dharampal used to say that British understood, documented some parts of Indian culture so that Britain can find new ways of ruling Indians.
By saying that Tamils have focused more on âEthicsâ and less on âaestheticsâ & Malayalees focused more on âaestheticsâ and less on âEthicsâ, I am not giving a value judgment. My aim is not to put down any region, culture, community, language etc. I am attempting to study the uniqueness of various communities & regions. As Prof. Balagangadhara says we have to study culture to see if the solutions we are proposing to the societies are effective.
Wanted to study unique features of people from Karnataka, Andhra, Orissa, Maharashtra, Punjab etc. This is kind of academic study.
My request:
Please donât bring in straw man arguments & completely unrelated issues. There are people who will say âI put India first, the nation first and all these cultures go to hellâ or âI only care about what is written in constitution and I fight for a India and these are pure bunkumâ
This thread is not for discussing constitution, India as first etc. This is an honest attempt to understand unique features of various regions & their impact of politics, geo-politics etc. So please avoid chest thumping.
My second request would be to avoid the so called âquestioningâ game. Somebody from Bangalore can start questioning like âDefine Tamil Cultureâ, âDefine Malayalam literatureâ , âYou cannot call Tamil Literature has unique focus because Tolkapiyam was written in different date from Tirukkuralâ, âThe Tamil writers for the last 2000 years were born in different areas & times, so you cannot club them togetherâ , âDefine precisely Tamil Hindu literatureâ
I am sure that even with these requests, some people will start the provocations, chest thumping, âQuestioningâ to derail the thread and get it locked. So my request to others is to avoid these provocations whatever they might be and focus on the aim. Baits will be laid & traps will be set, people have to be careful so that they donât fall for them.