<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Any war has a tremendous cost in lives of innocents i.e children and women. Going to war against a country just because of few lunatics is against humanity. IMO Forced settlements will leave behind seeds for future wars as shown by WWI and WWII. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Iraq war is beginning of something big. Slowly itâs heading towards Clash of Civilization or Clash of Ideology.
Some recent triggers are Cartoon, dream for Shia nuclear bomb, Hamaz rule. Now they have larger motivation for cause. Next 8+ year may change world and countries map.
<b>Here comes Mr. George 'Rambo' Bush. Hope, Mr. Bush knows Newton's third law of motion.
There should a way to avoid unneccessary deaths of innocent people. May be wife of Iranian president should beat up her husband to shut his big mouth.
</b><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>'US plans military blitz against Iran's nuke sites'</b>
[ Sunday, February 12, 2006 12:31:48 pmPTI ]
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LONDON: The United States is drawing up plans for bombing raids backed by submarine-launched ballistic missile attacks against Iran's nuclear sites as a 'last resort' to block Teheran from developing nuclear weapons, a media report said on Sunday.
Central Command and Strategic Command planners are identifying targets, assessing weapon-loads and working on logistics for an operation, the Sunday Telegraph reported.
The war strategists are reporting to Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, as the US is updating plans for action if the diplomatic offensive fails to thwart the Islamic republic's nuclear bomb ambitions, the report said ...
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/article...,curpg-1.cms....<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
some how i support this.
its good for iran and the world, and certainly better than a full scale iraq style war in iran.
hope this goes as smoothly as israel's neutering of the Osirak facility. israel had a problem with IRAQ's nukes not iraq - so they want and bombed osirak, similarly if usa get rid of iran's nuke facility and leaves rest of iran well alone, its better than carpet bombing iran.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->ben_ami,
Feb 12 2006, 10:50 PM]some how i support this.
its good for iran and the world, and certainly better than a full scale iraq style war in iran.
hope this goes as smoothly as israel's neutering of the Osirak facility. israel had a problem with IRAQ's nukes not iraq - so they want and bombed osirak, similarly if usa get rid of iran's nuke facility and leaves rest of iran well alone, its better than carpet bombing iran.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
While intentions might be right, big mouth Irani President has an agenda. He sucking in USA to its agenda. DO you think Iranians do not know what is coming or are not prepared for it? They have faught 10 years war with Iraq. Heard about human wave attacks by Iranians? Combine Irani nationalistic genes with Islamic fervor and you have a formidable opposition. Irani president is provoking USA to get involved militarily. Nobody should take the whole issue at the face value of Irani president.
There is a bigger game going on here with hidden players controlling the affairs.
USA has a genuine security concerns but probably is rushing in a bit too fast very predictably. There is a big risk for India as this region is so close to our borders. Combine that with Nuke equipped Pakis, Kashmir, Afghanistan, Iraq, Al Queda, Palestine, Syria, ...and not to mention wily guily China.....are we getting a bigger picture here??
That what concerns me. In these days with advance technology any military offensive is immediately reflected to all over the world with photos of dead bodies of children and women.
Remember, the cartoon fiasco has not even cooled down as yet. WHole Islamic world has risen to protest against cartoons. Now Iran will only add fuel to the fire. USA is already stretched militarily and economically.
India is economically linked closely to Amrika Bahadur. USA's survival is important for an equilibrium. A weakened USA will not be in India's interests.
But as is said in Hindi 'vidhi ki lekhini kaun taal sakta hai'. Who can change the destiny already written by Almighty!
While intentions might be right, big mouth Irani President has an agenda.
sure. as does al queida. to wake up the sleeping giant.
He sucking in USA to its agenda. DO you think Iranians do not know what is coming or are not prepared for it?
yes they do. they are daring usa to do another iraq
They have faught 10 years war with Iraq. Heard about human wave attacks by Iranians? Combine Irani nationalistic genes with Islamic fervor and you have a formidable opposition.
meanwhile add the combined weight of europe and usa and u have dom spelt out for iran. which is why a attackon their nuke facility is better than a full fledged attack on iran. that would destroy the persia we indians love so much.
Irani president is provoking USA to get involved militarily. Nobody should take the whole issue at the face value of Irani president.
yes, i know that as does everyone.
There is a bigger game going on here with hidden players controlling the affairs.
israel for sure is one of those players. they may have helped this lunatic to become president too, by pulling ghe right strings and with quality disinformation, knowing that once ahmedinajad is in power they will find it that much easier to get usa to do the dirty work for them
USA has a genuine security concerns but probably is rushing in a bit too fast very predictably.
cos they are being made to ruch by the blumenthals and wolfowitz's
There is a big risk for India as this region is so close to our borders.
iraq iran war wasnt risk to us. an osirak style attack woud last a day. a full scale war is dangerous for us yes., and also for iran.
Combine that with Nuke equipped Pakis, Kashmir, Afghanistan, Iraq, Al Queda, Palestine, Syria, ...and not to mention wily guily China.....are we getting a bigger picture here??
yes. we could win brownie points on both sides by playing our cards right.
That what concerns me. In these days with advance technology any military offensive is immediately reflected to all over the world with photos of dead bodies of children and women.
an osirak style attack wont kill much of civilians. osirak itself kiled precious few. which is why its best in everyon's interest if usa opts to go after irans nuke facilities instead of iran per se'. after all its only their nukes that are a kabab mein haddi
Remember, the cartoon fiasco has not even cooled down as yet. WHole Islamic world has risen to protest against cartoons.
notice how islamic world never rose against the osirak bombings.
Now Iran will only add fuel to the fire. USA is already stretched militarily and economically.
thats what iran is trying. the best way for usa to react would be not to bite the bait and do the job by attacking through the backdoor instead of the front door.
India is economically linked closely to Amrika Bahadur. USA's survival is important for an equilibrium. A weakened USA will not be in India's interests.
usa will survive for another 50 years at least come hell or high water. a weakened usa may be good for india - may result in more cost cutting and therefore more outsourcing and imports.
But as is said in Hindi 'vidhi ki lekhini kaun taal sakta hai'. Who can change the destiny already written by Almighty!
yes. and i hope the almighty has some good things lined up for persia. its sad that destiny already ensured that the children of cyrus had to become muslim. now i hope becomming muslim doesnt ensure the physical destruction of iran.
iran's nuclear facilities getting destroyed is to my mind a small price to pay for having the rest of iran and its civilians preserved
<b>Iran resumes enrichment: diplomats</b>
India will vote against Iran, Whatever rest of world will try it will backfire them.
Invade Iran may solve this problem.
the romans had a saying - that when the gods wish to destroy someone they first make him/them go mad.
iran has gone mad.
<b>Vinaash Kaale Viprit Buddhi !
Brain works in reverse direction during end times- Old Indian Saying.
Only time will tell whose buddhi is working in the reverse direction!</b>
and who actually is near vinash (iran + islam or west)
It will take Iran at least 7-8 years to make bomb with or without help, unless or until someone just handover them readymade goody, which is very much possible. China may try, in return oil security for decades. West current nagging can delay process for a while but it will be impossible for them to stop Iran. They were unable to stop India.
Only Invading or bombing some nuclear sites may delay process. With current global situation, itâs not possible.
<b>The diplomatic options are required to be persued to the fullest extent possible. This should be followed by putting pressure on Iran through the United Nations. For the Indian political leaders, it has become a very difficult choice especially for those who are presently not directly in the Government. In view of the availability of a so called Muslim vote Bank, some of the political outfits in India are thinking of making use of the Iranian issue, as a means of furthering their own partyâs cause at the expense of wider security ramifications for the nation. Let us hope that wiser sense will prevail in them and it may also be taken note of that so far it is only the political leaders belonging to the majority community that is voicing various concerns. No Muslim leader of any significance has come out strongly in favor of Iran.</b>
<b>BJP with him on Iran</b><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->A statement after a meeting of the BJP Parliamentary Party executive, chaired by former Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee, which discussed the issue, <b>stopped short of coming out in open support of the Indian vote at IAEA saying it was not in India's interests to see Iran acquiring nuclear weapons.
"India can clearly neither ignore, nor minimise the strategic implications and adverse consequences of Iran acquiring nuclear weapons. It was therefore patently in India's interests to be in the forefront of that vast majority of the international community questioning the many clandestine devices through which nuclear technology and material have been transferred to Iran from Pakistan and several other countries".
"These acquisitions are in clear violation of the obligations, and commitments under the Non-Proliferation Treaty plus all related safeguard provisions of it,"</b> the party said.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Vote bank policies by Indian politicians are not only destroying India internally but are also inviting external entities to create havoc.
<!--QuoteBegin-Mudy+Feb 14 2006, 10:31 AM-->QUOTE(Mudy @ Feb 14 2006, 10:31 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->It will take Iran at least 7-8 years to make bomb ...
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
but israel said that iran was only months away from the point-of-no-return, after which it'll become a question of when not if iran gets the bomb.
so its either now or never.
02-15-2006, 03:03 AM
(This post was last modified: 02-15-2006, 03:06 AM by ravish.)
What is objectionable in the stand taken by the BJP. I feel that taking into consideration the security concerns of the nation the stand taken by them is quite sound.In fact, the path being persued by the CPM and some others is rather questionable.
Moreover, it is not much relevant as to when and at what speed Iran can acquire nuclear weapon and the associated delivery system. Given its past unstable history, the very fact of its ability to creat one needs to be checked in the larger interest of world stability and peace.
BJP stand is Ok, but Mullah Yadav and Communist parties are doing rerun of 1962.
They can't stop Iran nuke bomb, sooner or later its going to happen.
US is hoping Libya type of success. Its very difficult with Iran.
Islamic countries shouldn't have nuclear weapons. But, India should keep it's mouth shut to the max extent possible, and try not to play any role.
If Iran's nuclear facilities are bombed, India only benefits.
<!--QuoteBegin-Mudy+Feb 15 2006, 04:30 AM-->QUOTE(Mudy @ Feb 15 2006, 04:30 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->BJP stand is Ok, but Mullah Yadav and Communist parties are doing rerun of 1962.
They can't stop Iran nuke bomb, sooner or later its going to happen.
US is hoping Libya type of success. Its very difficult with Iran.
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iran wont harm india ever.
but pakis/taliban may play some islamic card and get nuclear knowhow from them and then try mischeif.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->iran wont harm india ever.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sure, as they did in 1965 and 71. One should never trust Mullahs. They unite when "Islam Khateray mai hai" call.
Iran will target Israel and SA.
if iran had a contribution in the 65 and 71 wars. then i want to know about it cos its news to me.
i know they dont have much regard for pakistan. also they vetoed a paki attempt to mobilise the opec against india regarding the kashmir issue.
iran cant be clubbed with other islamic nations. those fall in 3 categories - arabs, iran and others. the last is made of countries which never had much of a past, afghanistan, uzbegistan, malayasia, north african countries etc. exceptions are egypt and iraq who are semi-arabs (ie. semetic non arabs) in any case.
iran on the other hand is very proud of its past glory, of its aryan heritage, and even preserves its zorastrian past, or relics like religious carvings thereof.
finally there are the arabs who by virtue of being the founders of islam have a pride of place amongst other muslims. and thats what iran doesnt do - suck up to the arabs, who are sunni. iran is shia.
its ironic if iran harms israel cos historically iran ws a lot friendlier to jews than were the arab tribes. iran may mobilise jehadi forces against usa yes. and it knows that once it gets nukes, usa wont be able to send troops, just as it cant in north korea. which is why iran is hell bent to get nukes.
so far i know iran has never objected to kashmir issue or to india in any way. not even after babri or godhra, like pakis do.
Historical facts
1965
Iran, Indonesia, and especially China gave political support to Pakistan during the war.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->1971
The Pakistan Army (PA) was already on the move, sending reinforcements to East Pakistan onboard Pakistan International Airlines (PIA) Boeing 707s and PAF Lockheed C-130B Hercules transports. In total, within the following weeks three PA divisions were transported to Dacca, the capital of East Pakistan, mainly via Colombo, in Sri Lanka. <b>This airlift was reportedly supported by C-130s of the Imperial Iranian Air Force (IIAF)</b> and Türk Havva KuvvetlerI/Turkish Air Force (THK), but it seems that actually <b>Iran used this opportunity to donate all of its four older C-130Bs to PAF â despite an US arms embargo imposed on Pakistan. The heavy equipment of the Pakistani divisions followed, transported by a convoy of ships, escorted by warships of the Pakistani Navy (PN). </b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Lacking numbers to match Indian numerical superiority, the residue F-86s were complemented by 90 Canadair F.Mk.6 Sabres. These were bought in 1967, by Iran - via a Swiss intermediary - from Germany, without a US end-user certificate (but probably with US convinience). <b>The reported price of the total package was $10 million. Upon their arrival in Iran, the Imperial Iranian Air Force - which operated only a handfull of US-supplied F-86s at the time - plegded inability to overhaul them. For this purpose all the ex-German Sabres were sent to Pakistan - and they never came back</b>. Instead, they were integrated into three PAF units, and by 3 December 1971 at least 88 remained intact, of which 74 were operational. A total of 48 of these were wired for Sidewinders: the PAF thus had a fleet of exactly 72 72 Sidewinder-compatible F-86F/Sabre F.Mk.6s<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Finally, during the 1971 War, an agreement was reached with the Imperial Iranian Air Force to deploy a squadron of Northrop F-5A Freedom Fighters to Pakistan. These aircraft were actually owned by the USA, and â technically â only âloanedâ to Iran in the frame of the Military Assistance Programme. By the time of the 1971 War, they were already slanted to be transferred to South Vietnam, Greece and Jordan, in 1972. The first four Iranian F-5As, however, arrived in Pakistan only on 16 December 1971: too late to take part in hostilities. The PAF operated them for few months and then all were returned to Iran. <b>Unconfirmed Indian reports claim that Pakistan received also a total of 35 F-86Fs from Saudi Arabia and Iran during the war, but there is no confirmation for this as of now</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Iran want nuclear bomb, Pakistan was helping them. They have common religion.
Iran is Shia-Islamic country, which is secondary when it comes to Islamic brotherhood.
India should not depend on any country for its own security. World is a grandchess board, we should know how to play and win.
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