TN Brahmans are a very civilized people, who don't like to engage in street level violence, however I agree with you that weapons and martial arts training might be what they need. In fact in East Asia many of the monks in monasteries had to learn martial arts to defend themselves because they were targeted. TN Brahmans need to do the same thing.
<!--QuoteBegin-ashyam+Dec 10 2006, 08:40 AM-->QUOTE(ashyam @ Dec 10 2006, 08:40 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Wait, if minority Jews can control politics in US why can't the Brahmans in TN?
What is required is a coordinated attempt to fight back. If DK can put insulting statues in front of the temples using political power, certainly they can be removed using constitutional power. Under secular constitution nobody has right to insult a religion. What is needed is to work out a detailed legal argument for this.
TN Brahmans, instead of spending all their time in the temple, home and office, should spend some time to organize among themselves politically and strategically. Build bridges with other hindus. When somebody tries to sideline Namboodiris in Kerala, it is a Nair organization (NSS) that comes out to defend Namboodiri rights, especially religious ones.
[right][snapback]61956[/snapback][/right]
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12-12-2006, 02:30 AM (This post was last modified: 12-12-2006, 02:33 AM by ramana.)
I hate to say I told you so. Here is Sandhya Jain in Pioneer, 12 Dec 2006
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Periyar and Lord Rama
Sandhya Jain
Fourteen years after the removal of the offending Babri structure at his sacred birthplace, Lord Rama returned on December 6, 2006, to face his greatest modern iconoclast, the late EV Ramasamy Naicker. EVR or Periyar, as he was popularly called, was the most avid native votary of the colonial myth of the Aryan Invasion of north India and its supposed expulsion of the 'original' Dravidian inhabitants to the south.
Tutored well by invasion theorists, Periyar projected Hindu dharma as an Aryan imposition from the north, concentrating his bile especially upon Lord Rama, moral exemplar of Hindu dharma. Interpreting the Ramayana as a text depicting Dravidian subordination, he projected Ravana as more ethical than Lord Rama, Sita and Sugriva. Besides vigorously propagating his retelling of the Ramayana, Periyar openly indulged in vandalism and iconoclasm of the images of Lord Rama, Sita and other Hindu deities. He is reputed to have claimed that the Dravidian movement would attain ultimate victory the day Lord Ranganatha (Mahavishnu) at Srirangam and Chidambaranatha (Shiva) at Chidambaram were blown apart and their temples razed to the ground with canons.
Instigated thus by colonial officials and their missionary cohorts, Tamil society came to accept an invented Dravidian identity and to create a chillingly anti-Hindu polity, which even assumed anti-India separatist overtones. Fortunately, Periyar's Dravidar Kazhagam (DK) movement split as a section of his followers could not digest his marriage to an exceedingly young girl, and though MG Ramachandran later wisely closed the separatist chapter, the corrosive legacy of Tamil particularism is yet to be fully undone.
<b>I believe the current violence in Tamil Nadu, triggered by righteous Hindu anger against an EVR statue furtively placed in front of the Ranganathaswamy temple in Srirangam, symbolises Hindu society's growing confidence in tackling offences by its successive colonial oppressors.</b> Indeed, I view the decision to illegally install the statue in the dead of night on November 21 as a last ditch attempt to force new generation Tamils to retain the movement's atheistic (read anti-Hindu) orientation. <b>This is because in recent times it has become apparent that Tamil youth are wearying of the political culture of atheism and seek anchorage in Hindu dharma and civilisation, symbolised in open visits to temples and reverence for Hindu deities.</b>
The placing of EVR's statue in front of a renowned temple, doubly sacred for its proximity to the footprints of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, was not just a deliberate provocation, but a desperate reiteration of the old missionary Hindu-baiting agenda. It bears noting that though the decision to install EVR's statue was taken in 1973 when the DMK was in power, it could not be implemented due to sustained Hindu resistance. <b>In the 1990s, a law forbade putting up statues without Government permission; hence the Karunanidhi regime is complicit in the statue's illegal installation as it failed to remove it despite a Hindu outcry.</b> Indeed, the regime facilitated inauguration of a bronze EVR statue at the same site on December 10, after violence followed damage to the stone sculpture by outraged Hindus on December 6. This wholesale availability of Periyar statues is suspicious and suggests a deep anti-Hindu conspiracy.
The State Government has been slow to contain organised violence by DK cadres. Hindu devotees complain of attacks on the Sankara Matham at Salem, Sri Raghavendra Swami Matham at Erode, the famous Ayodhya Mandapam at West Mambalam, Chennai and several other temples and mathams. Brahmin priests have been assaulted with dangerous weapons, their top-knots and holy threads cut off, and the murtis of Hindu deities desecrated and beaten with slippers. <b>No political party or leader, either at Central or State level, has condemned this motivated attack upon Hindu dharma and its sacred institutions.</b>
<b>It is pertinent that when police arrested four Hindu Makkal Katchi (HMK) followers for damaging EVR's statue, they found that the principal accused was an OBC (like Periyar himself), while the other three were Scheduled Castes. Shocked, Chief Minister Karunanidhi stated in the Legislative Assembly that those who tarnished the statue did not know that EVR had fought for them, an open hint to large sections of Hindu society to embrace Periyar's divisive and hate-filled agenda.</b> <b>This strengthens my personal conviction that this supposedly intra-Hindu conflict is a carefully contrived stratagem to fragment the growing consolidation of Hindu society.</b> It is bound to fail because atheism has no appeal for society as a whole; it can be imposed as state policy (like Soviet Communism), but its reign cannot exceed the span of two generations; this is what is happening in Tamil Nadu today.
<b>To my mind, it is no coincidence that the Tamil Nadu provocation follows the desecration of statues of BR Ambedkar in some States, causing violence by his followers in Uttar Pradesh and Maharashtra.</b> On the surface, the violence has a visibly caste hue, yet it is pertinent that <b>Ambedkar's appeal is not confined to Scheduled Castes and he is widely revered by upper castes as the erudite author of the Indian Constitution. Indeed, upper castes have no political or social scores to settle by disrespecting the Dalit icon; nor is iconoclasm a Hindu characteristic.</b>
Few commentators realise that in an era in which the Indian political template is expanding to encompass more and more groups in an electorally winning combination, the polarisation of upper caste vs scheduled caste is political suicide. Hence there has to be a deeper conspiracy behind the dishonouring of Ambedkar statues; the objective is more than the destabilisation of Mr Mulayam Singh Yadav.
I suspect a link with Bahujan Samaj Party leader Mayawati's avowed ambition to be India's first Dalit Prime Minister, and her refusal to quit the Hindu fold until this goal is achieved. <b>Ms Mayawati's Dalit constituency is under great pressure from the Sonia Gandhi-led UPA,</b> which wants to whittle away the constitutional privileges of Hindu Scheduled Castes and grant parity to converts to Islam and Christianity. At a time when the BSP leader is striving to appeal to all Hindu castes and varnas, a pernicious plot has been unleashed to alienate Dalits from the larger Hindu society through disrespect to Ambedkar. The needle of suspicion points to those with the resources and the freedom to execute such vicious designs with tacit state support.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Is this related to the Maharashtra riots? Is someone provoking these incidents in India to observe the reaction? or Trigger events? <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
INC+ missionaries and ofcourse foreign hand.
Salem, Dec 8: <b>Volunteers of the Periyar Dravidar Kazhagam, a splinter group of the Dravidar Kazhagam, cut the sacred threads of four Brahmins,</b> besides assaulting them at Ramnagar area here on Thursday, police said.
According to Alexander Mohan, DIG, Salem Range, the four employees of a private company were on their way to office yesterday afternoon, when a group of eleven volunteers of Periyar Dravida Kazhagam, attacked them.
Mohan attributed the incident as a repercussion to the damage caused to the statue of social reformer Periyar E V Ramasamy at Srirangam.
All the eleven people, including PDK members <b>Martin and Sakthi</b>, were arrested and a case has been charged under Sec 307(attempt to murder) of the IPC at the Karumalaikoodal police station, he added. (Agencies)<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Brahmins had no hand on desecration of Periyar but PDMK, DMK etc got new opportunity to attack brahmins. How different it is from ethnic cleansing of Pandits from J&K by Muslims?
Mudy when you post pictures it would help if there are captions. We are not some illuminati to automatically get the meaning of the image. Thanks, ramana <!--emo&--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
But seriously folks we need to think calmly and try to understand why these incidents are taking place? Is it true that the EVRN statue was installed at dead of night and what does that mean?
Further there were allegation by Jayalalitha that the current MK administration was friendly to Hindus as they were reducing the charges on the Shankaracharyas. Is she behind the statue installation via the PKK diehards?
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Mudy when you post pictures it would help if there are captions. We are not some illuminati to automatically get the meaning of the image. Thanks, ramana<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It seems they had removed original pictures with captions.
Before the 'hindutva experiment', that jehadis/evanjehadis talk about endlessly, Gujarat went through what was called the KHAM experiment. KHAM=kshatriya-harijan-adivasi-muslim. It was highly succesful in Gujarat. When UPA came out with a wafer thin majority it was a foregone conclusion that UPA will consolidate this alliance. All this seems to be part of that consolidation. What is interesting is that it has been paced really well. The weakpoint in this strategy is that since it is a long-drawn one, they have to make sure that no major event happens close to the next elections that may consolidate the hindu vote or all these efforts will go waste.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Hindu Munnani leader hacked to death </b>
Agencies | Madurai
A Hindu Munnani leader was hacked to death by unidentified persons at Tenkasi in Tirunelveli district of Tamil Nadu, triggering tension in the communally sensitive town.
According to the police Kumarapandian (38), president of Hindu Munnani Tenkasi unit, was attacked by the gang late last night while he was returning home at Tenkasi, about 90 km from here. He was critically injured and died on the way to a hospital.
Kumarapandian was instrumental in organising several religious functions, including the 'Vinayakar Chathurthi' procession in the town. He had taken the lead to observe "Hindu Awakening Day" in Tenkasi.
Tirunelveli Superintent of Police Senthamarai Kannan visited the site of the crime to conduct an on-the-spot inquiry. A large contingent of police has been deployed in sensitive town. A Special Team had been formed to nab the culprits, police said.
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From Today's Asian Age
Karuna defends Periyar statues
By Our Special Correspondent
Chennai, Jan. 6: Erecting statues of "fully clad" Tamil rationalist leader E.V. Ramasamy "Periyar" in front of temples is far less objectionable than having nude idols of Hindu gods installed within, according to Tamil Nadu chief minister M. Karunanidhi.
Answering a question at a press conference on Saturday on whether he supported the installation of statues of Periyar, an atheist, in the vicinity of Hindu temples, the chief minister said, <b>"Periyarâs statue depicts him wearing shirt and dhoti. But some idols inside the temples are nude. What do you do with such idols?"</b>
Continuing, he gave two instances of deities being depicted in the nude in two famous temples of Tamil Nadu â in Chidambaram and Tiruvarur. "For instance, you have the Vallabha Ganapathi idol at Chidambaram temple and the Utchishta Ganapathi idol at Tiruvarur, where even the priests are so embarrassed that they keep the idols covered with pieces of cloth."
Mr Karunanidhi, himself a follower of Periyar, pointed out that the late rationalist leader was a Hindu and also an atheist. "Is there not a space for atheism within Hindu religion itself," he asked.
The chief minister had earlier made similar remarks, but with reference to the various smaller statues adorning the gopurams (temple towers) of some temples which depicted Kama Sutra postures. He had then said that Hindus should not object to Periyarâs statue after having accepted such erotic representations on their temples.
This time, Mr Karunanidhiâs remarks refer to deities within the temples. His earlier observations had been criticised by Hindu groups and the BJP, which were upset already by the installation of a statue of Periyar in the temple town of Srirangam in December 2006.
Periyarâs followers in the Dravidar Kazhagam, founded by him as a social reformist, anti-Hindu, anti-Brahmin movement in the first half of the 20th century, had installed his statue in front of the famous Sri Ranganathaswamy temple at Srirangam, near Tiruchi, one of the leading Vaishnavite shrines in the country. The BJP and Hindu groups reacted in anger, and a few activists damaged the concrete statue early in December.
The suspects were arrested and the DMK government even slapped the National Security Act on them, jailing for them for a year.
While the DK replaced the damaged Periyar statue with a bronze one, which is still under a 24-hour police guard, there were some attacks on Hindu places of worship in which the Periyar followers damaged pictures of Hindu gods. Some petrol bombs were also thrown at the Ayodhya Mandapam in Chennai.
The government reacted by arresting a few members of the Periyar Dravidar Kazhagam. But the Hindu activists pointed out that while their leaders were detained under the NSA, the DMK government was treating the "violent" Periyar followers with kid gloves. "Whenever the DMK and Karunanidhi came to power, these kinds of attacks on Hindus and Hindu institutions have taken place. Would the DK dare to install Periyar statues, with the controversial Periyar statements against worship and God, in front of mosques and churches," asked Mr Arjun Sampath, the president of the Hindu Makkal Katchi, before he was grabbed by the police and detained under the NSA.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->A professor alleges that the accused had threatened to kill him
BANGALORE: On the directions of a city court, the Bangalore police on
Thursday registered a case of attempt to murder against Vishvesha
Tirtha Swami of Pejawar Math, Udupi, and six others.
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Its all about money, Sanskrit prof should join IER, i am sure will get paid at least $1700.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->He said that through a disciple of the math, Prof. Venkatesh had borrowed Rs. 12 lakh for his friend Girish. He had claimed that Girish needed the money for a few hours and promised to return it soon after.
"With the good intention of helping someone in need, I withdrew the cash from the math's bank account and gave it to him. The money was part of the funds donated to the math by the public for social activities," the swami said.
After learning that the money belonged to the math, Mr. Girish returned Rs. 5 lakh and assured him that he would repay the remaining amount soon, the swamiji said.
The swamiji said he had paid the money on the request of one his disciples. Prof. Venkatesh's has a limited association with the math, he said. .
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<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Police raid in Azhakodi Devi Temple, devotees attacked, temple under Govt.'s control
6/2/2007 3:45:27 AMÂ HK
KOZHIKODE: Police today attacked hundreds of Hindu devotees & Hindu Aikya Vedi activists when they protested against the government's move to take over the Azhakodi Devi Temple & its properties. Later Police arrested hundreds of devotees including large number of woman & children and taken them in to the Police custody.
The Police and govt. employees of the Hindu Religious and Charitable Endowments Department, controls by the CPM government forcibly takeover the cash, properties, furniture & bank account details of the temple and handed over to the Governmentâs executive officer.
Hindu Aikya Vedi and other Hindu organizations state leaders are on the way to Kozhikode to take further course of action and the decision will be announced later today
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<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>HAV activists stormed Azhakodi Devi temple premises, takeover the control of temple properties</b>
6/3/2007 6:38:20 AMÂ HK Correspondent
KOZHIKODE : Minutes before hundreds of Hindu Aikya Vedi activists stormed Azhakodi Devi temple premises and freed the temple properties from the control of government authorities. <!--emo&:cool--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/specool.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='specool.gif' /><!--endemo--> The situation is highly tense and huge number of Police forces are moving towards Kozhikode district. More details awaited.
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<span style='color:red'>AP gives special status to Tirumala</span>
<!--emo&:clapping--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/clap.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='clap.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:clapping--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/clap.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='clap.gif' /><!--endemo-->
NDTV Correspondent
Friday, June 8, 2007 (Hyderabad)
The Andhra Pradesh government has notified the <b>seven hills of Tirumala as a place of worship only for Hindus</b> and has issued an ordinance to this effect.
The government has said the Tirumala hills will have special status and will be called 'Tirumala Divyakshetram.'
<span style='color:red'>This means no other religion can be propagated anywhere in Tirumala and no political activity will be allowed.</span>
<!--emo&:clapping--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/clap.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='clap.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:clapping--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/clap.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='clap.gif' /><!--endemo--> http://www.ndtv.com/convergence/ndtv/story...%205:32:00%20PM
From deccan chronicle
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<b>State bans propagation of other faiths in Tirumala </b>
Hyderabad, June 8: The State government has issued orders setting up the Tirumala Divya Kshetram comprising the seven sacred hills, holy theerthams and the central shrine of Lord Venkateswara.
The government also issued orders banning propagation of other religions in the precincts of the Tirumala Divya Kshetram and some other temples.
These orders were issued in the wake of criticism from several quarters that the Congress government had shrunk the seven sacred hills of Tirumala to two and was encouraging religious conversions in the area. To deflect the criticism, the government had promulgated an ordinance earlier banning propagation of other religions in places of worship of a particular religion.
Chief Minister Y.S. Rajasekhar Reddy told mediapersons on Friday that holy spots other than temples would also be notified if respective religions gave representations. âThe Constitution has guaranteed freedom of religion but that does not allow propagation in places of worship of other religions,â he said. âIt hurts religious sentiments.â
Principal Secretary (endowments) I.V. Subba Rao denied that the area of the temple had ever been reduced. âWe issued orders setting up the divya kshetram to put all such speculations at rest,â he added. The department consulted several heads of peethams and members of the self-styled TTD Pariraskhana Samithi before issuing orders, he said.
Satellite imageries were also used to demarcate the geographical borders of the seven hills. All the seven hills, Seshadri, Garudadri, Venkatadri, Narayanadri, Vrishabhadri, Vrishadri and Anjanadri, right from foothills, would form part of the divyakshetram. In addition to this, 10 holy theerthams, footpaths leading to Tirumala from all directions, motorable ghat roads from Tirupathi to Tirumala and from Tirumala to Papavinasanam will form part of the complex.
Following is the list of temples notified by the State government where propogation of other religions is prohibited: Tirumala Divya Kshetram comprising all seven sacred hills, 10 theerthams under TTD limits and all its temples in Tirupati, Sri Varaha Laxmi Narasimha Swamy Devasthanam (Simhachalam), Veera Venkata Satyanarayana Swamy Devasthanam (Annavaram), Sri Venkateswara Swamy Devasthanam (Dwaraka Tirumala), Sri Durga Malleswara Swamy Devasthanam (Vijayawada), Sri Kalahasteeswara Swamy Devasthanam (Srikalahasthi), Sri Bhramarambha Mallikarjunaswamy Devasthanam (Srisailam), Sri Varasidhi Vinayaka Swamy Devasthanam (Kanipakam), Sri Ram temple (Bhadrachalam), Raja Rajeswari temple (Vemulavada), Narasimhaswami temple (Yadagirigutta), Panakala Lakshmi Narasimha Swamy temple (Mangalagiri), Koormaswamy temple (Srikoormam), Suryanarayana temple (Arasavilli), Lakshminarayanaswamy temple (Dharmapuri), Narasimhaswamy temple (Ahobil Mutt), Mahanandeeswaraswamy temple (Mahanandi) and Veerabhadraswamy temple at Kuruvi.
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One thing forumites need to understand here. Whatever may be the agenda of Evangelites and their political mentors ( viz. AP CM), there are some red lines that are impossible to cross. Fiddling with Tirupathi is too much even inside corrupt AP Congress party. Hence the backlash and the resultant GO.
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Interestingly there is an immediate response from the Evangelists. Did GPI's masters abroad pulled the plug?
<b>Evangelist claims Reddy had sought $5 million </b>
Friday, 08 June , 2007, 22:17
Hyderabad: A Christian evangelist on Friday alleged that Andhra Pradesh Chief Minister Y S Rajasekhara Reddy had demanded $5 million for party funds in December 2003 even as the later denied the allegations as 'wild' and 'baseless'.
K A Paul, chairman of the Global Peace Initiative (GPI), told newspersons that Reddy had sought the money from him and promised to help GPI go overseas.
He alleged that the Chief Minister, accompanied by senior Congress leader Botsa Satyanarayana, now a state minister, approached him in December 2003 seeking funds for 2004 elections. He claimed that he had declined to pay the money.
Paul alleged that he was facing threat to his life as Reddy bore grudge against him for refusing to give money. "Now my life is under threat from Dr Reddy," he said.
However, Reddy told a news conference on Friday that he did visit the orphanage run by Paul's brother on his invitation in December 2003. "But I never asked for money. When Dr Paul wanted that All India Congress Committee (AICC) President Sonia Gandhi be invited to the orphanage, I spoke to her but she did not evince any interest," said Reddy.
The Chief Minister said that Paul was friend of Telugu Desam Party president N Chandrababu Naidu. "I don't know why he is making such wild and baseless allegations," he said.
Mupalla: On K A Paul The Plane Truth
Houston minister Dr. K.A. Paul flies around the globe using Jesus to pull in worldwide donations -- unfortunately spending more money on jet fuel than orphans
<!--emo&:roll--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/ROTFL.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='ROTFL.gif' /><!--endemo-->
But a Houston Press investigation into Anand Kilari -- the man who calls himself Dr. K.A. Paul -- showed some far less admirable moments in his life, including:
⢠claiming another minister's leper colony as his own, and videotaping said lepers for a promotional video
⢠transporting children in an airplane one former crew member called a "flying death trap"
⢠leaving a trail of unpaid bills for the plane's fuel and maintenance
⢠interfering with a murder investigation in India, earning the wrath of that country's National Council of Churches
⢠fleeing to the United States from India after nine of his American volunteers were arrested and thrown in prison
⢠abandoning an 11-year-old girl after checking her into a hospital
The investigation revealed a story much different from the one spun by Anand Kilari and his supporters. It's the story of an egomaniac with a doctored past and an obsession with an airplane that receives more money than starving orphans in India, a man whose hubris and deceptions have burned nearly every bridge that was supposed to lead him to his true, unspoken goal: to show the world that where there once was Mother Teresa, Mohandas Gandhi and Martin Luther King Jr., there is now Dr. K.A. Paul.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->At which point we had to ask Kilari, "You don't own a $100 property anywhere in the world, but you own a freaking 747?"
"No, I don't own freaking 747, you idiot. I don't own!"
"Who owns it?"
"It is the organization owns it, you chicken!"
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It would be interesting to see the response of other evanjehadis. Will they back YSR or KAP . They just cant afford to sit quietly as the stakes are high!
Its really interesting to see the "backlash" on YSR immediately after Tirumala hills are declared "divyakshetram". I figure it is some poor understanding of local politics and conditions and a knee jerk reaction by a "uber evangelist" who simply could not digest the news.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Q:The tantri has since clarified that the punyaham was conducted only because Ravikrishna, as the son of a Christian lady, is not a Hindu by birth.
A: By what right does anyone say he is not a Hindu? His school certificate proclaims him a Hindu, <span style='color:red'>his passport says he is a Hindu</span> -- what authority has the priest to overrule the Government of India, which issued the passport?
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wow! Does the Indian Passport mention the faith too? Has he even seen an Indian passport ever?
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