When balarAma was cavorting with his wives and girlfriends and enjoying a pitcher of vAruNi beer, dvivida the mighty ape made obscene gestures. balarAmaâs eyes rolled in languor, he sang loudly and he moved like a male elephant in musth. The great ape was a student of sugrIva in the days of yore and had learnt great deeds in battle. The vAnara was spreading much havoc and raping women of the yaduâs feudatories in revenge for the killing of his friends from pragjyotiSha, naraka and mura. He would capture citizens of the yaduâs feudatories and seal them in caverns by blocking the entrances with stones, like a wasp imprisons spiders. He was also smashing cow-pens, setting fire to villages and throwing firebrands down mine shafts in the Anarta province. In the west coast he churned up the water and created floods in the coastal villages. He also destroyed trees in the forests of the yAdavas and hammered the vanAdhyakShas. He then advanced to the shrauta yards of the garga bhAradvAjas and other Brahmins and desecrated the sacrificial altars by urinating or defecating into them.
Thus, he arrived at the raivataka mountain where balaram was stationed with his girls, and repeatedly vocalized the loud noise kilakilA. balabhadra's girls were humored by the ape, but he soon grew obscene. The ape then showed his ass in front of the girlsâ face. Infuriated balabhadra hurled a rock at the ape. The ape escaped the rock and plucked balabhadraâs beer pitcher and smashed it to pieces and made fun of him. Then he tried to pull down the girlsâ garments and laughed loudly. balabhadra furious with this behavior, shook himself of his languor and picked up his halAyudha and his favorite musala, known as sunanda. dvivida armed with sAla trunk, which he uprooted with one hand attack the yadu chief, and struck balarAma on his head. balarAma fell unconscious briefly, but quickly rallying back tore down the log with his halAyudha. Then swinging his musala he hit the ape on his head. Gashed on his skull, the ape was a like split mountain oozing red oxide of mercury. But the ape fought on pulling up another log and attacking the yadu hero. But saMkarShaNa destroyed that with his hala and then broke up the other trees the ape used on him. Run out of logs the ape attacked the mAdhava with boulders, but he powdered those rocks with his great musala. The ape then rushed at balabhadra with his fist clenched. rAma kept his weapons aside and fiercely shattered the collar bone of the ape. With that dvivida vomited blood and breathed his last.
10-19-2005, 02:51 AM (This post was last modified: 10-19-2005, 02:52 AM by Sunder.)
<!--QuoteBegin-Hauma Hamiddha+Oct 19 2005, 12:25 AM-->QUOTE(Hauma Hamiddha @ Oct 19 2005, 12:25 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->dvivida the mighty ape made obscene gestures.
...The great ape was a student of sugrIva in the days of yore and had learnt great deeds in battle.[right][snapback]39774[/snapback][/right]
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Is this the same Dvivida (brother of Maindha) who fought under Sugreeva's command in Rama-Ravana yuddha? Valmiki often refers Maindha, Dvivida brothers and Gava/Gavaksha/Gavaya brothers in Yuddha Kanda.
<!--QuoteBegin-Sunder+Oct 18 2005, 04:21 PM-->QUOTE(Sunder @ Oct 18 2005, 04:21 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Is this the same Dvivida (brother of Maindha) who fought under Sugreeva's command in Rama-Ravana yuddha?
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Yes indeed- it is the same vAnara; the two are known to be the sons of the ashvinau.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->You might be familiar with the basic stories about Lord Hanuman, but do you know all the details of his life? For instance, how he became the brave warrior he is, and where his legendary mace came from? If not, no problem.Come Friday, October 21, India will witness its first animated film on the god. The pathbreaking Hanuman is a total entertainer, packed with pranks of a baby Hanuman, spectacular war sequences and lilting music
I was watching the Krishna serial from Ramanand Sagar. In that serial while showing the Mohini avatar they mention that the demon king Bali was a descendant of Sage Kashyapa. Is this the same Sage Kashyap from whom the Kashyap gotra gets its name ?
11-19-2005, 09:22 PM (This post was last modified: 11-19-2005, 09:27 PM by Hauma Hamiddha.)
<!--QuoteBegin-rajesh_g+Nov 19 2005, 02:37 AM-->QUOTE(rajesh_g @ Nov 19 2005, 02:37 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->HH
Kashyapa. Is this the same Sage Kashyap from whom the Kashyap gotra gets its name
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Yes- the same kashyapa of the kAshyapa gotra. Only that in the purANas the R^ishi kashyapa was transposed from being a mere mortal (martya) of the vedas to a mythic patriarch of all beings.
-hirANyakashipu was killed by viShNu as nR^isiMha
-prahlAda was thrown down by kArttikeya in the contest of pulling the spear and killed by indra
-virochana was killed by indra
-bali was crushed by the 3rd step of viShNu and sent to pAtAla. Subsequently he killed by indra.
(Some hindu traditions believe that he is an immortal asura).
-bANA is supposed to have had 1000 arms and all but two of them were chopped off by kR^iShNa devakIputra
prahlAda, the demonic son of hiraNyakashipu, ascended the throne of the asuras after his father had been slain by nR^isimha. Spreading fear and havoc in the in the worlds due to his pride and immense strength he caused much anxiety to the gods. It was then that the young kumAra, the commander of the deva army, filled with youthful pride decided to display his sports. He threw his shakti and pierced the earth with it. He then possed a challenge to the universe by stating:
"If there be any being that is superior to me in might or protects the brahmins better than me, or protects the veda and the brahman better than me or is possessed of energy like me, let him draw up this spear or at least shake !"
viShNu noticed that the devas, yakShas, asuras and rAkShasas were filled with consternation at this challenge. viShNu, himself unable to bear the challenge with respect to moving the shakti looked at the son of agni and stepped forward. The mighty viShNu seizing that blazing shakti with his left hand began to shake it. When the missile was thus shaken by trivikrama of great energy the earth shook violently. There were upheavals in the sea, the mountains quaked, and the huge forests trembled and fell. viShNu then turning to the asurapati prahlAda said:" I have shown my might by shaking the dart and stopped for the good of the earth. Behold the might of kumAra. None else in the universe can raise this shakti." Unable to bear the challenge the fierce asura prahlAda seized the shakti with all his hands and tried to shake it. But he was unable to move it and swooning from his exertions fell head long on the himAlAyas. Thus was the fall the daitya prahlAda.
ShA.pa. 328
Brahmanas without knowledge of gotra get assigned the Kashyapa gotra. What is the story behind this ? Kashyapa gotra -> fallen brahmanas ? or reconverted brahmanas ?
<!--QuoteBegin-rajesh_g+Nov 19 2005, 11:08 AM-->QUOTE(rajesh_g @ Nov 19 2005, 11:08 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Brahmanas without knowledge of gotra get assigned the Kashyapa gotra. What is the story behind this ? Kashyapa gotra -> fallen brahmanas ? or reconverted brahmanas ?
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Yes people brought into the brahmin fold are "kAshyapized" or if they have forgotten their gotra. They are not fallen brAhmaNas. The basic concept is that kashyapa being a mythic patriarch will anyhow be the father of these guys.
In Andhra and Kashmir one can still find these "fake" kAshyapas whose pravaras are distinct from the real lineal kashyapas.
When indra slew vala with a blow from his vajra he fell from the skies. The great serpent vAsuki pulled out his gall bladder and was flying through the sky as though splitting the welkin in two. He appeared like a bridge of silver across the sky illumined by the gem in his head. Then garuDa attacked the sarpa as if he may destroy heaven and earth. The mighty serpent to escape dropped the gall bladder of the demon on the ridge of the mANikya mountain on which turuShka trees which secrete copious resin grow. garuDa caught some of the daitya's bile from the but became unconscious due to it and emitted it through his nostrils. vAyu pulled out the nails of vala and threw them on clusters of lotuses. agni threw the blood of vala in the low lying marshes of the narmada. The sarpa recovering grabbed the intestines of the demon vala and deposited them in the chera country.
Hindu geography believes that these regions mark the sites of gem stone deposits
X-posted
In bR^ihatsamhita 60.19 varAhamihira states that sUrya should be worshipped by installing idols of his and they should be worshipped by specialized priests called magAchAryas. This is corroborated by the bhavishya purANa chapter 139 that narrates the following tale (a critical reconstruction of it):
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kR^ishNa, the hero of the yadus married jAMbavati, the daughter of the bear-king jAmbavAn. Their son was the valiant sAmba. He went to the banks of the river chandrabhAga and constructed temple in the honor of sUrya. No local brAhmaNa knew of the mysteries of his worship and hence could not take up priesthood at the temple. So sAMba sought help of gauramukha, the adviser of the yadu chief, ugrasena. gauramukha asked him to go to shakadvipa and obtain a special class of priests called magAchAryas to worship sUrya. saMba said:" pray, tell me Oh brAhmaNa what are the antecedents of these worshippers of the sun. gauramukha narrated: "The first of the brahmins amidst the shakhas was called sujihva. He founded a gotra termed the mihira gotra. He had a daughter of the name nikShubhA. sUrya was enamoured by her and impregnated her. Thus she gave birth to jarashabda who was the founding father of all the magachAryas. They are distinguished by the sacred girdle called the avyanga that they wear around their waist". saMba there upon called on kR^ishNa to send him garuDa and flying on his back he landed in shaka dvIpa. He collected the magAchAryas, brought them back to bhArata and installed them as priests of his sUrya temple.
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The Idol of sUrya should be cosntructed thusly: He should have a human form with a solar corona placed behind him. He should be on a chariot with the horses standing for the seven solar rays. He should hold a discus and trident in two arms, and lotuses in the other two. His feet should be covered by boots upto the knees. His waist should bear the avyanga.
This temple on the chandrabhaga was situated in what is now the terrorist state of Pakistan and was demolished by Awrangzeb (may piss be upon him)in the 1600s.
There is considerable epigraphic evidence for the prevalance of the saura sect in India and definitely the cult was very popular at the time shankara bhagavatpAda formalized the six sects of sectarian Hinduism [shaiva, shakta, vaiShNava, gANapatya, kaumAra, saura]. The earliest pieces of evidence clearly support the Iranian connection. The coins of the kushaNas have an image of sUrya with the inscription miiro. The GovindpUr inscription from the 1130s speaks of the magas as being brought to the land by sAmba and 6 great poets who were magAcharyas are mentioned. Mihira Kula, the Hephalite ruler sponsored the construction of another sUrya temple in Gwalior. This suggests that the Iranian influences on the saura sect were continous and over a long period of time. In Rajasthan and Northern Gujarat there were a number of sUrya temples including the well known one at moDherA. These contain idols of suryA with the boots up to the knees clearly implying the Iranian connection. Most of these temples were destroyed in the fine vandalistic traditions of the zealots of Allah. Priests with the sirname maga are seen around the sun-temple in Osian in Rajasthan suggesting that it was probably a famous center of the Iranian sun cults. So it is clear that original home of the magas was indeed in the west and following the devastations of the al-Qaramitah and the Ghaznavids their remnants fled to the east and are now found there. Today the remnants of the magachAryas are the shakadvipI brAhmaNas who are still present in Uttar Pradesh. While they are not accorded the same status as the Arya brAhmaNas, they still observe basic brahminical rites, such upanayanaM and shaucha rules.
Analysis of the names of the queens of the Karkota dynasty of Kashmir shows that there were Iranians amidst them. They seem to have reinforced the saura cult in kAshmIr as evidenced by the mArtANDa temple in kashmir and a kashmirian idol of lalitAditya's time with the classic Iranian dress.
However, it should be noted that the Sun cult also existed in Southern India. In Thanjavur there is the Suryanar temple with absolutely no Iranian influence in the iconography. This suggests that while the idea itself spread widely across India, the priest did not physically move into these regions. I have heard that the sUrya temple in a hill temple complex built in Pune by the Peshwas was also consecrated by maga priests as late as 1750AD however, it is iconographically intermediate between the northern and southern forms. Finally, the sauras also tried to provide a "vedic tinge" for the sect via the composition of the sUryopaniShat and the appropriation of the savitA gAyatrI.
The visible imprints of the saura mata that persist today are: 1) The highly popular Aditya hR^idayaM, which is attributed to agastya and has been inserted into the yuddha kANDa of the rAmAyaNa. This hymn appears to be an early composition of the saura school. 2) The second great saura contribution is the sUrya namaskAra vidhi which is a yogic/tantric practice derived from the saura tantras.
I was watching the Krishna serial from Ramanand Sagar yesterday. There is an episode where Banasura, friend of Kansa goes to talk to Jarasandha (King of Magadha) to ask for his daughters' hand(s) for Kansa. Jarasandha's main objection was that Kansa was the son of Ugrasen (King of Mathura) who was given to Dharmic ways.
Banasura then goes on to describe how that was not true and goes on to say that Kansa was as Dharma Nirpeksha as they come. I think he meant a-dharmic but I found his choice of words dharma-nirpeksha interesting. Before this I have always found Dharma Nirpeksha being used for translating the word secular.
I dont know Sanskrit at all but it almost seems like dharma nirpeksha means "one who doesnt side with Dharma" ? Am I right ?
<!--QuoteBegin-rajesh_g+Nov 26 2005, 05:07 AM-->QUOTE(rajesh_g @ Nov 26 2005, 05:07 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->I dont know Sanskrit at all but it almost seems like dharma nirpeksha means "one who doesnt side with Dharma" ? Am I right ?
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Apeksha could be translated as 'looking forward to', or 'expecting'. Nirapeksha is just the opposite of it, closely meaning 'non expectation.'
Secularism cannot be Dharma Nirapeksha as they cannot be indifferent to the Innate Nature. Matha or Pantha nirapeksha could be close to secular. Perhaps Ashok and others can throw more light on this.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->to look away, to look around, AV.; SBr. ; to have some design; to have regard to, to respect; to look for, wait for ; to expect, hope; to require, have an eye to, Sah. ; with na, not to like, kathas.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its hard to read in the krishna.com CD I have. It almost seemed like Dharma Nirpekha was used to mean adharmic ? And I am sure that atleast Doordarshan uses Dharma Nirpeksha to translate Secularism.
<!--QuoteBegin-rajesh_g+Nov 26 2005, 10:37 PM-->QUOTE(rajesh_g @ Nov 26 2005, 10:37 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin--> And I am sure that atleast Doordarshan uses Dharma Nirpeksha to translate Secularism.
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I remember to have read somewhere that, while the Indian Constitution was first translated into the Rashtra Bhasha, the Senior Singhvi objected to the translation of the word 'secularism' as <i>dharma</i>nirpekshata and represented to Mrs. Indira Gandhi that the word 'pantha nirpekshata would be more suitable; Mrs Gandhi seemed to have agreed with him
<!--QuoteBegin-rajesh_g+Dec 13 2005, 01:49 PM-->QUOTE(rajesh_g @ Dec 13 2005, 01:49 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->I was recently told that Kaikeyi had a promise from Dasratha that her son will become the King. True ?
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This is one of the two boons Kaikeyi wanted from Dasharatha. The other one was to exile Rama to the forests for 14 years with no permission to enter ANY city.
Actually I was told that this was besides the 2 boons. She was promised that her son would be King just like Satyavati was in MBh. True ?
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Rajesh ji, I am not aware of any such boons - atleast from the Valmiki Ramayana.
Recently while reading Dharampals books and also while watching Krishna recently I heard some mention of how the wealth of a person may be allocated. I vaguely remember that
(1) only 1/6th of a person's income is due for taxes (per Manu Dharma Shastra ?) and
(2) that a person should only and atleast spend 1/6th (?) of his income towards charity. IIRC this was while I was watching Krishna. I think the episode was when Shukracharya was asking King Bali to desist from giving land worth 3 steps to Vamana.
Some knowledge regarding income allocations per Dharma Shastras would be much appreciated.
