Vedic Astrology And Associated Studies

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Vedic conference begins in Sikkim</b>

Statesman News Service
GANGTOK, April 11: A three day Regional Vedic Sammelan 2006 commenced here at the Sanskrit Pathsala at Pancheykhani, East Sikkim, yesterday.

The summit is jointly organised by the managing committee of the pathsala and Dikling Pacheykhani Shivalaya in association with the Maharishi Sandipani Rastriya Vedvidya Pratisthan, Ujjain,

The main objective of the sammelan is to make people aware of the usefulness of Vedas to mankind.

Addressing the gathering yesterday, Mr V.Rama Rao, the chief guest of the function elaborated the different cultures and traditions of the country

In order to retain the original values of Sanskrit, the state government has embarked on this mission by starting a Sanskrit University at Geyzing, west Sikkim, he said.

The chief minister, Mr Pawan Chamling in his address, stated that education fulfills the demands of self-discipline in human lives and religion teaches us to become complete human beings.

He appealed to all the devotees to get inspiration through this sammelans vedic recitation.

The chief minister also said that the state government has provided freedom of religion and has always made a sincere effort to imbibe the cultural heritage of all the sections of the society.

The Governor and the chief minister were given a ritual Paanch Kanya reception on their arrival. The programme was also addressed by members of the Rashtriya Vedvidya Pratisthan.
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[Amber G.]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->what are the kinds of astrology?? one is rashi based and other nakshatra based as far as i know. could someone elucidate these two - i mean what eaxctly is a rashi and whats a nakshatra?? and how are these different from the "zodiac" system of the Greeks/westerners??<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Mathematically speaking:

Full revolution = 360 degrees = 2 pi radians

A sidereal year is about 360 days (Actually 365.2564 days) hence the measurement of "degree" came around - Sun "moves" around a degree each day..

And you have 12 months in a year (Month = synodic month - from new moon to new moon = 29.53 days ) - So another way to divide full revolution is rashi's (same as Zodiac) - 12 Rashis... (360/12 = 30 degrees apart) .. son moves around 1 rashi each month.

Another practical way to divide full circle is to see how much moon moves each day
Since sidereal month is around 27 (actually a little over 27.32 days) so we divide the ecliptic in 27 equal parts , these are called 27 naxatras (Because sidereal month is a little over 27 days .. some Hindu astonomers added one more naxatra)

Each Naxatra is (360/27 = 13+1/3 degree.

So in one sense (mathematically speaking) you can use any measurement .( US ephemeris uses degree/minutes/seconds .. mathematician use radians .. ) it makes no difference in calculations...

Astrologically - Western "sign" (Eg "Leo"/"Singh" rashi) is based on solar position (Means sun is at that particular location) while Rashi/ naxtra (Or Hindu panchang) is based on lunar position (on that particular day what is the position of moon)

So say, Vrishib Rashi Position (Called Taurus or Bull in Zodica) is essentially same as Rohini Naxtra--- as far as ecliptic is concerned .. But you are a Taurus if the position of sun was in Taurus - while for Rashi that day the moon has to be near the stat Aldebaran)

(Actually in the zodiac based on "tropical" year "Taurus" is no longer near star Aldebaran - It was 2500 years ago, now it is almost more than a rashi away! - see the next para)


A little complication comes because of difference between "tropical" and "sidereal" ..
(Western is "tropical" year based) Hindu is mainly sideral .. (In sanskrit it's Nirayan or Sayan but most of Hindu astronomers use sidereal) ... Basically with sidereal - these are positions of actual stars/rashis and not degrees counted from vernal equinox (The difference is due to precession of equinoxes) ...

Hope that helps. Any good book on Astronomy could be used.

Name of Naxtras:

Ashwini Pushya Swati Sravana Bharani Ashlesha Vishakha Dhanishtha Krittika
Magha Anuradha Satabisha Rohini Poorvaphalguni Jyeshta Poorvabhadrapada
Mrigashirsa Uttaraphalguni Moola Uttarabhadrapada Ardra Hasta Poorvashada
Revati Punarvasu Chitra Uttarashadha

[shamu]

I am interested in knowing what experts have to say about this.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--> jyotirved  <jyotirved@sify.com> to *****
Dear Friends,

Namaste!

We Kashmiri Pandits are as addicted to Patri Melapak (Tekini milnavuni) as anybody else!  Besides, there is hardly anyone, even if he does not know ABC of jyotish, who does not want to know as to when his “badsharwar” (sade–sati) will start or end etc. etc.  I have gone through all those pangs myself and made a thorough study of all the astrological works besides a lot of astronomical books!  I even studied Western system of astrology and had become a “famous” astrologer, though my predictions were as correct as anybody else’s i.e. hardly 50%.  However, this is a secret that no other “jyotishi” shares with anybody -- that his/her predictions are hardly more correct than fifty per cent, whatever logic or Ayanamsha he may use!  When I analyzed the reasons for such a dismal rate of success/failure, the conclusions were startling!  And I am keeping those very conclusions before you!

I have been asked very often whether I would prefer Western system of predictions to the Indian system or vice-versa!

To arrive at any conclusions about such a discussion, we have to bear the following facts in our minds:

1.    Whether Indian or Western, no system of predictions has any sanction  either from the Vedas  or even Puranas least of all our dharmashastras etc. 

2.    All our shastras admonish us from consulting “nakshatra jeevis” so much so that the Manusmriti calls these nakshatrajeevis as outcastes and not fit to sit in any sabha of learned people.

3.    The Manusmriti advises that “The king must keep a watch on his kingdom like a heron and act with prowess like a lion”  --- nowhere has he advised to consult some soothsayer before undertaking any activity!

4.    All the Ramayanas, whether Valmiki or Adhyatma or Ramacharitamanasa etc. etc. say that before deciding about the coronation of Bhagwan Rama, Dashratha wanted his guru Vasishtha to find some suitable muhurtas for that function.  It was on the advice of Bhagwan Vasishtha that Dasharatha decided to anoint the Yuvraja the very next day, as it was “Tishya” then.  It is clear that either Vasishtha Muni did not know as to what was going to happen to Dasharatha by declaring Bhagwan Rama as crown-prince or he kept quiet deliberately since he did not want to interfere in the divine dispensation!

Obviously, being the son of Brahmaji and being a highly exalted yogi as well as jnyani, Vasishtha-muni could peep into past as well as future.  It means that even if some exalted souls can foresee as to what is going to happen, they do not reveal our “bhavishya” before hand, unlike the breed of astrologers of today, who masquerade as “Paasharas” and “Vamadevas” to tell us even our past and future janmas just by glancing at our birth-charts, even if those charts are fundamentally incorrect.

5. Almost all the jyotishis suggest one or the other remedial measure to their clients, and mostly these are in the form of various gems.  What is surprising is that we have become so dimwitted that we forget our entire itihasa of our past!

(i)            Why was Dasharatha not suggested some “ruby” or “coral” to ward off the evil Dasha that was going to kill him when Rama would leave for the forests? 

Because our Rishis were not greedy to have claimed to cheat death by just making him buy some gems!

(ii) Bhagwan Krishna was born in a prison  ---   I wonder why He could not use some    “sapphire” to take birth in a palace!

(iii)Vasudeva and Devaki---the parents of Bhagwan Krishna--- were in chains when He was born! It is said that Lord Krishna was a complete – 16 kala sampoorna  --- divine incarnation of Vishnu and was thus really Omnipotent, Omnipresent and Omniscient!  He could loosen the chains of His mother as well as father while taking birth in a prison! He could make all the guards of Kansa’s prison fall asleep while being taken out of prison by Vasudeva! He demonstrated His Omnipotence by making Yamuna recede while Vasudeva was carrying Him to Gokul from Mathura!  He guided Vasudeva on his way back from Gokul to Mathura in a dark night full of torrential rains and storms! The guards remained asleep till Vasudeva entered the prison after bringing Yogamaya from Mathura with him!  It all shows that Krishna was really Omnipotent!

But then the moment Vasudeva was back in prison, his fetters were again gridlocked automatically!  Same was the case with Devaki! Both Devaki and Vasudeva remained in fetters till Kansa was killed by Krishna!

What does it demonstrate?  Just the fact that if the Omniscient, Omnipresent and Omnipotent Krishna could not ameliorate the miseries of His own father or mother before the appointed time, how can a ruby or a sapphire---or some Mangala or Shani yagya--- remove all our miseries or give us a Union Minister’s seat!

Obviously, we are being taken for a ride by such Jyotishis!

Then not in the distant past, Smti Indira Gandhi would run after astrologers for knowing her future.  She had a rare and original ekamukhi rudraksha, which only either the Maharaja of Nepal had or she was wearing!  It is said that some top-notch jyotishis had suggested that rudraksha to her!  Ironically, both the King of Nepal as well Mrs. Indira Gandhi were assassinated “by the people” they “had trusted” ekamukhi rudraksha not withstanding! 

What does it prove?  That we should not be hoodwinked by soothsayers!

Then again a well known Tantrik of yore---highly respected by the then PM--- is out on bail, not by dint of his “Tantra-Kriya” but because of some legal loopholes in FERA!

Dhirendra Brahmachari, another high profile “Tantrik”, met with an accident in the plane he was flying himself!  If he could not see his own death looming large how could he forewarn others!

6. The Gita is said to be the gist of all our shastras.  When Arjuna expressed his doubt about whether Pandavas would win or lose the battle, Bhagwan Krishna neither asked him to consult some soothsayer nor did He tell him to wear some ruby!  On the other hand, He just advised him to fight and either get killed on the battlefield and go to heavens or win the battle to be the ruler of the entire earth!

What does that prove?  Obviously, it warns us against relying on any soothsayers, especially if they call themselves “Vedic Jyotishis” since they are taking us for a ride literally.

7. Yes, Bhagwan Ram did worship Shiva at the time of going to war at Rameshwaram but that was not to please Mangal or Shani, but to show respect to the divine trinity  -- Brahma, Vishnu and Mahesh---in this case Vishnu worshipping Shiva!

Similarly, at the time of the Mahabharata war Arjuna was asked to worship Maha-Shakti but not to please Rahu or Ketu but to gain strength from his own ATMA-Shakti, in the form of Divine Shakti!

The Gita is very clear “ye yatha mam prapadyante tanstathaiva bajameaham”  --- “I will ‘worship’ you in whatever way you worship Me”.

   8. There is no mention of any Rishi like Vasishtha or Garga or Brighu ever having written       any works of predictive astrology in any of the Puranas.  The Vishnu Purana by Parasharis is  full of astronomical references ---and that also sayana i.e. the seasonal year when Mesha sankranti is another name of Spring Equinox and so on, but we do not find any mention of any Brihat Parasharis Hora Shastra there!  Obviously, it is the worst concoction that can ever be had, and that is why it is the bible of “Vedic astrologers”

   9. In India, we have started going downhill ever since our rulers started runningafter Jyotishis.  In ancient days, during the time of Mahabharata, it was a dharma yudha that we had to fight against our own Duryodhanas but ever since the advent of astrology before the invasion of Alexander the Great, and with him the “Yavana Jatakam” of Sphujidwaja and the Surya Sidhanta of Maya the Yavana (mlechha!),  we had to fight outsiders!  The more the outsiders invaded us the more our rulers started consulting soothsayers whom they called Rajyajyotishis!  (In those days jyotishis did not dare to call themselves Vedic Jyotishis since the general public was not then that illiterate about the Vedic principles as they are thee days, thanks to Vedic Jyotishis!)

  10. These monarchs wanted to know if at all their horoscopes indicated whether they would  win or lose and for winning the battles, instead of making military preparations they just started wearing rubies and diamonds to ward off evil spirits!

  11. The maximum credit for creating such a fear of omens and ghosts and ghouls and storms   and even clouds goes to Varahamihira!  It appears he later reincarnated as N. C. Lahiri since both of them had their own axes to grind  -- the former wanted to make his Brihatsamhita/Brihat Jatakam and Panchasidhantika world famous and the latter wanted to sell the maximum copies of his Bangla Vishudha Sidhanta Panjika and “Lahiri’s Indian Ephemeris””.  Before venturing into the battlefield, these monarchs would ask their soothsayer to prepare “narpati jaya charya” and consult Brihat Samhita etc. to see whether the “ketuchara” was favorable at that time or not!  No wonder with such a preliminary and hopeless knowledge of astronomical facts, we were being pushed back into dark ages by these jyotishis! 

12.   Our historical records are witness to the fact that we were   vanquished in every battle        whether it was with Alexander the Great or Chengiz Khan or Muhamud of Gazni or Nadir Shah or the Moguls  or finally the East India Company, thanks to the dependence of our monarchs on soothsayers (Rajajyotishis, huh!) instead of the principles of war strategy and statecraft as adumbrated by Chanakya, who chided the kings for consulting soothsayers!

12. The fate of BJP has not been any better than that of our earlier monarchs by depending more on their “Vedic Jyotishis” who were responsible for getting “Vedic Jyotisha (sic!)” prescribed in Indian Universities!  It is that very move that boomeranged on the party and even the “Minister of astrology” did not even win his own parliamentary seat, let alone being the Union Minister again, lest these “Vedic jyotishis” continued to perpetuate Adharma in the guise of “Vedic Jyotisha”!  Do you need any other proofs of the fact that these “Vedic Jyotishis” are really a scourge who will make you lose your seat of power just by making you advance your elections? 

13. If we continue to follow the trend of our “monarchs” of having blind faith in our soothsayers, there is no doubt that sooner than later we will become yesteryears’ Babylon, which is known as Iraq these days!

  14. It was priest class i.e. Brahmins the most respected community with whom      the secrets of  predictive gimmicks were supposed to rest!  Just see the plight of the Brahmin community these days!  They age treated worse than any OBC in case of government jobs and other quotas!  Why so?  Simply because they lost their dharma by being nakshatra jeevis, caring two hoots for the admonishments of the Manu!  No wonder they – the Brahmins are not fit for being consulted in any sabha of scholars!

  15. I must put on record that as a Kashmiri Pandit, I have more to  blame predictive gimmicks and soothsayers, including the panchanga makers, than anything or anybody else since they never “forearmed” (their pet dialogue is ‘forewarned is forearmed!)us about any calamities that were going to befall us!  On the other hand, just to prove their astrological gimmicks, they just made ---and are still making --- us celebrate all our festivals, including Mahashivaratri on wrong days. It is these very jyotishis, whom we had treated as our friends, philosophers and guides, who are responsible for our downfall as Kahsmiri Pandits, since they proved neither our friends, nor philosophers least of all our guides!  These Panchanga makers/jyotishis were the first to flee from Kashmir  --- like the king Hari Sigh at the time of Pakistani raid in 1948 (hope he had consulted his “rajajyotishi” to decide the muhurtas for taking the last flight to Jammu/Mumbai)----since they had already made their alternate homes in safer places like  Jammu and Delhi   They just proved to be Shylocks, who were only interested in their Pound of flesh by way of Dakshinas for janmapatris and panchangas and matching of horoscopes  -- all cheating and nothing else!

  16. These soothsayers have such a hypnotic grip on us that initially even I was brain washed to believe that the Vedas had nothing else to tell us excepting teaching us predictive astrology!  I was also so convinced that it appeared that even the principle of Secondary Progressions must have been exported from India to Western countries since the principle of “A day equals a year” was mentioned in our Vedas!

  17. However, there are neither rashis like Mesha etc. nor planets like Mangal, Shani etc.

in the  Vedas, Upanishads, Brahmanas etc. etc. Similarly, Vedanga Jyotisha, as has been  made clear several times already, is an astronomical work of 14th century BCE and tells us as to how to calculate mean tithi, nakshatra and Uttarayana-cum-Tapah-cum Magha etc. months.  It does not list any rashis nor any planets like Mangal, Budha etc.  Same is the case with Yajur Jyotisha of about 11th century BCE and later Atharva Jyotisha of about 5th century BCE.  As such, it is  really a fraud on the Vedas being played by some charlatans to call any predictive gimmicks as Vedic astrology and hail themselves “Vedic Jyotishis”. It is equally a crime under Consumer Protection Act since it is a misrepresentation of facts to a client and is thus a deficiency in service.

   18.It is being said that Sir Isaac Newton believed in astrology!  That just is not possible!   The astronomical ephemeredes, from which horoscopes are made, were so incorrect that “Horary Astrology” by a world famous Western astrologer, William Lilly, of 17th century, published by American Federation of Astrologers, has the planetary positions of all the charts incorrect! He was a contemporary of Sir Isaac Newton, and thus even if Newton had wanted to believe in predictive astrology, he could never have done so since the astronomical works of that period were fundamentally incorrect as they were mostly based on Ptolemy’s Almagest!

      In other words, the astronomical works of the West were hardly better than the Surya Sidhanta or Aryabhati of India!

   19.Similarly, Albert Einstein is supposed to have believed in astrology!  Dr. B. V. Raman has not said so anywhere in his “world famous” book ”Notable Horoscopes” while discussing the horoscope of Einstein!  Similarly, there has been no such indication in any of the astrological magazines which normally jump on such hearsays to encash them!  It maybe mentioned here that even in the “Notable Horoscopes” hardly any chart even of the 20th century is correct, leave alone the charts of Bhagwan Krishna or Gautama the Budha or Shankaracharya!  There is also a difference of heaven and earth in the planetary longitudes of the same work in a consolidated form given at pages 426 to 431 and the main charts given in the chart form!  Even the chart of the erstwhile editor of the Astrological Magazine viz. Dr. B. V. Raman himself given at page No. 401 is incorrect! And he was supposed to be the “greatest Vedic astrologer” of the twentieth century but surprisingly, could not calculate even his own horoscope properly!

      Same is the case with the chart No. 74, which is actually the chart of the spouse of Dr. B. V. Raman! The planetary longitudes on that page do not at all tally with the ones given at page 470 in the same book!

      And the delineations of all such charts are correct!  In other words, “Vedic astrology” can make correct predictions only from incorrect data!

  20. We have demonstrated it practically through “Mahesh” that it is impossible for any astrological predictions to have been correct in the past either based as they were on the data from the Surya Sidhanta or Aryabhati or Brahma Sphuta Sidhanta or Sidhanta Shiromani ----whether they were supposed to be so called nirayana or so called sayana! But then may be that is the beauty of predictive astrology  -- whether “Vedic” or “not-so-Vedic”  --- to make correct predictions from incorrect data!

  21. Predictive astrology is supposed to be a “science”!  What a preposterous statement! When the data on which predictions were based or are based these days are not correct, how can the results be correct and how can we draw correct inferences when we have not made correct observations at all!

  22. It is said that stars affect us!  It appears either these astrologers have gone honkers themselves or they suppose that all the world has really gone mad!  Let us see how:

I am a tiny human being on this small planet called earth.  The sun is hundreds of thousands of times larger than the earth! And there are other stars of our nakshatra/rashichakra that are supposed to affect me individually as per the Dasha-Bhukti that is running in my horoscope! However, this fantastic statement has no leg to stand upon since the nearest star of that Rashichakra is Alpha Aquilae which is known as Shravana in Sanskrit! And do you know its distance from me? It is seventeen light years!  And it is several times larger than our sun!  In other words, if that star wants to “affect” me individually, it will take it at least seventeen years to do so even if that “effect” travels at the speed of light!  And by then, my Rahu or Shani or whatever Dasha it may be must have been over!

Then how can such a star which is trillions of times larger than me send its rays in a concentrated from just to haunt me at a particular point of time!  Can you imagine what type of laughing stocks we are making of ourselves  by believing in such hocus pocus!

Similarly, the next nearest star of our Rashichakra is Alpha Bootis known as Swati in Sanskrit!  It is away by 26 light years from me and is again several times larger than our sun!!

It thus defies imagination as to how a scientist like Albert Einstein could have made a statement like “stars affect us”!  I m sure he could not have been cowed down by the special “aura” or “halo” which these “Jyotishis” are supposed to have since that is only to befool simpletons like ignorant adivasis!

Secondly, by quoting Newton and Einstein, these “Vedic Jyotishis” are themselves proving that they have no common sense at all!  If at all these two scientists did claim to believe in astrology, they would have believed in Western system since there was no “Vedic Jyotish” around those days!  And these two systems are just antitheses to one another – they cannot be integrated at any point of time since if my sayana moon is in Vrisha, my nirayana moon is in Mesha and so on!  Similarly, there are no Dasha bhuktis in the Western system nor is there any Sade-Sati etc.  Thus whatever support they try to muster for their preposterous claims goes in fact against the very grain of their own arguments!   

23. It is being said that quite a few Western “Vamadevas” and other   “Rishis” have    started believing in “Vedic Jyotish”.  We must not forget that Westerners like their Eastern counter-parts are interested in earning a few bucks the quickest way!  Just by reading a few books by Dr. B. V. Raman or K. N. Rao etc. etc. and the much touted “Brihat Parashara Hora Shastram” they can declare themselves as qualified “Vedic astrologers” It is immaterial if they cannot pronounce even the words of shantipath like “poornam adah poornam idam” properly or correctly, leave alone understanding their meaning, but then we have become so blind because of greed and avarice that we just let them masquerade as “Vamadevas” and “Parasharas”.  This can happen only with Hindu religion, which we are supposed to defend! Why don’t these “Vamadevas” proclaim themselves to be re-incarnations of Jesus Christ or St. Paul or St. John and so on!  We have already a glut of so many incarnations like Radha and Dattatreya and so on and so forth that we hardly need imported Vamadevas! Thus instead of preserving our cultural integrity, we are appreciating the efforts of “Vedic Jyotishi East India Company” to help us disintegrate our own culture by propagating some non-sense called “Vedic Jyotish” in overseas countries as well as in India.

I do not know how many times I will have to repeat it that predictive gimmicks are against the letter as well as spirit of the Vedas, Puranas, Itihasas and Smritis and therefore, have to be shunned at the earliest!  And naturally, these imported “Vamadevas” are just jugglers who have no other motives but to make fools of us and make us deviate from our cultural heritage, pretending as if they are propagating it!

24.I have yet to receive any response to my challenge to all these jyotishis to quote even a  single reference from any of our shastras which has advised us to marry only after matching horoscopes!  Leave alone shastras, they cannot quote anything even from their own “Jyotisha bibles”.  What type of experts are these “Vamadevas” and “Parasharas” and “Varahamihiras” if they cannot vindicate their statements/stands even by a single shastric text?

Do you need any other proofs to understand that you are really being made a fool by these jyotishis?

The last nail in the coffin of astrological gimmicks is the chart for the new lunar year!  It has been proved by me already quoting all the relevant Vedas and shastras that the current lunar New Year started on February 28, 2006, with the topocentric New Moon for Delhi at exactly 5hrs 0mts IST.  But then all the vernacular papers, apart from astrological magazines, are making predictions for the new year on the basis of a lunar New Year supposed to start from March 30, 2006, with the chart for New Moon being prepared for 15hrs 45 mts. IST on March 29, 2006.  In fact that is the time of Geocentric New Moon for an imaginary “centre of the earth” whereas the actual time of topocentric New Moon for Delhi on that date is 17hrs 26 mts. IST!

You can see it for yourself that not only is the very date of the New Year chart for a wrong date – March 29 instead of February 28, but even the timing of erecting that chart is based on a geocentric New Moon instead of the New Moon with parallax corrections for Delhi, which is known as topocentric phenomenon!

But then, as usual, these jyotishis will claim to have made correct predictions for our “matribhoomi” i.e. Bharatavarsha since, even at the cost of repeating a statement for the umpteenth time, these Vedic jyotishis can make correct predictions only from fundamentally incorrect data!

In view of the above discussion, it is clear that predictive gimmicks have no basis either as per the shastras or modern sciences.  It is immaterial whether these predictive techniques are of Indian system – euphemistically known as “Vedic Jyotisha” or Western system.  On the other hand, the so called Vedic Jyotisha has made us celebrate all our festivals on wrong days and the earlier we shun it the better so that we can start using a seasonal year for deciding our fasts, fairs, festivals and muhurtas.

When are you going to do that?

With kind regards,
Avtar Krishen Kaul      
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[Guest]

Avtar Krishen Kaul is with agenda, his objective is to discredit Muharat and other related Sanatan Dharma practice (Idol worship, temple visit, Sharaad, fasting) in Hinduism. He is doing because he follows Arya Samaj. But he is missing basic purpose of Arya Samaj, to promote Vedic Civilization. Arya Samaj believes everyday is auspicious so no need for Muharat, I agree but even they also celebrate Ram Nami and Diwali based on Hindu calendar. Diwali is also balidan diwas for Arya Samaj, On Diwali nite Swami Dayanad was poisoned.
Arya Samaj follows Hindu calendar.

There are lots of holes in his theory. Nothing is his own work but cut and paste from others who always discredit any Hindu practice/religion.

Have you seen him discrediting Havan? Why he is not doing? Why Havan should be done after Sun rise and before Sunset?
One can ask him what those mantra chanting will do to him, he can sing movie song infront of havan kunda?
Why to chant Shant mantra at the end not in begining?
Why to use only Mango tree stems for Havan not any other or just a cooking gas?
Why Arya Samaji change Janahu on Rakhi day?

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-ashyam+Apr 19 2006, 08:23 PM-->QUOTE(ashyam @ Apr 19 2006, 08:23 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->I am interested in knowing what experts have to say about this.

<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--> jyotirved  <jyotirved@sify.com> to *****
Dear Friends,
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[right][snapback]50106[/snapback][/right]

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As much as he tries to disprove the astrology, he makes a fool of himself when he equates Surya Sidhhanta and the science of astrology. Surya Sidhantha is a mathematical treatise on astronomy, not astrology. Much of the ancient Indian mathematicians believed in it and researched on that subject for several thousand years before this clown started to yap on a two-bit worthless online news site - and somehow he is trying hard to prove his logical prowess by running down millenias of mathematical research done by ancient Indian astronomers. If your ancestors were capable of measuring the distance between the moon and the earth, they were also capable of making sound judgements as to what is to be studied and persued and what shouldn't be - surely Vedic astrology wouldn't have survived all these years without having people to pursue it as a serious study?

And then there are people who post the article on a forum with an innocent looking question like "Is this true?" forcing people to read through the garbage - a way of advertising an ideology and cast doubts on the followers so much so that after a few of such repititious garbage throwing with puppy-eyed-innocent-questions like this the people here would start to question their faith and pursuit of a subject - a ploy mostly used by Pakis and Christian missionaries to sow doubts about Hindu religion in others minds.

All must seek the truth, no doubt about that, but not by running down others believes or by mocking another's pursuit. If you have doubts about a certain subject make sure that you do a little research yourself before raising "Please comment on this garbage" or "Is this true?" sort of questions.

Asathoma Sadgamaya, Tamasoma Jyothir Gamaya,
Eswar

[Guest]

Eswar,

Take it easy..

Shyam,

Frankly I couldnt read through the whole post from Sri Kaul. Rest of his post might have some merit but I lost interest in what he had to say midstream. His 'criticism' sounds pretty silly to me.

[Bharatvarsh]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Our historical records are witness to the fact that we were   vanquished in every battle        whether it was with Alexander the Great or Chengiz Khan or Muhamud of Gazni or Nadir Shah or the Moguls  or finally the East India Company, thanks to the dependence of our monarchs on soothsayers (Rajajyotishis, huh!) instead of the principles of war strategy and statecraft as adumbrated by Chanakya, who chided the kings for consulting soothsayers!<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is absolute rubbish, Alexander suffered many casualties in the battle with Purushottama and had to retreat because his soldiers rebelled and did not want to fight anymore, he was later injured by an arrow shot by some Indian during his retreat. Mahmud of Ghazni's 17 raids into India are rubbish and later day exaggerations, we did lose against him but he was also scared of Hindus and retreated through Makran desert to escape the wrath of Raja Bhoja. The guy is a joke, everyone knows that the Marathas, Jats and Sikhs smashed up the Mughals who were reduced to penury, Waliullah was inviting Abdali to come and rescue Muslims saying that the Mughal empire was gone and that Hindus were now the rulers and even the Brits had to fight 3 wars with Marathas (of which, they lost the first one badly) before they could take over.

[Guest]

Hope to start the classes in early July, possibly at Sunnyvale Temple, CA or other convenient place. Please have someone intereswted contact me by e-mail or phone
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>A VEDIC MATHS (VM-AIM) WORKSHOP </b>
"How to make Friends with Numbers and Influence People  with Fun and Laughter (or at least without tears!)"
Instructor :  Dr VIJAY ASHAR
                 Adjunct Professor,
                 Mathematics & Quant.  Methods                                                                                                                             Phone: (408) 541-9927 bhakta711@yahoo.com , vijay.ashar@gmail.com

'Vedic Mathematics' was described as "mental mathematics" by its founder, Sw. Bharati Krishna Teerthaji of Shankaracharya Order. It provides very easy, superfast, mental methods along with speedy cross-checking for verifying answers.

These methods are easy to understand and their variety, speed, and ease of calculation brings joy to the heart and a smile to the face of every student. Together, they represent a complete system for solving a variety of mathematical problems and constitute a holistic mental approach to tackle them efficiently. As such, the methods of Vedic Mathematics are a real boon in preparation for all competitive examinations.

Based on sixteen crisp, chemistry-like formulas (sutras) and thirteen corollaries (upasutras), they have wide-ranging applications in various branches of mathematics, including arithmetic, algebra, geometry, calculus, and beyond.

In this gound-breaking workshop on Vedic Mathematics, we will discuss and demonstrate the application of a few of the sutras to various problems in arithmetic and algebra. The method of presentation will elicit participation from students, so they develop an appreciation for the power of these methods, and strengthen their numeracy skills. By the end of the workshop, the students will develop a great flair and confidence for working with numbers in everyday life, and in the process will develop a greater awareness of Vedic cultural heritage.

The contents of the workshop will be beneficial to anyone with a curious and inquiring mind from ages 11 to 80 plus.
.......................................................................................................................................................................

Dr Vijay Ashar has a doctorate in Statistics and O.R./Economics from North Carolina State University and post-Doctoral training in Computer & Information Systems. He is currently an Adjunct Professor in the Adm. Management Program of Central Michigan University. Earlier, he was an Associate Professor of Quantitative Sciences with the Universities of New Haven, of Hartford and of Connecticut in Stamford. He had also spent two years as Visiting Professor of Computer Science and Business Administration at Jackson State University.

Subsequent to his doctoral studies, Dr Ashar spent 17 years with IBM Corporation in East Firshkill, New York and parted as an Advisory Systems Scientist. Later, he spent three years as a student resident at Arsha Vidya Gurukulam, in Saylorsburg, PA, studying Vedanta. While there, he also taught Sanskrit and Vedic Mathematics. 

Since 1994, Dr Ashar has been regularly conducting lectures, seminars and (training) workshops in India, USA, Singapore, etc for diverse audiences including school and college students and teachers, post-graduate (e.g. MBA, Engineering, etc) students and professors, professionals, Rotary Clubs and even senior citizen groups (in USA).

Some of the major institutions where he has given presentations are: Jamnabai School, Somaiya College, S P Jain College of Management, Jhunjhunwala College, Nehru Planetarium, Indo-American Society- all in Mumbai; Andhra University (Vishakapatnam), Vishwa Bharati University (Shantinekatan), Bangalore Education School Board, J Krishnamurti Schools in Rishi Valley, Bangalore, Chennai, Varanasi, etc.
                                                                                                                       In USA, Dr. Ashar has conducted classes and seminars at Penn State Univ., East Stroudsburg Univ. (PA), Athens Univ., OH, Stevens Inst. of Technology, NJ, Vedanta Society in Hollywood , CA,  Cerritos College, Cerritos, CA, etc.

During his recent visits to India and Singapore since 2002,  Dr. Ashar has conducted several seminars and workshops at various institutions. Some among these are National Singapore University, Univ. of Bombay, various faculties at Somaiya Vidyavihar, Indian Planetary Society, S. P. Jain Institute of Mgmt, etc., all in Mumbai;  Gujarat Vidyapeeth and Gujarat Univ., Ahmedabad, Various Amrita Institutes of Education (from high school to University levels) in Kerala;  Amrita Vishwa VidyaPeetham in Coimbatore, TN; Amrita Institutes of Computer Technology; Bangalore University, Mysore Univ., Bharathiyar Univ (Coimbatore), Indian Space Research Org. (ISRO), IIM Bangalore,  Satyam Computers Corp, (Bangalore), etc.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[Guest]

<b>A wonderful analysis of Astrology in the light of spirituality</b>

No doubt horoscope is the telescope for seeing the cycle of deeds. God has already arranged the happiness and misery in alternating way. The periods of nine planets rotate in a cycle. Each period has sub-periods of the nine planets again as a sub-cycle. This means that while eating a sweet dish a secondary hot dish is also introduced. The horoscope is a beautiful arrangement of your deeds in alternating way by the divine Father who has immense affection on the souls. The total period of the nine planets is 120 years. For each Zodiat of birth (Janma raasi) there will be a continuous ascending period of sixty years and another continuous descending period of 60 years.

One may be born in the beginning or in the middle or in the end part of ascending period or descending period depending upon his previous interference through rituals. Mesha, Karkataka, Simha, Vrischika, Dhanush and Meena zodiats have the beginning of ascending period of 60 years which ends with the period of Jupiter. For other zodiats the ascending period of 60 years starts with the period of Saturn for 60 years which ends with the period of Venus. Thus one is born with an ascending period of 60 years or with a descending period of 60 years or at any point between these two periods. If a person is born in Mesha, starting with the period of Sun, the 60 years life time is ascending. If the same is born with the period of Saturn, the person will have a descending period of 60 years.

A realized soul dragged back the fruits of bad deeds from the present life cycle, will be born in the beginning of ascending periods. If the ignorant soul dragged back the fruits of good deeds from the present cycle, he will be born in the beginning of descending period. If the whole life is with happiness or misery the person will be bored. The reason for such boring is only the person himself who has interfered with the good arrangement of God. Therefore Jesus said that let the will of God happen always. However for ignorant souls also the God made some compensation by introducing the sub-periods of all the nine planets in the main period of each planet. Thus a secondary alternative arrangement of side dishes is done by the Godmother because the children are ignorant of even the technology of eating!

Jyotisham (Astrology) is the subject which relates to Jyoti or planet. The actual meaning of Jyoti is only God. According to the Veda (Param Jyotirupasampadyate) and the Brahma Sutras (refer the sutra of Jyotiradhikaranam). Jyoti means light. The planet is like the jailor guiding you to the jail where you will enjoy the misery or is like a guide who guides you to a bar like heaven where you will drink and sleep. The planet guides you to the fruit of your deed. It is called as Graha which means that it will capture you wherever you are present to deliver the fruit of your deed to you at the exact fraction of second. It is a computerized system of deeds and fruits.

This computer does all the calculations and is called as Chitra Gupta. Chitra Gupta means the protector of witness through the audio and video system. All your thoughts, words and deeds are recorded and will be exhibited as witness in the upper world. The judge does not require any type of other witness. There is no need of an advocate and therefore such provision does not exist. You will just see and hear your thoughts, words and deeds in the audio and video system (Chitra Gupta) and an automatic judgment is delivered by another system called as Yama.

There is no possibility of doing any ritual there since it is only a place of enjoyment of fruits (Bhoga Loka). All the heavenly pleasures and hell - punishments are given according to periods of another horoscope that is prepared based on the time of death. Thus the wheel of the planets is the executive system of the soul in this world as well as in the upper world. Yama is the son of the Sun like Saturn, is also the controlling powerful planet in the upper world.

The Lord is all in all and is the employer of the planets. The planets function due to the fear about Lord. The Veda says the same (Bhishodeti Suryah). Astrologers are like the elementary school teachers and should become spiritual gurus like professors. The priests and the astrologers should rise in their standards and guide the people to the spiritual path. Instead of doing so, both have colluded and are doing business by exploiting the public.

The astrologer takes some money for studying the horoscope and recommends the Japam of a planet. The priest does it and gives commission to the astrologers. It is like a doctor referring the patient to the laboratory for diagnosis for getting the commission. The whole spirit is lost and the spiritual path is lost long back in this Kali Yuga. The priests and the astrologers say a story that even Lord Shiva suffered due to Saturn. The story is only a creation for promoting the business.

Even if you believe the story, you can take it in positive sense. You can understand that even the Lord respects the cycle of deeds. What sin Lord Shiva did to undergo the affect of Saturn? The story is foolish even at the root. Let us assume that even Lord Shiva has to suffer the affect of Saturn for a bad deed. If that is so, how can an ordinary human being escape the same type of effect with the help of this petty priest and petty astrologer?

Astrology is elementary level of spiritual knowledge which introduces the super-natural power that is beyond the science. This should finally lead to the existence of unimaginable God beyond logic and science. Astrology is not allowed to grow to become philosophy by these commercial intellectuals. Its growth is arrested and is limited so that the exploitation of devotees can take place. Astrology should be allowed to become philosophy. The school education should grow to become the university standard. The priests and astrologers should develop to become spiritual gurus. Otherwise they are doing sin in the name of God which will affect them here and there.

The astrologers have developed a wrong concept in astrology by which the people think that they are receiving good or bad affects accidentally by the movement of planets without reference to their deeds. It is just like saying that one is arrested by police on a road because while he was standing on the road, the police incidentally came there and captured him. He is feeling that his arrest was due to the incidental meeting with the police on the road and the arrest happened without any reason. Similarly people are thinking that the bad results are achieved by the incidental movement of the planets and their periods.

This is complete nonsense. The planets are very disciplined and regular in their movements. Since you are proved as a thief and your arrest is ordered by the court, the police have arrested you with the exact background. You pose as if you are innocent and the arrest is simply incidental due to movement of police meeting you accidentally. You may escape the police for sometime even after the order from the court, but the planet catches you exactly in the same fraction of second as soon of the order from the divine court is released.

In fact the results of deeds of any human being are mainly postponed after the death to the upper world. The results of all your deeds are not given in this world especially when you are in the human life which is very rare. The main aim of this very rare human life is that you should recognize the God and obtain His grace before the end of this human life. This human life is mainly meant for such effort (Saadhana) and therefore this world is called as Karma Loka. You will not be always disturbed with the enjoyment of fruits of your deeds in this world because the main purpose will not be served in this little precious time of human life. When the student is occupied in the studies in the period of preparation for examination, the principal will not disturb him either by punishments or by encouraging cultural activities. Once the examinations are over there is a long vacation time in which these can be take up.

Similarly there is lot of time after death and therefore the fruits of the deeds are mainly given after the death in a separate world called as Bhoga Loka. The earth is meant for the karma to be done to recognize the human form of the Lord and get guidance and practice it to please God. Therefore a separate time and a separate world (hell & heaven) are meant for this purpose. People who do not know the main aim of human life and the significance of this karma loka are worried for not seeing the results here itself immediately. This is the main aim of creation of hell and heaven separately as the upper worlds. However the results of some deeds are released here itself in case they can activate the soul in the spiritual line. With such aim certain effects of misery to divert the soul to the God and certain effects of happiness as alternative intervals for encouragement are released.

Without understanding the significance of these effects, people either sleep and become lazy in happiness or get worried and feel tensions in misery. When such effects have no use on the spiritual line, the soul is released from the gross body and is pushed to Bhoga Loka and further cycles of animals and birds in a condemned state. Thus the ultimate aim of human life and the ultimate aim of the good and bad results must be realized in the light of the spiritual divine path. This human life is not just for the mechanical deeds and corresponding results like a routine machine.

At the Lotus Feet of His Holiness Sri Dattaswami

Anil Antony

<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>[EDITED - Leave emails and personal website details out. No signatures please.
-Admin]</span>

[Pandyan]

<!--QuoteBegin-Mudy+Jan 20 2009, 02:56 PM-->QUOTE(Mudy @ Jan 20 2009, 02:56 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->acharya,
Satrajit Majumdar's analysis never came true. When analysis is done based on personal agenda or ideology, it never works.
[right][snapback]93514[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have a much simpler explanation. Astrology is fraud, therefore it will never work. <!--emo&--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->

[Guest]

Astrology is not fraud but people miss use it and give bad name to Astrology.

In place of judging prediction based on BHO's Birth time which is very conflicting, he should have used inaguration time to make any prediction.
12.06 pm Washington DC, USA - 20 Jan 2009.

[Pandyan]

<!--QuoteBegin-Mudy+Jan 20 2009, 04:57 PM-->QUOTE(Mudy @ Jan 20 2009, 04:57 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Astrology is not fraud but people miss use it and give bad name to Astrology.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
AFAIK, there is no Hindu basis for astrology. Neither is there a scientific one.

[Guest]

<b>I will move astrology related dicussion to Astrology thread in culture forum.</b>

Hindu is reference to people of Indic civilization.
Astrology is referred in Ramayana, Mahabharat, Puranas etc.
why everything is to be proven to scientific level? Do all scientific findings are over? All research is done? Is current scientific knowledge is ultimate. I don't think so.
West is still doing research on Gayatri Mantra.
Benefits of Yoga are still mystery.

[Pandyan]

Pretty sure astrology was adopted from greeks, so no, there is no Hindu basis. It has backfired on Hindus plenty of times, such as 3rd battle of panipat (unless someone can repudiate this, I have read about it plenty of times). Who knows where else it screwed Hindus over.

Astrology should be relegated to carnivals and fairs, away from the forefront of Hindu life and activity. Otherwise we can be a laughing stock of the world, like MM Joshi and his moronic insistence that it be treated as a science course.

[Guest]

NO, Why give credit to Greek, When Vedic Culture did lot.
It is complex study. Lot of astonomy, Mathematics knowldge is required.
Pandyan, Read Valmiki Ramayan, Mahabharat.

[Pandyan]

Mbh, Ramayana came later. Astrology was taken from Greeks. Has no "vedic" Hindu basis. Maybe someone else can confirm this.

[Guest]

I was touring Greenwich Observatory in Greenwich, London. Everything including zero and knowledge of astronomy was credited to Greeks and everyone else , no mention of India. Later I remember, Vedic culture came from Europe by people sitting on Chariot and wrote Vedas, Mahabharat and Ramayana in one sitting and Witzel can vouch.

[Pandyan]

My correspondence with Dr. Koenraad Elst.

>>> Was astrology adopted from the Greeks?


To: koenraadelst@hotmail.com
Subject: Astrology?
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 14:47:56 -0500


Yes it was. No such thing as "Vedic astrology".

KE

[Guest]

Our member had written this article couple months ago...
Separating Chaff and Grain

[Pandyan]

Thats the worst article I have ever read.

I think I'll place my bets on Elst and HH.