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Progressive Duplicity and moral policing - Bharatvarsh - 07-01-2009
Of course homosexuality existed in ancient India as it existed in every other human culture & exists today, what kind of dumb question is that.
The rest is the usual Freudian like fluff about "repression" bla bla bla.
Most traditional cultures tolerated homosexuality but they did not accept it as being on par with heterosexuality or encourage it which makes sense considering the survival of the species depended on heterosexuality before invitro fertilization. Even the Greeks who are all made out to be enthusiastic homosexuals by motivated gay activists had people opposing it. In "The Laws" Plato says that homosexuality is "para phusin" or "against Nature", just one example.
Progressive Duplicity and moral policing - Husky - 07-05-2009
<!--QuoteBegin-Bharatvarsh+Jul 1 2009, 07:00 PM-->QUOTE(Bharatvarsh @ Jul 1 2009, 07:00 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Of course homosexuality existed in ancient India as it existed in every other human culture & exists today, what kind of dumb question is that.
The rest is the usual Freudian like fluff about "repression" bla bla bla.
Most traditional cultures tolerated homosexuality but they did not accept it as being on par with heterosexuality or encourage it which makes sense considering the survival of the species depended on heterosexuality before invitro fertilization. Even the Greeks who are all made out to be enthusiastic homosexuals by motivated gay activists had people opposing it. In "The Laws" Plato says that homosexuality is "para phusin" or "against Nature", just one example.
[right][snapback]99339[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->With "against nature", did Plato mean it doesn't occur in nature or that, because it produces no offspring, it can be regarded as being unproductive, hence (?) "against nature".
Well, if the former, then it may be because Plato didn't get to see National Geographic's entry (was it?) on homosexuality in the animal world - mammals, birds, insects. (Not that NatGeo is the most scientific or reliable of all natural-world/doco-type outlets, but it's infinitely more reliable than say the modern christist unscience that's been clocking overtime to shout down these findings.)
Yes here:
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20..._gayanimal.html
<b>Homosexual Activity Among Animals Stirs Debate</b>
James Owen in London
for National Geographic News
July 23, 2004
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->But, actually, some same-sex birds do do it. So do beetles, sheep, fruit bats, dolphins, and orangutans. Zoologists are discovering that homosexual and bisexual activity is not unknown within the animal kingdom.
Roy and Silo, two male chinstrap penguins at New York's Central Park Zoo have been inseparable for six years now. They display classic pair-bonding behaviorâentwining of necks, mutual preening, flipper flapping, and the rest. They also have sex, while ignoring potential female mates.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Some hypotheses are offered here:
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...al-beetles.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Homosexual Beetle Activity Offers Reproductive Edge</b>
Matt Kaplan
for National Geographic News
November 4, 2008
Homosexual activity among male flour beetles can actually increase the insects' chances of reproducing, a new study finds.
This behavior in the 0.13-inch-long (three-millimeter-long) Tribolium castaneum, which can be found infesting flour in most temperate areas, has been observed for decades.
[image:] homosexual beetles
From an evolutionary perspective, why homosexuality exists at all is a mystery. In theory, males should focus their energies on reproducing with females.
"We noticed that these male beetles spent quite a lot of time in this seemingly counterproductive behavior and wondered what was going on, so we set up some experiments to find out," said lead author Sara Lewis, an evolutionary ecologist at Tufts University in Medford, Massachusetts.
Her findings appear in the Journal of Evolutionary Biology.
Homosexual behavior has been seen in many animals, including insects, penguins, and primates.
(Related: "Homosexual Activity Among Animals Stirs Debate" [July 23, 2004].)
Some researchers suggest that male animals need to practice breeding as much as they can before meeting females.
Others argue that males need to get rid of old, less effective sperm before they encounter females.
Some scientists have even asserted that homosexual behavior is a method of exerting social dominance over other males.
Tracking Success
Lewis's team marked individual males and females, then tracked their sexual exploits while simultaneously monitoring the paternity of any offspring born in the group. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Goes over the page.
IIRC, it was Sparta's men who at one point were predominantly homosexual (?), but all had stay-at-home wives for babies as well (to produce future generations of Spartans). If I didn't confuse history entirely, then one can't really envy the Spartan females of that period.
Progressive Duplicity and moral policing - Husky - 07-09-2009
<!--QuoteBegin-Bodhi+Jul 9 2009, 04:16 PM-->QUOTE(Bodhi @ Jul 9 2009, 04:16 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->kahA kahUM ratiyA kI kathA batiyA kahi Avata hai na kacHU rI
Ayi gopAla liyo bhari a~Nka kiyo mana bhAya piyo rasa kU rI
tAhI dinA soM gaDI aMkhiyAM rasakhAni mere a~Nga a~Nga me pUrI
pai na dikhA.i parai aba bAvari dai ke biyoga bithA kI majUrI
(prema-vATikA.114)
{How do I describe that night dear, for words are escaping my tongue;
gopAla came, took me in his embrace, did what he liked, and we tasted the nectar;
And since that day, as if his eyes are stuck on every pore of rasakhAnâs body;
But I have not seen him since, left with this gift of his, this madness, this pain, this agony...}
The recent discussions on homosexuality brought to our mind that great poet of braja-bhAShA, Syed Ibrahim Piyani turned vaiShNava sAdhu rasakhAna, for whom his homosexuality itself had become the vehicle to reach kR^iShNa-devotion.
There are of course many unknown things about rasakhAna, including his parentage and early life, and we have no intentions to go into much of those details, in brief what stands almost certain from internal evidence of his own writings is that he was a homosexual, was a paThAna, used to live in dillI, and most scholars of Hindi history consider him a contemporary of Akbar. We however feel that he was an old man by the time of Akbar, and must have rather seen those times when himU had suppressed the last of Afghans and was crowned in dillI. (We have seen some hints of its mention in a couple of his lines, but that will require more analysis.)
The vaiShNava hagiography by gokuladAsa called âdosaibAvana vaiShNavan kI vArtAâ (Discussion on 252 vaiShNava-s) recounts the life of rasakhAna, and provides some details about rasakhAnaâs homosexual beginning and how through it he turned to devotion. Reproduced below is the relevant part of the prose (#218):
âso vA dillI me eka sAhUkAra rahato hato | so vA sAhUkAra ko beTo baDo sundara hato vA cHoro so rasakhAna ko mana laga gayo | vAhI ke pIcHe phiryA karai vAko jhUTo khAve ATha pahara vAhI kI naukarI karai |... eka dina chAra vaishnava milaki bhagvadvArtA karate hate | karate karate aisI bAta nikasI jo prabhu me aisa lagAvanA jaise chitta sAhUkAra ke beta me lagyo hai...â
In summary, he used to live in dillI and been in homosexual relationship with a certain vaishyaâs son, with whom he used to spend day and night and the story of their scandalous affaire was well known in the town. Once he was passing by a group of vaishnava sAdhu-s and got curious overhearing their discussion. (One sAdhu said that one must develop love for the Lord like this paThAna loves that vaishya boy). His curiosity drew him to them and when he asked he was shown a picture of kR^iShNa in shrI-nAtha form (some other descriptions mention it in muralI-manohara form, although little difference it makes). The image was so attractive that rasakhAnaâs heart was immediately struck by its beauty, and he fell in love, as rasakhAna himself says in one of the dohA-s recorded in prema-vATikA: âprema-deva kI cHabi lakhi, bhaye miyA rasakhAnaâ â one glance at the image of the Lord of Love, and miyA became rasakhAna.
He then visited vR^indAvana, and started roaming around in the company of vaiShNava vairAgI-s, eventually taking dIkShA in puShTi mata from the son of famous vallabhAchArya, composing and singing love songs for his new love, and eventually becoming the famous rasakhAna. His poems are mostly in the savaiyyA meter, and present an entirely unique strain of devotion. Above all, one can find such expressions in his work that would easily remind one of his homosexual beginnings.
It seems Moslems did not take kindly to his conversion, and some complained against him with the emperor (Akbar?), although there is no mention of any persecution of rasakhAna except for this line that he wrote:Â âkahA karai rasakhAna ko ko.U chugala-labAra | jo pai rAkhana-hAra hai mAkhana-chAkhana-hAraâ (What harm can these petitioners bring to rasakhAna, for his protector is now none lesser than kR^iShNa himself.)
According to janaShRuti, towards the end of his life he once heard a recitation of rAma-charita-mAnasa (which must have been composed just recently by young tulasIdAsa), and took to its reading and hearing very lovingly.
His immortal, famous last-wish:
mAnusa hauM tau vahI rasakhAna basauM mili gokula gaoM ke gvArana
jo pasu hauM tau kahA basu mero charauM nita nanda kI dhenu majhArana
pAhana hauM tau vahI giri kau jo dharyo kara cHatra purandara kArana
jo khaga hauM tau basero karauM mili kAlindI kUla kadamba kI DArana
(If reborn as a human, then wish to be reborn as rasakhAna, living among those shepherds of gokula;
And if I have to be reborn as an animal, for what control do I have in it, then wish to be born as a cow that would graze together with the cows of nanda;
And if I be sent as a stone, then let me be on that hill, which my Lord picked up due to the wrath of purandara;
And if I become a bird, then I wish I shall make home on the branches of those kadamba trees that grow on the banks of holy yamunA)
bhAratendu records about rasakhAna in his uttara-bhaktamAla, and counting him among other moslem-turned-Hindu devotees, he ecstatically concludes: âina musalmAna harijanan pai koTina hinduna vAriyeâ: (the gain of such hari-jana musalmAns makes cheaper to me the loss of a million Hindus.)
[right][snapback]99576[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Progressive Duplicity and moral policing - Bharatvarsh - 09-14-2009
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Shamelessness is paraded as Modern
R Vaidyanathan
13 September 2009
There has been an explosion of Modernism or, to quote a TV anchor, "the sublime
assertion of modern thinking" in the last few weeks. One was the celebration by
homosexuals after a Delhi high court ruled that homosexuality is not a criminal
activity. As if society anytime considered it criminal. Society considered it a
mental case or perversion, but never criminal.
But the queer crowd had their parades; they re-christened themselves as LGTB
[Lesbian - Gay - Trans-Gender and Bi-sexual, dragging in even the bi-sexual as
fellow travellers. They claimed to belong to a minority and demanded human
rights. Our 24 hour 'breaking news' TV mafias and main stream media [MSM] jumped into the fray. Incidentally, gays are called MSM, Men having Sex with Men, the same abbreviation for our incredible main stream media.
For a few weeks, it was made to appear that being gay is the most virtuous
thing, and if a girl is not lesbian she is missing out on something profound. I
do not know how many TV anchors or MSM of the news variety editors would
encourage their children to belong to that exalted category of LGTB.
Enter the dim-witted Celina baby, who positioned herself as an equal to the
great yoga guru Ramdev, and had the audacity to suggest debate with him. Her
claim to fame is the amount of skin she can reveal; her two minute bytes were
peddled by 24 hour non-news channels since for them it was hot copy and might
enhance their TRP's. One anchor even suggested that she is a "graduate,"
implying that she is "highly educated." That perennial rebel without a pause
with zero intelligence Mahesh Bhatt was conspicuous by the inane
inconsequentials he mouthed on "freedom."
It was bizarre to the core and revealed the slow but sure development of putting
shamelessness on a pedestal and worshipping it. Shyness is a virtue and
shamelessness is Adharma; it is completely turned upside down by our mindless
media.
Homosexuals were always present in India even before Macaulay made them
criminals by Section 377. But who cared? People may giggle, but nobody was
arrested for being gay. Society treated them with the indulgence appropriate to
such a category.
Shyness prevented society from castigating them. Nor did it punish them.
Christopher Isherwood was alleged to have been a homosexual. He was not beratedfor it. One of his friends in Calcutta reputedly jocularly commented to him notto entice young Bengali boys. Christopher was an erudite scholar associated withthe Ramakrishna Mission; his works on the Upanishads are highly rated. The point is that he was neither glorified for his sexual orientation nor berated.
Savita Bhabhi
The second case is more bizarre. There was a cartoon pornographic portal which
portrayed a lustful and ever sexually indulgent lady called Savita bhabhi. She
was always having sex with assorted groups like door to door salesmen to
neighbourhood kids to fashion show referees; the site was located in London. Its
owner came out from his assumed name of Deshmukh to the real name of Puneet
Agarwal. When his real identity became known, his family and community were
aghast and he was forced to stop it.
Pritish Nandy, writer and film producer, wrote in a national daily that "Savita
Bhabhi is a symbol of freedom, of empowerment, of the sexuality our women can
wield if they are allowed to escape the sham world we Indian men trap them in
because of our own fears of sexual inadequacy masquerading as machismo."
Adman and TV commentator Suhel Seth added that "the fact that she was called
'bhabhi' indicates a perverseness that always existed [in India] but we were in
denial about." This is the level of our mental bankruptcy and moronic approach
to any social issue. There are many more of this type parading as intellectuals
and social activists. These vultures are for the philosophy of anything goes. It
is for the TRP and not for any value system.
An assorted group of "freedom fighters" jumped into the fray to defend the right
to pornography, when the family of Puneet Agarwal itself felt that he cannot do
just any business just to get a return on investment. That man was shamed by his
family and community, but the TRP crowd was in a nauseating brawl with
government, regulators and all types of societal values, oblivious that they
were shaming themselves.
This trend started with the former Minister of Child Welfare [Renuka Chowdhary]
starting a movement to fill up pubs with young girls as some girls were attacked
in a pub in Mangalore by some fringe elements. The print media and TV,
particularly the MSM variety, made a big issue of it and encouraged young boys
and girls to go to pubs and drink. Drinking was made a virtue in the name of
freedom and right.
Page 3 has taken over the papers. It is time that all pages be numbered Page 3,
perhaps as Page 3a, 3b etc. These whiners who hardly pay for their drinks - they
are freedom fighters since they always want things free - have the audacity to
suggest what is good for the women of this society. They are arrogant, abrasive,
and absurdly self-indulgent.
Indian society is accommodative and understands the complexities of human
nature. It does not insist on linear behaviour. But the wretched and the crooked
among our media want to pitch a war between modernism and antediluvians, and
between rights and suppression. They have made a grave error of superimposing
Western debate on Indian society.
We think that when shamelessness is equated with freedom and modernity, there is
a need for transparency and full disclosure. The denizens, anchors, editors, and
correspondents who parade such shamelessness as sacred should disclose whether
they belong to such category? Whether they are from happily married families or
from broken families? Whether they will encourage their wives and Bhabhis to
behave in such fashion since it is a symbol of freedom?
They should also disclose their love life, family life and children who go to
school. And provide information if such "freedoms" are encouraged and provided
to them. If not, others will put it in the public domain. These anchors and
editors cannot get away from personal responsibility and personal behaviour when
they speak of societal norms.
It is high time some sections of our media at least expose these vermin who are
out to peddle poison as freedom, and perversion as sacred. Let us understand the
importance of shyness in some situations, and appreciate silence in many
situations. There are still concepts of virtues and perversions, and let it not
be forgotten in the TRP race.
The author is a Professor of Management; the views expressed are his own
http://www.vijayvaani.com/FrmPublicDisplay...cle.aspx?id=792<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->