Thankyou HH and Sunder for your replies.
I will ask around and gather more details when I go to India the next time around. All I know at this time is that our gotra is Kashyapa, we are somehow called Gaud (sp?) brahmins (ie the ones who didnt attend Sri Rama's celebrations on his victory over Ravana as Ravana was a brahmin and were supposedly cursed by Sri Rama) and we are decendants of Acharya Sri Hit Hari Vansh Goswami - could never figure out how all that was related to Kashyapa gotra. Thanks for your replies, guroos - you guys are tremendous assets at IF .. <!--emo&  --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Regards..
I vaguely remember my dad telling me (years and years ago) something about we might have been kshatriyas a few hundred years ago but cant confirm it so what HH says about honorary status does ring a bell. Unfortunately my dad is no more so will have to confirm it with somebody else..
If it can be confirmed then it would be a good example of mobility between varnas. <!--emo&:thumbsup--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thumbup.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='thumbup.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Thankyou HH and Sunder for your replies. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Rajesh ji, the thanks should go to Sri HH. I am only a bystander, marvelling the abundance of Knowledge, just as you are <!--emo& --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
BTW, your mention of being a Kshatriya.. You still ARE one. You need not be a Jathi Kshatriya, or a Karma Kshatriya, you could still be a Guna Kshatriya. i.e. a selfless actor in nature.
Or perhaps a Bauddhika Kshatriya <!--emo& --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> http://www.bharatvani.org/books/tfst/chi1.htm
HH/ Sundar
I belong to the maudgalya gothra (Angirasa, Maudgalya, Bharmaswa (?)), I was trying out the Gothra Survey form. Now the trouble is my subsect. I could have put it under 'Others', but I would like to seriously know more about my subsect. We are not "Vadamal", our ancestory lies in Tirunelvelli. We are Rig Vedics, and sometimes people say that we are "Chozhi" class. Now I would like to know who are these Chozhiyars - what is the basic difference between us and the "Vadamal" group. Sometimes I have seen us being a little, shall I say, "humbled" by saying how we are "lesser" mortals than the "Vadamal" group <!--emo&:unsure:--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='unsure.gif' /><!--endemo--> . I would appreciate if I could know the meaning of all this <!--emo&:blink:--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blink.gif' /><!--endemo--> .
Regards, and Thanks,
Eswar
Eswar, HH can throw better light on this one. But in the meanwhile, here is something I found on the Kerala Iyers' site. (I think we need to take Gotra and Pravara in a new thread than mixing it with Temple history.)
http://www.keralaiyers.com/sects.html
Sub sects of Kerala Iyers
Depending on the path they chose to migrate the Kerala Iyers are divided into Palakkad Brahmins and Pandikkars. The ndikkars. The Palakkad Brahmins migrated via the Palakkad pass and the Pandikkars (meaning those belonging to Pandya Nadu) migrated via Shenkottai (Aruvamozhy pass). The other wave of migration was from Tirunelveli and they maintained a separate identity. It is strange to note that though both these districts belonged to Pandya Nadu, the people who migrated from Tirunelveli consider those who migrated from Madurai as Pandikkars. They say that this sect is not through out Travancore state but in pockets around Cochin.
Till recently the identity of these groups were maintained. Cross marriages between these groups were uncommon. The Samoohams were separately maintained in towns where there is considerable population of both these groups, e.g., in Trichur, Irinjalakkuda, and Ernakulam. Most of the sub groups of Iyers like Vadamas, Brihatcharanams, Vathimas, Ashtasahasram, etc are represented among Kerala Iyers. Those belonging to Krishna Yajurveda etc. are also represented. Vadamas means those from North and Brihatcharanam means 'Big step'. Most of the Kerala iyers belong to these two groups. The other numerically powerful group is Ashtasahasram who have migrated from a village called Ennayiram in Tamil Nadu.
The Iyengars are normally absent but there are Vaishnavite villages in Pallipuram, and Thirunellayi. The Iyers of these villages wear a red line (Urdwa Pundram) as against the Vibhuthi of other iyers. They also did not have "Paramesawar Preetyartham" in Sankalpas but used to perform Viswaksena Pooja instead of Ganapathi Pooja. But over years due to possible reason of non-availability of priests, they perform their rituals similar to other Smarthas. It is important to note that their womenfolk always used to wear the ritualistic Sari measuring 9 yards similar to Iyers and not Iyengars. They also did not follow Ramanujacharya but were followers of a rebel group of Vaishnavas belonging to Ahobila.
There are two more groups of Vaishnava smarthas (research has indicated that early Vadamas preferred to wear Gopi Chandana instead of Vibhuti) in Kerala; they wear Gopi Chandana in the pattern of Madhwa Brahmins of Karnataka who speak tulu and the long Gopi Chandana mark like the Marathi Brahmins round about Pandarpur.
<b>Another interesting group is Chozhiyans. People say that they originated from Chozha Desa but the fact is that they are a sub group of Brahmins called Sholiyars who claim that 'The Great Chanakya' of Chandra Gupta's court was one of them. They were generally temple priests by profession. They also are supposed to have officiated as priests in functions of non-Brahmins. These Brahmins have tuft in front of the head similar to the Namboothiris or the Chidambaram Deekshithars. There is a proverb among Kerala Iyers that "Chozhiyan Kudumi Chumma Aadathu" meaning a Chozhiyan does not do anything without purpose. This group of Brahmins occupies mainly the villages of Kodunthirapally, Chembai, Nellayi, Padur and Vengassery.</b>
The other interesting groups of Iyers found in Kerala are the Mukkanis. They are the group of people who help the Potti (Karnataka Brahmin) head priest to perform Pooja in Thiruchendur Temple of Tamil Nadu. They say that during the invasion of Tamil Nadu by Malik Kafur, their forefathers who were the chief priests in Thiruchendur ran away and settled in a village called Mukkani. After the soldiers retreated they went back to claim their Pooja rights, they were told that due to their cowardly act they have lost this right. Most of them are settled around Trivandrum of Kerala.
There are then the Kurukkal who are a very small community doing Pooja in Shiva Temples owned and managed by Kerala Iyers in and around Palakkad. They are Shivacharyas and in the by gone era considered as inferior.
There are also Azhwars who are Bhattacharyas doing Pooja in Vishnu or Krishna Temples owned or managed by Palakkad Iyers. As mentioned earlier there is a considerable population of Iyers belonging to Krishna Yajurveda in Kerala. They perform Pratha Sandhya after the bath and again take bath before their Madyannikam. Because of this practice some people refer them as Madyanna Parayan.
Searching the net for more instances of Gotram, I found some mentions on Namboothiri site (which I am pasting below), and also of a Bengali angle to it. When I get time, I plan to consolidate this and try to make some sense out of the pravara (across India.) I am aware of "Aruvella" Niyogis in Andhra. If anyone has more info on this, or links, it would be appreciated.
http://www.namboothiri.com/articles/gothram.htm
The Smrthis as to the number of Gothrams - 7, 8, 10, and so on, upto 48. "Manusmrthi" quotes 8, while "Dharma Pradeepam" speakes of 48. The famous "Dasagothrams" (ten Gothrams) are :
1. Bhaaradwaajam,
2. Kausikam,
3. Vaatsam,
4. Kaundinyam, 5. Kaasyapam,
6. Vaasishttham,
7. Jaamadagnyam, 8. Vaiswaamithram,
9. Gauthamam, and
10. Aathreyam.
"Vishnu Bhaagavatham" has reference to the following set of seven sages (Saptharshis) :
1. Mareechi,
2. Athri,
3. Angirass, 4. Pulasthyan,
5. Pulahan, 6. Krathu, and
7. Vasishtthan.
Several among the Saptharshis referred to in "Manusmrthi" as Swayambhuva Manu's progeny and ancestors are said to be creators of Rigveda Sookthams. The Saptharshis of the present Vaivaswatha Manwantharam are :
1. Vasishtthan,
2. Kaasyapan,
3. Athri, 4. Jamadagni,
5. Gauthaman, 6. Viswaamithran, and
7. Bharadwaajan.
The Chiranjeevis (those who live eternally) who are said to have become eligible to be the next set of Saptharshis are :
1. Deepthimaan,
2. Gaalavan,
3. Parasuraman, 4. Kripan,
5. Dronan, 6. Vyaaghan, and
7. Rishyasrngan.
PRAVARAM
Pravarams are sub-classes attached to each Gothram (Click here for article: About Namboothiris). The word literally means renowned, the best, the greatest, etc. Every Gothram has three or five Pravara-Purushans (great persons) whose names are attached to the Gothram thus defining the Pravaram. Therefore, every Braahmanan, just as he has a Gothram, has a specific Pravaram too.
The performer of certain rituals like Ishti and Yaagam has to know which Pravaram he belongs to, since he has to disclose it while doing them. Some Pakazhiyan (Aaswalaayanan) families have to say their Pravaram while performing Udakakriya.
GOTHRAM - PRAVARAM - CHARANAM : OCCASIONS FOR CHANGE
There are circumstances under which a Namboothiri family's Gothram, Pravaram and Charanam are to be changed. The occasions may be (1) "Dathu" (adoption), (2) "Penkoda"/ "Veli" (marriage) or (3) "Sarvaswa Daanam Vettirikkal" or "Vettirikkal".
(1) "Dathu" : Adoption of a boy (Unni) or an adult (Namboothiri) by a family is done only when all the lines (Thaavazhi) (branches) of the family cease to have a fertile male and threat of extinction prevails. It is recognised only through a "Pathu Kayyu Dathu" (ten hands - the boy's and the two original and the two adopting parents). After adoption, the boy and all his descendants must follow a combination (or mixture) of the two Gothrams and Pravarams of the previous and new families, if any of these are different. Those alive in the family at the time of adoption, retain theirs. If later, yet another adoption takes place in this family, they take on a mixture of the two, if different, and so on. Adopting family loses their earlier duties, powers as well as Charanam and accepts those of the boy's original family.
(2) "Penkoda" / "Veli" : The "Udakapoorvam" part of Namboothiri marriage ritual releases the bride from her father's Gothram, Pravaram and Charanam. The later portion, "Paanigrahanam", of the ritual attaches her to the groom's Gothram, Pravaram and Charanam for the rest of her life.
(3) "Sarvaswa - Daanam Vettirikkal" or just "Vettirikkal" : When all branches (Thaavazhi) of a family cease to have a fertile male, instead of "Dathu", a girl of the family can be given in marriage to a Namboothiri of another family, then receive both of them to the girl's house, and transfer the entire property and assets to him. The wife and their descendants then adopt her husband's Gothram, Prvaram and Charanam (if different), and other prescribed duties. The other living members of the family continue to keep their own Gothram, Pravaram and Charanam.
Some such families now do not know their original Gothram, Pravaram and Charanam, having been a long time after the event and the death of the then living members.
Many mistakenly believe that Viswaamithra Gothram has no Pravaram. Even Namboothirs of this Gothram, have Pravarams such as Kaathyolkilam and Madhuchhandass. Inter-marriage between different Pravarams is not permitted within Viswaamithra Gothram and therefore, many among this Gothram have forgotten their Pravaram. Among Namboothiris, in Kaasyapa Gothram, there is only one Pravaram, "Naidhruvam Aavatsaaram". Inter-marriage is permitted within Aangirasa Gothram if Pravarams are different.
------------
Traditional genealogy of bengali brahmins: shANDilya gotra
http://members.tripod.com/~tanmoy/traditio...yopadhyaya.html
Traditional genealogy of bengali brahmins: sAvarNa gotra.
http://members.tripod.com/~tanmoy/traditio...gopadhyaya.html
04-29-2004, 07:22 AM
(This post was last modified: 04-29-2004, 10:43 AM by Hauma Hamiddha.)
<!--QuoteBegin-rajesh_g+Apr 27 2004, 01:06 PM-->QUOTE(rajesh_g @ Apr 27 2004, 01:06 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin--> If it can be confirmed then it would be a good example of mobility between varnas. <!--emo&:thumbsup--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/thumbup.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='thumbup.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There has been some male mobility between varNas. They are usually of the following type:
1)people of the shudra varNa or indigenous tribals or foreign settlers like various mideaval Iranian tribes (eg. Saka, Parthian and Pahallavan) have becom kshatriyas. A notable case was the ceremony of lalitAditya the kashmirian emperor, where he had brAhmaNas elevate many tribes to the Rajput status. These became the agnikula Rajputs. Some Maharatta families are also kshatriyas of this type, while others claim a more ancient kshatriya origin.
2) Tribal and local priests occasionally gained access to the brAhmaNa varNa. The gurukal sect in TN may in part comprise of such upwardly mobile individuals. There is a certain rule of manu by which over several generations such mobility may happen.
3)The kshatriya/vaishya families of the Saurashtrians have undergone elevation to the purogidar status (considered equivalent to brAhmaNa). Some of them assume titles typical of brAhmaNas like Ayyar or Ayyangar.
4)Iranian priest of the aforementioned tribes, were absorbed in North India as shAkadvIpi brAhmaNa (usually assigned to kAshyapa gotra).
5) brAhmaNas have been down-graded in the North forming part of the Bumihar section.
.........
1) In ancient vedic times such transformations, usually involving marriage relationships with famous brahmin family resulted in kshatriyas becoming brAhmaNas: maudgalya (descendents of king bhR^imyAshva), shaDmarShaNas (descendents of great ikshvAku king trasadasyu), vAdhulas (descendents of king vItayhavya, the haihaya yadu) etc became brahmins.
2) vishvAmitra's clan a famous kshatriya clan became a brahmin clan- the kaushika gotra.
3) In more later times many brahmins assumed kshatriya-hood. The bharadvAja family gave rise to the shunga kings, kANva family to the kANva dynasty, the maitreya family to the maitraka kings, the bhArgava family to the famous ga~nga dynasty of south India.
..........
choLians are an early branch of south Indian brahmins. Along with the dIkShitas of Chidambaram, they are more closely related to the nambuthiris than the other Iyer groups.
The bR^ihat charaNaM means the great sect (not great step). They were the next large sect of brahmins to populate the tamil regions.
The vaDamas are the last and came from the north as their name indicates. They are not a uniform group. The bulk of them have a famous mantra for Narmada in the saMdhya indicating that they came from the banks of the Narmada, via Andhra. Other small groups from even further north such as Himachal and Nepal, Maharashtra or just a little north from Andhra. However, many of them have homogenzied a lot in recent time. Most people these days do not recall their ancestory and the knowledge of one's precise group is being lost.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Most people these days do not recall their ancestory and the knowledge of one's precise group is being lost. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In north India people still record their family name in temples.
One can trace ancestory more than 500 years back.
Thankyou HH for another very informative post. <!--emo&:rocker--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rocker.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rocker.gif' /><!--endemo-->
If you could also cite some examples or just general information similarly for downwardly mobile varnas that would be great.
Regards..
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->There are two more groups of Vaishnava smarthas (research has indicated that early Vadamas preferred to wear Gopi Chandana instead of Vibhuti) in Kerala; they wear Gopi Chandana in the pattern of Madhwa Brahmins of Karnataka who speak tulu and the long Gopi Chandana mark like the Marathi Brahmins round about Pandarpur.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sunder i belong to Vaishnava smartha who wear Gopi Chandana instead of Vibhuti, though Rajamannargudi near Thanjavur is my native. In our family we get conflicting claims about the length of the Gopi Chandana that we should wear. And the latest i heard from that subject was that the length should reflect your Gnanam. <!--emo& --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> We speak tamil.
And i hear that there is two more sub-classification of vadamas in the Tanjavur belt as 1) Vada desathu vadama 2) Chozha desathu vadama. And i also heard from our family members that one of our fore fathers came down from Vada desa to Chozha desa (hence the vada desathu vadama) during the islamic invasion. They say that the people who migrated down south during that period generally went either to Chozha desa or Pallakkad.
So, i am not sure whether it implies Chozha desathu vadama migrated to south earlier than the vada desathu vadama.
Hi HH,
Thanks for the wealth of information.
I would like you to clarify the pravaras & sutram for SankRti gotram.
1. Does the order matter when listing the pravaras?
The sandhya book that I have lists the following 3 pravaras for SankRti gotram:
a. Angirasa, gaurIvIti, sAnkRtya
b. sAktya, gaurIvIti, sAnkRtya
c. sAktya, sAnkRtya, gaurIvIti
You website lists it as:
Angirasa, sAmkRtya, gaurivIta
Angirasa, gaurivIta, sAnkRtya
shAktya,, gaurivIta, sAnkRtya
Also is the correct pronunciation gaurivIta or gaurIvIti ?
Furthermore how am I to determine which of the pravaras is mine?
06-07-2004, 10:14 PM
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2004, 10:15 PM by Sunder.)
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Also is the correct pronunciation gaurivIta or gaurIvIti ?
Furthermore how am I to determine which of the pravaras is mine?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Mitradena, are you a Sankrithi too ? <!--emo& --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I was initiated, and taught to say my abivadhanam as follows:
Abivaadhayae, <b>Saakthya, Sankruthya, Gauriveetha</b> thraya rishae, pravaraanvithah, Sankrithi gotrah, apasthambha sutra, Yajuh.shaka adhyaayee, --- namaaham asmi Bo.H
Never said gauriveethi.
HH, you would be able to enlighten us. Perhaps we should approach HH, with fuel (samidh) in our hands.
Cool!
Long live the descendents of Sankrti!
I have seen people with last name Sankriti/ Saankritya/Sankrityan in different parts of India. Maybe we are all related!
Even I used to say gaurIvIta, but the sandhya book says gaurIvIti.
Furthermore, Rgveda verse 29 is attributed to gaurivIti sAktya and verse 73 & 74 to gaurIvIti. So gaurivIti could be the correct pronunciation.
06-08-2004, 09:29 AM
(This post was last modified: 06-08-2004, 09:31 AM by Hauma Hamiddha.)
<!--QuoteBegin-mitradena+Jun 7 2004, 11:17 AM-->QUOTE(mitradena @ Jun 7 2004, 11:17 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--> Angirasa, sAmkRtya, gaurivIta
Angirasa, gaurivIta, sAnkRtya
shAktya,, gaurivIta, sAnkRtya
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are two unrelated saMkR^ityas. 1) kevala A~ngirasa. A~ngirasa is there in their pravara.
2) shAktyas- these are vasiShThas- they have no A~ngirasa in their pravara and are descendents of shakti the son of vasiShTha through arundati.
shakti had two sons parAshara and gauravIti, whose son was saMkR^iti, from whom this gotra descends.
All currently recorded shAktya saMkR^ityas are only known to follow the Apastambha sUtra.
gauravIta is a patronymic derived from gauravIti the son of shAkti; hence it should be thus
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Perhaps we should approach HH, with fuel (samidh) in our hands. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
well that is only for great munis not for mere vrAtyas like me. <!--emo& --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Hi HH,
I found a third SankRti listed as "sAnkRti Atreya" in the Mahabharata!
The book I have is titled "Sandhyavandanam" and published by Giri trading, Chennai. ( http://www.giritrading.com)
The lists of gotra in there are taken from a book called the "Dharma Sindhu".
It lists all the 3 sankRti gotra/pravarams under the bhAradvAja section. Which I assume is a sub-section of the kevala Agirasas.
More info on the kevala Angirasa sankRti :-
The Srimad Bhagavatam states that one vidAthin belonging to the bhAradvAja family was adopted by Maharaja Bharata son of dushyanta/sankuntala.
This vidAthin's descendents were:
vitatha
bhuvamanyu(bhumanyu)
Nara
<b>SankRti</b>
SankRti had 2 sons gurudhI and rantideva. rantideva is of course the famous Kshatriya king mentioned in many puranic stories.
Their descendents were converted into brahmanas.
Hi,
Am Sathish.New to this pot. My sharman is Rangaswami and gotram Kaushika. We are North Arcot Vadama. First of all great job with the research. Iam really amazed by it. Now to my queries.Firstly, how do I find out what subsect of Vadama do I belong to. Secondly, if Intermarriage within Gotras is prohibited, does that apply to different Pravaras arising out of the same Rishi?Thirdly, whats the significant difference in usage and practice of semi secular rituals in weddings and other social occassions between different subsects belonging to the same area.
Thanks
<!--QuoteBegin-Rangaswami+Jun 23 2004, 12:19 AM-->QUOTE(Rangaswami @ Jun 23 2004, 12:19 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--> Firstly, how do I find out what subsect of Vadama do I belong to. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The only reliable way to do this is by consulting your predecessors. What kind of forehead mark do you wear? That may give a clue.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Secondly, if Intermarriage within Gotras is prohibited, does that apply to different Pravaras arising out of the same Rishi?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In most cases yes- All the bhArgavas sharing a common male ancestor for example do not inter-marry, but kevala bhArgavas and real bhArgavas may.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Thirdly, whats the significant difference in usage and practice of semi secular rituals in weddings and other social occassions between different subsects belonging to the same area.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are differences between sects of smArtas. For example in Tamil nad there the the great sect (bR^ihat charaNa) or the old migrants who have very different customs from brahmins of the northern sect or vaDamas. The vaDamas are also extremely heterogenous in themselves having multiple unrelated origins with different customs.
Some customs are gotra specific. For example the "main-line" bhArgava who practice the atharvan or were associated at some point with the atharvana shruti had some peculiarity in their marriage [cannot be discussed on open forum] and funeral customs that is no longer in vogue in the moderns. The conversion of vaiShNavism also introduced some special customs.
Finally, amongst other communities like Nayak, Nayadu, Nayar etc there are tremendous regional differences in customs even though they emerged from a common cultural stream.
Family tree- <b>Rishis & Maharishis Lineage</b>: -
1. Brahma
2. Atri & Daksha(two sons of Brahma).
3. Daksha begot Aditi
4. Aditi begot Vivasvat
5. Vivasvat begot Manu.
6. ILA (daughter of Manu - she married Soma)
7. ILA gave birth to .Pururavas.
8. Pururavas
9. Ayusha
10. Nahusha
11. Yayati(1st and greatest conquerer on earth) - he married Devayani daughter of Sage Sukracharya.
12. Devayani gave birth to two sons - Yadu and Turvasu - The descendants of Yadus were called as Yadavas.
13. Yadu had a son called Kroshtu
14. Devamidbush
15. Shoora
16. Vasudeva(Andhakas is another clan descended from another son of Kroshtu - 17. Ugrasena is the head of Andhakas - Vasudeva was the chieftain to the king Ugrasena).
18. Kamsa was the son of Ugrasena
19. Vasudeva Married Devaki the daughter of Devaka who was the brother of King Ugrasena.
20. Devaki gave birth to the SREEKRISNA
<b>Lineage of Bhrigu: -</b>
1.Bhrigu
2.Sukracharya (also called as kavi Ushanas).He had a daughter named Devayani who was married to King Yayati.
3.Chyavana (wife's name is Sukanya the daughter of King Sharyat).
4.Richika (hereditary chief of Bhrigus -the warrior priests - he was the high-priest of Mahismat, the king of Haihayas - he was considered the master of Atharvan lore - he married Satyavati daughter of king Gadhi after migrating from the present Gujarat to Punjab).
5.Jamadagni (son of Richika - Sage Jamadagni married Renuka who was affectionately called as Amba).
6.Parasurama (also called as Bhargava - Avatar - Bhagavan).
<b>Lineage of Aryas:-</b>
1.Sage Agastya(he married the great Lopadmudra - he had a daughter by name Rohini).
2.Sage Vashista(brother of Sage Agastya)
3.Sage Vishwamitra(he was the son of King Gadhi - he was called as Viswaratha - he married Rohini the daughter of Sage Agastya).
<b>Sage Vashishta's Lineage:-</b>
1.Sakthi.
2.Parasara
3.Krisna dvaipayana(Vedavyasa - he married Vatika the daughter of the great Master of Atharvan lore Sage Mahaatharvan Jaabali).
4.Suka
5.Blind Dhridrirashtr(he married Gandhari) - Kauravas
6.Pandu -(he married Prita/Kunti sister of Vasudeva - the powerful Yadava chief and the adopted daughter of King Kuntibhoj and also to Madri sister of Salya the king of Madra) Pandavas
7.Vidhur
<b>Sage Viswamithra's lineage: -</b>
1.Sunahshepa
2.Devadatta
I am a newcomer to this Forum. I am deeply impressed by the depth and width of knowledge of the participants--especially HH.
May I know how I can access the bharatavarsha site? Everytime I try to log on I get a notice that the site is FORBIDDEN !
In all Tamil Brahmin weddings a charade of the Bridegroom being intercepted on his way to Benares for further studies is being enacted. I have seen similar things in Tamil speaking Iyengars of Karnataka also. Is this practice prevalent throughout this country? I will be grateful for any information about this.
To my knowledge only gotra pravaras of three generations are being called out during Tamil Brahmin marriages nowadays. Were they reciting SEVEN generations of gotra-pravaras in days of yore?
Thanks
Hi,
I am new to this forum and I am amazed at the knowledge that you guys have.
I would like to know if anyone has heard of Sankethis. They are a particular sect of people, originally Tamil brahmins who migrated to Karnataka. Their dilect is a mixture of Tamil and Kannada.
I would like to know more about their style of wearing the nine yards saree and the kind of forehead mark that they wear. Any info about this will be appreciated.
Please do not give me anything from google because i have read all thats in there.
Anyone who is a sankethi / mysorean / has moved with these people, can give their personal observations .....
thanks in advance...
regards,
suman.
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