Nuclear Thread - 2

ramana · (This post was last modified: 08-24-2007, 02:49 AM by ramana.)

X-posted...
QUOTE("Rangudu")<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE("ramana")The angst is about what else is ther ein the deal - the side bars and the winks and nods.
Ok how do you address that issue then? If you believe there are winks and nods then you essentially do not believe the PM. If that is the case, then whatever assurances he gives will also be disbelieved. The only alternative then is to get rid of this deal.

What you are asking is akin to proving that God exists or whether humans have a soul etc.</div>

But God exists and humans do have a soul which goes back to God. So that not for debate.

What bothers me is the strange drive not to have a debate and if one occurs it should be under the non voting clause and that too between the holidays so that it will be short and swift. Sounds like Hiranyakashyapu's clauses.
And we are to believe that they are strong supporters of democracy and debate. "The Indian tradition is to debate the issues to the fullest extent and in the end the dominant view triumphs and there is silence"- Karen Armstrong.

MMS and his coterie- Montek bhai, Sanjay Baru and other nameless folks saw the American military, economic and cultural 'phalanx' and signed on to the program without getting buy-in form the rest of India. They think they are doing this in the best interests of India. That is what all previous folks who first saw phalanxes also thought.

It took a march of few hundred miles to show the hollowness of the phalanx on the banks of the Hydphases. And the memory was erased for two millenia and shows up only in the blue eyes of the frontier tribes.

Maybe India needs its own second Hydphases to find its true self.

08-23-2007, 03:38 AM

ramana,
I am shocked how paid media and other govt agencies are trying to suppress debate and diverting into religious insult. They think themselves as Third Reich.
They should stop calling India largest democracy.

Worst logic they have now is BJP started and Congress is completing.
Its like I told my family that I want to buy dress for wedding which should look good on me, my intention was to have nice Saree. After week my relative who is married to western woman, came and they decided to bring mini skirt for me because it looks trendy, western, exposed legs will make it sexy and good.
Now when I started screaming hell I was looking for something else, but my relatives are claiming that you ask for dress which should look good on you. So here it is, wear it or go to hell.

QUOTEMMS and his coterie- Montek bhai, Sanjay Baru and other nameless folks saw the American military, economic and cultural 'phalanx' and signed on to the program without getting buy-in form the rest of India.
There is more to it. Wait and see. <!--emo& Big Grin

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

ravish · (This post was last modified: 08-23-2007, 07:45 AM by ravish.)

There is nothing secret in the Agreement as it will have to pass through US legislation process. In India , it has been shared with so many of our top political leaders.The main noise is political rather than on any of the clauses in the Agreement. For the BJP, it cannot allow the Congress to take the credit on anything to do with nuclear. For Left, anything to do with the USA, except for sending their own children to that place for a better life is too bad for the nation.
Given these limitations , the political reactions on the deal will develop to ensure if some political instability can be brought into the otherwise calm surroundings in the corridors of power in Delhi.

08-23-2007, 11:15 AM

QUOTEThere is nothing secret in the Agreement as it will have to pass through US legislation process
Is India is 51st state of US? May be I missed handover or surrender ceremony on 15 th Aug?

Why it should not be passed by Indian Parliament? Why we have to wait for contents from US Congress? I know I will get text when it will come to floor in US Congress. When US Congress can go through debate, Why not India?
In US, they make available text to constituents on request (free of cost), why India is not letting its citizen its content?
Why Indian PM is running away? Ofcourse in US, US Congress will bat for their own interest not for India. So back to question, Indian PM is working for US or India. I know he is appointed PM, but who had appointed him?
Either call Indian Congress is new Third Reich or let this deal go through vote.

QUOTEAgreement. For the BJP, it cannot allow the Congress to take the credit on anything to do with nuclear.
Don't know how to make you understand? Your logic is hilarious.
Did BJP had deal in draft format?
It was not, then how you can compare apples with oranges.

Columbus started his journey for India and endup in North America, now BJP started journey, who knows where Congress will land.
If people keep saying that Columbus started for India and North America is India, so God help me. <!--emo& Big Grin

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

It is not a question of credit, but can't trust PMO and MEA.

QUOTEthe political reactions on the deal will develop to ensure if some political instability can be brought into the otherwise calm surroundings in the corridors of power in Delhi.
According to KP Nayyar now a days those corridors are filled with paid vested interest group.

Its better to deal die then a deal on every Indian throat forever.
I know some babus will lose money or unable to send their kids to US univ, hey they can be spy as lot does by joining World Bank or other foundations or study circle in US.
Nothing is bad for country, if it is not a honest deal.

Honest deal should go through vote in parliament. Every deal, bills in US go through Congress and Senate, lot of time President loses and he conceded defeat gracefully, why not in India? India's so called democracy is less than 60 yrs (minus emergency), how it will grow? Of course, not by scare tactic?

08-23-2007, 11:52 PM

India in Crisis Over U.S. Nuke Deal

08-24-2007, 01:07 AM

QUOTELet Left do it now 
The Pioneer Edit Desk
And share blame for the mess
The Central Committee of the CPI(M) has met and decided, as was expected, to endorse the Polit Bureau's stand on the 123 Agreement to operationalise the India-US civil nuclear cooperation deal. Those looking for straws to clutch as the UPA Government inexorably inches closer to a looming crisis would claim that CPI(M) general secretary Prakash Karat's comments to mediapersons after the two-day meeting of the Central Committee indicate a softening in the stand of the Marxists and hence suggest that the Left is willing to step back rather than force the issue by taking the conflict to a point of no return. But this would be an erroneous assessment and while it may calm frayed nerves in the Treasury Benches, it is unlikely to bring about any material change in the situation that has now gathered a momentum of its own. The Central Committee has recorded that it "does not want the current crisis to affect the Government", but it has added a caveat: "However, this is contingent upon the Government not proceeding further with the agreement." For good measure, it has authorised the Polit Bureau "to take whatever necessary measures to see that the agreement is not operationalised." Lest the Marxists's intention be misinterpreted despite such clarity in the Central Committee's resolution, reiterating the CPI(M)'s official position, Mr Karat made it a point to tell newspersons: "If the Government decides to operationalise the agreement, the responsibility for the future of this Government lies with the Government... It is dependent on how the Government acts."

The Prime Minister has only two options at this stage: He can either 'act' and push ahead with operationalising the deal by initiating discussions with the IAEA on India-specific safeguards as a prelude to taking India's case to the 45-nation Nuclear Suppliers' Group, or he can call a halt to the process. Either way, the Prime Minister has to make his Government's decision public; he may have succeeded in keeping the deal a secret till the text of the 123 Agreement was finalised, but he cannot conduct discussions with either the IAEA or the NSG behind the smokescreen of secrecy. In a sense, he finds himself trapped between a rock and a hard place, a situation as much of his own making as that of the Left. So does the Congress find itself in a massive jam: If it gives the political go-ahead to the Prime Minister, it will signal the breaking of relations with the Left; if it tells the Prime Minister to lump the deal, then it will run the risk of losing face both at home and abroad. Mr Karat, therefore, has summed up the situation without over-stating the Left's contention by asserting that "it is dependent on how the Government acts". No doubt, this is excellent political strategy, but it does not necessarily fetch credit to the Left, especially the CPI(M). If 'ideology' is the main issue that has energised the comrades into demonstrating that they can do more than just 'bark' at the Government, then there is no reason why they can't reach out and topple the regime. Not only would that prove they mean business and are willing to go to any extent, but also spare the country needless political instability. Let's face it: With each passing day, the UPA Government is becoming increasingly untenable and its authority is rapidly diminishing. If it must exit, let the departure not be delayed. More important, let the Left not escape its share of the blame for the consequences of its politics of cynical opportunism.Â


So why he want to keep it sceret anymore, bring it out.

08-24-2007, 06:17 AM

Worse will come
Unless others stand up for the anti-nuclear rules

**acharya** · 08-24-2007, 09:31 PM

On the Spot - Tavleen Singh
Subservience has always been a reality
Thursday, August 23, 2007 9:38:16 IST
The BJP should have been supportive of the nuclear deal but managed to end up on the other side
for :
Political developments in the capital are moving with such speed that it has become risky to leave the environs of Delhi if you are in the business of writing political columns. I returned last week after a short sojourn away to find everyone discussing the imminent demise of Dr. Manmohan Singhâs government with the certainty that it was going, going gone and speculation only on when. The funny thing is that nobody seems happier about this than the Congress Party itself. In a political crisis the hardest thing to find is someone who tells you anything worthwhile on the record so you will have to take my word for it when I tell you that I have my information from what we in the trade call âhigh level sourcesâ.

The Karat school
When I heard rumours of the government falling the first thing I did was call someone in government to confirm if he believed he was on the verge of losing his job. He said, âYes. It seems certain that the government will fall but we arenât worried about elections. We will do much better than people are giving us credit for. I think we could get more than 170 seats next time so we will be the single largest partyâ.
He added that in his view the Marxists were going to do worse than they thought but were bringing things to a head because of the impression among those who belong to the Prakash Karat school of thinking that a third front government could become possible after the next election. There are wiser people on the Left who believe it would be a mistake to plunge the country into political instability by forcing an early election but the Karat school allegedly believes that the Left will be in a position to dictate who will be Prime Minister next time. Divisions in the politburo on this point led to the CPM calling a meeting of its central committee which is expected to make the final decision on whether the Marxists will withdraw their support to the government. This would mean either elections in winter or a minority government that could limp along till some time next year.
An interesting aspect of this political crisis is that the once mighty Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) has been reduced to playing a walk-on part in the drama. In the bitter words of a BJP friend, âWe have been reduced to being the B team of the Marxists. The sad thing is that the nuclear deal is in Indiaâs national interest. You only need to see how angry China and Pakistan are to gauge thisâ. The BJP which opened the way to closer relations with the United States should have been supportive of the nuclear deal but managed to end up on the other side. And, is now being swept along in the momentum of the Leftâs objections at a time when it seems unprepared to face the electorate. Recent elections in Uttar Pradesh and Bihar showed that the party has failed to improve its appeal with voters and according to the partyâs own assessments is likely to face an anti-incumbency factor in Madhya Pradesh and Rajasthan. It barely exists in southern and eastern India and is fighting with the Shiv Sena in the west. Gujarat remains a state that the BJP could win but this is not going to make the difference the party needs if it wants to dictate who our next Prime Minister will be.
So the only beneficiary of the government falling is likely to be Congress. Newspaper polls indicate that the Prime Minister is being seen as the hero and a man ready to sacrifice his government for what he believes to be the national interest. Prakash Karat is being seen as a bully and a traitor. Rarely, before have there been so many analysts in the national media attacking the Marxists for what is seen as their subservience to China.

A Left Centre?
This subservience has always been a reality but this is the first national political crisis in which it has been on full display. The charge that the nuclear deal compromises Indiaâs âsovereigntyâ because of limits on testing and reprocessing is not something that bothers urban, educated, middle class Indians and in rural parts the deal is not an issue. So what exactly does Prakash Karat seek to achieve by bringing down the government? The only reason that makes sense is that the Marxists could be under the impression that fresh general elections will throw up a coalition of small, regional parties who will be dependant on Marxist support and easier to control than Congress. Ever since Dr. Manmohan Singh became prime minister he has been ordered around by his Leftist allies as if they were running the government and not him. If he has finally taken a stand against their bullying tactics he has done so over a matter of foreign policy that he considers vital for Indiaâs national interest. He is not in a position to back down now and the Marxists are not in a position to back down either without ending up with large dollops of egg on their face. It is a situation of their own creation and if voters respond by reducing their seats in the next Lok Sabha they will get what most people view as a comeuppance that has been a long time coming.

08-24-2007, 10:56 PM

Support to any deal should be given only after understanding deal, Do these sold media knows the content before saying for or against?
Agents are passing article and money to these journalist and they are writing whatever others want to listen.

Government biggest mistake is hiding content of this deal. Letâs see how long third Reich Congress and Gestapo MEA manage to sell country.
I have to say Gestapo MEA had done pretty good job saving âQâ, ready to raise issue with Pakistan regarding Gurdawara but kept their mouth shut for demolition of temples in Malaysia and atrocities against Hindus in Pakistan, Bangladesh and Saudi Arabia.

**acharya** · 08-25-2007, 12:28 AM

Media Watch - M.V. Kamath

Nuke issue unites ideological rivals
Friday, August 24, 2007 11:47:48 IST
A fallout of the 123 Agreement between India and the US may be that international treaties and bilateral agreements will have to be approved in Parliament

for :

Few issues in recent times have attracted so much media attention as the 123 Agreement between the United States and India. Interestingly enough, for once the Left Parties seem to be in agreement with the BJP. The Indian Express (August 8) reported that the Left Parties have joined the growing chorus of opposition to the civil nuclear pact under the heading: 123 Not Right, say Left. The report said that âin words that recalled the BJPâs condemnation of the dealâ the Left Parties have pledged to âpress for a constitutional amendment for bringing international treaties and bilateral agreements for approval in Parliamentâ.
The strongest media support came editorially from The Hindu (August 6) which said of the agreement that âit is sound and honourable and âthe assurances provided to Parliament by Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in 2006 have been fulfilled virtually in their entiretyâ. In a full-length editorial the paper however admitted that ârealism demands that we recognise the limitations of the 123 agreementâ, noting that âwe must not allow the 123 to become new leverage to pull India deeper into the US strategic embrace, especially in the military and political spheresâ. It also said that while the Manmohan Singh government deserves âfull creditâ for negotiating an agreement that is âindisputably to the advantage of Indiaâs nuclear programme and energy sector,â it needs to be reminded âthat its breakthrough will count for little if it turns out that the hidden cost is a further erosion of external independenceâ.

The critique
From reports appearing in the media it is clear that the government is trying its best to convince the public that the agreement is good for the country, an opinion not shared by many scientists. Thus, writing in The Indian Express,A. N. Prasad, a former Director of BARC has taken strong â and logically argued â exception to the treaty, saying that âWe are now in effect reduced to a mere recipient state mandated by the Hyde Act to carry out a set of doâs and donâts and strive to earn a good behaviour report card to become eligible to continue receiving what they (US) can offerâ¦â. The Pioneer (July 31) carried two articles, one by Satish Chandra which was extremely damning and another by C.P. Bhambri which plainly said that âThe UPA government, for extremely wrong reasons, has put all its eggs in the American basket.â Satish Chandra damned the Hyde Act saying that it, âmakes US cooperation conditional on many humiliating provisions restricting the independence of Indian foreign policy,â keeping India âunder constant threat of termination of cooperationâ. He also charged that, âThe grease lubricating the nuclear deal is the prospect of multi-billion dollar contracts (with US firms) not just for nuclear reactors but also for arms purchasesâ.
Perhaps the strongest criticism of the deal is in an article that appeared in The Hindu, written by someone who âhas had a long association with Indiaâs technological establishment and prefers a discussion of the issues rather than his identity.â Obviously, he is a top scientist who does not want to be recognised by the government. The author expressed his surprise that âcommentators seem to be outdoing even the party spokesman in praising the governmentâ adding that âin the case of the India-US nuclear deal, one must concede that the P.R. machine has been phenomenally effectiveâ. It is almost unbelievable. The attack against the BJP â and more especially the Left â has become vicious. The Times of India (August 9) while conceding that âThere are hurdles still ahead for the agreement (and) it has to be endorsed by US Congress, the International Atomic Energy Agency and Nuclear Suppliersâ Groupâ damned the Left saying that âit is a ritual with the Left to oppose the government while continuing to support it from outside (and) apparently it does not prevent them from making common cause with the BJP which it otherwise claims to detestâ.
The Left incidentally deserves condemnation for various reasons but surely not on this ground. Why has Congress been courting the Left if it doesnât trust it? If the point is made that out ânational sovereigntyâ is being sold, according to Jug Suraiya (writing in The Times of India) ânational sovereignty is a portmanteau termâ considering that âsometimes more weightage has to be given to one word and less to the otherâ â and one hasnât come across a more strange logic. Suraiya proceeds to damn the CPI which originally dismissed Indiaâs freedom struggle as a âbourgeois movementâ which it wouldnât âtouch with an ideological bargepole borrowed from the Soviet Unionâ.

Kowtowing media
What has that got to do with the 123 agreement? And what was The Times of Indiaâs own role in pre-independence days? The Indian Express (August 9) was equally vicious. As its editorial put it: âIf the BJP was utterly opportunistic in attacking the nuclear deal with the United States, crude anti-Americanism masquerading as anti-imperialism has pushed the CPM into embracing what it calls right-wing ultra-nationalistsâ. The CPI-CPM deserves strong criticism, but should this be on the issue of the nuclear deal? Indian scientists are sulking. A certain kind of terrorism has been unleashed against them to silence them, which is a frightening thought. Are we allowing freedom of thought and expression or is the government trying to shut off any opposition? What are we coming to?
If the Express is to be believed, mot of the CPMâs arguments like those of the BJP are a deliberate misreading and misinterpretation of the Hyde Act. According to it âthe Congress leadership, however, must have the courage of conviction to call the CPMâs political bluffâ. âWhat is at stakeâ said the Express âis not merely nuclear cooperation with the US, but the very history and legitimacy of Congressâs claim to defending Indiaâs national interestsâ. Amen. What all this amounts to is to strangle discussions, impose one view on the country held sacrosanct and turn Indian democracy into a mockery. Have we forgotten 1975 and the Emergency? Canât someone argue contrary to the will of the government without being told to shut up? Is political wisdom the monopoly of any one part that every citizen has to accept without questioning? Shades of Sanjay Gandhi! One thought India has grown up. Apparently times havenât changed. Nor has the kowtowing media.

08-25-2007, 12:51 AM

QUOTEPM trying to scuttle N-debate: BJP 
Pioneer News Service | New Delhi
Govt must tell how it address Left's concerns, says Opposition
The BJP on Thursday accused the Manmohan Singh of deliberately avoiding a discussion on civil nuclear deal in Parliament and demanded that he should take the Parliament and the nation into confidence about how he hopes to address the concerns of the Left parties on the issue.

"What the Government thinks or plans to do with regard to the nuclear deal is not a private affair to be sorted out between the Left and the Congress. It concerns the nation and the Government cannot ignore the main Opposition party in this matter," BJP Parliamentary Party leader VK Malhotra told the mediapersons.

He sought to blame the "delay" in Prime Minister Manmohan Singh making a statement in Parliament on the India-US nuclear deal for the turbulence in the country's stock markets.

"This delay has created uncertainty in the country. Sensex has plummeted. There is uncertainty in economic and other fields. He (Manmohan Singh) should make the statement as soon as possible," Malhotra said.

He also demanded Singh disclose to Parliament how his Government would address concerns raised by its Left supporters on the nuclear accord with the United States.

"The Prime Minister should take Parliament and the nation into confidence about his talks with the Left," he said. The BJP leader maintained his party would vociferously raise its objections in Parliament over what it sees as a possible impact the nuclear deal would have on India's strategic options.

He said the Opposition would be satisfied only if Singh renegotiates the pact with the US in the light of the objections raised over the India-specific Hyde Act. Malhotra said his party would also seek a debate in Parliament on the Sachar Committee report as he accused the Government of an overdrive in Muslim welfare scheme.

"The Government is trying to cover up the loss of Muslim support, which it has suffered because of 123. It is trying to come out with a heavy dose of appeasement measures. There should be a debate therefore in Parliament on the issue."

Malhotra said his party would also seek a discussion on prices, farm issues and internal security.

ramana,
Looks like IM may create problem for Third Reich COngress.

ramana · (This post was last modified: 08-25-2007, 01:49 AM by ramana.)

There is strong possibility that this whole mess is a tactic between Left and INC to deny BJP its rightful place as the prinicipal opposition party in teh Parliament.

If one notices the INC talks to Left as if it is the only legitimate party that has issues and concerns on the 123 agreement. And the Left is a UPA supporter. The BJP is being ignored or marginalized.

Glad they noticed that and can take some effective action to restore democracy.

One reason MMS is avoiding debate is he will have to acknowledge the role of BJP in getting the deal and how it was massaged/nudged with their inputs along the way as revealed by KP Nayar in the Telegraph. In that case it would reduce his glory and legacy and for the INC it would be sleeping with the enemy and bring instant withdrawl of support from the Left.

**acharya** · 08-25-2007, 02:34 AM

The Moving Finger Writes

123 Agreement: We cannot trust the US
By M.V. Kamath

When all is said and doneâand so much has already been said and doneâin the matter of the 123 Agreement between India and the United States, there is only one question that we need to address ourselves to: Can we trust America? The plain and simple answer is: We canât.

When all is said and doneâand so much has already been said and doneâin the matter of the 123 Agreement between India and the United States, there is only one question that we need to address ourselves to: Can we trust America? The plain and simple answer is: We canât.

The US is determined to hold on to two aims: One, to remain the only Super Power on earth, unchallenged and unchallengeable and two, to maintain an economic stranglehold on all countries, especially the developing ones and, most notably, India.

It is no sin on the part of the United States to entertain such vain hopes, only, India does not have to succumb to them, which is exactly what Washington expects Delhi to do. And we have fallen for false promises in a big way.

The record of the United States in the matter of winning trust is abominable and, in this regard, its past history tells it all. It is doubtful whether it would have gone to the succour of even Britain when Hitler started World War II. It joined the conflict only when Japan attacked its Navy at Pearl Harbour. It made friends with the Shah of Iran when it needed him most. When he ceased to be of any use, he was unceremoniously dumped. When it suited its purpose, it gave Pakistan every assistance possible and it couldnât care less if that hurt India, described as the single largest democracy in the world. When it suited its purpose again, Saddam Hussain was given full support in terms of arms and equipment. When it didnât, the US turned against him in full fury and ultimately had him hanged. To keep the Soviet Union out of Afghanistan, the US encouraged Pakistan to help set up the most reactionary forces in Islam, notably the Taliban and Al Qaida and gave liberal economic help to the ISI. As long as Musharraf was agreeable to be a poodle, the US went along with him.

Now, aware of its irresponsibility but unwilling to acknowledge it publicly, it is dead set to attack the very terrorists it once actively supported, irrespective of what Musharraf thinks. America couldnât care less for Pakistani sensitivities, forcing Musharraf to say: âWe are not with you if you are not concerned about our sensitivities. We have our inner self-respect. We will take everybody on board. We are not here to play your game. We are here to protect our country.â

Well said, even if it is too late. Washington may finally manage to have him thrown out and he would deserve it. But it is a warning to the UPA government never to trust the United States on matters pertaining to our interests. If Washington thinks it is important and necessary in its self-interest to betray India, it would do so gladly and without the slightest compunction.

Dr Manmohan Singh is warned. US Under Secretary of State Nicholas Burns is reported as saying that Washington will act as Indiaâs âshepherdâ at the Nuclear Suppliersâ Group (NSG) to clear the next hurdle in the way of their civil nuclear deal getting the final approval of the US Congress. Maybe. It is right now in the US interest to befriend India. But let us remember that in the end India has to bow down to a tricky American lawâthe so-called Ryde Actâthat is highly dictatorial in its content and essence. And India has become a supplicant to its disgrace and, worse still, the UPA has not hesitated to engage in an information war against its own citizens by giving selective briefing to a naÃ¯ve media.

Even The Hindu (August 6) which editorially supported the 123 Agreement as âsound and honourableâ has felt it necessary to note that âwe must not allow 123 to become new leverage to pull India deeper into the US strategic embrace, especially in the military and political spheres.â

The hidden cost to India is immeasurable. India will be turned into a debtor nation, at Washingtonâs mercy. As A.N. Prasad, a former Director of Bhabha Atomic Research Centre and former Consultant on Safeguards at the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) has notedâand nobody can accuse him of lacking in expertiseââthere have been overt suggestions in the Hyde Act to the (US) Administration for not only attempting capping (of Indiaâs national security efforts) but also try to eventually roll back our strategic programme and report to the Congress.â Are we to become slaves to an American law? Delhi is warned. Two things must be taken into consideration: One, we should never let down Russia which has come to our help when we needed it, just to get some transient assistance from the US. Two, we have plenty of thorium available in the country and we must make use of it. It may take time, but at least we will not be dependent on the whims and fancies of the US and its self-serving laws.

Writes Shri Prasad: âThe steady progress India is making with the starting construction of the first 500 Mwe Prototype Fast Breeder Reactor (PFBR) is an envy of many in the advanced world.â We should not let our own scientists down. As another writer with long association with Indiaâs technological establishment but who has declined to be named (obviously he will get into trouble with the UPA government if his identity gets known) writes: âMoving the nuclear energy cycle to thorium as quickly as possible will vastly reduce our dependence on imports, since thorium is plentifully available in India. This, however, requires a strong R&D effort. Demotivating Indiaâs scientific community through a deal that has little support amongst them is not the best way to go about it.â

The Indian public is being fooled. It was evident in the body language of Dr Anil Kakodkar, chairman of the Indian Atomic Energy Commission when in an interview he said just âyesâ when asked whether he was satisfied with the 123 Agreement as published. What Shri M.E. Narayanan, National Security Adviser said notwithstanding, we are being beguiled and ensnared to sell our long-term interest for short-term gains. It is better to stay away from the US and be a friend than to be a friend only to be futurely betrayed. The Indian Vishwamitra is being enticed by the American Menaka and he is willingly letting himself to be taken for a ride. According to Shri Narayanan what we have got âis as good a text as one can possibly getâ which is poor consolation.

It is better to be careful than clever. Nothing is more damaging than wishful thinking, a point that National Security Advisers would be wise in remembering. Dr Manmohan Singh, Sir: You have been warned of America, beware!

08-25-2007, 05:57 AM

QUOTEThere is strong possibility that this whole mess is a tactic between Left and INC to deny BJP its rightful place as the prinicipal opposition party in teh Parliament.
That is why they are treating BJP second largest party as lepers.

Now someone should monitor who are those 150 people involved in this deal and watch their march to different Foundation and study circles in US.

Indian National Congress reminds initial stage of Third Reich, suppress one group and pop up others to destroy suppress group.
They have traitor Babus and external agencies to support their great agenda/Game.

Role of so-called western resident Indian elite will give everyone shock.

Till now, Moron Singh refused to give any details, He is only talking with Left.
Jaya gave him real good and honest slap, but he is shameless person.
No action against R Sen is not surprising, Indian diplomats never fails to show diplomat card when they receive illegal parking tickets, they don't care how Indians feel, NRI are embarrassed when they see who are representing them, but when deal is not going according to their own wish they use undiplomatic language against MPs, and shamelessly they deny and still want to retain position.
Every thing is sick.

Bodhi · (This post was last modified: 08-25-2007, 09:55 PM by Bodhi.)

What I am most surprised about is the type and amount of coverage to the deal, and left's opposition - in the english (and Indic) news papers and TV channels. They are all out to:

1) "Educate" the people that the deal is good, and as good as it can get, even better than what china got.
2) Left's stand is understandable, and respectful. They are opposing it on a plank of the matter of principal. Red Salutes to the Comrades!
3) BJP/George Fernandes/Arun Shourie etc. are irrelevent - dont even show what they are doing.

Now, they have moved on to selling a better and more important news for the future of India - that is the Jail sentances for Sanjay Dutt and Salman Khan. Creating a nostalgia - and even a sense that how great these folks are and that the poor folks are being victimized unjustly.

08-26-2007, 02:58 AM

QUOTERSS turns Red on 123 
Pioneer News Service | New Delhi
Amid the ongoing war of words between the Left parties and Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, the RSS has joined the criticism of the Indo-US civil nuclear agreement against the ruling coalition and has supported the red brigade for its "posturing" as justified.

"Whatever be the explanation for the Congress party's new-found arrogance, the Left is justified in its posturing (over the nuclear deal)," an editorial in Sangh mouthpiece Organiser said.

"There is no mention of the deal in the common minimum programme under which this bizarre Government was formed. There was no need for UPA to take forward the deal compromising national interest," the Sangh write-up said. It accused the ruling coalition of using tricks to avoid early elections and said Prime Minister Manmohan Singh could have avoided confrontation with the Left over the deal.

"The Left is understandably hurt that the Prime Minister chose to take to the street a matter that could have been sorted out at the dining table," the editorial said. The RSS editorial alleged that the Prime Minister had at all levels tried to undercut the Left.

"Right from the appointment of the Finance, Commerce and Industry Ministers to the constitution of the Planning Commission, where he smuggled in IMF retainers, Prime Minister pushed his own peculiar agenda," it claimed. The article insisted withdrawal of support to the UPA could have been the "most honourable" course for the Left. "But the party is hugely confused; confounded by the fear of going to the people. The pro-deal lobby is planting stories that the CPM will meet its Waterloo in an election," it said. It also challenged Singh to seek a mandate from the public.

"After all he has no popular mandate other than that of Sonia Gandhi's. The supporting parties are not sure of his capacity to lead them to an electoral victory. That is why they want to delay the poll." The editorial rejected suggestions that an early election could arrest economic growth, saying any occasion to test public mood is welcome in a democracy.

"In the 1990s, we had four elections to the Lok Sabha and six Governments. It did not arrest our economic growth. The talk of stability is all bunkum. What India needs is a responsive, popular and intensely nationalist Government," it said.

08-27-2007, 11:54 PM

Doubts grow over U.S.-India nuclear deal 
QUOTEIt contains a nonbinding clause directing the U.S. president to determine whether India is cooperating with American efforts to confront Iran about its nuclear program. That has been seized on by Indian critics as proof that Washington intends to direct New Delhi's foreign policy.

The nuclear deal does not address what happens if India tests an atomic weapon â a sign, American critics say, that New Delhi got too much out of the pact.

Indian critics, meanwhile, argue that the lack of an explicit right to test is a sign the U.S. aims to shut down the country's weapons program.

......

That, Indian and American officials privately say, could end up scuttling the pact, which still has to be approved by U.S. lawmakers, delaying it to the point where it is no longer viable.

08-28-2007, 06:40 AM

<!--emo&

--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /> India finds uranium in icy Ladakh
Scientists have for the first time found uranium in 'exceptionally high concentration' in Ladakh, the icy Himalayan region in Jammu and Kashmir that has strategic significance for India.

Bangalore, Karnataka, India, 2007-08-26 12:45:02 (IndiaPRwire.com)

Scientists have for the first time found uranium in 'exceptionally high concentration' in Ladakh, the icy Himalayan region in Jammu and Kashmir that has strategic significance for India.

Samples of rocks analysed in a German laboratory have revealed uranium content to be as high as 5.36 percent compared to around 0.1 percent or less in ores present elsewhere in the country.

India badly needs uranium to fuel its nuclear power plants and the proposed India-US nuclear deal is all about importing it. The Ladakh find may cheer those opposed to the deal even though detailed exploration and mining may take years.
<img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/clap.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='clap.gif' /> gr8 news.
I think now US will back out of the nuclear deal as we don't need any uranium supplies
+
v have massive sources of Thorium which is the future of nuclear fuel.

08-30-2007, 08:00 PM

Govt forms panel, decides not to operationalise N- DealQUOTENew Delhi, Aug 30: In order to resolve the ongoing impasse over the Indo US nuke deal, the government today buckling under the Left pressure decided not to operationalise the deal. Earlier a meeting took place between Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and senior CPI(M) leader Sitaram Yechury, here on Thursday.

"The operationalisation of the deal will take into account the committee`s findings," a statement read out by External Affairs Minister Pranab Mukherjee said after a meeting of the Congress and Left parties, bringing to an end the three-week stand-off between the two sides on the deal.
...........

In place of giving statement in Parliament, Babu Moron Singh came out with another 59, 60, 61.... committee. People call Left traitor and Moron Singh is trusting Commies to work with them.

08-31-2007, 08:11 AM

QUOTERenegotiate 123, have own Hyde Act: Advani 
Pioneer News Service | New Delhi
Leader of Opposition in the Lok Sabha LK Advani has ended speculation about change in the BJP's opposition to the India-US civil nuclear agreement and called for renegotiation of the deal after amending the domestic Atomic Energy Act.Â 

Advani's demand for change in the AE Act is being interpreted as a suggestion to the Government to bring in a law similar to the US Hyde Act, the enabling legislation for the 123 Agreement between the US and India.

Clarifying BJP's stand in the wake of certain observations he made in a recent interview to a newspaper, Advani told party MPs on Thursday that, "Actually it (the interview) was intended to clarify how the BJP's opposition to the agreement stems from considerations of pure national interest, and not from any kind of anti-Americanism which may be motivating the Leftist parties".

Calling for renegotiation of the nuclear deal, Advani said a suggestion had been made recently that as the domestic laws of the US were the ones that are causing the problem, India should examine whether it could alter its laws, such as the Atomic Energy Act, 1962 in such a way as to insulate our strategic objectives.

"If that can be done, we should strengthen our laws, and, on the basis of those altered laws, renegotiate the 123 Agreement," he said.

Advani asserted that the position of the BJP on this vital question had been stated consistently and unambiguously in a series of statements over the last two years and each of the statements was fully deliberated upon and approved by the senior-most leaders of the party under the guidance of former Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee.

"These are the statements that my colleagues, Yashwant Sinha and Arun Shourie were asked to release to the media. These statements embody the party's considered view on every aspect of the deal. There is no change in that position," he said.

Referring to the interview, Advani sought to emphasise that the provisions of the Hyde Act militated against India's sovereignty, especially in regard to the conduct of foreign policy.

He said if the 123 Agreement was enforced in its present form, it would seriously impair the country's nuclear weapons programme, and jeopardise India's strategic objectives.

Advani pointed out that the 123 Agreement was the first step towards operationalising the Hyde Act, and other US laws. Several of the requirements of those laws have been built into the 123 Agreement. Moreover, the agreement specifically provided that, in implementing it, the party concerned - the US in this case - shall be governed by its national laws. Hence, provisions of the Hyde Act and other relevant laws shall apply with full force, he said.

"These facts are indisputable - and just as unacceptable. They push the country not into a 'strategic partnership' with the US but a 'strategic subservience' to the USA, which the BJP cannot accept," he said.

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