12-10-2007, 10:20 PM
(This post was last modified: 12-10-2007, 10:24 PM by ravish.)
U are ignorant of the very fundamental policy of the Govt of India on Anand margis. Even today, a tab is maintained on them. It was started at a time when the communists were no where around and the Congress had absolute power majority in Lok Sabha. Shri Prabhat Ranjan Sarkar faced trial on murder charges in the Sessions court at Patna. At that time, Shri Karpoori Thakoor was CM.
Coming back to the point of discussion, if ISCON is guilty of any violation of the law or its activities are considered a threat to national security, the Government has to take action. Whether the Govt is under BJP or PM does not matter.
Having said that, the use of the State machinery against ISCON for political gains is not correct and if it happens we will see another Nandigram at a much larger scale. So far no political party has been able to take sustained advantage by such actions, if past is taken as any indicator. There is no mass following of ISCON, so not many people in India will be really interested in what happens to it in India. However, I expect a lot of noise both in the print media and in the internet from NRIs in States and in the EU as most of its followers have high speed cyber connection.
12-11-2007, 12:25 AM
(This post was last modified: 12-11-2007, 12:28 AM by Bodhi.)
forget government policy (which keeps tab on RSS too, and has banned it 3 times in last 60 years each time without any sound or legal basis), and murder trials which ended in no charges (we even have one against Kanchi Shankaracharya-s without chargesheet).
Instead of hiding behind a thousand confusing noices, you have still not chosen to answer a very simple question about your own statement. that was why YOU THINK its time Govt of WB should come in to check ISKCON, whereas you have found no reason for the same treatment to Church in India or Islamia.
then you quickly add "<b>if</b> ISCON is guilty of any violation of the law". news report was not about violation of law in the first place. it was about a communist party report citing ISKON to be opposing communism. but lost on your enlightened mind.
Ravish don't dodge the question.
So now you you (what are you the next Stalin?) get to decide what is religious and what is not?
Cut the crap, and answer the question like Bodhi said.
What are you people trying to do? Reason with Ravish?
If you want to have a logical exchange, I invite you people to my home and continue your discussion with my 2 year old son. <!--emo&  --><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tongue.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Friends,
I have already answered the question. In the absence of any evidence I am in no position to recommend any legal action against ISCON. As far as Church and Mosque is concerned, no Government in India, I mean no politician will try to displease either of them. Fighting election is the first priority. In the case of ISCON, it has no vote bank of its won, so action will obviously be faster. The Communists in India are no different than any other political party and as such there is nothing special about them. The entire politics in the North runs on caste and religion and CPM is no exception. Hope I have been able to make things sufficiently clear.
"In the absence of any evidence I am in no position to recommend any legal action against ISCON."
Hmm doesn't that seem contradictory to your enlightened sikular mind, here is what you said before:
"It is indeed a very dangerous development. It is time for the State to intervene or it will again turn out to be a problem like that of Anand Marg."
But then what do we know, we are not proud of our Urdu "heritage" and are just dumb Hindoos not venerable progressives like yourself.
let the apparatus of the State handle the matter. We in India have elaborate system of checks, so nothing fundamentally wrong can happen on any organisation.The vigilent media and the civil society is there to ensure justice.
The communist state apparatus has its own agenda. We have proved numerous times how dorky is our vigilant media.
Best thing you can do is to stop making your false assertions.
12-12-2007, 06:00 PM
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2007, 06:04 PM by Bharatvarsh.)
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->let the apparatus of the State handle the matter. We in India have elaborate system of checks, so nothing fundamentally wrong can happen on any organisation.The vigilent media and the civil society is there to ensure justice. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ashyam was right, reasoning with you is like talking to a brick wall.
What the hell is there for the "state to handle" here?
Was there any criminal allegation against IKSCON that was proven?
Stop running around in circles and just make up your mind.
Bharatavarsh: Somewhere in another thread (missionary thread) there's a newsitem about Christian health resort center in Kerala where in past 10 years over 900 people have died/gone missing and atrocities against women can't even be listed. Not a peep from anyone on this, all investigations are in limbo and Kerala govt was preoccupied with cleansing ritual in Guruyaoor temple after some minister threw a fit.
This is one real small example, can literally fill this thread of other orgs who deserve much more of state's attention.
Take ashyam's advice, when you talk to a 2 year old atleast you are assured that the opposite party brings an open mind and honesty to the table.
<b>Chhattisgarh: 12 missing policemen killed</b><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->All the 12 policemen, who went missing after an encounter with Maoists in Chhattisgarh's Dantewada forests, have been killed by the extremists, police sources said on Friday.
The extremists also looted 11 self-loading rifles and an AK-47 rifle from the policemen, they told PTI.
Among the killed were eight Chhattisgarh Armed Force personnel and four from district force, who got separated when a 28-member police party came under attack from the Maoists in the Golapalli forest, 450 km from Raipur
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Southern communists denied British visa: Glasgow fallout?
New Delhi, July 26 (IANS) In what could be a fallout of the three Bangalore doctors' arrest in the attempted terror strikes in Britain, the British High Commission here has denied visa to a group of Communist Party of India-Marxist (CPI-M) activists from the southern states who wanted to travel to Cuba via London.
Activists of Democratic Youth Federation of India (DYFI) and Students Federation of India (SFI) - the youth and students wing of the CPI-M - sought British visa to travel to Cuba to attend the international solidarity meeting that is being organised on the occasion of Moncada Day July 26, a day of historical importance in the Cuban revolutionary struggle.
The high commission has denied visa to the leaders from the southern states - both Kerala and Tamil Nadu - citing "technical" troubles. But the party activists alleged that it was "discrimination" as their counterparts from the northern and eastern states, who had submitted the same documents, were granted visa.
"They have kept our passports for 10 days and they informed us about the denial of visa only Monday evening. Out of the 12 people, who sought visa, they picked and chose the people from the south to deny the permission," DYFI national president P. Sriramakrishnan told IANS here.
Apart from Sriramakrishnan, DYFI's Kerala state president M.B. Rajesh, Tamil Nadu secretary S. Kannan, SFI national president Arun Kumar, Kerala secretary M. Swaraj were also not given visas.
Six others, including those from West Bengal, who were granted visa, have already left for Havana.
Sriramakrishnan alleged that he and his colleagues have been denied visa only because they were from the southern states. "The British authorities are viewing the entire south Indians as suspects after the arrest of Bangalore doctors. It is highly unfortunate," he said.
Three Indian doctors from Karnataka were arrested in connection with the recent failed bombings in Glasgow.
Senior leader and CPI-M politburo member Brinda Karat said the high commission's move was "illogical and irrational".
"If they have denied visa only to the people from south, it extremely unfortunate. Such a move to deny visa to people from a whole region is irrational, illogical, and it could be construed as discrimination," Karat told IANS.
She also asked the Indian government to take up the matter seriously.
The leaders have then approached the Russian embassy for visa to travel to Havana via Moscow.
The 11-member delegation is to attend a 10-day conference, which will also be attended by activists from the US, Latin American countries and Caribbean Islands to study employment generation, industrialisation and education system in Cuba.
It was on July 26, 1956 that Fidel Castro led the attack on Moncada Barracks, marking the beginning of the Cuban revolutionary struggle, which ended on Jan 1 1959 when Fidel and Che Guevara led the cheering crowds entering Havana to overthrow dictator Batista.
http://www.mangalorean.com/news.php?newsty...al&newsid=48899<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What those nuts do not understand is that communists under Budha are friends of west and those under Karat and Yechuri are not. Fallout is not Glasgow, it is the nuke deal.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Fallout is not Glasgow, it is the nuke deal. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its a old article dated July 26.
<!--emo&:blow--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blow.gif' /><!--endemo--> Ayyo.....
<span style='color:red'>Centre sleeps as Maoists plan bloodbath in Chhattisgarh </span>
Navin Upadhyay | New Delhi
Chhattisgarh Government fears a major Maoist offensive against Salwa Judum camps, but its desperate SOSs to the Centre has met with a stony silence. State Government officials feel that the situation was grim and they could do precious little to combat Maoists with the current level of deployment.
The Maoists have mobilised nearly 10,000 armed cadre in Bastar alone. The security forces are vastly outnumbered with each battalion required to operate in an area of 3,000 sq ms and each company in 500 sq km. A lone policeman is supposed to guard an area of four kilometres.
Even as intelligence inputs indicate that the Maoists are plotting mayhem by launching a major offensive on the Salwa Judum camps, the Centre has so far not promised to meet the State's requirement of additional Central forces.
Sources said the State needed at least 70 additional battalions of Central paramilitary forces to launch and sustain any major strike against Maoists. "This is the only way we could think of eliminating Maoists altogether," said a senior official.
Sources said the Chhattisgarh Government has repeatedly asked the Centre to urgently send additional battalions of Central forces to combat the situation. Officials feel that even if the Maoist activities had to be checked at current level, at least a dozen additional battalions of Central forces are needed at the earliest.
"There are two ways of looking at the problems. The first is to launch an all-out offensive against the Maoists and completely weed them out. The second is to check their growth and prevent them from undertaking major operations," said an official.
Painting a grim scenario, he said the Centre has ruled out providing 70 battalions for a decisive push against the Maoists. "We are now pleading for at least a dozen battalions to avert any major incident," he said, adding, "So far we have no indication of any help coming soon."
The official said in the worst affected Bastar district alone, there were nearly 9,000 armed Maoist cadre. These include members of the Dandakarnaya special zone committee, divisional committee, area committees, local organisational squads, military companies, local guerrilla squads, Andhra Pradesh border committee, link squads of Maharashtra and north Telengana special zone committee. Besides, nearly 1,500 Maoist cadre from Bihar, Jharkhand, Orissa, Andhra Pradesh and Maharashtra have also joined the Bastar offensive.
Despite such a large mobilisation of Maoists in Bastar, the State Government has just six battalions (around 500 security men in the areas for undertaking offensive operation. Four other battalions are deployed for guarding the Salwa Judum camps, one battalion for providing security to road construction work, two battalions each for guarding the armouries and opening the national highway and other roads.
Sources said the Centre has told the State Government that it was not possible to meet the latter's demand for paramilitary forces at this stage in view of the coming elections in North-Eastern States and Karnataka. Besides, the State has also been told to fill up the vacancies in the State police.
"These are lame excuses. In a country like India, Assembly elections are held in some or the other State every year. The Centre must reallocate forces effectively to tackle serious internal situation issues. Even if they pull out one battalion each from some States, our needs could be met," said the official.
He also pointed out that the new police recruits are not equipped and trained to tackle Maoists. " We have recruited 10,000 policemen during the last three years. But they can't overnight be trained," he said.
The current trend in Maoist violence in Chhattisgarh has shown that the terrorists have changed their strategy and shifted from guerrilla warfare to military combat tactics.
Sources said that when the Maoists cadre, who are fanned out in dense forests, spot an advancing battalion, they first engage them in skirmishes and firing, which allows their back-up units to mobilise, lay ambush and attack security forces.
Sources said unlike in the past when the security forces lost their lives while conducting offensive operations, now most of the casualties take place during movement of the forces for sending rations to the police camps or escorting sick policemen.
"We can meet the new challenges only by moving in bigger battalion formations and for that we need urgent hike in deployment," the official said.
Prime Minister Manmohan Singh may have admitted that the Maoist violence has emerged as the single-most security threat to the nation, but his Government seems to be doing little to combat the situation.
http://www.dailypioneer.com/indexn12.asp?m...t&counter_img=1
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Kerala: CPI-M reaches out to Church
New Delhi: Worried over the loss of precious Christian votes in Kerala, the Communist Party of India-Marxist's (CPI-M) national leadership is asking its state unit not to confront the Catholic Church.
Already in a crisis in West Bengal, where the party has lost face after its activists "invaded" Nandigram to take control from opposition activists, party here do not want any trouble in its other bastion.
With the Catholic Church in Kerala distancing itself from the party after a bitter row with party leaders, the CPI-M is learnt to have warned its leaders in Kerala not to make any statements that may provoke the Church.
Kerala has been witnessing a string of Sunday pastoral letters targeting the communists. In turn, CPI-M leaders have launched a verbal offensive against the Church clergy.
Party sources said CPI-M general secretary Prakash Karat and politburo member S. Ramachandra Pillai, both hail from Kerala,- have initiated some discussions with Church leaders in the state.
"However, our Kerala leaders' comments were worsening the already-soured relations. Our politburo has warned the Kerala leaders not to do or say anything that causes more problems," said a source.
The source added that the party leadership would step up discussions with Church leaders after the CPI-M congress in Coimbatore in Tamil Nadu ends March 2.
The CPI-M central leadership is also attempting a patch up with the community by intervening in Orissa, where Christians are facing communal attacks.
CPI-M politburo member Sitaram Yechury was a member of the delegation led by the Catholic Bishops Conference of India (CBCI), the supreme body of the community in the country, when it visited riot-hit Orissa last week.
In its editorial in the latest issue of the party mouthpiece People's Democracy, the CPI-M has warned that the communal violence in Orissa was a part of an "overall strategy" by the Rashtriya Swayamsewak Sangh (RSS) to subvert secular principles and urged the people to protect the minorities.
The CPI-M has organised nationwide protest marches against the recent attacks on Christians in Orissa's Kandhamal district where three people were killed allegedly by Hindu mobs.
The communists are also concerned about the Christian community's growing proximity to the Congress in Kerala. Although the community had supported the Congress for decades, it supported the CPI-M-led Left Democratic Front in the 2004 parliamentary elections and in the 2006 assembly polls.
Christians constitute 19 percent of Kerala's 30 million people.
Party sources pointed out that the state leadership's war of words with the Christian leadership in Kerala has violated the party's basic principle that it should not hurt the sentiments of the minority communities.
Kerala's minorities, especially the Catholics, are upset with the CPI-M-led government over its educational policies, which Christian leaders feel amount to interference in their affairs.
Both the state and minority institutions have been locked in a legal battle over the government policy on self-financing colleges, which are mostly run by Christians or Muslims.
The CPI-M leadership's worries deepened when the Kerala churches joined hands with a dominant Hindu group, Nair Service Society, to oppose the education reforms mooted by the CPI-M government.
Some bishops had even warned that there could be a second "Liberation Struggle", a movement spearheaded by Christians, Nairs and Eazhavas and supported by Muslims that had led to the dismissal by New Delhi of the E.M.S. Namboodiripad government in Kerala in 1959.
Besides, the verbal battle between CPI-M Kerala secretary Pinarayi Vijayan and Church leaders over a deceased Marxist legislator, Mathai Chacko, reached a new low with the bishops urging the faithful to keep away from the Communists.
Vijayan called the late legislator a hardened Marxist, and thus an atheist, but bishops insisted that he had followed Christian rituals.
The state secretary, once seen as close to many Church leaders, then asked the Church to keep off political affairs and alleged that the community leaders were trying to mobilise forces for the Congress party.
http://news.in.msn.com/national/article.as...umentid=1174630<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There is a nexus between Maoist and Christians of India. Recent episode in Orrisa and involvement in Chatisgarh , AP is no more hidden.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Maoists turn cannibals to intensify reign of terror in Malkangiri </b>
Pioneer News Service | Bhubaneswar
<b><span style='color:red'>Maoists are turning cannibals. They eat human flesh to terrorise villagers</span>. </b>This was revealed by the residents of Bandiguda, 45 km from the district headquarters town of Malkangiri. The district police, under the leadership of daredevil SP Satish Kumar Gajbhiye, risked in organising a community policing programme in a far-flung area, known as the Red Terror Zone of the district. On August 3, 2007, the people of Bandiguda saw Mukunda Madhi of their village being lifted by 'Papular Dalam Commander' Bhagat, as Mukunda was suspected by the Maoists as a police informer.
<b>Next morning, Mukunda was brought back to the village, where he was killed in a most gruesome manner. And Bhagat even ate his flesh as the villagers looked on in horror.</b> The reign of terror forced Mukunda's family members to keep telling the police for several days that he was not at home as he had gone to a relative's house.
'Commander' Bhagat was acting under the orders of Ganapathy, general secretary of the CPI(Maoist), according to sources. The Maoists, who had suspected Mukunda as a police informer, were taking the revenge on him for the arrest of their dreaded colleague Sriramulu Srinivas.
However, January 12 was a totally different day for the village, which is located between Balimela and Bejingwada. Gajbhiye made all efforts to ensure safety for the horror-stricken tribal villagers. With successful confidence-building operations by the police, the tribals came forward to organise a community policing programme in the village. More than 1,500 men, women and children gathered to participate in sports events, a cultural extravaganza and a health camp.
It may be mentioned here that under Security Related Expenditure (SRE) such programmes are being organised in the Maoist-prone district. Earlier, the police endeared themselves to the common men at Salimi and Bonda ghats through such programmes.
SDPO Sanjeev Arora also joined the programme at Bandiguda. The lunch was sumptuous and the villagers immensely enjoyed the feast. It was celebration time for the innocent tribals, who have been trying to fight terrorism. Giving out the hard realities about the Maoists, a senior villager said the extremists were initially good as they used to take up their causes and highlight their plights. But they now have turned as a gang of robbers and killers.
The programme was also attended by the family members of Mukunda. Initially, the villagers were reluctant to attend the event, despite wide publicity. However, the crowd grew gradually with all the villagers joining the programme. The eldest resident of the village was felicitated as Bhumiputra along with others, who have extended support for the anti-terrorism drive.
The most important aspect of the programme was the daring attitude shown by the district police since the area is considered as a 'den of Maoists'. Policemen and other officials do not even dare to go there in disguise.
http://www.dailypioneer.com/indexn12.asp?m...t&counter_img=5<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->SUB:Â JYOTI BASU IS THE MOST UNFIT CANDIDATE
     FOR BHARAT RATAN AWARD
At the moment a controversy is raging in India as to on whom the Bharat Ratan, country's highest civilian award should be conferred. In this connection, CPM is pushing forward the name of their aging leader Jyoti Basu.
The Bharat Ratan award is the highest civilian honor which is awarded to a person who has distinguished himself/herself for the highest degrees of national service which includes artistic, literary, and scientific achievements, as well as " recognition of public service of the highest order." As is evident from the following facts that Mr. Jyoti Basu is the most unfit, thoroughly undeserving and completely unqualified candidate for this honor. Therefore, we strongly urge not to consider him as a possible candidate for the highest civilian award of India:
He has been a leftist leader all his life and currently belongs to CPM, a faction of the old Communist movement in India. It is a well known fact that before Independence these communists not only opposed the freedom movement, quit India movement, but also after Independence in 1962, supported Chinese invasion of India. At that time, Jyoti Basu made a very recklessly disturbing statement saying that since I do not see any Chinese soldiers in Kolkata, I cannot condemn them.
In order to appease his vote bank, Jyoti Basu supported the creation of Pakistan at the time of Independence.
At the time of Great Kolkata killings in 1946, Jyoti Basu did nothing to help Hindus of Kolkata who were being slaughtered by Muslim fanatics. Nor did he help the Hindu women in Noakhali who were mercilessly raped and murdered by Islamic goons.
During his regime, 12 Anand Margi Sadhus were murdered in the broad day light allegedly by CPM cadres, but none of them was brought to books.
Jyoti Basu has acted as a collaborator with the enemies of Bharat on several occasions.
There are 220 police stations in Kolkata . It is alleged that Jyoti Basu has appointed 100 Muslims as officer-in-charge of those Police Stations to keep his opponents under control.
In 1988-89, when Hindus were being persecuted in Bangladesh, and Islam was declared as the state religion, Jyoti Basu went to Bangladesh and shamelessly certified that Bangladesh was the most communally harmonious state.
Under the guise of land reforms, he took away all the land from Hindus and distributed it to Muslims to keep himself in power.
Communism is an alien ideology in India. Indian Communists like Jyoti Basu are not rooted in Indian traditions and philosophy and have no reverence for Indian ethos.
In order to be Chief Minister of West Bengal, he allowed millions of Bangladeshi Muslims to enter India illegally. In 1996, Indrajit Gupta, the former Home Minister had announced that 10-15 million Bangladeshis are living in India. The problem of Bangladeshi Muslims has developed into a serious security problem for Indian government. Jyoti Basu encouraged construction of Madrasas with Arab funding in the state. This has changed the demographic balance of India and created a frightening situation. He is responsible for this mess to a great extent.
His pro-Muslim policies have given fillip to the terrorist activities all over India. As a result of Jyoti Basu's anti-Indian policies, 8 districts in West Bengal have become Muslim majority areas. Hindus are fleeing from the districts bordering West Bengal to safer places.
Booth capturing and scientific rigging in West Bengal elections are the gifts of Jyoti Basu to Indian democracy.
In the mid-eighties, Jyoti Basu opposed computerization on the plea that it would cause unemployment and pushed West Bengal to backwardness.
During his Chief Ministership, most of the industries moved from West Bengal to other States, causing massive unemployment in West Bengal and bringing down the State to the bottom steps of the economic development order.
His flawed economic policies guided by Communist ideology have destroyed jute mill industry and Metal Box industry in West Bengal. Because of lack of employment opportunities, most of the educated Bengalies are looking for jobs in other states of India.
Before Jyoti Basu came to power, according to all indicators of education, employment, health, wealth and prosperity, West Bengal was one of the top most states in India. During Jyoti Basu's misrule, West Bengal has been relegated to a backward state.
Gopal Krishan Gokhale had said "What Bengal thinks today, India thinks tomorrow." Jyoti Basu proved him wrong. People of West Bengal have been forced to think only of the failed ideology called Communism.
Before Jyoti Basu came to power, intellectuals in Kolkata, were free to criticize anybody. But now their voice has been gagged. Fear psychosis prevails all over West Bengal.
He is a known Hindu basher.
This man has done irreparable damage to Indian polity. In the backdrop of what has been mentioned above, it is absolutely essential that this person should never be considered for Bharat Ratan Award.
Further, we maintain that Bharat Ratan is the most prestigious award in India. Before conferring Bharat Ratan on any individual, it should be widely debated in print and electronic media. In order to maintain the sanctity of Bharat Ratan, this issue should neither be politicized nor left to the discretion of a few bureaucrats.Â
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