Christian Subversion And Missionary Activities - 4

[acharya]

<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Jun 27 2008, 02:29 AM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Jun 27 2008, 02:29 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->See also Bharatavarsha's important post above.


Disturbed christoterrorist thieves at it again. Purple words are mine.

http://www.haindavakeralam.com/HkPage.aspx...EID=6568&SKIN=C
<b>‘Inculturation’ - A danger to communal amity!</b>
One of the comments:
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Hindu
21/06/2008 20:07:57  Cultural infiltration
Yes. This is a very serous issue. Recently asianet aired an interview with a Padri who is an expert in carnatic music. Rev. Father Povvathil has done research in "Karnatic music abd Christianity".It is foolishness to link carnatic music with christainity.He recite <b>Vathapi Ganapathi</b> like Shemmangudi sreenevasa Iyer. <b>Ganapathi is acceptable to them. Because GANA <span style='color:purple'>(now suddenly) stands for christains. Therefore GANAPATHI is (now made out to be) none other JESUS.</b></span> They have changed strategies. The new straegy is Cultural infiltration in lieu of cultural aggression.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->(Final line of person commenting is wrong: Cultural infiltration was always a part of christian aggression. Ever since Greco-Roman times.)

Vatapi Ganapathi is a famous Carnatic song. Carnatic music is Hindu music, and this song's theme is very Hindu too. As every Hindu knows, Ganapathi (Lord of the Ganas) is the famous name of Vigneshwara. Ganapathi, together with Pillaiyar, is a very popular name for Ganapathi in TN.

<b>Sankara</b>, if you read this, this is the sort of unforeseeable sinister things I meant about christians singing Hindu songs and why their doing so is usually not to be trusted. Now they have already started lying that traditional Hindu songs themselves aren't Hindu anymore either but are 'psecular' and - more unbelievably - are about their non-existent jeebus instead <!--emo&:blink:--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blink.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:lol:--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='laugh.gif' /><!--endemo--> Christoliars can't stop lying even were they to try to.
[right][snapback]83448[/snapback][/right]
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KAIRALI is a MALYALAM TV CHANNEL
I was watching it recently and they show lot of Gulf news and Dubai news,

One of the shows had St George Syrian Christian program show in Dubai
They had a carnatic music program and some padri and the entire mrudangam and violin team was playing the song.
It was total cultural appropriation of the Hindus by the Kerala Christians.
There was Bharat Natyam

---

Conclusion

The Christian community is finding that Indians do not go to any western cultural shows or rock concerts or music show.
The onloy way the Christians can still show they are part of India is to try to appropriate and mingle with the Hindus. Only way is to fake themselves to
like the Hindu gods and also fool the new converts and hindus who see it as OK


They need christians to mingle freely within the Hindus festival and cultural landscape so that they do not become isolated.

These things have been done after years of social studies and social engineering

[acharya]

comment

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->I am an Indian and a Christian, and proud of it. Similarly all Indians who are Hindu, Muslim, or of any other religion should be proud of what he or she is. But where paranoia is, there is no pride, but only suspicion and hatred.

The adoption of Indian customs, traditions, dresses, and imageries actually denotes the Indianisation of Christianity. It should be welcome. That is how it would appear to a normal proud Indian.

There is no virtue in paranoia and hatred.

<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[acharya]

http://www.appiusforum.com/book.pdf

http://www.appiusforum.com/issues_for_christians.html

http://www.appiusforum.com/index.html

http://www.appiusforum.com/myright.html

http://www.appiusforum.com/brahmin_response.html

http://www.appiusforum.com/civilizations.html




http://www.appiusforum.com/sanskrit.html
The influx of foreign invaders through the North West over the centuries, forced the Dravidian culture South. Originally Grantha was used for writing Sanskrit only, and Sanskrit was later transliterated with Nagiri after the 7th c. AD. Scholars over the years have indicated that many Hindu writings have been tampered with, and certainly this could have happened during the transliteration process. The later varieties of the Grantha script were used to write a number of Dravidian Languages, and the modern Tamil script certainly seems to be derived from Grantha.
<b>
The scriptures of Hinduism are written in Sanskrit, and epigraphic evidence clearly shows that they could not have been written before the second century A.D. The Christian thought is seen in the Hindu scriptures and this influence traces back to Christian Gospel preached by the Apostle Thomas first to the Pahlavas.</b>

The bibliographical evidences indicate that the Vedas are written in the Grantha and Nagari scripts, and according to tradition Veda Vyasa, a Dravidian, compiled and wrote the Vedas. <b>The Grantha script belongs to the southern group of scripts and Veda Vyasa being a Dravidian would certainly have used it. Since the earliest evidence for Grantha is only in the 5th c. AD, the Vedas were written rather late.</b>

[Husky]

Christians are still as ignorant as their kind was in the days of the (pagan and learned) Ancient Greeks and Romans, I see.

Julianus was always averse to christianity's fondness for making up history (aka lying) and disapproved of the gospels for their pretence to historicity. He realised the danger of such shams and developed a serious dislike of stories that were dressed up as history but of which it was not made clear that they were merely works of fiction (pseudohistory, in other words; a prime example was the babble) .

Though no one takes christian lying seriously (well, no one of consequence anyway), it is still the duty of every human who values truth to set the record straight. Lies should never be allowed to impose on humanity. One can't usually convince the sort of people who think the highest skill and aim in life is to have "blind faith", because they will believe anything - 'reason be damned'. But the rest of the world is not so curiously disposed/disadvantaged. You can easily explain to all other people what's so obviously wrong with this latest lie which is only the newest addition to the massive christian collection of falsehoods (a ~1500 year old collection!) So what else is new: it's a religion <i>known</i> for collecting lies and lives.

[Husky]

http://www.hamsa.org/demise.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Planning the Demise of Buddhism (and Hinduism)</b>
Peoples of the Buddhist World by Paul Hattaway, Piquant Editions, Carlisle, 2004
Reviewed by Allen Carr<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Send this to all your Buddhist friends.

[acharya]

<b>
AP TO CREATE SEPARATE WELFARE DEPARTMENT FOR CHRISTIANS</b>

By GLOBEGATHER.COM NATIONAL NEWS BUREAU, 19 JULY 2008

The Andhra Pradesh government has decided to create a separate department for Christians on the lines of minorities welfare department.

The department will be headed by a principal secretary and look after all issues related to Christians.

State Chief Minister Y S Rajasekhara Reddy held a meeting on issues of Christian minorities with senior officials yesterday and decided to help community members who want to visit their holy land on the lines of Muslims visiting Mecca.

The issue was pending for a long time. Now, Christians can file applications online and preference will be given to white card holders, said Reddy.

"They will be allowed to go for the visit in batches and and all assistance like Haj pilgrimage will be given," he said. The first batch could leave next month.

The Chief Minister also decided to constitute a separate finance corporation for Christians. The meeting decided to arrange mass marriages for Christian and Muslim minorities. Poor couples will be paid Rs 15,000 towards marriage expenses, it was decided.

[acharya]

<b>WE WILL TRY TO FORM NON-CONG GOVT: TRS CHIEF</b>

By GLOBEGATHER.COM NATIONAL NEWS BUREAU, NEW DELHI 19 JULY 2008

TRS chief K Chandrashekhar Rao on 19 July met Mayawati and said the third front will try to form a non-Congress government with the BSP supremo as the prospective Prime Ministerial candidate.

Rao, whose party has three members in the Lok Sabha, attacked Congress President Sonia Gandhi, saying she is not for formation of separate state of Telengana.

"Behenji (sister Mayawati) has always given her blessing for Telengana," the TRS chief, who has been fighting for creation of the separate state out of Andhra Pradesh, told reporters after meeting the Uttar Pradesh Chief Minister.

During the meeting, the two leaders held discussions related to the July 22 vote of confidence and devised ways in which the government could be defeated on the floor of Parliament.

Asked about the prospects of Mayawati becoming the Prime Minister, Rao said "it will be a happy moment. I was the first to suggest that she should be the Prime Minister." Attacking Sonia, he said she does not want formation of Telengana. "In her speech in Nellore (two days back), she said 'Jai Andhra'," Rao said.

[G.Subramaniam]

http://www.tcgcohio.org/Numrich/CH2_CND_...n_0207.htm

[From The Church Next Door: Local Christians Face America’s New Religious Diversity, draft manuscript by Dr. Paul D. Numrich. Please do not quote or cite without author’s permission.]



Chapter 2: Evangelizing Fellow Immigrants: South Asian Christians



[figure approx. here: map of South Asian religious sites in metro Chicago]



The Asian-American population of metropolitan Chicago has increased dramatically since the revision of federal immigration laws in the 1960s. The 2000 census counted nearly 400,000 Asians in the six-county region, a 52 percent increase over the previous census. South Asians, mostly from India and Pakistan, make up a significant proportion of Chicago’s overall Asian population and represent a remarkable religious diversity. The accompanying map shows the locations of Hindu temples, Muslim mosques, Christian churches, and miscellaneous other religious centers with large or exclusively South Asian constituencies. The Christian churches represent a variety of denominational and theological identities, including Baptists, Catholics, Evangelicals, Methodists, Lutherans, Mar Thoma, Orthodox, and Pentecostals.

This chapter highlights initiatives of South Asian Christians to evangelize fellow South Asian immigrants in metropolitan Chicago, often in cooperation with non-immigrant evangelical groups and volunteers. We will examine three cases: 1) semi-itinerant Indian evangelists, 2) Telugu Lutheran congregations, and 3) a South Asian Christian community center.



Indian Evangelists

Note: Suburban Chicago Mennonite Church is pseudonymous, at the request of Rev. John Bushi, who once served on staff there.

One day a few years ago, evangelist John Bushi stopped in to a small gift shop run out of Suburban Chicago Mennonite Church to see if it carried any items from his native India. The church eventually appointed Rev. Bushi as its minister of evangelism, with a special focus on low-profile outreach to immigrant Indians throughout metropolitan Chicago.

Although Suburban Chicago Mennonite Church is predominantly white, it is beginning to reflect the growing ethnic and racial diversity of its locale. The church has made overtures to nearby Hindu and Muslim congregations, though no institutional relationships have yet materialized. The pastor saw Rev. Bushi’s evangelistic approach as compatible with the congregation’s views on outreach: “What he is trying to do is build relationships so that there are comfortable, natural ways to share Christian faith with the others who are in his fellowship. . . . Our whole church is based on the concept that we don’t exist for ourselves, we exist to reach out to others who need Christ, who need a church home where they feel loved and accepted, or who are seeking, seekers looking for something.”

An ordained minister of the Indian Baptist Mission, a union of missionary Baptist denominations in India, Rev. Bushi found the Mennonite tradition amenable to his evangelical concern for his fellow Indian immigrants. “Mennonites believe in helping people, at the same time being with God, which I like very much. When you don’t care for the human being who is suffering next door and just talk about religion, that makes no sense. Mennonites are very helping and kind and supporting.” Rev. Bushi is now also a licensed Mennonite minister.

His approach is simple, direct, but not overtly religious initially. He invites Indian families to attend informal social get-togethers where they share food, songs, games, and other activities that will begin to form a close relationship within the group. He seeks out potential attendees at libraries, gas stations, airports, and other public places, as well as by posting fliers in Indian businesses and scanning newspaper ads for Indian names. He even attends local Hindu temples, being careful not to give offense in any way.

After a couple of get-togethers, Rev. Bushi begins to probe into deeper topics, especially spirituality and family life. One group that meets in the western suburbs comprises newlyweds experiencing marital problems. “We want to bring them together and show how they can make their lives better with the help of God,” Rev. Bushi told us. Many Indian immigrants have lost their jobs since September 11, 2001. “Every family has gone through some problems. So my presence is meant to encourage them constantly, and pray with them, and see how God can help them with their lives.”

Rev. Bushi trains others to carry on this work, running workshops for what he calls his “core group.” They study the Bible together and discuss practical aspects of evangelism, focusing “on how God has helped us in our lives.” Rev. Bushi freely shares what God did for him when he found himself languishing in an Indian prison in 1980. His mother wrote him a letter, saying, “You have tried all your possible ways, why don’t you try God? Why don’t you pray?” “So that night I prayed,” he told us, “and I had a peace. And a miracle happened, that I was released without any charges.” He went on to earn an engineering degree, work in a scientific research institute, and complete a master’s degree in theology from United Theological College in Bangalore, India. He draws from his scientific background in conversations with young Indian immigrants who work in engineering, computers, and other technical fields, calling his approach “creative evangelism for the 21st century.”

Rev. Bushi senses a significant attitude shift within the immigrant Hindu community in recent years. He feels that the early immigrants tried to assimilate to America’s dominant Christian culture, downplaying their Hindu identity and practices in order to fit in. But he thinks that a societal rise in secularism and tolerance for religious diversity has emboldened Hindus. “[Society] says you can believe in any god, so we have religious freedom. They say that there is no need of prayer in the schools, at Christmastime don’t use Christ’s name in any public places, and even the Supreme Court takes out the 10 Commandments. So these guys [Hindus] get some kind of encouragement, ‘OK, we can have our own idols, we can have our practice.’ So they become stronger and stronger. And Hindus never stop at one place. If they are allowed to go in a evangelistic way, they will try to change and convert people because they also believe in the same kind of conversion that we talk about.” Rev. Bushi identified several strategies used by Hindu temples to attract new members, such as free medical care, classical Indian dance classes, and yoga instruction.

For Rev. Bushi, this Hindu assertiveness is a harbinger of ill for America. “I take it seriously that this country is blessed because of prayers and [Christian] values. But slowly these values are going away because people are not paying attention. So once these idol worshipers come and bring evil things into the society, then probably we will face a lot of problems.”

Rev. Bushi’s Indian fellowship participated in some joint activities with the larger congregation when he was on staff at Suburban Chicago Mennonite Church. One lay leader of the larger congregation wanted to see more such interaction. He once “crashed” a gathering of Indian youth and was impressed by the testimonies he heard. “I was just drawn in—so intriguing—and I was so amazed at some of the stories that I was hearing,” he explained to us. “I was an outsider crashing their party, but I felt like I was welcome there. And I encouraged them to tell the same stories that they told each other to the rest of the congregation, so that we could be more intimately involved as a big family. As much as I was blessed by hearing these stories, I figured the bigger congregation could be too.”

Rev. Bushi works closely with other semi-itinerant Indian evangelists in the Chicago area. Rev. Jai Prakash Masih started an Indian fellowship at another Mennonite church in the suburbs following Rev. Bushi’s social evangelism approach. “Religious diversity is the reality of the world,” he told us. “One cannot deny it. The most appropriate response is Jesus’ mandate: Go out and preach.” But Indian evangelists must adopt the right attitude in interacting with fellow immigrants. “Personally, I draw on the concept of respect. [Jesus and the apostles] called us to share our faith. To share is not to belittle or condemn, it is to love, not judge. . . . You need to begin with where people are, you cannot bring them to your turf, but [begin] on their own turf. Missions in the traditional way have been misused and have colonial implications. Missions should be based on the mandate of love, to reach out, not bringing people where you are.”

Another local Indian evangelist, who goes by the name of Pastor G. John, heads up the Chicago Bible Fellowship, which meets in various rented facilities. He feels called to correct the false “human assumptions” of other religions, like the concepts of reincarnation in Hinduism and nirvana in Buddhism. By contrast, “[Christian] doctrines are not made on human assumptions,” he explains. “We have proof, and that proof is the Lord Jesus. See, like a seed he was buried, and he disappeared like water, and when he rose again, he did not come as a monkey or some other disciples [via reincarnation]. Jesus died, Jesus was buried, Jesus rose again. So that is what the Bible says. It is a blessed hope, a living hope, a good hope. So, if I die, I will rise again. This kind of message is preached to non-Christians.”

Although such preaching might be perceived as confrontational, Pastor G. John knows that it must be carried out with respect. He likes Rev. Bushi’s approach because of its patience and hospitality—when the time is right, you can give your testimony to people without hurting them, while still telling them the truth of the Gospel. He also knows that in the end, only God can convict human hearts. “Yeah, we preach Christ, but we know by experience that we cannot change anybody. If I have power to change people, maybe within a week I change the whole city of Chicago. We depend on God, God does, we trust 100 percent. See, Lord Jesus said in John 15:5, ‘You can do nothing without me.’ So we know by experience that we cannot change any people, but we preach, that is our responsibility. The rest, He has to change people.”



Telugu Lutheran Congregations

Rev. John Bushi contrasts his semi-itinerant ministry to the established Indian pastors of the Chicago area. One such is Rev. Shadrach Katari who pastors two Telugu (south Indian) Missouri Synod Lutheran congregations, Bethesda Asian Indian Mission Society on Chicago’s north side and Wesley Church Chicago in a near west suburb. Despite differences of venue, pastors like Rev. Katari share much in common with the Indian evangelists we have considered thus far.

Rev. Katari often accepts invitations to speak about Christianity to religious and secular groups within the Indian immigrant community. He will not participate in non-Christian worship services due to the Missouri Synod prohibition against religious “syncretism” (see Chapter 5). He believes that, although other religions contain ethical teachings similar to Christianity, “we have only Christ to save us from sin.” He finds Hindus more receptive to the Gospel than Muslims since Islam does not accept the divinity of Christ. Hindus are more likely to believe in Christ as a divine savior, a familiar notion in their religion.

Rev. Katari has written a series of evangelistic tracts that he and members of his congregations distribute to Hindus, especially along Devon Avenue in the heart of the South Asian community on Chicago’s north side. One calls Jesus “the Great Guru” and assures Hindus that his death frees them from the effects of karma. Another tract discusses the Hindu concept of moksha, ultimate liberation from the human condition. According to Rev. Katari, “their moksha is to go into God and become God, oneness in God. But our moksha is like the Kingdom of God, and it is different. We have our individuality from God, and we can recognize ourselves. I can explain to them what is moksha and how we enjoy moksha, how we got peace in moksha, like that. So, I translated the Kingdom of God into moksha.”

Rev. Katari adopts a personal approach in evangelizing the Indians he meets on Devon Avenue, a strategy he learned while in seminary in India. “When I go, it’s a busy street, they are buying groceries. I find people who are sitting on benches and at tables . . . and I make friendship with them. . . . I ask them what they are doing, like that. Then I talk about Jesus Christ, and they talk about their religion. I explain how Jesus came to this world and how he saved our souls from sin and condemnation.” Such street evangelism can be difficult in India. “God gave us a chance to talk to them in America,” says Rev. Katari. “In India, sometimes we don’t have a chance to talk like that. Now we do. So, in our case, in this free country, we are able to talk.”

He also explains that caste distinctions must be considered when evangelizing fellow Indian immigrants. Many Indian Christians come from the lower castes due to the history of Christian missions in India. When Rev. Katari witnesses to upper caste Hindus, he takes what he calls a more “theoretical” approach, discussing Hindu scriptures and doctrines. With lower caste Hindus, he discusses “practical” aspects of Hinduism, like its rituals.

Vijay Eanuganti is a member of Rev. Katari’s congregation on Chicago’s north side. He interacts with Indian Hindus and Muslims on a daily basis, sometimes in the taxi he drives for a living, often in Indian restaurants. Like his pastor, Vijay uses the word “friendship” to describe his approach to fellow Indian immigrants. “If I go to lunch, I sit like one hour,” he told us. “Every day, new people are coming, and with them I am doing friendship. I am trying to invite them to church.”

In one case, Vijay developed a friendship with a Hindu man who had failed the city cab driver examination twice already. Although the man had driven a taxi in India, he found the exam here very difficult and began to despair of ever passing. Someone told the man to call Vijay for help. Vijay recalls the man saying over the phone, “Oh, I am very scared about my examination.” Vijay replied, “OK, come to my church on Sunday.” “He came. The pastor prayed for him, and I prayed for him. The third time, by the grace of God, he has passed [the exam]. So he was very faithful to God [after that]. Every Sunday he comes [to church].”

Vijay shares such testimonies with the people he encounters. “Now I call all people to the church to just, what do you call, to praise the Lord. I give a statement here. When I came [to America] I had nothing. When I came here the Lord blessed me. . . . I tell them, if you also believe in this Lord Jesus Christ, He is going to bless your people also.”



Devon Avenue Christian Community Center

Note: The names of Devon Avenue Christian Community Center and individuals associated with it are pseudonymous, at the Center’s request.

Located in the heart of the South Asian community on Chicago’s north side, among the myriad Indian restaurants, sari shops, Indo-Pakistani grocery stores, and other ethnic businesses, stands Devon Avenue Christian Community Center (DACCC), an evangelistic outreach ministry that provides Christian literature, children’s activities, tutoring, small group fellowship opportunities (especially for women), English-as-a-Second-Language instruction, immigrant social services, and Christian worship services for the neighborhood. DACCC is supported by evangelical churches and colleges throughout the Chicago area that contribute financial assistance and volunteer staff. Even so, this is primarily an outreach by South Asian Christians to their fellow immigrants.



Excerpt from Devon Avenue Christian Community Center newsletter, Summer 2003:

In 1998, the Swaminarayan Temple in Bartlett, Illinois, began a new venture for the South Asian community in Chicagoland. . . . It is said that when the construction is finished it will be the largest Hindu temple outside of India. . . .

We are concerned about reaching the lost for Christ, and what a wonderful blessing from God to bring our work home to us. In the next few years, 6 more Hindu temples are expected to be built in Chicagoland.

How are we going to reach them in our own communities?



Assistant director Paul Kelvin, who is not a South Asian, explained DACCC’s basic approach, including its implications for non-immigrant volunteers. “There is a method of evangelism called ‘friendship evangelism.’ Through our natural contacts as friends, we share our faith just as one friend might share with another. That is how we cross over as well as be a friend to the community by giving, by sharing Christ’s love through activities for kids and ESL and all those things through the Center, those activities of outreach.”

Paul likes a phrase he read somewhere, “building bridges of friendship that bear the weight of truth.” “I think that sums up what we do. . . . [Such] friendship is understanding culture, you know, take off your shoes, all of those things, learning the basics of what [another] culture respects, things that might offend. The idea is not to build walls between that person and yourself by not understanding anything about them. If there are fewer walls, then they are more willing to listen to what you have to say about your faith.” Paul monitors his non-immigrant volunteers closely to make sure they don’t step on any “cultural toes.” “Our underlying message is that we respect each other and we are not forcing anything on anybody. We are just sharing with people what we believe. If the person responds, that is up to them.”

One interesting gesture of respect came in response to criticism from Muslims in the neighborhood. Each year at the Indian Independence Day parade along Devon Avenue, Christian groups distribute hundreds of evangelistic tracts, most of which are discarded by parade goers. Some Muslims expressed dismay that Christians would allow passages from the Bible to be trampled in the street. Now DACCC mobilizes volunteers to pick up the tracts so as not to offend Muslim sensitivities about scripture. (Muslims respect the Bible as originating from the prophets Moses and Jesus, thus making Jews and Christians fellow People of the Book.)

For the same reason, the Bible is displayed in a prominent place in DACCC’s bookshop, as Radha Sanghat, an Indian woman, explained to us. “When you come into the bookstore, you will see that the Bible is on the highest shelf. The reason is that Hindu people revere their religious books. So we don’t have a casual attitude towards the Word of God. You will never see us sitting on our Bible, you will never see a Bible put on the floor.”

“We try to do things in an ethnic way,” Radha continued. “We dress like the community does, we dress very modestly. We are all things to all people for the sake of the Gospel, like [the Apostle] Paul said, without compromising the Gospel. So we bring about outer changes which makes them feel welcome and accepted, and once they are in, the love of Christ wins them over.” This culture-sensitive approach includes respecting many traditional South Asian views on gender. Men and women sit separately at the Center’s worship services, “because that is how God is worshiped in Hinduism and in Islam. Women and men are separated. They are very reverent in worship, so we cover our heads, too. We make it as easy as possible for them, so that the outer [behavior] does not disgust them. Offenses are kept to a minimum.”

Radha directs the women’s programs at DACCC. The center has created a haven for many South Asian women, some of whom experience spousal abuse and other family problems. “When they came to us and they found us loving them and treating them with kindness, respect, and dignity, they started opening up to us and sharing. We became a safe place for us [South Asian women]. As they started sharing their problems, that is when we started expanding and helping them wherever we could. And through word of mouth we have grown. . . . When women come in here they are isolated, they don’t have community. We helped by doing ladies’ luncheons and inviting the other women from the community. So within community, they built community, got to know each other and develop friendships.”

Radha spoke of one woman who was about to undergo an abortion. Through the prayers and friendship of women at DACCC, the woman decided to have the baby, “this precious little one,” as Radha says. “The woman is a friend and she brings her baby and all of us love her. She has found community in us.”

“What we do is friendship evangelism,” Radha echoes Paul Kelvin, DACCC’s assistant director. “Here is our policy: we live the Gospel, and once others live it, then they will believe it. That is why this is a friendship center. . . . We want to be the aroma, the love, and the hands and feet of Jesus in the community. We live the Gospel first and then we give it vocally.”

Sanjay Pandya, an Indian man, volunteers his time at DACCC. He agrees with this quiet, friendly approach to his non-Christian fellow immigrants. When we asked him how American Christians should respond to the growing number of non-Christian immigrants generally, he replied, “The response is not to condemn, the response is to love and accept them. We need to be different, to show them that there is a difference in us. . . . We shouldn’t be condemning and saying that you are wrong. No, we should love them.”

Sanjay told us of a person that he regularly accompanies on walks around the neighborhood, during which time he shares what Jesus has done for him and prays for the person when asked. “That’s all I do now. I don’t speak anything more. I leave it to the Lord. He will do what He has to.” Fewer words, more Christian love—that’s his approach nowadays. “Love, that’s it. Love, and meet the needs. Don’t speak too much, just meet the needs. A lot of people are hurting.”

Sanjay says he came to know the Lord in 1978. “Then I realized what was the truth.” He also realized something that other new immigrant Christians share: “Usually, it’s your own people you feel for first.”



Excerpt from Devon Avenue Christian Community Center newsletter, Summer 2003:

Cricket Update—In our Spring Newsletter we shared about the recent breakthrough in reaching out to Muslim and Hindu men in the Devon Ave. area through telecasting the Cricket World Cup at [the Center]. The final tallies are in—The men continued to flood in to [the Center], especially when India and/or Pakistan played. . . . Nearly 500 different men attended the telecasts, with the highest count for one night at 100. About 250 “JESUS” videos were given out in various languages. Some refused the videos, but many accepted them with thanks. The location barrier was broken and the men are no longer afraid to come to [the Center].



For More Information

The book, Namaste America: Indian Immigrants in an American Metropolis, by Padma Rangaswamy (University Park, PA: Pennsylvania State University Press, 2000), paints a comprehensive portrait of the Indian immigrant experience in Chicago. For an in-depth look at the religious diversity of the South Asian population in the United States, see two books by Raymond Brady Williams, Religions of Immigrants from India and Pakistan: New Threads in the American Tapestry (New York: Cambridge University Press, 1988) and Christian Pluralism in the United States: The Indian Immigrant Experience (New York: Cambridge University Press, 1996).

The Federation of Indian American Christian Organizations of North America is a watchdog organization for Christian rights in India. Contact them at FIACONA, 110 Maryland Avenue, NE, Suite #510, Washington, DC, 20002, phone 202-547-4700, email dcoffice@fiacona.org, Web site www.fiacona.org.

Information about Rev. Shadrach Katari’s ministry to Telugu Lutherans can be found at the Web site of one of his churches, www.geocities.com/wesleychurch_chicago.



For Discussion

1. In this chapter, we see immigrants and non-immigrants cooperatively evangelizing South Asians. What advantages and disadvantages might each group have in this work? Do you think non-Christian South Asians would be more open to evangelization by fellow immigrants or by non-immigrants? How important is it not to step on “cultural toes” when dealing with immigrant religious groups?
2. Discuss the “social evangelism” or “friendship evangelism” approach. Are you comfortable with it? What are its strengths and weaknesses? Do you think it would be difficult for an evangelical Christian to maintain a friendship with a person who does not respond to invitations to become a Christian? What is the proper balance between “doing” and “preaching” the Gospel?
3. Recall this statement by Rev. John Bushi: “Hindus never stop at one place. If they are allowed to go in a evangelistic way, they will try to change and convert people because they also believe in the same kind of conversion that we talk about.” Discuss the implications of multiple new religious groups with conversionary agendas encountering each other in the United States. Can they all get along? Does this situation strengthen or weaken American society?
4. Are adherents of some religions inherently more receptive to the Gospel than others due to the nature of certain beliefs? Recall Rev. Shadrach Katari’s view that Hindus are more receptive than Muslims. Are there other avenues of receptivity besides similarities of beliefs? Discuss obstacles to receptivity as well, such as Islam’s rejection of the divinity of Jesus Christ.



Back

[Husky]

<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jul 20 2008, 01:27 AM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jul 20 2008, 01:27 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->http://www.tcgcohio.org/Numrich/CH2_CND_...n_0207.htm

[From The Church Next Door: Local Christians Face America’s New Religious Diversity, draft manuscript by Dr. Paul D. Numrich.  Please do not quote or cite without author’s permission.]

One day a few years ago, evangelist <b>John Bushi</b> stopped in to a small gift shop run out of Suburban Chicago Mennonite Church to see if it carried any items from <b>his native India.</b>
[...]

But he thinks that a societal rise in secularism and tolerance for religious diversity has emboldened Hindus.  “[Society] says you can believe in any god, so we have religious freedom.  They say that there is no need of prayer in the schools, at Christmastime don’t use Christ’s name in any public places, and even the Supreme Court takes out the 10 Commandments.  So these guys [Hindus] get some kind of encouragement, ‘OK, we can have our own idols, we can have our practice.’  So they become stronger and stronger.  And Hindus never stop at one place.  If they are allowed to go in a evangelistic way, they will try to change and convert people because they also believe in the same kind of conversion that we talk about.”  Rev. Bushi identified several strategies used by Hindu temples to attract new members, such as free medical care, classical Indian dance classes, and yoga instruction.

            <b>For Rev. Bushi, this Hindu assertiveness is a harbinger of ill for America.</b>  “I take it seriously that this country is blessed because of prayers and [Christian] values.  But slowly these values are going away because people are not paying attention.  <b>So once these idol worshipers come and bring evil things into the society, then probably we will face a lot of problems.”</b>
[right][snapback]84603[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Indian christians, western christians - they're all the same. Because of christianism.

It's not "missionaries" that are the problem, it's christianism. It would be a beginning when more people start acknowledging that, instead of couching terrorism in sensitive terms in order to not offend minorities.

[G.Subramaniam]

Community Health evangelism

http://www.globalconnections.co.uk/

( search for hindu )

--

THE COMMUNITY HEALTH EVANGELISM (CHE) APPROACH
Medical Ambassador’s Community Health Evangelism (CHE) Program is broadly aimed
toward the whole community. We do this by training local villagers to share spiritual,
physical, emotional and social truths with their fellow villagers.
Through CHE, we desire to reach the greatest possible number of people with physical
and spiritual help, and we have learned that we can do so by training Community Health
Evangelists. The approach includes the following primary characteristics:
5
1. Concentration on meeting priority needs keenly felt by the village in simple
community projects---designed to teach the people to do as much as possible on
their own. We attempt to begin at the ability level of the people in relation to
their leadership, initiative, and self-reliance.
2. An aggressive initiative of going to the people.
3. An integration of preventive medicine, health education, and sometimes curative
care, into a total program. The emphasis is on prevention and education, with
expected results in changed lifestyles and conditions.
4. A vision and goal to reach the most people as possible.
5. A program of instruction which shows the people how they can participate in
their own development. Lessons are developed, which are aimed at simple
health education, identification or major diseases, recognition of the need for
medical care, and care of the sick (especially children).
6. Community self-help and community leadership emanating from the peoples’
commitment to the program.
7. A commitment to delegate most of the tasks to local church leaders, community
leaders, and the CHEs, who can best generate local support and commitment
for the program.
8. An understanding that the content of the training must be transferable and
multipliable.
9. A commitment that readily available local resources should be used as much as
possible.
10. Provision for good working relationships with the nearest available back-up
hospital for necessary obstetrical, surgical and medical care of severely ill
patients.
11. Mass inoculation programs for measles, BCG, DPT, and polio. Such programs
should be community-sponsored programs.
12. Provision for sanitation training, with an emphasis on safe water and proper use
of pit latrines.
13. Provision for easily accessible family planning instruction materials.
An underlying foundation for a CHE Program is that the community sees a project as
their own, not outsiders who initiated it. Too many times organizations have come from
the outside to do something for the people, but when the outsiders leave, what had
been accomplished disintegrates. There is no sustainability. The people expect the
outsiders to provide the funds, parts or labor to maintain and repair the project.
When we do things for people in the community, then the people always see what has
been done as belonging to the outsiders. The emphasis from the beginning must be on
the community, saying this is ours and we will make it happen. We need to be enablers
of people, so that they take responsibility for the work health under God’s direction.
There is not one action, but many that enables community ownership to happen.

CORE ELEMENTS OF CHE
Community Health Evangelism is made up of three essential groups:
The CHE Training Team
The training team is the group that initiates the program. They usually come from
outside the area. There should be two to four people on each training team, including
potential combination of the following skills---nursing, public health, teaching,
agriculture, nutrition, water development, and sanitation. At least one member should
be a nurse, but not all members should be medical personnel. The training team’s
expertise should be any combination of---nursing, public health, agriculture, sanitation,
nutrition, social work and teaching. Because the team of trainers works full-time, they
are nearly always salaried.
The Community Health Committee
The key to a successful Community Health Evangelism Program, that will be multi
pliable, transferable, and ongoing, is that the program must be community-based, rather
than outside agency-based. The program must be integrated around community
committees, which are chosen from community members.
The committee should, preferably, be community-based. The members should be
mature, well-respected people, who represent different segments of the community; i.e.,
education, government, business, agriculture and health.
Volunteer Community Health Evangelists
The Community Health Evangelism volunteer is the major worker in the program.
Adequate attention to their ministry will require about two half-days of work a week.
Once the communities have chosen such people and they have been trained, their job
is as follows:
1. Put into practice what they have learned around their home and with their family;
that is, they model what they have learned.
2. Promote good health, prevent disease, and model abundant Christian life as a
volunteer.
3. Practice evangelism and discipleship with individuals and groups.
4. Do home visiting on a regular basis, sharing the spiritual and physical truths they
have learned.
5. Initiate and coordinate local community self-help projects.
6. Teach in a way that will help others to become teachers, themselves, and
thereby, repeat the instructional process and expand the circle of learning.


PROGRAM DESCRIPTION
Community Health Evangelism has the following elements:
1. A team of three to four trainers works with the community to assess their needs
and establish community health committees. These committees choose workers
(CHEs) who have an average community education.
2. A group of CHE trainers normally train 12 to 18 people from five to eight areas
within walking distance of the training location. Training sessions normally are
conducted two days per week, until 40 to 50 sessions have been completed.
Half of each training day will be spent on health teaching and the other half on
spiritual teaching. All the teaching must be transferable, so that the people
being trained will be able to teach others who, in turn, can teach others.
3. The CHE trainees then teach what they have learned in their community by
means of story-telling, discussions and example. Their main roles are teaching
in the home, assisting in community health projects, and having a spiritual
ministry. A part-time CHE worker can work with up to 400 people.
4. Each training team works in a given area for three to five years, establishing
projects in three to six geographically adjoining areas. They will be involved in
training 150 to 200 CHEs, covering 15 to 25 villages serving 80,000 to 100,000
people.
5. It is best for the CHEs to be volunteers, but remuneration, if desired, may be
given by the Community Health Committee. If so, it must be a community’s
responsibility to provide funds. Remuneration in kind; i.e., doing work for the
CHE worker, is a good method of reward.
6. The program is begun first in one area and then expanded into adjacent areas.
Additional workers may need to be trained in the original area to obtain a better
ratio of CHE to the population.
7. The goal is for each initial training team to be replaced by three to six, especially
bright and gifted, local CHEs. These will be chosen from those trained by the
initial outside training team to become trainers, themselves. These local training
teams will expand the program into adjacent areas within the country.
8. As much as possible, funding for the individual project needs to come from the
local communities, but where local resources are insufficient funds may be
solicited from in-country agencies who are interested or working in community
health, agriculture, etc.
9. Major expansion of the CHE Program best takes place by training multiple
national community health teams. In each country, models are developed to
show how to integrate a spiritual ministry into an already existing community
health program. This enables other communities to learn by observation how to
establish an integrated program from the beginning.
In the decade of the 90's, it is our vision to establish training teams in 80 countries of the
world to train 100,000 people as CHEs. They will be models for their country in how to
help people help themselves--both physically and spiritually. The training teams are not
only to be Medical Ambassador workers, as the major multiplication of the CHE strategy
will take place by training other organizations to implement their own CHE projects.
MAI provides the lesson plans, problem-posing pictures, picture books, and Bible study
materials, which they can use in their own program.

The CHE Program has been used
mainly in rural areas and with people
open to the Gospel. We have different
models for starting a CHE Program in
different situations. The Community-
Based CHE Program, which we have
described above, is most commonly
used in our 45 projects in 25 countries.
The MOST DESIRABLE MODEL is a
Community-Based model, which
enhances the probability of success.
But there are also Family-Based,
Feldscher-Based and Church-Based
CHE projects. These other three
alternative approaches depend on the
nature of the target area.
MODIFYING THE CHE STRATEGY
We are now working in an area called the 10/40 window, which requires different
approaches. This area stretches from 10 to 40 degrees North latitude. It reaches from
Japan on the east through North Africa and Southern Spain on the west. Europe and
Northern Russia are not in this window, but Russian’s old Muslim republics are
included.
It is in the 10/40 window that 60 percent of the world’s population lives, with 82 percent
of the poorest of the poor living there. Eighty-four percent of these people have the
lowest quality of life. Also, 97 percent of the people in the 55 le ast evangelized
countries live there, but 8 percent of the world’s missionaries work among these people.
A number of changes have been made to CHE so it would be better accepted by the
medical professionals and religious forces in these closed countries. In these countries,

CHE stands for Community Health Education, instead of Evangelism, and the workers
are called Community Health Educators.
But to implement changes, the following non-negotiables must be present as we adapt
the CHE Program for these closed, un-reached countries.
First - The integration of physical and spiritual ministry.
Second - Multiplication of all work through intensive training.
Third - Community ownership of a program, which is directed by the
villagers, themselves, with a minimum of resources from the
outside.
Fourth - An emphasis on prevention of disease rather than cure.
Fifth - The program is sustainable after the training team leaves.
Sixth - The program is effective in helping people physically and spiritually.
Seventh - The program is sensitively adapted to meet the needs of a
particular people.

A FAMILY-BASED CHE PROGRAM is
used in closed, un-reached countries,
where there are no Christians. It is a
precursor to establishing a normal
Church-Based CHE Ministry. A
Christian family, trained as CHEs,
moves to an un-reached village and
begins to minister as CHEs. As people
come to Christ, experience God’s love,
and see the benefits of an integrated
ministry, a normal Community-Based
CHE Program is begun.
The families’ training is a combination
for a CHE and a Trainer, but their main
role is as a CHE, not a trainer. Their
goal will be to fill the role of CHEs,
themselves, until their work bears fruit
and they have made disciples, many of
who, in turn, may become CHEs.
The Christians may invite their neighbors in
for a weekly class on health and spiritual
topics on Moral Values. Those that are
spiritually open are invited to a
chronological approach Bible study. They
begin with commonly held concepts as a
bridge to Christianity.
Training Team
Homes Homes
Growth
Groups
C
O
M
M
U
N
I
T
Y
Focus
C
O
M
M
U
N
I
T
Y
Homes
C
O
M
M
U
N
I
T
Y
Growth
Groups
Growth
Groups
Chur ch
CHE family
(one per
community)
CHE family
(one per
community)
CHE family
(one per
community)
Community-Based Program

We are using this model in over 120 villages in Eastern Nepal and Northern India, with
all Buddhists and Hindu communities in the foothills of the Himalayan Mountains, where
over 105 fellowships/churches have been started.

----

and much much more

every wicked evangelism trick spelled out

[G.Subramaniam]

I am more and more convinced that the only way to stop xtianity is to deal a death blow to it in the west -
by education, by outreach, by using our super-IQ status to push hinduism

Much of the west is only very lightly xtian

[G.Subramaniam]

From globalconnections.uk

Globalisation and the Hindu World
Global Connections Conference July 2002
Robin Thomson and Suneel Shivdasani, South Asian Concern
A way of life? Cultural fascism? Universal spirituality?
Which Hinduism will dominate the 21st century?
Aim
To help the participants to
§ Understand the impact of Hinduism today
§ Pray for Hindus
§ Begin to develop creative ways to communicate with Hindus
A. The Hindu world: South Asia and the Diaspora
B. Hinduism’s impact on the rest of the world in the 19th and 20th
centuries
· Vedanta for the Western world (Vivekananda. Aldous Huxley, Radhakrishnan)
· Packaging the faith for the market (the gurus)
· Beyond the New Age: Universal spirituality
C. The impact of globalisation on South Asia
· The colonial and missionary experience: ideas of freedom, self-determination
and struggle
· Market forces: economic exploitation, the consumer revolution, global
competitors
· The global village: windows on the world, MTV to Bollywood, the Internet
highway
· Technology: factories & dams to missiles, software solutions and transgenic
mice
· Environment: devastation and degradation
D. Hindu Nationalism
· 19th century renaissance
· 20th century polarisation: the RSS, defining Indianness as Hindu culture
· Hindutva, Ayodhya, Gujarat: the Sangh Parivar and the cycle of violence
· Conversion as an escape – to Christianity? Buddhism? Islam? Buddhism again?
· Nepal’s unenviable choice: Monarchy? Maoism? Hindu nationalism? Or...?
E. Christian responses
Can we turn barriers into bridges?
· Social/cultural structures: the dilemmas of caste and people groups
· Theological/cultural challenges: Christ is unique but is he Asian?
· Spiritual powers: demonstrating Christ’s love and power
Globalisation and the Hindu World
Global Connections Conference July 2002
Robin Thomson and Suneel Shivdasani, South Asian Concern
Hindus today
Hindus are inescapably linked with India, the Punya Bhoomi (sacred land).
Traditionally a Hindu could not leave its boundaries without losing caste. But all that
has changed and now Hindus are found all over the world.
This is something comparatively recent. Although South Asians had been migrating
all over the former British Empire, the last 50 years have seen large scale migrations
to Europe, North America and Australia. The pace has been accelerating over the past
5 years, especially to North America. The USA has been issuing around 100,000 visas
a year for computer professionals. The majority of these are Indian Hindus.
Converging cultures
Today we see a process of "convergence" of the culture of middle class, urban South
Asians around the world, whether they live in New Delhi or New York, London or
Lahore, Colombo or Paris. They watch the same films, listen to the same music, enjoy
the same food, read the same books.
Hindus in the Diaspora come from different parts of the Indian sub continent, but the
largest groups are Gujarati and Punjabi, of whom many migrated via East Africa.
They are mostly business people, professionals or skilled workers. Sindhis are another
key business community. Recently Sri Lankan Tamils, escaping from the civil war,
have settled in every European country, the USA and Canada.
Many of the recent migrants are highly educated professionals. Many also come from
higher castes, so that the spread of caste in the diaspora is different from that of India
as a whole.
Diaspora Hindus face a marked generation gap. The 1st generation, especially of
those who moved 20-30 years ago, are very different from the 2nd and now the 3rd
generations, born and brought up away from the sub continent. This younger
generation finds itself living in two (or more) worlds: the world of their parents and
the worlds of schools, friends, work and pleasure.
Pressures
Like everybody else, Hindus face the relentless pressures of secularism and
materialism. For some, their religion becomes irrelevant; for others it becomes more
important, as they try to retain their identity or rediscover their roots. In recent years
large numbers of temples have been built and many priests and gurus are invited to
visit. Strong efforts are being made to teach the younger generation what Hinduism is,
through books, camps, special lectures or CD ROMs. This was never needed "back
home" where the younger generation "absorbed" Hinduism as their way of life.
What will be the impact of this globalisation on Hindus in the diaspora? And what, in
turn, will be their impact on India and the rest of South Asia?
India continues, with China, to be the world's most diverse, populous and challenging
country. It is the world's largest democracy, with an expanding economy, self
sufficient in food, a nuclear and space power, resilient in the face of political divisions
and natural disasters. At the same time it is still predominantly rural, still with 40%
living below the poverty line, still with vast disparities of wealth and poverty,
sophistication and superstition, education and illiteracy, high and low social status.
Hinduism remains India's driving force, along with the many other forces which it has
absorbed and synthesised, especially over the la st 100 years. How will it change, if at
all, as the world becomes smaller?
Globalisation and the Hindu World
Global Connections Conference July 2002
Robin Thomson and Suneel Shivdasani, South Asian Concern
Positive
The contribution of NRIs (Non Resident Indians or people from any part of the subcontinent)
is increasingly significant. They generate as much wealth as the entire
South Asian economy. Their entrepreneurial, social and educational skills are
increasingly valued, as the links around the world strengthen, and as resources - and
ideas and values - flow back and forth. What happens in the Diaspora impacts South
Asia, and vice versa.
Negative
The last three years have seen a disturbing trend. Along with reports of much
response to the Good News, there has been a strong increase in extremist Hindu
nationalism. This has resulted in unexpected pressure on Christians in certain parts of
India and Nepal.
The challenge of prayer
Praying for Hindus is still our greatest challenge.

[acharya]

<b>Changing your mother? Engaging with Hindus over conversion – Robin Thomson writes:</b>
“To seek to convert already God-loving people to another faith is a sin… it should be made a crime…”
This comment by the Secretary of the Hindu Council UK reflects the
increasing concern of many Hindus about what they perceive as
aggressive conversion activity by Christians and others. What lies
behind such concerns? Some are linked to the growth of Hindu
nationalism, others to the struggles over caste that continue to raise
deep feelings on all sides. Have Christians caused
misunderstanding through insensitive actions or even exploitation or
is conflict inevitable because ‘dharma’ and ‘religion’ are
incompatible? What are the real issues and how do we engage with
Hindus in ways that will lead to better understanding on both sides,
as well as the fulfilment of our mission task?


http://www.globalconnections.co.uk/NR/rdon...af501fe3d1f1863

http://www.globalconnections.co.uk/NR/rdon...222ced112524215

[G.Subramaniam]

<!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 21 2008, 03:34 AM-->QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 21 2008, 03:34 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Changing your mother? Engaging with Hindus over conversion – Robin Thomson writes:</b>
“To seek to convert already God-loving people to another faith is a sin… it should be made a crime…”
This comment by the Secretary of the Hindu Council UK reflects the
increasing concern of many Hindus about what they perceive as
aggressive conversion activity by Christians and others. What lies
behind such concerns? Some are linked to the growth of Hindu
nationalism, others to the struggles over caste that continue to raise
deep feelings on all sides. Have Christians caused
misunderstanding through insensitive actions or even exploitation or
is conflict inevitable because ‘dharma’ and ‘religion’ are
incompatible? What are the real issues and how do we engage with
Hindus in ways that will lead to better understanding on both sides,
as well as the fulfilment of our mission task?


http://www.globalconnections.co.uk/NR/rdon...af501fe3d1f1863

http://www.globalconnections.co.uk/NR/rdon...222ced112524215
[right][snapback]84690[/snapback][/right]
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Acharya when I click on these links it asks for a username and password

Can you please post the entire text

[acharya]

These are links to PDF files. Download them
Try right click

[G.Subramaniam]

<!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM-->QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->These are links to PDF files. Download them
Try right click
[right][snapback]84711[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


I did, it says enter username and password

[acharya]

<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jul 21 2008, 12:51 AM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jul 21 2008, 12:51 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->These are links to PDF files. Download them
Try right click
[right][snapback]84711[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


I did, it says enter username and password
[right][snapback]84724[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It is OK for me.
Try using firefox

[G.Subramaniam]

<!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 22 2008, 01:08 AM-->QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 22 2008, 01:08 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jul 21 2008, 12:51 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jul 21 2008, 12:51 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->These are links to PDF files. Download them
Try right click
[right][snapback]84711[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


I did, it says enter username and password
[right][snapback]84724[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It is OK for me.
Try using firefox
[right][snapback]84759[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


I am using firefox

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jul 22 2008, 12:50 AM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jul 22 2008, 12:50 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 22 2008, 01:08 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 22 2008, 01:08 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jul 21 2008, 12:51 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jul 21 2008, 12:51 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-acharya+Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(acharya @ Jul 21 2008, 11:05 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->These are links to PDF files. Download them
Try right click
[right][snapback]84711[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


I did, it says enter username and password
[right][snapback]84724[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It is OK for me.
Try using firefox
[right][snapback]84759[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


I am using firefox
[right][snapback]84808[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just cancel the first time . You will get authorization error. Then press back button and try again. It downloads.

[dhu]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Cases booked against 3 foreigners  </b>

Hyderabad, July 22: Cases under Foreigner’s Act were registerded against three foreigners after complaints of their alleged involvement in indulging in religious conversion at a school in Tilak Nagar.

Mild tension prevailed at the school premises with the activists of BJP and Hindu Vahini staging a protest today in front of the school demanding action against the accused.

Trouble started when activists of Hindu Vahini and BJP gathered in front of the St Anna’s high school at Tilak Nagar. They alleged that three US nationals and three others from Tamil Nadu were indulging in religious preachings to the students during prayer time. The preachings were going on for the past one week, the right-wing activists alleged.

Initially, the school management denied any such activity in the school premises. With the protestors unrelenting, the school management claimed that the foreigners were imparting ‘moral values’ only and no preaching or conversion activity was going on in the premises.

The BJP and Hindu Vahini activists argued the need for foreigners to impart moral values to the students and claimed that the school management was directly supporting the conversion activity.

At one stage, the right-wing activists tried to barge into the school premises but were prevented by the police.

Police took the three US nationals— Richard (26), Jerry Dorge (48) and Casper Rhonda (43)—into custody and took them to the Kacheguda police station.

The BJP and Hindu Vahini activists, however, did not relent. They staged a dharna in front of the police station demanding cases against the accused and action against the school management.

Police booked cases under Foreigner’s Act and are investigating. ‘‘All the three are in possession of valid documents and have come to the city on invitation from YMCA. We are yet to investigate the charges against them,’’ East Zone DCP T Prabhakar Rao said.

The police have to collect evidence of the foreigners’ involvement in religious conversion, the DCP said and added that the statements of the schoolchildren and their parents would also be taken.

Police are also investigating into the involvement of the three other persons from Tamil Nadu in the alleged conversion activity. The involvement of the school management would also be probed, Prabhakar Rao said.

The foreigners hail from Atlanta and have landed in the city on July 11.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->