Hindu/Indian Culture Outside India

[RomaIndian]

edit

[balai_c]

No, buddy, I am afraid you have been duped. This story is not factually, or for matter even allegorically correct. The story begins with Kaliyuga, but then stoops down to laughable myths like notorious Aryan-Dravidian clash. This is straight out of fairy tales of 19th century racist orientalists.



One of the reason white guys are driven to appropriate Dharmic culure and its immense intellectual accomplishments is the biblical fairy tale of Ham.



[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_Ham"]Curse of Ham[/url]

The Curse of Ham (more properly called the Curse of Canaan) refers to the biblical incident in Genesis 9:20–27 in which Ham's father Noah placed a curse upon Ham's son Canaan. Genesis tells how Noah, the first "husbandman" (farmer), was also the first to cultivate the vine and make wine. After Noah became drunk, and was "uncovered within his tent", his son Ham "saw the nakedness of his father" and told his two brothers, Shem and Japheth, who then covered Noah with a cloak while averting their eyes. When Noah awoke and "knew what his younger son had done to him", he pronounced the curse, not on Ham, but on Ham's son Canaan. Canaan was condemned to be a "servant of servants...to his brothers."



Questions raised by this story, especially regarding the nature of Ham's transgression, and the question of why Noah cursed Canaan when Ham had sinned, have been debated for over two thousand years.[1] The original objective was to justify the subjection of the Canaanites to the Israelites,[2] but in the first few centuries of the modern era, it came to be interpreted as a curse of, and explanation for, black skin; in addition, when Islam became established in the middle east, and with it the widespread Muslim practice of owning black African slaves, it became interpreted as a curse of slavery visited on black Africans, Ham's supposed descendants.[3]

The explanation that black Africans, as the "sons of Ham", were cursed, possibly "blackened" by their sins, was advanced only sporadically during the Middle Ages, but it became increasingly common during the slave trade of the 18th and 19th centuries.[33] The justification of slavery itself through the sins of Ham was well suited to the ideological interests of the elite; with the emergence of the slave trade, its racialized version justified the exploitation of a ready supply of African labour.



In the parts of Africa where Christianity flourished in the early days, while it was still illegal in Rome, this idea never took hold, and its interpretation of scripture was never adopted by the African Coptic Churches. A modern Amharic commentary on Genesis notes the 19th century and earlier European theory that blacks were subject to whites as a result of the "curse of Ham", but calls this a false teaching unsupported by the text of the Bible, emphatically pointing out that Noah's curse fell not upon all descendants of Ham, but only on the descendants of Canaan, and asserting that it was fulfilled when Canaan was occupied by both Semites (Israel) and Japethites (ancient Philistines). The commentary further notes that Canaanites ceased to exist politically after the Third Punic War (149 BC), and that their current descendants are thus unknown and scattered among all peoples.[

To, proud racist Europeans when they saw brown skinned Indians excelling in science and technology, supremely skillful in literature, philosophy, most of the time superior to their own, it created a cognitive dissonance. This impelled them to create a theory that would eventually help them appropriate these achievements, and pas them as their own.



The other objective was to de-judafy christianity, because of their immense hatred (the latter owing to downright antisemitism.) In India, they saw a strange exotic world both respectable and revolting, something that was ready for digestion.



The purpose of the Dravidian project was to generate ethnic troubles within the north and south Indian population, apparently due to diverse and disparate culture and spiritual traditions. They also tried this in other places like Rwanda,where the tragic Hutu-Tutsi feud degenerated to a bloody civil war resulting in the death of millions of people, scores more homeless. Just google this war, you will find out more yourself.



Thankfully because of the unique civilizational character of Indian society and tireless effort of Dharmic savants, a war was avoided, even after the colonial government having invested millions of rupees in the newly formed justice party in the madras presidency (today known as Tamilnadu). The objective was to start a separation movement , like we have seen in Kashmir , headed by the infamous Periyar.



P.S: The word DRAVIDIAN is a notion of a separate culture and community, not a separate race or ethnicity. So, the Aryan-Dravidian clash can only happen in fiction, not in reality.





Regards,

Balai_c

[RomaIndian]

[quote name='balai_c' date='08 June 2012 - 03:41 PM' timestamp='1339165987' post='115044']



P.S: The word DRAVIDIAN is a notion of a separate culture and community, not a separate race or ethnicity. So, the Aryan-Dravidian clash can only happen in fiction, not in reality.





Regards,

Balai_c

[/quote]



I do write about a suppossed Aryan-Dravidian Clash, but its a misunderstanding that i mean the Aryans to have been White People and Dravidians Brown. I put in "Dravidian" in Quotation Marks though. I believe Aryans to have been Indians and Brown Skinned and native to India. "brown, golden hued, beloved of all who goes forth to all the Deities" RV Hymn to Indra. My History on the Internet is a constant fighting against the notion of White Supremacist Theories of "White European Like Aryans" and "Brown Skinned Dravidians". My Family is of a Brown Colour themselfes.



Ps: To me "Dravidian" in my Story is a fictional Negroe Race.



Many wishful Greetings, RomaIndian

[balai_c]

I am certain you are aware of the notion. I apologize in advance if I hurt your feelings. My contention on the skin color is in fact, because of the story of Ham, and its use in justifying slavery and colonial oppression. A war between North and south Indian would result in the decimation and cessation of Indian way of life as we know it. That is why I looked so agitated. This was the original intent behind the proposition of Aryan Invasion Theory.

[RomaIndian]

[quote name='balai_c' date='08 June 2012 - 04:10 PM' timestamp='1339167738' post='115047']

I am certain you are aware of the notion. I apologize in advance if I hurt your feelings. My contention on the skin color is in fact, because of the story of Ham, and its use in justifying slavery and colonial oppression. A war between North and south Indian would result in the decimation and cessation of Indian way of life as we know it. That is why I looked so agitated. This was the original intent behind the proposition of Aryan Invasion Theory.

[/quote]



Yes i fully comprehend and NO you didnt hurt my Feelings. Many Southindians are not distinguishable from Northindians and vice versa. There shouldnt really be a fight over it. All Indians cluster together on Genetic Charts, eventhough there are slight differences between the jatis and castes and regions but overall they form one southasian cluster distinguishable from all other Clusters. An Northindian will cluster together with an Southindian before with an European. North and Southindian Clusters are related. I support only what is good for india, a Divide of Indians is not good.



Ps: But back to my Original Question. Do you believe that the Persecution and Demonization of Rroma, Indians and Hindu Culture has something to do with the Kali Yuga we are in?

[balai_c]

Ps: But back to my Original Question. Do you believe that the Persecution and Demonization of Rroma, Indians and Hindu Culture has something to do with the Kali Yuga we are in?

In a word, NO. This is because Kaliyuga began with the end of the Mahabharata war. The Indian idea of cyclical Itihasa is markedly different from the linear history as understood by west. Roma people was said to have left India in the 16th century, taken by Islamic imperial forces, as courtesans and court musicians, who in course of time came to Europe. They were clubbed together as Europe's own Gypsies. Because Europe was obsessed with Biblical fairy tales from Genesis, old testament, they could not reconcile with a darker skinned pagans, who could not be deconstructed within their own narrow religious worldview. This started the wave of savage persecutions on your ancestors. It had nothing to do with India , or very large historical epicycles like the Yugas.

[RomaIndian]

[quote name='balai_c' date='08 June 2012 - 04:55 PM' timestamp='1339170431' post='115052']

In a word, NO. This is because Kaliyuga began with the end of the Mahabharata war. The Indian idea of cyclical Itihasa is markedly different from the linear history. Roma people was said to have left India in the 16th century, taken by Islamic imperial forces, as courtesans and court musicians, who in course of time came to Europe. They were clubbed together as Europe's own Gypsies. Because Europe was obsessed with Biblical fairy tales from Genesis, old testament, they could not reconcile with a darker skinned pagans, who could not be deconstructed within their own narrow religious worldview. This started the wave of savage persecutions on your ancestors. It had nothing to do with India , or very large historical epicycles like the Yugas.

[/quote]



Seems as if you demystified my "Theory" :unsure

But yes, your approach is good i guess. <img src='http://www.india-forum.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />

Gypsies were very different in Europe, they were dark skinned and didnt fit into the Christian Theology of that Time.

[balai_c]

The Hutu-Tutsi Civil wars in Wikipedia:



[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_Genocide"]Hutu tutsi civil war[/url]



Another source:



[url="http://worldnews.about.com/od/africa/f/tutsihutu.htm"]Real cause[/url]



And another:[url="http://www.mahalo.com/hutu-and-tutsi/"]hutu-and-tutsi civil war[/url]

The Hutu and Tutsi are two central African tribes who have been involved in civil war since the mid 20th century. In 1994, an estimated 500,000 Tutsis and thousands of Hutus were killed in the Rwandan Genocide. Both groups have occupied the same region for centuries and share a common language and culture.

History



The Hutu are descended from Bantus who worked as fishermen, cattle herders and farmers in Africa's great lakes regions. The taller, cattle-herding Tutsi migrated from northern Ethiopa in the 1300s with the intent to conquer the Hutu, but ended up settling into the local culture and adopting the Bantu language, although they added their own traditions and words into the mix. Intermarriage among the two groups was not uncommon.

The Conflict



It has been theorized that the distinctions between Hutu and Tutsi were not emphasized until the area was colonized by European settlers. When conducting census counts, the Belgians separated Africans into Tutsi and Hutu groups based solely on appearance or wealth. The colonists beleived that the Tutsi were superior because they were taller and had longer noses and therefore more similar to Europeans. On this basis, only Tutsi were allowed to participate in government or seek education. Naturally, this caused dissatisfaction among the Hutu majority. In 1959, the Belgian government reversed this practice and implemented a Hutu government. Civil wars and genocides instigated by both sides have occurred periodically ever since.

Now, you can understand why I was so apprehensive!

[balai_c]

And one more thing- the word ARYA in samskut means noble, not white. It a measure of virtue, not an indicator of ethnicity . The latter idea of ARYAN master race is a Germanic corruption and distortion of the original Dharmic meaning. It was hijacked by motivated scholars, to satisfy their political and civilizational objectives.

[RomaIndian]

@balaiC great posts

[RomaIndian]

Plou ca in India. Its a Song about India by Roma Gypsies from Europe.



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgWcx2BvlZw&feature=player_embedded[/media]

[rhytha]

This is taking it too far.









WASHINGTON—Following the publication of the image above, in which the most cherished figures from multiple religious faiths were depicted engaging in a lascivious sex act of considerable depravity, no one was murdered, beaten, or had their lives threatened, sources reported Thursday. The image of the Hebrew prophet Moses high-fiving Jesus Christ as both are having their erect penises vigorously masturbated by Ganesha, all while the Hindu deity anally penetrates Buddha with his fist, reportedly went online at 6:45 p.m. EDT, after which not a single bomb threat was made against the organization responsible, nor did the person who created the cartoon go home fearing for his life in any way. Though some members of the Jewish, Christian, Hindu, and Buddhist faiths were reportedly offended by the image, sources confirmed that upon seeing it, they simply shook their heads, rolled their eyes, and continued on with their day.

[shamu]

Above post should be in psy-ops thread. No in this one.