05-15-2006, 09:51 PM
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->or do you firmly believe 'jats,' some obscure ancient clan as some would have us believe, to be representative of the people who have predominantly occupied this area since time immemorial <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes. As has shown been shown by Dr. K. Elst among others, indic inundation of central asia-ME has been grossly underestimated, we have systematic evidence for the formation of indic derived ethnicities in the mittani/kassite/kurds/sindoi/maetoi/hrvat/etc and i see no reason to assume that such was not the case in the case of the massagetae derived from autochthonous indic jats. Are we to assume that Gurcharan Das' or dahiwal' surname that we find sytematically even upto bengal is derived from a tribe of invading iranian "Dahae". of course not. we should fit in this evidence into the overarching <i>paradigm shift</i> brought about by Elst and Sethna to state that indic inundation of central asia led to the rise of the dahae. Massagetae are, btw, the central force in the so-called sarmatians who displaced the pontic aryan (indic) scythians <i>from the east</i>:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->K Elst..The ones to blame are - who else? - the Aryans. They, and âspecifically Indo-Aryansâ57, played a role in the Hurrian and Kassite invasions disrupting Mesopotamia (while the IE or non-IE identity of the <b>Guti </b>and Lullubi invaders remains unknown, though attempts are made to link the <b>Guti </b>with the Tokharians); and from Bactria, they by themselves disrupted the economy of the Indus-Saraswati civilization....
...This scenario has been attested in writing in the case of Mesopotamia. Sergent quotes other experts to the effect that âfrom ca. 2230 BC, (â¦) the <b>Guti </b>had cut off the roads, ruined the countryside, set the cities on fireâ59 etc., that the Assyrian trade system was disrupted by the Mitannic people, etc. But is there similar evidence for the Indus-Saraswati civilization? <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, at the same time that the indic kassites and mittani were flowing into the mideast, the guti also invaded the same regions. OF course, the euros will make some arcane connection to "tocharians"; jats are simply too improbable as the source..
Yes. As has shown been shown by Dr. K. Elst among others, indic inundation of central asia-ME has been grossly underestimated, we have systematic evidence for the formation of indic derived ethnicities in the mittani/kassite/kurds/sindoi/maetoi/hrvat/etc and i see no reason to assume that such was not the case in the case of the massagetae derived from autochthonous indic jats. Are we to assume that Gurcharan Das' or dahiwal' surname that we find sytematically even upto bengal is derived from a tribe of invading iranian "Dahae". of course not. we should fit in this evidence into the overarching <i>paradigm shift</i> brought about by Elst and Sethna to state that indic inundation of central asia led to the rise of the dahae. Massagetae are, btw, the central force in the so-called sarmatians who displaced the pontic aryan (indic) scythians <i>from the east</i>:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->K Elst..The ones to blame are - who else? - the Aryans. They, and âspecifically Indo-Aryansâ57, played a role in the Hurrian and Kassite invasions disrupting Mesopotamia (while the IE or non-IE identity of the <b>Guti </b>and Lullubi invaders remains unknown, though attempts are made to link the <b>Guti </b>with the Tokharians); and from Bactria, they by themselves disrupted the economy of the Indus-Saraswati civilization....
...This scenario has been attested in writing in the case of Mesopotamia. Sergent quotes other experts to the effect that âfrom ca. 2230 BC, (â¦) the <b>Guti </b>had cut off the roads, ruined the countryside, set the cities on fireâ59 etc., that the Assyrian trade system was disrupted by the Mitannic people, etc. But is there similar evidence for the Indus-Saraswati civilization? <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, at the same time that the indic kassites and mittani were flowing into the mideast, the guti also invaded the same regions. OF course, the euros will make some arcane connection to "tocharians"; jats are simply too improbable as the source..