<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Husky,
I don't think we can say that european is heroic versus a decadent, sinful Semitic;<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->It is an error to attribute such a notion to me. This is the first time I've ever come across such an idea. It has certainly never been my view and is most alien to me.
In fact, I don't think you yourself ever indicated such a thing either. So who is this mysterious 'we'? <!--emo&
--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I never conceived of any ethnic battle of Greco-Romans vs Jewish people - besides, how different can people be when they both originate in the smallish region of the Mediterranean?
Nor did I ever even consider any side to have an ideological upperhand, that is, between Greco-Roman religion and Judaism. I have no troubles with either ideology (granted I don't know as much about the latter).
But I do have a problem with christoislamism: the heretical parasite ideologies that grafted themselves onto Judaism. I've always insisted Judaism had nothing to do with, but that christianity was an upstart religion that <i>claimed</i> its origins in Judaism in order to give itself legitimacy, all the while it mangled Judaic scriptures in order to validate jesus' messiah-ness.
Judaism itself is innocent of this. This is why I find fault with the terms 'judeo-christian' and 'Abrahamic religions' - both giving christianity (and islam) a sheen of respectability by wrongly grouping them with Judaism. Precisely why I take exception to the unfortunately commonly-used term 'judeo-christian', as it is offensive to the only legitimate religion there.
Anyway, explanation done. Now moving onto this:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Christianity arose from Hellenized Judaism. It's re-interpretations of the Hebrew Bible or Old Testament, employed "Allegory,"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->I can see how this is a possibility. But it's not 'Judaism' if it is Hellenized, in my opinion.
Whoever the scribes were who created Paul, they were specifically <i>not</i> Jewish - although I suppose we must allow some chance that they might have been Hellenized people from Judea (who were not Jewish if they were Hellenized, obviously) but even that need not have been the case.
The creators of 'Paul' were most certainly anti-Jewish since their anti-Semitic statements, which they put into the mouth of their fiction 'Paul', were hurled particularly at Jewish people (that is, at the practitioners of Judaism).
See here:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/A5.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The seeds of Christian hatred for Jews begins from the readings of the New Testament and the persecutions began when the Church first held power to enforce its dogmas. <b>The Biblical Paul, for example, put the blame of Jesus's death entirely on the Jews. In the first epistle of Paul to the Thessalonians (2:14-15), it says,
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->"the Jews who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets...."<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--></b>Also the gospel of John, makes it clear that the Jews represent an enemy (and John 8:44 puts the devil as the father of the Jews). <b>Many prominent priests used <i>Paul's epistles</i> and the gospels as Biblical justification for Jewish persecution.</b><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Now, who but non-Jewish people could have come up with that? Hence the authors of Paul could not be Jews, but at closest call can only come as far as being Hellenised Judeans (people of Judea) and, like I said, even that need not be at all.
I still think Paul's inventors might have been Gnostic christians from Syria, or Marcionites who were from Caesarea in Asia Minor it seems (in today's Turkey) according to this page.
In point of fact, I think it was far more likely that the Marcionites (a christian Gnostic sect) created Paul than any Hellenized Judeans.
See for example:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/B2c.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Falsified Paul: Early Christianity in the Twilight by Hermann Detering (of the Radical Criticism school), translated and made available here in its complete form online, along with a summary outline. In short:<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->This book shows that all the <b>Pauline letters</b> are all 2nd-Century fabrications, Catholically <b>redacted from Marcionite</b> gnostic dualist-god original versions.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
linked to from: Radikal Kritik's English pages<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Some more on Marcionites:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/B1b.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The most ancient dated Christian inscription (Oct. 1, 318 A.D.) runs "The Lord and Saviour Jesus the Good"â Chrestos, not Christos. This was the legend over the door of a <b>Marcionite Church, and the Marcionites were Anti-Jewish Gnostics</b>, and did not confound their Chrestos with the Jewish Christos (Messiah).<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->In the Synagogue of the Marcionites on Mount Hermon, built in the third century A.D., the Messiah's title is spelled Chrestos. According to Tertullian and Lactantius, the common people usually called Christ Chrestos.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->The second paragraph refers to their church as a Synagogue, whereas other writers call it only church. Since Marcionites were anti-Jewish, I don't think their building ought to be called Synagogue at all.
But Marcionism started in <i>Caesarea in Asia Minor</i> (turns out there are several other places also called Caesarea) according to http://www.medmalexperts.com/POCM/triumph_...cholarship.html
which seems to be quite knowledgeable about early christianity. Turns out Mount Hermon is shared between Syria (homeland of Gnostic christianity) and Israel.
I don't think we can say that european is heroic versus a decadent, sinful Semitic;<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->It is an error to attribute such a notion to me. This is the first time I've ever come across such an idea. It has certainly never been my view and is most alien to me.
In fact, I don't think you yourself ever indicated such a thing either. So who is this mysterious 'we'? <!--emo&
--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> I never conceived of any ethnic battle of Greco-Romans vs Jewish people - besides, how different can people be when they both originate in the smallish region of the Mediterranean?
Nor did I ever even consider any side to have an ideological upperhand, that is, between Greco-Roman religion and Judaism. I have no troubles with either ideology (granted I don't know as much about the latter).
But I do have a problem with christoislamism: the heretical parasite ideologies that grafted themselves onto Judaism. I've always insisted Judaism had nothing to do with, but that christianity was an upstart religion that <i>claimed</i> its origins in Judaism in order to give itself legitimacy, all the while it mangled Judaic scriptures in order to validate jesus' messiah-ness.
Judaism itself is innocent of this. This is why I find fault with the terms 'judeo-christian' and 'Abrahamic religions' - both giving christianity (and islam) a sheen of respectability by wrongly grouping them with Judaism. Precisely why I take exception to the unfortunately commonly-used term 'judeo-christian', as it is offensive to the only legitimate religion there.
Anyway, explanation done. Now moving onto this:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Christianity arose from Hellenized Judaism. It's re-interpretations of the Hebrew Bible or Old Testament, employed "Allegory,"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->I can see how this is a possibility. But it's not 'Judaism' if it is Hellenized, in my opinion.
Whoever the scribes were who created Paul, they were specifically <i>not</i> Jewish - although I suppose we must allow some chance that they might have been Hellenized people from Judea (who were not Jewish if they were Hellenized, obviously) but even that need not have been the case.
The creators of 'Paul' were most certainly anti-Jewish since their anti-Semitic statements, which they put into the mouth of their fiction 'Paul', were hurled particularly at Jewish people (that is, at the practitioners of Judaism).
See here:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/A5.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The seeds of Christian hatred for Jews begins from the readings of the New Testament and the persecutions began when the Church first held power to enforce its dogmas. <b>The Biblical Paul, for example, put the blame of Jesus's death entirely on the Jews. In the first epistle of Paul to the Thessalonians (2:14-15), it says,
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->"the Jews who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets...."<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--></b>Also the gospel of John, makes it clear that the Jews represent an enemy (and John 8:44 puts the devil as the father of the Jews). <b>Many prominent priests used <i>Paul's epistles</i> and the gospels as Biblical justification for Jewish persecution.</b><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Now, who but non-Jewish people could have come up with that? Hence the authors of Paul could not be Jews, but at closest call can only come as far as being Hellenised Judeans (people of Judea) and, like I said, even that need not be at all.
I still think Paul's inventors might have been Gnostic christians from Syria, or Marcionites who were from Caesarea in Asia Minor it seems (in today's Turkey) according to this page.
In point of fact, I think it was far more likely that the Marcionites (a christian Gnostic sect) created Paul than any Hellenized Judeans.
See for example:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/B2c.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Falsified Paul: Early Christianity in the Twilight by Hermann Detering (of the Radical Criticism school), translated and made available here in its complete form online, along with a summary outline. In short:<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->This book shows that all the <b>Pauline letters</b> are all 2nd-Century fabrications, Catholically <b>redacted from Marcionite</b> gnostic dualist-god original versions.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
linked to from: Radikal Kritik's English pages<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Some more on Marcionites:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/B1b.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The most ancient dated Christian inscription (Oct. 1, 318 A.D.) runs "The Lord and Saviour Jesus the Good"â Chrestos, not Christos. This was the legend over the door of a <b>Marcionite Church, and the Marcionites were Anti-Jewish Gnostics</b>, and did not confound their Chrestos with the Jewish Christos (Messiah).<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->In the Synagogue of the Marcionites on Mount Hermon, built in the third century A.D., the Messiah's title is spelled Chrestos. According to Tertullian and Lactantius, the common people usually called Christ Chrestos.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->The second paragraph refers to their church as a Synagogue, whereas other writers call it only church. Since Marcionites were anti-Jewish, I don't think their building ought to be called Synagogue at all.
But Marcionism started in <i>Caesarea in Asia Minor</i> (turns out there are several other places also called Caesarea) according to http://www.medmalexperts.com/POCM/triumph_...cholarship.html
which seems to be quite knowledgeable about early christianity. Turns out Mount Hermon is shared between Syria (homeland of Gnostic christianity) and Israel.