07-11-2007, 09:59 AM
Sorry for the delay in my reply.
"Existence of hundreds of dharma-shastra-s and debates amongst their proponents suggests that during old times, legal theorizing was a very lively part of intellectual life in India."
Ashok sir with regard to the above statement, can you throw more light on these debates. Alternatively can you give me sources to records of these debates and the attendant legal theorizing.
Dhu sir youâre post comparing the Native American-Indian outlook as different to the european law and social system hits the nail on the head figuratively as wrt my doubts.
I would like to illustrate here:
Consider the problems wrt the environmental problem that we are facing today and look at the problem from the Native American-Indian perspective and the european perspective. For the act of protection or conservation it is necessary for both of these groups to bring the object that is to be conserved on par with the value that they place on their own conservation or preservation. Thus both the groups practice the strategy of increasing the value of the object to be protected to a value that they perceive to be on par with their own perceived value, what then differs is the method employed by these groups to increase the value of the protected item. The Native American-Indians do not consider themselves to be the foremost of the living things on this planet nor is their definition of what constitutes the state of existence or life as narrow as the europeans. They therefore automatically confer a value equivalent to their own perceived value on all objects around them as well as the environment and the planet as a whole. I am assuming this purely on the basis of a collection of articles written by a group of Native American-Indian women writers. I do not have the citation at present will dig it up though.
The europeans on the other hand have a narrower definition of life and the natural order of things in their life. (That is if we assume the existence of such a natural order.) Thus for them to confer a value equivalent to their own it becomes necessary that they consider the continued existence of the particular object to be in their best interests. Only in such cases will the object be provided protection.
Thus in the case of the Native American-Indians they would provide protection to an object (Environment in this particular case) as they would consider it to be as alive as them and therefore possessed of the same rights as them. They possibly do not view themselves to be different from the object and therefore the question of discrimination does not arise at all. On the other hand the europeans will only afford protection for the object if and only if it is impinging on their continued existence. They would therefore look at the object as different from themselves and endowed with rights that are on a scale lower then the ones that they themselves enjoy.
Now link up this difference in outlook with our present legal system. The Indian legal and social system of the present times is dependent on the mandate as delineated by the Indian constitution. Such that our rules and regulations, policy decisions and social and governmental structures are validated and conceptualised and implemented according to the provisions and criteria laid down in the constitution. Now this constitution has as its basic characteristics values such as equality, freedom, fraternity, right to life among a lot of other principles, which can be loosely termed to be libertarian in idea. (NOTE: this is an extreme generalisation.)
Now replace the definitions of freedom equality as is generally know in our constitution with the definitions that the Native American-Indians practice. Pure fun is the result. Usage of these changed definitions would literally place the legal system on its head. Imagine the constitution guarantying basic human rights (sic) to animals and the environment and the courts upholding the right to life of a tree or a group Public Interest Litigation filed by a forest to protect its existence.
What this example if assumed to be true establishes is the negation of the infallible character of our basic definitions and our way of looking at life.
Would this example be in consonance with the idea put forth in your post? If so can you elaborate more on this idea and also provide more examples if possible.
Thanks
Pratardana.
----
Minor Admin Edit: 'Native American-Indian' or 'Native American' is a more politically correct term. The older term used before is considered derogartory or offensive these days.
"Existence of hundreds of dharma-shastra-s and debates amongst their proponents suggests that during old times, legal theorizing was a very lively part of intellectual life in India."
Ashok sir with regard to the above statement, can you throw more light on these debates. Alternatively can you give me sources to records of these debates and the attendant legal theorizing.
Dhu sir youâre post comparing the Native American-Indian outlook as different to the european law and social system hits the nail on the head figuratively as wrt my doubts.
I would like to illustrate here:
Consider the problems wrt the environmental problem that we are facing today and look at the problem from the Native American-Indian perspective and the european perspective. For the act of protection or conservation it is necessary for both of these groups to bring the object that is to be conserved on par with the value that they place on their own conservation or preservation. Thus both the groups practice the strategy of increasing the value of the object to be protected to a value that they perceive to be on par with their own perceived value, what then differs is the method employed by these groups to increase the value of the protected item. The Native American-Indians do not consider themselves to be the foremost of the living things on this planet nor is their definition of what constitutes the state of existence or life as narrow as the europeans. They therefore automatically confer a value equivalent to their own perceived value on all objects around them as well as the environment and the planet as a whole. I am assuming this purely on the basis of a collection of articles written by a group of Native American-Indian women writers. I do not have the citation at present will dig it up though.
The europeans on the other hand have a narrower definition of life and the natural order of things in their life. (That is if we assume the existence of such a natural order.) Thus for them to confer a value equivalent to their own it becomes necessary that they consider the continued existence of the particular object to be in their best interests. Only in such cases will the object be provided protection.
Thus in the case of the Native American-Indians they would provide protection to an object (Environment in this particular case) as they would consider it to be as alive as them and therefore possessed of the same rights as them. They possibly do not view themselves to be different from the object and therefore the question of discrimination does not arise at all. On the other hand the europeans will only afford protection for the object if and only if it is impinging on their continued existence. They would therefore look at the object as different from themselves and endowed with rights that are on a scale lower then the ones that they themselves enjoy.
Now link up this difference in outlook with our present legal system. The Indian legal and social system of the present times is dependent on the mandate as delineated by the Indian constitution. Such that our rules and regulations, policy decisions and social and governmental structures are validated and conceptualised and implemented according to the provisions and criteria laid down in the constitution. Now this constitution has as its basic characteristics values such as equality, freedom, fraternity, right to life among a lot of other principles, which can be loosely termed to be libertarian in idea. (NOTE: this is an extreme generalisation.)
Now replace the definitions of freedom equality as is generally know in our constitution with the definitions that the Native American-Indians practice. Pure fun is the result. Usage of these changed definitions would literally place the legal system on its head. Imagine the constitution guarantying basic human rights (sic) to animals and the environment and the courts upholding the right to life of a tree or a group Public Interest Litigation filed by a forest to protect its existence.
What this example if assumed to be true establishes is the negation of the infallible character of our basic definitions and our way of looking at life.
Would this example be in consonance with the idea put forth in your post? If so can you elaborate more on this idea and also provide more examples if possible.
Thanks
Pratardana.
----
Minor Admin Edit: 'Native American-Indian' or 'Native American' is a more politically correct term. The older term used before is considered derogartory or offensive these days.