<!--QuoteBegin-Honsol+Dec 13 2007, 07:30 PM-->QUOTE(Honsol @ Dec 13 2007, 07:30 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Im surprized about a couple of your statements here.[right][snapback]76108[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->What I meant to say was that the reason she (christian girl of Korean origin) did not agree with me was that her fundamental ideas of who God was, was entirely different from what Hindus think of when we think of God. The word "God" disguises too many dissimilarities and brings ideas separated by a great chasm together though the chasm in reality is unbridgeable.
The classmate was right though - perversely: our Gods turned out not to be the same. We <i>were</i> talking about different entities/ideas after all.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->First ,in christian and islamic theology God is genderless.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->"God is an angry male .... with a beard" (<- ex-Baptist's explanation to me).
The OT god is male. As in, specifically male and <i>not</i> female.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->In islam to call God father is a heresy.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->He may not be considered father, but allah is still very much male. Just like Allah's three daughters (as initially accepted by Mohammed, but then denounced by him afterwards) were female Goddesses.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->In Iskon God is seen as a real male ,not genderless.Being a person Krishna has wishes.He like to be a man,he like to be blue and play whit his cows and cowherd friends.We can say that Krishna have particular wishes.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Krishna is Shyama (blue-black) by nature. That's part of Krishna's symbolism, like blue Mahavishnu's profound depiction with his 5 implements (Shaarnga, Kaumodaki, Sudarshana, Nandaka, Panchajanya) or Shiva's neela-kantha. Mahavishnu is male, but his form as Mohini is female; his form as Varaha is a Boar.
Our Gods have already taken those gendered forms - but Brahman is genderless and formless.
We don't insist that our God is the "only form" and then insist he is also male - which makes no sense, to me anyway.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->I dont belive that God concept lead to intolerance (though some forms of theologies can lead to this),but when i was christian the thing that stop me to make a reason was the fear of eternal hell.I was so afraid that i try to not think at something that seem out of place.When i got a more strong disease i was so afraid that im gona die and go in eternal hell and have panic attacs frecvently.I even go to chuch in front of the Jesus icon and ask him to show himself if he is the real God.I was so bad that i must go to eternal hell?But no answer came.(nearbie the priest discuss whit some students how to stop a gay manifestation).<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
"I dont belive that God concept lead to intolerance" - IMO it depends on how we define God. The God of the bible threatens to punish those who violated his laws upto the third generation (including for tolerating polytheists and idolators). The God of the NT portion of the bible threatens with eternal damnation for not believing/accepting he saved us from sin and was resurrected.
Honsol, don't ever worry about "hell" again. Worst case scenario: all of us at IF and all your pagan ancestors and my pagan ancestors will all be there.
If you ever panic about it again - during your sleep or when ill or in some unreasonable waking hour - just try to remember that <b><i>at least you won't be alone</i></b>. There's some great company to be had. Shivaji, Confucius, Thomas Paine, Hypatia, Aurobindo, native American chiefs.... list is endless. We'll party down-under in the firey pits, if it ever came to that.
The classmate was right though - perversely: our Gods turned out not to be the same. We <i>were</i> talking about different entities/ideas after all.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->First ,in christian and islamic theology God is genderless.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->"God is an angry male .... with a beard" (<- ex-Baptist's explanation to me).
The OT god is male. As in, specifically male and <i>not</i> female.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->In islam to call God father is a heresy.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->He may not be considered father, but allah is still very much male. Just like Allah's three daughters (as initially accepted by Mohammed, but then denounced by him afterwards) were female Goddesses.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->In Iskon God is seen as a real male ,not genderless.Being a person Krishna has wishes.He like to be a man,he like to be blue and play whit his cows and cowherd friends.We can say that Krishna have particular wishes.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Krishna is Shyama (blue-black) by nature. That's part of Krishna's symbolism, like blue Mahavishnu's profound depiction with his 5 implements (Shaarnga, Kaumodaki, Sudarshana, Nandaka, Panchajanya) or Shiva's neela-kantha. Mahavishnu is male, but his form as Mohini is female; his form as Varaha is a Boar.
Our Gods have already taken those gendered forms - but Brahman is genderless and formless.
We don't insist that our God is the "only form" and then insist he is also male - which makes no sense, to me anyway.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->I dont belive that God concept lead to intolerance (though some forms of theologies can lead to this),but when i was christian the thing that stop me to make a reason was the fear of eternal hell.I was so afraid that i try to not think at something that seem out of place.When i got a more strong disease i was so afraid that im gona die and go in eternal hell and have panic attacs frecvently.I even go to chuch in front of the Jesus icon and ask him to show himself if he is the real God.I was so bad that i must go to eternal hell?But no answer came.(nearbie the priest discuss whit some students how to stop a gay manifestation).<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
"I dont belive that God concept lead to intolerance" - IMO it depends on how we define God. The God of the bible threatens to punish those who violated his laws upto the third generation (including for tolerating polytheists and idolators). The God of the NT portion of the bible threatens with eternal damnation for not believing/accepting he saved us from sin and was resurrected.
Honsol, don't ever worry about "hell" again. Worst case scenario: all of us at IF and all your pagan ancestors and my pagan ancestors will all be there.
If you ever panic about it again - during your sleep or when ill or in some unreasonable waking hour - just try to remember that <b><i>at least you won't be alone</i></b>. There's some great company to be had. Shivaji, Confucius, Thomas Paine, Hypatia, Aurobindo, native American chiefs.... list is endless. We'll party down-under in the firey pits, if it ever came to that.