06-24-2008, 08:41 AM
<!--QuoteBegin-Bodhi+Jun 24 2008, 08:03 AM-->QUOTE(Bodhi @ Jun 24 2008, 08:03 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->so can we say the main difference is that the vetAla wants to come back into the human body, whereas pishAcha is kind of ok in that state and only concerned about sucking the prANa of the living (more like a leech rather than a bat) in order to sustain its state?
now as you said both are still close to annamaya. do they still retain a gender-identity (male/female)?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Bodhiji,
Yes that can be called the main difference between vetAla and the pishAcha.
Regarding gender identity, it is supposed to be maintained. In fact unfulfilled desires of the vital beings include sexual desires, and the sexual impulse is primarily the domain of prANa anyway. So, as long as a being has the vital-sheath (prANamaya kosha), it can have sexual desires. Thats why most descriptions of heavens describe apsarA-s and hooris etc.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->As you would be knowing, there is a shrine around kAshI known as pishAcha-mochana (liberator of/from pishAcha-s). Here, a peculiar rite of post-piNDa-dAna is performed. In this rite, the shloka-s invoke all the pitR^i-s from both the paternal and maternal lineages who are lingering in the pishAchayoni, and the shloka-s very specifically invoke all those pishAcha-s who in their human life were related to the performer and died prematuredly like killed by wild-animals, in accident like fire, in madness, or died without progeny, or without repenting for heavy sins like bramha-ghAta etc.
What is the link between a premature death etc with the pishAcha-yoni?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are several such temples. One of the most famous is the vishNupada temple in Gaya.
A life that ends prematurely, either due to accident, murder or suicide, is likely to leave a strong bondage to the physical realm. Unfulfilled tasks of a prematurely ended life bind a person to the physical realm more strongly than a life that ends normally. Even suicide. We may think that a person committing suicide should not be bound to physical realm as much. But usually the decision to commit suicide is taken only by a part of the being, either mental or vital. And the whole being may not approve of it, which makes parts of being remaining attached to the physical realm.
A person dying without progeny usually means that no proper last rites were conducted, since antyeShTi and shrAddha are supposed to be performed by a son.
A mad person was supposed to be possessed by some vital beings, who possessed the person due to their attachment to the physical realm, and they don't want to let go even after death.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->so pishAcha is basically a result of a strong unfulfilled attachment ...like you said
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is valid only for those dead spirits (preta-s) that have fallen into a pishAcha like existence due to their attachment. These can be released from their pishAcha-yoni.
But there is supposedly a whole class of pishAcha-s that properly belong to the lower vital world and are not related to spirits of dead people. They are the typal beings of lower vital world, and don't take rebirth as humans etc.
Normal people are rarely troubled by pishAcha-s unless there happens to be some unfortunate connection with a dead person. Or if a person is neurotically open to be possessed by vital beings. Sometimes people with very strong egos are happy to get associated with vital beings because it gives them a sense of extraordinary power while hollowing them from within and destroying their productive social lives.
A very large percentage of people who take up serious spiritual practices, are assaulted by vital beings in the beginning phase of their sAdhanA. In more advanced stages of their sAdhanA, the hostility of the vital beings can change to temptations. This story is almost universally told in all major spiritual traditions of the world.
now as you said both are still close to annamaya. do they still retain a gender-identity (male/female)?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Bodhiji,
Yes that can be called the main difference between vetAla and the pishAcha.
Regarding gender identity, it is supposed to be maintained. In fact unfulfilled desires of the vital beings include sexual desires, and the sexual impulse is primarily the domain of prANa anyway. So, as long as a being has the vital-sheath (prANamaya kosha), it can have sexual desires. Thats why most descriptions of heavens describe apsarA-s and hooris etc.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->As you would be knowing, there is a shrine around kAshI known as pishAcha-mochana (liberator of/from pishAcha-s). Here, a peculiar rite of post-piNDa-dAna is performed. In this rite, the shloka-s invoke all the pitR^i-s from both the paternal and maternal lineages who are lingering in the pishAchayoni, and the shloka-s very specifically invoke all those pishAcha-s who in their human life were related to the performer and died prematuredly like killed by wild-animals, in accident like fire, in madness, or died without progeny, or without repenting for heavy sins like bramha-ghAta etc.
What is the link between a premature death etc with the pishAcha-yoni?<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are several such temples. One of the most famous is the vishNupada temple in Gaya.
A life that ends prematurely, either due to accident, murder or suicide, is likely to leave a strong bondage to the physical realm. Unfulfilled tasks of a prematurely ended life bind a person to the physical realm more strongly than a life that ends normally. Even suicide. We may think that a person committing suicide should not be bound to physical realm as much. But usually the decision to commit suicide is taken only by a part of the being, either mental or vital. And the whole being may not approve of it, which makes parts of being remaining attached to the physical realm.
A person dying without progeny usually means that no proper last rites were conducted, since antyeShTi and shrAddha are supposed to be performed by a son.
A mad person was supposed to be possessed by some vital beings, who possessed the person due to their attachment to the physical realm, and they don't want to let go even after death.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->so pishAcha is basically a result of a strong unfulfilled attachment ...like you said
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is valid only for those dead spirits (preta-s) that have fallen into a pishAcha like existence due to their attachment. These can be released from their pishAcha-yoni.
But there is supposedly a whole class of pishAcha-s that properly belong to the lower vital world and are not related to spirits of dead people. They are the typal beings of lower vital world, and don't take rebirth as humans etc.
Normal people are rarely troubled by pishAcha-s unless there happens to be some unfortunate connection with a dead person. Or if a person is neurotically open to be possessed by vital beings. Sometimes people with very strong egos are happy to get associated with vital beings because it gives them a sense of extraordinary power while hollowing them from within and destroying their productive social lives.
A very large percentage of people who take up serious spiritual practices, are assaulted by vital beings in the beginning phase of their sAdhanA. In more advanced stages of their sAdhanA, the hostility of the vital beings can change to temptations. This story is almost universally told in all major spiritual traditions of the world.