09-10-2008, 01:06 AM
Bharatavarsha isnt the actuall name of the country of India today, this was the name given to the whole of Greater India after it was conquered by Bharata:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Bharatavarsha refers to the total Earth. Emperor Bharata was the first and the only emperor to rule all India.
The Vishnu Puranam accounts the extent of Bharatavarsham,
  "Uttaram yat samudrasya Himdreschaiva daksinam
  Varsham tat Bharatam nama Bharati yatra santati"
  (The region spanning in between the Himalayas in the north to the
  Indian ocean in the south is called Bharatavarsham and the natives
  of this region are called Bharatiyas (Indians)]]
Bharatakantham is the region which is contained in Bharatavarsha, comprising of modern South Asia. In the Hindu prayer invocations (Sankalpam), the normal order of geography is
  Bharatavarshe (Akhanda Bharatam), Bharatakante (Bharatam),..
  (In the land of Bharatavarsha, in Bharatakantha and so on)<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Republic of India is officially known as BhÄrat after Bharata (Monier-Williams: "'king Bharatas's realm' i.e. India")<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bharatavarsha refers to a greater landmass then the Republic of India covers today, also, the Ideology of King Bharata is considered by some people to be a Mythology in the Mahabarata, not factual evidence.
Whereas the word India, rather then being based on a mythological being, is based on the geographic location of the country based on the Indus River.
There is also a page here for the official names of India in each of the 23 Schedule VIII languages of India:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Official_names_of_India
It isnt actually called Bharatavarsha by any of them, I consider Bharatavarsha to be India's mythological name for an area that covered a larger part then modern India / Bharat does today.
There is also this page here for the names of India:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->India
The English term is from Greek HindÃa (Ἰνδία), via Latin India. HindÃa in Byzantine (Koine Greek) ethnography denotes the region beyond the Indus (ἸνδÏÏ) river, since Herodotus (5th century BC) ἡ Ἰνδική ÏÏÏη "Indian land", ἸνδÏÏ "an Indian", from Avestan HinduÅ¡ (referring to Sindh, and listed as a conquered territory by Darius I in the Persepolis terrace inscription). The name is derived ultimately from Sindhu, the Sanskrit name of the river, but also meaning "river" generically. Latin India is used by Lucian (2nd century).
The name India was known in Anglo-Saxon, and was used in King Alfred's translation of Orosius. In Middle English, the name was, under French influence, replaced by Ynde or Inde, which entered Early Modern English as Indie. The name India then came back to English usage from the 17th century onwards, and may be due to the influence of Latin, or Spanish or Portuguese. [1]
Sanskrit indu "drop (of Soma)", also a term for the Moon, is unrelated, but has sometimes been erroneously connected. Listed by, among others, Colonel James Todd in his Annals of Rajputana, he describes the ancient India under control of tribes claiming descent from the Moon, or "Indu", (referring to Chandravanshi Rajputs), and their influence in Trans-Indian regions where they referred to the land as Industhan.
[edit] Bharat
The name BhÄrat[2] is used for the Republic of India, derived from BhÄrata in the official Sanskrit name of the country, BhÄrata Gaá¹arÄjya. The form Bharata is used in several other Indian languages.
The Sanskrit word bhÄrata is a vrddhi derivation of bharata, which was originally an epithet of Agni. The term is a verbal noun of the Sanskrit root bhr-, "to bear / to carry", with a literal meaning of "to be maintained" (of fire). The root bhr is cognate with the English verb to bear and Latin ferÅ. This term also means "one who is engaged in search for knowledge".
The BhÄratas were Indians mentioned in the Rigveda, notably participating in the Battle of the Ten Kings.
The term BhÄrata as a name for India as a whole is derived from the name of Bharata son of Dushyanta, a legendary ruler mentioned in the MahabhÄrata (the core portion of which is itself known as BhÄrata). The realm of Bharata is known as BharÄtavará¹£a in the MahabhÄrata and later texts. The term vará¹£a means a division of the earth, or a continent. [1]
From: Vishnu Purana (2.3.1)[2][3]
  uttaraá¹ yatsamudrasya himÄdreÅcaiva daká¹£iá¹am
  vará¹£aá¹ tadbhÄrataá¹ nÄma bhÄratÄ« yatra santatiḥ
  à¤à¤¤à¥à¤¤à¤°à¤ यतà¥à¤¸à¤®à¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤¸à¥à¤¯ हिमादà¥à¤°à¥à¤¶à¥à¤à¥à¤µ दà¤à¥à¤·à¤¿à¤£à¤®à¥ ।
  वरà¥à¤·à¤ तदॠà¤à¤¾à¤°à¤¤à¤ नाम à¤à¤¾à¤°à¤¤à¥ यतà¥à¤° सà¤à¤¤à¤¤à¤¿à¤ ।।
  "The country (vará¹£am) that lies north of the ocean and south of the snowy mountains is called BhÄratam; there dwell the descendants of Bharata."
The term in Classical Sanskrit literature is taken to comprise the territory of the contemporary Republic of India, Pakistan, Nepal and Bangladesh, as well as portions of eastern Afghanistan. This corresponds to the approximate extent of the historical Maurya Empire under emperors Chandragupta Maurya and Ashoka the Great (4th to 3rd centuries BC). Later political entities unifying approximately the same region are the Mughal Empire (17th century), the Maratha Empire (18th century) , and the British Raj (19th to 20th centuries).
Akhanda Bharata ("undivided Bharat") is an irredentist term of Hindu nationalism calling for a re-unification of the region under the predominance of Dharmic culture.
[edit] Hindustan and Hind
  Main article: Hindustan
The name Hind is derived from the Iranian equivalent of Indo-Aryan Sindh. The Avestan -stÄn means country or land (cognate to Sanskrit sthÄna "place, land").
India was called Hindustan in Persian although the term Hind is in current use. al-Hind اÙÙÙد is the term in the Arabic language (e.g. in the 11th century Tarikh Al-Hind "history of India"). It also occurs intermittently in usage within India, such as in the phrase Jai Hind.
The terms Hind and HindustÄn were current in Persian and Arabic from the 11th century Islamic conquests: the rulers in the Sultanate and Mughal periods called their Indian dominion, centred around Delhi, Hindustan. -stan is a Persian suffix meaning "home of/place of".
HindustÄn, as is the term Hindu itself, entered the English language in the 17th century. In the 19th century, the term as used in English referred to the northern region of India between the Indus and Brahmaputra rivers and between the Himalayas and the Vindhyas in particular, hence the term Hindustani for the Hindi-Urdu language. Hindustan was in use synonymously with India during the British Raj.
Hind (Hindi: हिनà¥à¤¦) remains in use in Hindi-Urdu. In contemporary Persian language, the term Hindustan has come to mean the Indian subcontinent, and the modern Indian Union is called Hind. The same is the case with Arabic language, where al-Hind is the name of the Republic of India. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The official name for India today is Bharat, with variations of different names in different languages.
I definately consider the different names to be purely language based, and both India and Bharat are historically correct. It is a choice to call the country whichever of the names you want it to be called.
India is not the Christian name, the words origins predate Christianity by thousands or years. It is a purely geographic name used for the section of land between the Himalayaas and south of India.
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Sep 9 2008, 11:11 AM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Sep 9 2008, 11:11 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--> when speaking in English (for example, we don't want to go all British and be calling the HimAlayAs as the "Himm-uh-lay-us" which to us is pretty much like the baabaaa the Hellenes heard and described as barbar-barbaric). Nor can "aesthetic-sounding English" be the reason: since by far most Indians speak English badly/not properly anyway (Tamglish, Tenglish, Hinglish what have you), nothing wrong in occasionally making our way of speaking Engelsk sound a bit nicer by adding in Bharatam when we get the chance.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your example here is not language difference though, it is a linguistic difference based on accent. Everyone from different parts of the world speak with a different accent, and a persons accent is normally based on their first language, or which language they use more often. I have heard many Indians in England that can switch fluently between English and Gujerati / Hindi or any other language and speak in the correct pronounciation for both, I have also spoken to transfer students from India that can speak English a whole lot better then most English people can. Linguistic differences for pronounciation are based on the language you speak most commonly, and also based on how much slang you use, for example, not one person in my family can actually speak Gujerati properly, it is always full of slang and English words because they have long forgotten the real Gujerati language and vocabulary, this is what I was reffering to when I say I dont like a combination of different languages. A language is always different based on who is speaking it, but if one actually chooses to learn to, they can learn to speak and pronounce languages clearly with the proper pronounciation and without using slang.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Bharatavarsha refers to the total Earth. Emperor Bharata was the first and the only emperor to rule all India.
The Vishnu Puranam accounts the extent of Bharatavarsham,
  "Uttaram yat samudrasya Himdreschaiva daksinam
  Varsham tat Bharatam nama Bharati yatra santati"
  (The region spanning in between the Himalayas in the north to the
  Indian ocean in the south is called Bharatavarsham and the natives
  of this region are called Bharatiyas (Indians)]]
Bharatakantham is the region which is contained in Bharatavarsha, comprising of modern South Asia. In the Hindu prayer invocations (Sankalpam), the normal order of geography is
  Bharatavarshe (Akhanda Bharatam), Bharatakante (Bharatam),..
  (In the land of Bharatavarsha, in Bharatakantha and so on)<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Republic of India is officially known as BhÄrat after Bharata (Monier-Williams: "'king Bharatas's realm' i.e. India")<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bharatavarsha refers to a greater landmass then the Republic of India covers today, also, the Ideology of King Bharata is considered by some people to be a Mythology in the Mahabarata, not factual evidence.
Whereas the word India, rather then being based on a mythological being, is based on the geographic location of the country based on the Indus River.
There is also a page here for the official names of India in each of the 23 Schedule VIII languages of India:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Official_names_of_India
It isnt actually called Bharatavarsha by any of them, I consider Bharatavarsha to be India's mythological name for an area that covered a larger part then modern India / Bharat does today.
There is also this page here for the names of India:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->India
The English term is from Greek HindÃa (Ἰνδία), via Latin India. HindÃa in Byzantine (Koine Greek) ethnography denotes the region beyond the Indus (ἸνδÏÏ) river, since Herodotus (5th century BC) ἡ Ἰνδική ÏÏÏη "Indian land", ἸνδÏÏ "an Indian", from Avestan HinduÅ¡ (referring to Sindh, and listed as a conquered territory by Darius I in the Persepolis terrace inscription). The name is derived ultimately from Sindhu, the Sanskrit name of the river, but also meaning "river" generically. Latin India is used by Lucian (2nd century).
The name India was known in Anglo-Saxon, and was used in King Alfred's translation of Orosius. In Middle English, the name was, under French influence, replaced by Ynde or Inde, which entered Early Modern English as Indie. The name India then came back to English usage from the 17th century onwards, and may be due to the influence of Latin, or Spanish or Portuguese. [1]
Sanskrit indu "drop (of Soma)", also a term for the Moon, is unrelated, but has sometimes been erroneously connected. Listed by, among others, Colonel James Todd in his Annals of Rajputana, he describes the ancient India under control of tribes claiming descent from the Moon, or "Indu", (referring to Chandravanshi Rajputs), and their influence in Trans-Indian regions where they referred to the land as Industhan.
[edit] Bharat
The name BhÄrat[2] is used for the Republic of India, derived from BhÄrata in the official Sanskrit name of the country, BhÄrata Gaá¹arÄjya. The form Bharata is used in several other Indian languages.
The Sanskrit word bhÄrata is a vrddhi derivation of bharata, which was originally an epithet of Agni. The term is a verbal noun of the Sanskrit root bhr-, "to bear / to carry", with a literal meaning of "to be maintained" (of fire). The root bhr is cognate with the English verb to bear and Latin ferÅ. This term also means "one who is engaged in search for knowledge".
The BhÄratas were Indians mentioned in the Rigveda, notably participating in the Battle of the Ten Kings.
The term BhÄrata as a name for India as a whole is derived from the name of Bharata son of Dushyanta, a legendary ruler mentioned in the MahabhÄrata (the core portion of which is itself known as BhÄrata). The realm of Bharata is known as BharÄtavará¹£a in the MahabhÄrata and later texts. The term vará¹£a means a division of the earth, or a continent. [1]
From: Vishnu Purana (2.3.1)[2][3]
  uttaraá¹ yatsamudrasya himÄdreÅcaiva daká¹£iá¹am
  vará¹£aá¹ tadbhÄrataá¹ nÄma bhÄratÄ« yatra santatiḥ
  à¤à¤¤à¥à¤¤à¤°à¤ यतà¥à¤¸à¤®à¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤¸à¥à¤¯ हिमादà¥à¤°à¥à¤¶à¥à¤à¥à¤µ दà¤à¥à¤·à¤¿à¤£à¤®à¥ ।
  वरà¥à¤·à¤ तदॠà¤à¤¾à¤°à¤¤à¤ नाम à¤à¤¾à¤°à¤¤à¥ यतà¥à¤° सà¤à¤¤à¤¤à¤¿à¤ ।।
  "The country (vará¹£am) that lies north of the ocean and south of the snowy mountains is called BhÄratam; there dwell the descendants of Bharata."
The term in Classical Sanskrit literature is taken to comprise the territory of the contemporary Republic of India, Pakistan, Nepal and Bangladesh, as well as portions of eastern Afghanistan. This corresponds to the approximate extent of the historical Maurya Empire under emperors Chandragupta Maurya and Ashoka the Great (4th to 3rd centuries BC). Later political entities unifying approximately the same region are the Mughal Empire (17th century), the Maratha Empire (18th century) , and the British Raj (19th to 20th centuries).
Akhanda Bharata ("undivided Bharat") is an irredentist term of Hindu nationalism calling for a re-unification of the region under the predominance of Dharmic culture.
[edit] Hindustan and Hind
  Main article: Hindustan
The name Hind is derived from the Iranian equivalent of Indo-Aryan Sindh. The Avestan -stÄn means country or land (cognate to Sanskrit sthÄna "place, land").
India was called Hindustan in Persian although the term Hind is in current use. al-Hind اÙÙÙد is the term in the Arabic language (e.g. in the 11th century Tarikh Al-Hind "history of India"). It also occurs intermittently in usage within India, such as in the phrase Jai Hind.
The terms Hind and HindustÄn were current in Persian and Arabic from the 11th century Islamic conquests: the rulers in the Sultanate and Mughal periods called their Indian dominion, centred around Delhi, Hindustan. -stan is a Persian suffix meaning "home of/place of".
HindustÄn, as is the term Hindu itself, entered the English language in the 17th century. In the 19th century, the term as used in English referred to the northern region of India between the Indus and Brahmaputra rivers and between the Himalayas and the Vindhyas in particular, hence the term Hindustani for the Hindi-Urdu language. Hindustan was in use synonymously with India during the British Raj.
Hind (Hindi: हिनà¥à¤¦) remains in use in Hindi-Urdu. In contemporary Persian language, the term Hindustan has come to mean the Indian subcontinent, and the modern Indian Union is called Hind. The same is the case with Arabic language, where al-Hind is the name of the Republic of India. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The official name for India today is Bharat, with variations of different names in different languages.
I definately consider the different names to be purely language based, and both India and Bharat are historically correct. It is a choice to call the country whichever of the names you want it to be called.
India is not the Christian name, the words origins predate Christianity by thousands or years. It is a purely geographic name used for the section of land between the Himalayaas and south of India.
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Sep 9 2008, 11:11 AM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Sep 9 2008, 11:11 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--> when speaking in English (for example, we don't want to go all British and be calling the HimAlayAs as the "Himm-uh-lay-us" which to us is pretty much like the baabaaa the Hellenes heard and described as barbar-barbaric). Nor can "aesthetic-sounding English" be the reason: since by far most Indians speak English badly/not properly anyway (Tamglish, Tenglish, Hinglish what have you), nothing wrong in occasionally making our way of speaking Engelsk sound a bit nicer by adding in Bharatam when we get the chance.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your example here is not language difference though, it is a linguistic difference based on accent. Everyone from different parts of the world speak with a different accent, and a persons accent is normally based on their first language, or which language they use more often. I have heard many Indians in England that can switch fluently between English and Gujerati / Hindi or any other language and speak in the correct pronounciation for both, I have also spoken to transfer students from India that can speak English a whole lot better then most English people can. Linguistic differences for pronounciation are based on the language you speak most commonly, and also based on how much slang you use, for example, not one person in my family can actually speak Gujerati properly, it is always full of slang and English words because they have long forgotten the real Gujerati language and vocabulary, this is what I was reffering to when I say I dont like a combination of different languages. A language is always different based on who is speaking it, but if one actually chooses to learn to, they can learn to speak and pronounce languages clearly with the proper pronounciation and without using slang.