Pls use this topic to discuss technology, costs, methodologies, prospects, copyrights issues, infrastructure etc for digitizing manuscripts..
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<!--QuoteBegin-Ashok Kumar+Oct 20 2006, 10:38 AM-->QUOTE(Ashok Kumar @ Oct 20 2006, 10:38 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Bodhi,
The situation is that many of the technical people who are fighting the battle right now are doing it on their spare time. Their full time jobs are something else. Even with this they have made a dent. Such people working full-time should be able to turn the tide.
All the Indic research in IITs/IISC etc is still a labour of love rather than a full time pursuit.
It is still not rewarding enough in India for bright young folk to consider making this a career.
It is such a shame that even a century after original publication many of the original sanskrit works on astronomy, maths, tantra etc remain untranslated.Â
I remember reading history of maths where greeks were worshipped and even credited with "inventing" calculus because Archemedes had a limit procedure for getting area of a circle by summing up areas of small triangles. It was specifically mentioned, that there was no evidence that India ever thought of even most basic elements of calculus.
Now we know that it is fair to say that Calculus was invented in India by Madhava, Nilakantha etc. Taylor series, power series, idea of derivatives etc has been around in India for 100s of years before Newton & Leibnitz supposedly "invented" calculus. This realization dawned after a few Indians spent some time poring over Kerala maths texts.Â
Even now there is no systematic translation of these texts. You can't even buy them anywhere. They are tucked away in some old university libraries. When I check out many such old texts from a university library, I notice in most cases that I am the only person in the last 70-80 or even 100 years who has done that!
This is the conditions of sanskrit texts which actually got published. There are scores of manuscripts that haven't even been touched.
Recently I was trying to study a process in Samavedic texts called "Chala-prakriya", in which a letter (akshara) called chalAkShara is used as a error correction mechanism. For a R^icha there is a chalAkShara, same witha sAman, or even pada-pAtha. This error-correcting mechanism is much better than simple checksum and pretty ingenious. There have been sparse comments about it in few hard to get books. But it is too hard to get the original texts, because those manuscripts never got published. They are hiding in manuscript collections in England, or various locations in India. For one two page manuscript copy, the British Library London charged me 18 pounds! I see names of many manuscripts dealing with chalAkSharas in manuscript catalogues but have to put the effort and money to acquire them.
This is the state of affairs after half a century of independence, when leftist/marxist fatcats in JNU get paid handsomely to tarnish India, but no government agency would take upon itself to publish and translate these texts. NDA govt at least started the National Manuscripts Mission to preserve the scattered manuscripts. It took the bone-heads in the government this long to decide on even preserving the manuscripts.
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What are the copyright and property rights associated with this ?
<!--QuoteBegin-Ashok Kumar+Oct 20 2006, 05:38 AM-->QUOTE(Ashok Kumar @ Oct 20 2006, 05:38 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->
This is the state of affairs after half a century of independence, when leftist/marxist fatcats in JNU get paid handsomely to tarnish India, but no government agency would take upon itself to publish and translate these texts.Â
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This is the way to subvert an entire civilization and country without even firing a shot.
Rajesh,
Many of these old texts are out of copyright. Typically sanskrit publications don't even claim copyright.
I usually make a copy for my use. Had to buy an used office-style photocopier at home for the volumes!
<!--emo&:ind--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/india.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='india.gif' /><!--endemo--> Pl contact
www.sainiksangh.com
They have stumbled upon a library on Sanskrit.
Ashok guroo
Perhaps an internet repository can be setup for this. And open-source translation projects be setup ?
Capt Kumar
Do you know these people ?
<!--emo&:rocker--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rocker.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rocker.gif' /><!--endemo--> <span style='color:blue'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>I am their NRI rep.</span></span>
Capt Kumar,
This link http://sainiksangh.com/protectionheritage.htm says:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Protection of Heritage
We hold a repository of rare and old manuscripts and records in Sanskrit numbering over 50,000 and collected from various sources over a period. These valuable records are yet to be developed into a library for want of funds and expertise. The manuscripts are not catalogued and need extensive preservation. Some work on this has already been done with the support of National Archives Government of India. However for the Orientalist and research scholars this collection, which has yet not been scrutinized fully , can be of great interest. Further information may be had on contacting us.
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50,000 manuscripts is a huge number! Of course many of these will be copies of existing texts, but likelihood of many interesting things being there is high. Having them scanned will be of immense use.
There is a way to use a digital camera on a mount to take images of such manuscripts etc fast and without subjecting them to too much stress. If you buy that contraption, it costs an arm and a leg. But it shouldn't be too hard to just build one. A digital camera on a mount which can be clicked with a remote control and a light source and you have a fine manuscript scanner.
Rajesh,
Simple scanned pdf's for out of copyright texts should be possible. Even more ambitious and useful will be transliterated versions which won't have copyright issues at all. Sanskrit Document List website has a good voluntary effort in this regard. And there are many such transliteration efforts, but still miniscule compared o actual number of texts around. Translations are even harder to find apart from major works.
Capt Kumar,
Actually, we should be able to put together a digitizer system for use by sainiksangh if someone in India can put the effort in digitizing the manuscripts. Digitized versions can then be put on an online depository. That will make the task of catalouing etc also much easier as people worldwide can chip in with their help when they look at the manuscript scans.
<!--QuoteBegin-Capt Manmohan Kumar+Oct 21 2006, 12:48 AM-->QUOTE(Capt Manmohan Kumar @ Oct 21 2006, 12:48 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--emo&:rocker--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rocker.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rocker.gif' /><!--endemo--> <span style='color:blue'><span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%'>I am their NRI rep.</span></span>
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Interesting article on our discussions on restoring the Skt manuscripts. The costs seem too much though.
http://ia.rediff.com/news/2006/oct/25hindu...?q=np&file=.htm
This topic has been split from the original topic.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Imaging technology restores 700-year-old sacred Hindu text
Scientists who worked on the Archimedes Palimpsest are using modern imaging technologies to digitally restore a 700-year-old palm-leaf manuscript containing the essence of Hindu philosophy.
Original page:
<img src='http://www.rit.edu/~930www/pics/palm_leaf_original.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
Restored page: <img src='http://www.physorg.com/newman/gfx/news/palm_leaf_restored.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
Each palm leaf of the sacred Hindu manuscript, the Sarvamoola granthas, was captured in multiple sections, processed and digitally stitched together. This image shows a stitched and processed page after applying modern imaging technologies. Images were taken by Roger Easton, from Rochester Institute of Technology, and Keith Knox, from Boeing LTS, using a Sensys scientific digital camera and an infrared filter.
Scientists who worked on the Archimedes Palimpsest are using modern imaging technologies to digitally restore a 700-year-old palm-leaf manuscript containing the essence of Hindu philosophy.
The project led by P.R. Mukund and Roger Easton, professors at Rochester Institute of Technology, will digitally preserve the original Hindu writings known as the Sarvamoola granthas attributed to scholar Shri Madvacharya (1238-1317). The collection of 36 works contains commentaries written in Sanskrit on sacred Hindu scriptures and conveys the scholar's Dvaita philosophy of the meaning of life and the role of God.
The document is difficult to handle and to read, the result of centuries of inappropriate storage techniques, botched preservation efforts and degradation due to improper handling. Each leaf of the manuscript measures 26 inches long and two inches wide, and is bound together with braided cord threaded through two holes. Heavy wooden covers sandwich the 340 palm leaves, cracked and chipped at the edges. Time and a misguided application of oil have aged the palm leaves dark brown, obscuring the Sanskrit writings.
"It is literally crumbling to dust," says Mukund, the Gleason Professor of Electrical Engineering at RIT.
According to Mukund, 15 percent of the manuscript is missing.
"The book will never be opened again unless there is a compelling reason to do so," Mukund says. "Because every time they do, they lose some. After this, there won't be a need to open the book."
Mukund first became involved with the project when his spiritual teacher in India brought the problem to his attention and urged him to find a solution. This became a personal goal for Mukund, who studies and teaches Hindu philosophy or "our way of life" and understood the importance of preserving the document for future scholars. The accuracy of existing printed copies of the Sarvamoola granthas is unknown.
Mukund sought the expertise of RIT colleague Easton, who imaged the Dead Sea Scrolls and is currently working on the Archimedes Palimpsest. Easton, a professor at RIT's Chester F. Carlson Center for Imaging Science, brought in Keith Knox, an imaging senior scientist at Boeing LTS, as a consultant. Mukund added Ajay Pasupuleti, a doctoral candidate in microsystems at RIT, and the team was formed.
The scientists traveled to India in December 2005 to assess the document stored at a monastery-like mathas in Udupi, India. Sponsored by a grant from RIT, the team returned to the monastery in June and spent six days imaging the document using a scientific digital camera and an infrared filter to enhance the contrast between the ink and the palm leaf. Images of each palm leaf, back and front, were captured in eight to 10 sections, processed and digitally stitched together. The scientists ran the 7,900 total images through various image-processing algorithms using Adobe Photoshop and Knox's own custom software.
"This is a very significant application of the same types of tools that we have used on the Archimedes Palimpsest," Easton says. "Not incidentally, this also has been one of the most enjoyable projects in my career, since the results will be of great interest to a large number of people in India."
The processed images of the Sarvamoola granthas will be stored in a variety of media formats, including electronically, in published books and on silicon wafers for long-term preservation. Etching the sacred writings on silicon wafers was the idea of Mukund's student Pasupuleti. The process, called aluminum metallization, transfers an image to a wafer by creating a negative of the image and depositing metal on the silicon surface.
According to Pasupuleti, each wafer can hold the image of three leaves. More than 100 wafers will be needed to store the entire manuscript. As an archival material, silicon wafers are both fire- and waterproof, and readable with the use of a magnifying glass.
Mukund and Pasupuleti will return to India at the end of November to give printed and electronic versions of the Sarvamoola granthas to the monastery in Udupi in a public ceremony in Bangalore, the largest city in the Karnataka region.
"We feel we were blessed to have this opportunity to do this," Mukund says. "It was a fantastic and profoundly spiritual experience. And we all came away cleansed."
Based on the success of this project, Mukund is seeking funding to image other Dvaita manuscripts in the Udupi region written since the time of Shri Madvacharya. He estimates the existence of approximately 800 palm leaf manuscripts, some of which are in private collections.
Source: Rochester Institute of Technology
http://www.physorg.com/news77908116.html
http://www.rit.edu/~930www/webnews/views...p3?id=2046
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http://ignca.nic.in/nl002203.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->National Mission for Manuscripts
SURVEY to identify manuscripts, acquiring or copying and preserving them would form the most immediate tasks of the National Mission for Manuscripts, expected to be launched by early October. According to the Mission Document finalised by the Department of Culture, there is no accurate account of the number of manuscripts available in the country. Various sources place the estimates differently. Hence, it becomes imperative to identify the manuscripts available, as they are with custodians ranging from institutions to individuals.
The manuscripts once identified have to be acquired or copied so that they can be preserved at least in the state they are in. It is this urgency that Secretary Culture, Shri N. Gopalaswami, underlined while inaugurating a one-day seminar, where the Discussion paper for the Mission Document was circulated. Quoting the words of Whiltey Stokes, Secretary to the Council of Governor General in 1868, the Secretary Culture said what was said about manuscripts in India 134 years ago was still relevant.
Mr. Stokes then writing on the state of the manuscripts had said that `no time should be lost in taking measures to save the manuscripts which are degenerating because of the climate, white ants and declining interest.'Â Experts, subject scholars, government representatives and the implementing agencies participated in the seminar to consider the proposals in the Discussion Paper.
According to the Discussion Paper only a small percentage of the manuscripts has been surveyed and catalogued and their number may not be more than 20-25 per cent of the estimated total. The most daunting task for the Mission arises from the fact that the custodians of the manuscripts are dispersed and unidentified. Manuscripts are in the possession of various institutions - libraries, museums and archives, religious bodies, private collectors as also individuals. According to a conservative estimate there are over five million manuscripts in India in various forms and scripts, 60,000 in European countries and 1.5 million in South Asia and Asian countries. Sanskrit manuscripts form 67 per cent of the total number. Some of the practical difficulties anticipated are in preserving the manuscripts once they are identified. Since the manuscripts are in different forms and materials like birch bark, leather, palm leaf, paper etc. it is necessary to train the owners of the manuscripts in their preservation.
The Mission has designated IGNCA as the Nodal Agency for implementing the Mission. The Mission has an estimated outlay of Rs. 250 million for 5 years. The implementation period will coincide with the 10th Five-Year Plan. The Directorate of the Mission will be located at the Centre and IGNCA will also set up a National Manuscripts Library.
The IGNCA Trust will constitute the National Empowered Committee for the implementation of the Mission, chaired by the President of the IGNCA Executive Committee. The Empowered Committee shall have as members the member Secretary. IGNCA, Secretary Culture, The Director General of the National Archives and 10 - 15 others nominated by IGNCA.
Opening discussions at the seminar, Prof. N.R.Shetty, Member Secretary, IGNCA, gave a short background on the work the Centre has done with regard to documenting, preserving and dissemination of the manuscript wealth of the country. He also emphasized on the need to create a National Register of manuscripts as one of the first steps in the implementation of the Mission.
A substantial number of Indian manuscripts have been taken outside the country. It will be part of the Mission's efforts to get copies of these manuscripts, for which budgetary provision has been made. The Mission will also extend financial help to institutions, universities and other sources that have considerable number of manuscripts to improve their storage facility. Some of the States where major wealth of manuscripts are available are Tamil Nadu, Uttar Pradesh, Andhra Pradesh, Rajasthan and Orissa. (See list for major State administered institutions with huge collection of manuscripts)
The Mission Document states that the objectives of the Mission are: (1) To enhance the access to the manuscripts, improve awareness about cultural inheritance and encourage the use of manuscripts for educational and research purpose and lifelong learning; (2) to facilitate conservation and preservation of manuscripts through training, awareness and financial support; (3) to document and catalogue Indian manuscripts, wherever they may be, maintain accurate and up-to-date information about them and the conditions under which they may be consulted; (4) to promote ready access to these manuscripts through publication, both in book form as well as machine readable form; (5) to boost scholarship and research in the study of Indian languages and manuscriptology; (6) to build up a National Manuscripts Library at IGNCA.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
S.No. Organisation Number of Manuscripts
1. Sampurnanand Sanskrit University, Varanasi 1,20,000
2. Government Oriental Manuscript Library, Chennai 66,077
3. Oriental Institute and Manuscript Library, Tiruananthapuran 56,000
4. Saraswati Mahal Library, Thanjavur 47,000
5. Adayar Library and Research Centre, Chennai 40,000
6. Orissa State Museum, Bhuvaneshwar 25,000
7. Andhra Pradesh Oriental Manuscript Library & Research Institute, Hyderabad, 21,136
8. State-Central Library, Hyderabad 17,000
9. Rajasthan State Archives, Jaipur 14,000
10. Rajasthan Oriental Research Institute, Jodhpur 12,262
11. Government Manuscript Library, Allahabad 11,000
http://namami.nic.in/
National Mission for Manuscripts website.
Google to digitise 800,000 books at Mysore varsity
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Search engine Google to digitise 800,000 books at Mysore varsity
IANS
Sunday, May 20, 2007Â 15:16 IST
NEW DELHI: <b>At least 800,000 books and manuscripts, including India's first political treatise the 'Arthasastra' written in the 4th century BC by Kautilya, that are lying in Mysore University in Karnataka, will be digitised by Google, the world's leading Internet search engine.</b>
"Written in both papers and palm leaves, there are around 100,000 manuscripts in our library, some dating back to the eighth century. The effort is to restore and preserve this cultural heritage for effective dissemination of knowledge," said J. Shashidhara Prasad, vice chancellor of the university.
"<b>Many manuscripts on ayurveda, mathematics, medicine, science, astrology and economy including 'Arthasastra' and several paper manuscripts of the Wodeyar dynasty of Mysore will be digitised first," </b>Prasad, who was recently in Delhi, said.
Written either in Sanskrit or Kannada, these resources of knowledge would be patented and printed after the digitisation work is over, Prasad said.
"Depending upon the exclusivity of the materials, we will patent them before making them available on public domain," he said, adding that Google has offered them free service.
<b>"Google has offered to digitise theses manuscripts as well as 700,000 other books free of cost. Google India chief (Eric Schmidt) had already interacted with us and is ready to provide us expertise, software and even manpower," </b>Prasad said, adding that they have also received some financial assistance from the University Grants Commission (UGC) for the digitisation work.
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He means copyright when he says patenting.
08-19-2007, 12:12 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-19-2007, 12:14 AM by Bodhi.)
Oriya palm-leaf manuscripts - Illustrations of Ramayna in Orissa
Vali vadha and Setu Bandhan:
<img src='http://content.cdlib.org/xtf/data/13030/3m/ft6870073m/figures/ft6870073m_00186.gif' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
from Lavanyavati:
<img src='http://content.cdlib.org/xtf/data/13030/3m/ft6870073m/figures/ft6870073m_00017.gif' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
from Michha Patajoshi, Vaidehisa Vilasa:
<img src='http://content.cdlib.org/xtf/data/13030/3m/ft6870073m/figures/ft6870073m_00118.gif' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
And a lot of Ramayana sculpture (incl. Setu Bandhan) in various temples all across orissa, incl inside Sri Jagannath Puri temple, but most notable sculpture is on the vimana of Varahi Temple at Chaurasi in Orissa. image : http://content.cdlib.org/xtf/data/13030/3m...0073m_00280.gif
09-20-2007, 02:52 AM
(This post was last modified: 09-20-2007, 02:58 AM by ramana.)
Good site with a treasure trove of e-books.
http://2020ok.com/4895.htm
A museum will be built on the Murugharajendra math premises to display manuscripts, inscriptions which belong to a period between 12th century and 19th century
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->A museum will be built on the math premises to display the treasure
The Murugharajendra Math, one of the ancient maths of Chitradurga district, has a big collection of manuscripts and copper plate inscriptions. <b>The math has been collecting manuscripts and inscriptions for the past over 200 years. The math authorities say that they have 800 manuscripts written on palm leaves and over 5,000 manuscripts written on paper, along with a few copper plate inscriptions.</b>
<b>These manuscripts belong to a period between 12th century and 19th century. </b>They essentially mention about the Vachanas of the 12th century social reformer Basaveshwara and other propagators of Veerashaivism, including Akkamahadevi.
Mentioning about a few most ancient and valuable manuscripts, epigraphist Rajashekharappa said that the math has a few unpublished poems of Harihara, a Kannada poet of the 13th century.
<b>âShabdamani Dharmapuran, a 13th century grammar book of old Kannada, is one of the invaluable treasures of the math,â</b> he said. Besides manuscripts, the math has innumerable collections of letters written by the Palegars of Chitradurga, the Keladdi kings of the Malnad region who ruled between the 16th and the 18th centuries.
A bell, which has inscriptions of Biccugatti Bharmanna Nayak, a feudal king of Chitradurga, and another letter written in âgold-coloured inkâ by Lingaraj Wodeyar of Kodagu district, are among the other precious collections.
Prof. Rajashekharappa feels that a great amount of study is still required to bring out more information about the manuscripts. So far, the collection has been preserved in a small room. But the math is now planning to exhibit the treasure by constructing a building.
To preserve this heritage, officials of the Chitrakala Parishat and the Department of Manuscript, Bangalore, visited the math. <b>Experts from the department would use scientific methods to protect the manuscripts from being spoiled.</b>
<b>To educate the people, the math has published catalogues and books about the manuscripts.</b>
Soon, a museum would be constructed on the math premises to display the treasure. Prof. Rajashekharappa, who has made extensive study on the manuscripts, said that it will indeed help researchers to bring out more details about an ancient era and about age-old Kannada literature. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
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