05-16-2008, 08:37 AM
(This post was last modified: 05-16-2008, 08:39 AM by G.Subramaniam.)
http://www.indianpediatrics.net/july1999...69-676.htm
Low birth weight vs IQ study in Pune
Social and Environmental Assessment
Thirty per cent of the mothers had some degree of college education, whereas one per cent of the mothers were illiterate. Five per cent of the children lived in independent bungalows and the rest in lower and middle class localities. Most of the children (91 %) came from middle or lower middle class families (SES II or III). Fifty six per cent of the children lived in overcrowded houses.
A multiple linear regression analysis was done using IQ as the outcome variable and infant and socio-environmental information as predictor variable. The predictor. variables included socio-economic status, locality, spaciousness of the house, mother's education, etc., mental and motor age on}3ayley Scales at one year (available from the previous phase of the study), and chronic medical problems like seizures and asthma.
The regression analysis showed that mother's education (β coefficient 0.33373, p <0.001), spaciousness of the house (β coefficient 0.19424, p <0.020), and a mental age at one year (β coefficient 0.22959, p <0.009) had a significant impact on the 6 year IQ. Chronic medical problems had a negative impact on the 6 year IQ (β coefficient - 0.3573, P <0:020). Multiple R of the final module was 0.4354.
--
IQ = 50-69
Control Group = 0%
Low Birth Weight = 3.5%
IQ = 70-84
Control Group = 5.6%
Low Birth Weight = 13.4%
IQ = 85-110
Control Group = 77.5%
Low Birth Weight = 70.1%
IQ = Above 110
Control Group = 16.9%
Low Birth Weight = 10%
Mean IQ
Control Group = 101
Low Birth Weight = 94
<!--emo&<_<--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/dry.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='dry.gif' /><!--endemo--> This has been the most prolific discussion on India Forum and I have been reading it with quite an interest.
And here is my opinion:
In Indian conditions,
1.The biggest divider between high IQ and so called low IQ is
Language.
That is to say, those who can do git-pit in English vs. other languages.
2. Another divider is between city born and bred vs. village born and bred.
Moreover, IQ is no more simply IQ e.g. it can be I(ntellectual)Q.
Then, there are things like 'abstractQ' vs. 'concreteQ' e.g. Japanese and some others are considered high in 'cq' while Indians are considered high in 'aq'.
Another 1 is 'emotionalq' in which again Indians are considered very high.
Somewhere in another thread, I have touched on 'politicalq'.
In nutshell, you name it and there is classification of 'iq'; therefore, I consider it very hazardous to say something like collective Indian 'iq'.
I sent an email to steve sailer and he started a thread in his blog
So far no one has refuted me
http://isteve.blogspot.com/2008/05/indian-...mographics.html
A closer look at high end Indian iQ
( after Flynn )
Southern brahmin = 0.01 * 1100 mil = 11 mil
Avg = 125, SD = 15
Above 120IQ = 0.63 * 11 = 6.930 mil
Above 130IQ = 0.37 * 11 = 4.070 mil
Above 140IQ = 0.16 * 11 = 1.760 mil
Northern brahmin = 0.04 * 1100 mil = 44 mil
Avg = 120, SD = 15
Above 120IQ = 0.50 * 44 = 22 mil
Above 130IQ = 0.25 * 44 = 11 mil
Above 140IQ = 0.09 * 44 = 3.960 mil
--
Southern Merchant = 0.03 * 1100 mil = 33 mil
Avg = 115, SD = 15
Above 120IQ = 0.37 * 33 = 12.210 mil
Above 130IQ = 0.16 * 33 = 5.280 mil
Above 140IQ = 0.05 * 33 = 1.650 mil
--
Northern Merchant = 0.12 * 1100 mil = 132 mil
Avg = 110, SD = 15
Above 120IQ = 0.25 * 132 = 33 mil
Above 130IQ = 0.09 * 132 = 11.880 mil
Above 140IQ = 0.023 * 132 = 3.036 mil
--
By ignoring the small right hand tail of the peasants, the muslims and the dalits and the tribals
--
Over 120IQ = 6.930 + 22 + 12.210 + 33 = 74.140 mil
Over 130IQ = 4.070 + 11 + 5.280 + 11.880 = 32.230 mil
Over 140IQ = 1.760 + 3.960 + 1.650 + 3.036 = 10.406 mil
Comparing Hi-End IQ
India vs China
---
Assumptions
1.For India , I am simply going to use the upper caste + brahmin segment = 20% of 1.1 bil = 220 mil,
Avg IQ = 110 ( after Flynn ) and SD = 15
I am ignoring the small right hand tail contribution of Dalits and Backward castes
2. For China, the population is 1.3bil, and Avg = 105 ( after Flynn and compensating for Interior chinese and the non-han minorities )
3. Per La griffe du lion, in his article on smart fractions IQ, which measures the right hand tail,
the SD for East Asians is less than 6. So I am going to run scenarios for Chinese SD = 15, 10 and 7.5
Above 120 IQ
---
India , 0.67 ( 15 SD ) =
0.25 * 220mil = 55 mil
China, 1 ( 15 SD ) = 0.16 * 1300 mil = 208 mil
China 1.5 ( 10 SD ) = 0.07 * 1300 = 91 mil
China 2 ( 7.5 SD ) = 0.023 * 1300
= 30 mil
---
Above 130 IQ
---
India, 1.33 ( 15 SD ) = 0.09 * 220 mil = 20 mil
( 20 mil upper castes above Mensa range, has implications for white collar jobs migration for the west )
China , 1.67 ( 15 SD ) = 0.05 * 1300 mil = 65 mil
China , 2.5 ( 10 SD ) = 0.006 * 1300 = 7.8 mil
China, 3.33 ( 7.5 SD ) = 0.0005 * 1300 = 0.65 mil
---
Above 140 IQ
India, 2, ( SD = 15 ) = 0.023 * 220 mil = 5.060 mil
China, 2.33, ( SD = 15 ) = 0.01 * 1300 mil = 13 mil
China, 3.5 ( SD = 10 ) = 0.01 * 0.023 * 1300 mil = 0.300 mil
China, 4.67 ( SD = 7.5 ) = 0.01 * 0.001 * 1300 mil = 0.013 mil
The trimodality of the Indian IQ curve
In the Central govt jobs
the Dalits and tribals are given reservations according to their population % = 22%
The Backward castes ( including muslim dalits and muslim backwards and xtian dalits ) are given weightage at roughly half their population weightage = 27%
The remaining 51% is open to all but mostly taken by upper castes and brahmins
In Tamil Nadu, the IQ curve is quadri-modal
Dalits = 19%
Most Backward castes = 20%
Backward Castes ( all upper castes except brahmins ) = 30%
and 30% left open and largely taken by brahmins
In the rest of India too, the IQ curve is probably quadri-modal
but the relations between the upper castes and brahmins are still good and the upper castes have not demanded a brahmin free quota
Sanity Check
India vs Vietnam at the high end
--
Vietnam population = 88 mil
Indian population = 1100 mil
Vietnam IQ = 100 ( estimate )
India IQ = 82 from IQ and wealth of nations
--
Look at the high end, over 120 IQ
For India it is 2.5 SD
= 0.005 * 1100 mil = 5.5 mil
For vietnam it is 1.3 SD
= 0.093 * 88 mil = 8.1 mil
--
Do a sanity check and compare the high end of vietnam and India
From a pune center that coaches for the math olympiad
--
http://www.bprim.org/more.htm
Bhaskaracharya Pratishthana is a Pune based Institute founded in 1976 by the world famous Indian Mathematician Prof. Shreeram Abhyankar for conducting research in Higher Mathematics. Over the years a number students who have studied under Prof. Abhyankar ( brahmin ) and Prof. K. C. Sharma ( brahmin), have obtained their Ph.D. degree.
Since opportunities for professional courses for students of Mathematics and consequent lucrative job prospects have
increased over the years, the number of students offering to study Pure Mathematics and doing research in it has considerably dwindled.
--
The Pratishthana hopes that out of these students who are initially attracted to Mathematics because of job opportunities in the fields of Computer Science and Information Technology, some may feel inclined to undertake research in Higher Mathematics.
--
This center makes an online appeal for donations
http://www.bprim.org/apeal.php
It gets $10000 per year
---
Students of Bhaskaracharya Pratishthana who have received medals at
The International Mathematical Olympiad (IMO)
Year-wise Performance of Students' from BP.
( all brahmins and upper castes )
Year Name of the student Medal IMO held at the country
1992 Sachin Lodha Bronze (Moscow)
1992 Kaustubh Namjoshi Silver (Moscow, USSR)
1993 Kaustubh Namjoshi Silver (Istanbul, Turky)
1994 Subhash Khot Silver (Hong Kong)
1995 Subhash Khot Silver (Canada)
1996 Kaustubh Deshmukh Silver (India)
1997 Satyen Kale Bronze (Argentina)
1997 Chetan Balwe Silver (Argentina)
1998 Chetan Balwe Gold (Taiwan)
1999 Mandar Joshi Bronze (Romania)
2001 Nikhil Savale Bronze (Washington D.C. USA)
2002 Nikhil Savale Gold (Glasgow, U.K.)
2002 Shubhangi Saraf Bronze (Glasgow, U.K.)
2002 Tanmay Deshpande Bronze (Glasgow, U.K.)
2003 Nikhil Savale Silver (Tokyo, Japan)
2003 Shubhangi Saraf Silver (Tokyo, Japan)
2003 Anand Deopurkar Bronze (Tokyo, Japan)
2004 Anand Deopurkar Silver (Athens, Greece)
2004 Kshipra Bhavalkar Silver (Athens, Greece)
2004 Rohit Joshi Silver (Athens, Greece)
2004 Abhishek Dang Bronze (Athens, Greece)
2005 Abhishek Dang Silver (Merida, Mexico)
2005 Varun Jog Bronze (Merida, Mexico)
2006 Abhishek Dang Honorable mention (Ljublijana, Slovenia)
2006 Varun Jog Bronze (Ljublijana, Sloveniao)
2006 Ashay Burungale Bronze (Ljublijana, Slovenia)
2006 Apurv Nakade Bronze (Ljublijana, Slovenia)
2007 Abhishek Dang Silver (Vietnam)
2007 Prashant Sohoni Honorable mention (Vietnam)
The training will be aimed at introducing novice students to the Olympiad level Mathematics and motivating them to study for the Regional Mathematics Olympiad. The subjects taught will be Algebra, Geometry, Number Theory and Combinatorics.
The details of the programme are as follows:
Duration : 12th May to 24th May 2008
Timing : - Duration will be 4 hr.s per day (Monday to Saturday)
Eligibility : Students entering 9th, 10th, or 11th standard having scored
at least 80% in mathematics
Fees : Rs.2,000/- ( $50)
Sanity check India vs Indonesia
at the high end
---
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_the_...of_Nations
--
Indonesia has a population of 235 million, vs 1.1 billion for India
--
IQ of Indonesia is 90
IQ of India per table is 82
Assume SD = 15
--
For IQ above 120,
it is 2 SD for Indonesia
which works out to
0.023 x 234 mil = 5.4 million
For India, it works out to 2.5 SD
which works out to
0.005 x 1100 mil = 5.5 million
--
So both India and Indonesia supposedly have the same number of people , 5.5 mil with IQ > 120
So what are the high end achievements of Indonesia,
and India ??
Simplified Trimodal Model for current and future ( 60 years ) IQ
Future
--
Upper Castes + brahmins, 20% @ 110
Backward Castes, 40% @ 95
Dalits. Tribals. Muslims, 40% @ 85
Avg = 94
Current
Upper Castes + brahmins,
20% @ 110 - 5 Flynn, 105
Backward Castes,
40% @ 95 - 7 Flynn, 88
Dalits. Tribals. Muslims,
40% @ 85 - 10 Flynn, 75
Avg = 86.2
In a middle class hindu locale in Pune, mostly merchant caste, with still a fair degree of malnutrition
http://www.indianpediatrics.net/july1999...69-676.htm
Low birth weight vs IQ study in Pune
Social and Environmental Assessment
Thirty per cent of the mothers had some degree of college education, whereas one per cent of the mothers were illiterate. Five per cent of the children lived in independent bungalows and the rest in lower and middle class localities. Most of the children (91 %) came from middle or lower middle class families (SES II or III). Fifty six per cent of the children lived in overcrowded houses.
A multiple linear regression analysis was done using IQ as the outcome variable and infant and socio-environmental information as predictor variable. The predictor. variables included socio-economic status, locality, spaciousness of the house, mother's education, etc., mental and motor age on}3ayley Scales at one year (available from the previous phase of the study), and chronic medical problems like seizures and asthma.
The regression analysis showed that mother's education (β coefficient 0.33373, p <0.001), spaciousness of the house (β coefficient 0.19424, p <0.020), and a mental age at one year (β coefficient 0.22959, p <0.009) had a significant impact on the 6 year IQ. Chronic medical problems had a negative impact on the 6 year IQ (β coefficient - 0.3573, P <0:020). Multiple R of the final module was 0.4354.
--
IQ = 50-69
Control Group = 0%
Low Birth Weight = 3.5%
IQ = 70-84
Control Group = 5.6%
Low Birth Weight = 13.4%
IQ = 85-110
Control Group = 77.5%
Low Birth Weight = 70.1%
IQ = Above 110
Control Group = 16.9%
Low Birth Weight = 10%
Mean IQ
Control Group = 101
Low Birth Weight = 94
A simplified trimodal IQ curve for India
40% ( dalits, muslims + tribals ) @ 85IQ ( african american level )
40% ( Backward peasant caste ) @ 95IQ
( midway between hispanics and blue collar whites )
20% ( upper caste + brahmins ) @ 110IQ
( Ashkenazi levels )
Average = 94 ( in 60 years )
Understanding the standard deviation
--
From wiki
--
Assume India has an Avg IQ of 80 and a 15 SD
and a unimodal bell curve
Thanks to bell curve the number of people with high IQ falls off very fast
and a 1.1 bil pop
For IQ above 95, 1 SD ,
16% of 1.1 bil = 170 mil
For IQ above 110, 2 SD
2.3% = 28 mil
For IQ above 125,
0.130% = 1.400 million
For IQ above 140,
0.003% = 33000
--
Of course, I am the first to agree that Dalit, muslim and Tribal IQ
about 40% of the total, cluster very slightly above African IQ
And this segment is totally absent in the diaspora to the west
and is 50% of the diaspora in Fiji, Mauritius and the caribbean
----
Then from above, make a sanity check, whether the below is possible with just 1 million above 125 IQ and 33000 above 140IQ
think of the software, the back office jobs, the spread of buddhism, the indian civilisaion in south east asia,
the call centers,
the patel motels, the spelling bees, the nukes, the ballistic missile defence, the moon shot,
The Brahmos cruise missile and Sukhoi-30MKI Flanker,
and the performance of the diaspora in western countries
IQa ( in 3 generations )
Southern brahmin, 1% = 125
Northern brahmin, 4% = 120
Southern Merchant, 3% = 115
Northern Merchant, 12% = 110
Southern Peasant, 8% = 100
Northern Peasant, 32% = 95
Muslim , 15% = 85
Southern Dalit, 5% = 85
Northern Dalit, 20% = 80
Average = 94.10
---
For flynn effect, For present IQ,
IQp, I am reducing brahmin and merchant scores by 5, peasant scores by 7, Dalit and Muslim scores by 10
Note, in Africa, the Flynn reduction is 10
IQp ( at present )
Southern brahmin, 1% = 125-5=120
Northern brahmin, 4% = 120-5=115
Southern Merchant, 3% = 115-5=110
Northern Merchant, 12% = 110-5=105
Southern Peasant, 8% = 100-7=93
Northern Peasant, 32% = 95-7=88
Muslim , 15% = 85-10=75
Southern Dalit, 5% = 85-10=75
Northern Dalit, 20% = 80-10-70
( Northern Dalit = African = 70 in native country )
Average at Present in India = 86.3IQ
Flynn delta = 7.8IQ
This sort of makes sense, that the Flynn effect in India, 7.8 is somewhat less than than the Flynn effect for Africa = 10
Estimated IQ for Maharashtra
( Mumbai )
Brahmin, 5% @ 125 IQ
Upper Caste 30% @ 115 IQ
Backward Caste 40% @100IQ
Muslim, 10% @ 85 IQ
Dalit, 15% @ 85 IQ
Avg = 102
Estimated IQ for various states in India
---
Gujurat
Brahmins, 5% @ 120IQ
Upper Castes, 40% @ 110 IQ
Backward Castes, 20% @ 95 IQ
Muslims, 10% @ 85 iQ
Dalits, Tribals, 25% @ 80iQ
Avg = 97.5IQ
Tamil Nadu
Brahmins, 1% @ 125IQ
Upper castes = 25% @ 115 IQ
Backward Castes = 50% @ 100 IQ
Muslims, 6% @ 90 IQ
Dalits, 18% @ 85 IQ
Avg = 102.5IQ
Uttar Pradesh
Brahmins = 10% @ 120 IQ
Upper Castes = 20% @ 110 IQ
Backward Castes = 30% @ 95 IQ
Muslims = 20% @ 85 IQ
Dalits = 20% @ 80 IQ
Avg = 95.5IQ
Bihar
Brahmins = 5% @ 120 IQ
Upper Castes = 20% @ 110 IQ
Backward Castes = 40% @ 95 IQ
Muslims = 15% @ 85 IQ
Dalits = 20% @ 80IQ
Avg = 94.75IQ
Punjab
Brahmins = 5% @ 120IQ
Upper Castes = 25% @ 110IQ
Backward Castes = 50% @ 95IQ
Muslims = 0% ( ethnic cleansed 1947)
Dalits = 20% @ 80IQ
Avg = 97IQ
Orissa
Brahmins = 5% @ 125IQ
Upper Castes = 15% @ 115 IQ
Backward Castes = 25% @ 100 IQ
Muslims = 5% @ 85 IQ
Dalits, Tribals = 50% @ 85IQ
Avg = 95IQ
West Bengal
Brahmins = 5% @ 120 IQ
Upper Castes = 15% @ 110IQ
Backward Castes = 30% @ 95 IQ
Muslim = 25% @ 75 IQ
( these muslims are dalit Namasudra converts , 85-10 = 75 )
Dalits = 25% @ 80 IQ
Avg = 89.75IQ
The impact of the expulsion of brahmins from tamil nadu
---
Thanks to severe affirmative action,
since 1920, the brahmin % in tamil nadu has been reduced from 3% to 1%
--
Let us look at the impact on overall Average IQ
by replacing 2% brahmins ( 125 IQ) with 2% southern dalits ( 85 IQ )
0.01*( 3-1)*(85-125) = -0.8 IQ
which is hardly noticeable
in overall governance
Since Tamil Nadu only has 6% muslims ( as against 18% in north India ), and the Tamil Nadu hindus have not suffered -5IQ by islamic massacres, of course Tamil Nadu will have a higher IQ and better governance than north India
What Tamil Nadu has lost by expelling the brahmins is that the the software center is in Bangalore outside Tamil Nadu, not Chennai in Tamil Nadu
Step by Step
1. For IQ analysis, Indians can be lumped into Brahmin, Merchant Caste,
Peasant Caste, Dalit and Muslim
2. During muslim rule in north India, they massacred most of the elite of any
community to terrorise the rest into converting to islam
This means that in north India, the upper end of the IQ curve is truncated and
on average, the northern castes are now 5 IQ points below the equivalent
southern castes. So we have to consider IQ of northern and southern castes separately
3. Per Indian Surveys
Brahmins = 5%, Merchants = 15%, Peasants = 40%, Dalits+Tribals=25%, Muslims = 15%
Of these 20% are in South India and 80% in North India
4. Islam also reduces the IQ of its followers by 10
5. IQ measurement in India is too inaccurate due to malnutrition levels
similar to Africa, poor schools, poverty and illiteracy.
However, the IQ of the Indian diaspora, which does not suffer
these handicaps can be measured. It is assumed that in 3 generations
as the economy improves, the IQ in India will reflect that in the diaspora
6. Each Diaspora has a different caste mix
Mauritius, Fiji, South Africa = 50% Northern Dalit + 50% Northern Peasant
UK = 40% northern peasant + 60% northern merchant
Singapore = 25% Southern Dalit + 25% Southern Peasant + 50% Southern Merchant
USA = 20% Northern Peasant + 60% Northern Merchant + 20% Southern Brahmin
Due to immigration filters in USA, each caste in USA has IQ 5 points more than
in India
7. From Above the Lowest IQ caste is Northern Dalit and is
assumed to be no less than an African relocated to west = 80 iQ
8. From Above, southern Dalit = 80 + 5 = 85 IQ
9. In Mauritius the Indian diaspora has a per capita annual gdp of $6000
From the chart in IQ and wealth of nations, the IQ is predicted as 88
The diaspora IQ in Fiji and South Africa which have the same blend shows that
88IQ is a very conservative number
In Mauritius, therefore , the diaspora consists of 50% Northern Dalit and
50% Northern Peasant. We know that Northern Dalit = 80
Therefore by algebra, we can calculate Northern Peasant = 95 IQ
10. The Northern Peasant in Canada and UK is blue collar, high school
complete, middle class and this correlates with 95 IQ
11. Southern Peasant = 95+5 = 100 IQ
12. Indian muslims are mostly descendents of converts from Northern castes
of similar level to peasants
Muslim IQ = 95 - 10 = 85 IQ
13. In UK, in schools Indians perform midway between chinese ( 108 ) and
white ( 100 ) and we can interpolate an IQ of 104 for the entire UK diaspora
Of this 40% are Northern Peasants of 95 IQ and 60% of Northern Merchants
Therefore by algebra, we can calculate Northern Merchant = 110 IQ
14. Southern Merchant = 110 + 5 = 115 IQ
15. Singapore Diaspora consists of 25% Southern Dalit ( 85 IQ )
+ 25% Southern Peasant ( 100 IQ ) + 50% Southern Merchant ( 115 IQ )
This calculates to an average IQ of 104
By comparing the school performance of Indian kids with Malays ( 92 IQ ) and
Chinese ( 108 ), gives an interpolated IQ of 104, which matches calculated number
16. In USA, the Indian blend is
20% Northern Peasant in USA ( 95+5 IQ ) + 60% Northern Merchant in USA ( 110+5 iQ ) +
20% Southern Brahmin in USA
Overall this diaspora performs equal to Ashkenazi jews and can therefore be
assumed to have same IQ = 115
Therefore by algebra, we can calculate Southern Brahmin in USA = 130 IQ
17. Southern Brahmin in India = 130 - 5 = 125 IQ
And this makes sense because, since 1920, Castes of the level of
Southern Merchant ( 115 IQ ) demanded protection from the
IQ of the southern brahmin
by Affirmative Action
18. Northern Brahmin = 125 - 5 = 120 IQ
19. Indian IQ is the average of
20% Northern Dalit = 80 IQ
5% Southern Dalit = 85 IQ
15% Muslim = 85 IQ
32% Northern Peasant = 95 IQ
8% Southern Peasant = 100 IQ
12% Northern Merchant = 110 IQ
3% Southern Merchant = 115 IQ
4% Northern Brahmin = 120 IQ
1% Southern Brahmin = 125 IQ
Average = 94.10 IQ
My assumptions in Steve Sailer's blog
The population distribution of India
is
Southern brahmin = 1%
Northern brahmin = 4%
Southern merchant = 3%
Northern merchant = 12%
Southern peasant = 8%
Northern peasant = 32%
Muslim = 15%
Southern Dalit / Tribal = 5%
Northern Dalit / Tribal = 20%
--
Next I made the assumption that thanks to islamic massacres in north India which targeted the elite of each caste, and truncated the high end northern iQ, and reduced northern IQ by 5
--
Next, based on the caste composition of the various Indian diaspora
and the IQ scores of the diaspora, by algebra, I calculated the IQ of each caste segment and translated it back to India
--
India suffers from a serious flynn effect = 7.8
I assumed Flynn = 5 for upper castes and brahmins
Flynn = 10 for dalits and tribals ( same as africa )
and Flynn for peasant castes = 7
--
So after a lot of algebra
the current Indian iQ = 86.3, future Indian IQ = 94.1
when you say "North" you mean whole of India minus south? (Thats becomes a very broad "North"!)
And if that be so, your assumptions do not hold uniformly good for all regions within that "North". E.g. in East, the scale and frequency of islamic massacres were much less, compaed to West and proper North. (Assam/NE they could not penetrate, majority of Bengal converted easily without needing an ongoing masscre). So your assumption of 5 basis point reduction can not be uniform.
What about the impact of european colonization, especially on "south"? did it increase IQ or decrease it, and how much?
<!--QuoteBegin-Bodhi+Jun 8 2008, 11:49 PM-->QUOTE(Bodhi @ Jun 8 2008, 11:49 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->when you say "North" you mean whole of India minus south? (Thats becomes a very broad "North"!)
And if that be so, your assumptions do not hold uniformly good for all regions within that "North". E.g. in East, the scale and frequency of islamic massacres were much less, compaed to West and proper North. (Assam/NE they could not penetrate, majority of Bengal converted easily without needing an ongoing masscre). So your assumption of 5 basis point reduction can not be uniform.
What about the impact of european colonization, especially on "south"? did it increase IQ or decrease it, and how much?
[right][snapback]82525[/snapback][/right]
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There was plenty of massacres in bengal
As far as assam and north east is concerned, they are only 5% of the Indian population
Finally, my method was a first order approximation
06-09-2008, 09:35 AM
(This post was last modified: 06-09-2008, 09:51 AM by Bodhi.)
<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jun 9 2008, 12:07 AM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jun 9 2008, 12:07 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->There was plenty of massacres in bengal
[right][snapback]82526[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Have you accounted for the massacres of Hindus in karNATaka, Andhra, and northern kerala? There is no comparision of that with bengal!!
Looks like you mean TN when you say south? If so, yes TN witnessed relatively less of gazi visits with exceptions of the eunuch general of khilji, and usurper of mysrore and his son tippoo. karNATaka has been a witness of widespread and recurring massacres, ever since the Khilji times, and later during Bahamani/Bijapur/Mughal control. For a historical account, read jadunath sarkar, and if you prefer a graphical account then read India - A Wounded Civilization by VS Naipaul. Also visit Hampi for a first hand experience. As for Kerala, the ongoing islamic aggression on Hindus must only be compared with that in Punjab. Right from the old days to Tippo's time till the Moplah rioting during last century. Add to this the christian aggression. Kerala Hindus are under much greater stress than anywhere else in India with exception of J&K. Gazi aggression in Andhra for last 700 years up until the time of tyrant Nizam and his razakaars - we all know enough about it.
Coming to bengal, within the first 20 years of Khilji coming to bengal, vast populatioin converted including the Hindu rulers and their elites. wandering sufi imposters along with the mere threat of the gazi was good enough, and actual masscare was not much deployed. (Same was consolidated by the later sultans and mughals). Get some glimpses of how easily without much sword-effort Bengal fell to gazi, by reading A History of Nawabs in Bengal by Jadunath Sarkar. Nirad C Chaudhury has also written in massive detail on this.
Now, I am not denying the massacres in Bengal, only comparing the scale of these with those in south.
<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Jun 9 2008, 12:07 AM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Jun 9 2008, 12:07 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->As far as assam and north east is concerned, they are only 5% of the Indian population
[right][snapback]82526[/snapback][/right]
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So, it appears to me, you are applying the TN historical condition on rest of South India. And share of TN population in India would be comparable to that of NE.
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