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Removing The Sheen From Eastern Xtianity
#1
The dumb RSS always praises eastern kerala xtians

However, what is not well understood is that when the portuguese first showed up in kerala, the local kerala xtians immediately sided with the invader against the hindu kings
( per portuguese archives )

Later on, they found out the hard way, that unless they became catholic, they would be burnt in the fires of the inquisition

Even today, hindus are more oppressed in eastern xtian russia than in the west
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#2
Same with Goan Xtians also who immediately took to their Portuguese brothers in faith only to be bumped off by them.
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#3
deleted
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#4
I already replied check now.
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#5
yes
Got the email
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#6
Yes to everything else, except this:
<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Feb 23 2009, 09:44 AM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Feb 23 2009, 09:44 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Even today, hindus are more oppressed in eastern xtian russia than in the west[right][snapback]94850[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Are you talking about the ISKCON situation in Russia? Well, it's <i>proselytising</i> in Russia (IIRC with the blessings or at least visible presence of Junior <i>Ford</i>). Eastern Orthodox Russia is not a proselytising nation. They have a right to be left alone, as Hindus have a right to be left alone. Hindus ought to be fair on this.

It is not like America that's trying to push one religion of WASPYiness. Russia already officially recognises 4 major religions within its borders, since these have long been part of its landscape (and which have over time worked out some sort of established platform of 'coexistence', although the eternal catholic aggressiveness and islam tend to pose troubles):
- christianism: the Greek Orthodox Church, but unfortunately also the catholic variety,
- Buddhism,
- Judaism and
- islam.
And Russia wants to preserve this particular religious identity in stability, which is its right. Why throw oil on the carefully-contained fire of its existing dynamics?

ISKCON is openly taking its Krsna Consciousness there now. Russia has specifically declared it does not like proselytising (nor any meddling NGOs for that matter, including the American evangelical varieties). Can't existing Russian adherents of ISKCON just do offerings to a Krishna Moorthy in their homes (like Hindus living in western countries generally do), instead of Junior Ford or whoever agitating to build an ISKCON Temple there? Traditional Temples in Bharatam have a purpose because these tend to have been built on sacred sites where our Gods appeared or did something important. So, if building ISKCON Temples is causing so much stress in Russia, a puja room in Russian ISKCON homes can easily suffice and will not stifle followers' pursuits.
Also, surely ISKCON is a very visible path on the web, and people can discover it and follow it in private if they choose? There's no need for it to be taken to the public physically as this obviously goes against non-proselytising people's comfort. (One of the issues I have with ISKCON is that it is very into proselytising - it even tries to convert Hindus in Bharatam to Krsna Consciousness...)
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#7
Lets see what mother Gavrila have to say about hinduism
I sympathize greatly Indian people. Moreover, I wish you much I can help you people out there in great poverty and pain. Fr Paisie say about Indians that are a people with a distinct spiritual depth that manifests îmbucurătoare anxiety and spiritual searches. He admiringly about them: "The heart can not fill the table, and screws. They miss that after God, but is in error. Devil it themselves and it Śmutilează duhovniceşti. If the people would know Christ, the heart that is, would increase much unsaid. "

I met a large number of Indian animati most altruistic and noble feelings. I only resist their tradition "spiritual". I resist Satan who is hiding behind gurusilor's supernatural abilities, not the people themselves, but I pray that Christ to release from slavery and wily master of them settled in Heaven. . The most burning desire and right of my prayer is that people are aware of Indian orthodoxy, to know Him Christ, and to save the society from repressive system of castes which required 1-brahmin tradition.

(The translation is a little wrong,here is more exactly-Im against the devil ,who is behinde the supernatural abilites of gurus ,not common people,and i pray to Christ to free them from the slavery of their evil master(satan) and place them in heaven.My burning pray is that indian people to know christian orthodoxy ,find Christ,and save them from the caste sistem imposed by the brahmanic tradition.)

I use the google translation
http://www.google.ro/search?hl=ro&q=transl...%83utare+Google

Here the translation of mother Gavrila confesions about hinduism
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1

Father Pasisie true spirituality and fake spirituality of hindu gurus
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1

The meeting betwin orthodox missionary and the evil fakir
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1

From the goddes of death(Kali) to the emperor of life(Jesus)
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1

The plan of hinduism to destroy christianity
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1

http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1


http://translate.google.com/translate?prev..._state0=&swap=1
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#8
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->One of the issues I have with ISKCON is that it is very into proselytising - it even tries to convert Hindus in Bharatam to Krsna Consciousness...<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That quite irks me. After centuries of debating and understanding the different Hindu streams have more or less settled and go about minding their own business without annoying other streams. ISKCON tends to portray itself as the "only way" or "superior way" in an annoying way.
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#9
<!--QuoteBegin-Swamy G+Feb 25 2009, 11:09 PM-->QUOTE(Swamy G @ Feb 25 2009, 11:09 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->One of the issues I have with ISKCON is that it is very into proselytising - it even tries to convert Hindus in Bharatam to Krsna Consciousness...<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That quite irks me. After centuries of debating and understanding the different Hindu streams have more or less settled and go about minding their own business without annoying other streams. ISKCON tends to portray itself as the "only way" or "superior way" in an annoying way.
[right][snapback]94921[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
the fastest way ,not only way and is a superior way no doubt.They make a little noise yet they dont use the methods that american-christians sects use in converting.
I hope visit soon the iskon teacher here and ask him about the morality of iskon missionary aproach.
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#10
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Feb 23 2009, 11:47 AM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Feb 23 2009, 11:47 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Yes to everything else, except this:
<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+Feb 23 2009, 09:44 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ Feb 23 2009, 09:44 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Even today, hindus are more oppressed in eastern xtian russia than in the west[right][snapback]94850[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Are you talking about the ISKCON situation in Russia? Well, it's <i>proselytising</i> in Russia (IIRC with the blessings or at least visible presence of Junior <i>Ford</i>). Eastern Orthodox Russia is not a proselytising nation. They have a right to be left alone, as Hindus have a right to be left alone. Hindus ought to be fair on this.

It is not like America that's trying to push one religion of WASPYiness. Russia already officially recognises 4 major religions within its borders, since these have long been part of its landscape (and which have over time worked out some sort of established platform of 'coexistence', although the eternal catholic aggressiveness and islam tend to pose troubles):
- christianism: the Greek Orthodox Church, but unfortunately also the catholic variety,
- Buddhism,
- Judaism and
- islam.
And Russia wants to preserve this particular religious identity in stability, which is its right. Why throw oil on the carefully-contained fire of its existing dynamics?

ISKCON is openly taking its Krsna Consciousness there now. Russia has specifically declared it does not like proselytising (nor any meddling NGOs for that matter, including the American evangelical varieties). Can't existing Russian adherents of ISKCON just do offerings to a Krishna Moorthy in their homes (like Hindus living in western countries generally do), instead of Junior Ford or whoever agitating to build an ISKCON Temple there? Traditional Temples in Bharatam have a purpose because these tend to have been built on sacred sites where our Gods appeared or did something important. So, if building ISKCON Temples is causing so much stress in Russia, a puja room in Russian ISKCON homes can easily suffice and will not stifle followers' pursuits.
Also, surely ISKCON is a very visible path on the web, and people can discover it and follow it in private if they choose? There's no need for it to be taken to the public physically as this obviously goes against non-proselytising people's comfort. (One of the issues I have with ISKCON is that it is very into proselytising - it even tries to convert Hindus in Bharatam to Krsna Consciousness...)
[right][snapback]94864[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
They forgot to put traditional shamanism or pre-christian slavic religion in that list.Maybe they should also close missions from US,China(for russian misionarism) and also from Zambia,Tanzania,Uganda and many other african countries where orthodox-greek missionarise and proselytise today.
.Orthodox church was a misionary religion up to communist days.There are voices that want to relive the orthodox missionarism however their methods of conversions are not as good as catholic are for numerous reasons.
Orthodox doctrine is the same as the doctrine of Malabar church the diference being the way of Jesus nature is (dyaphisite or myaphisite) .

Regarding web,not all people have internet and didnt have in the past.
And they didnt heard about russian orthodox inquisition.
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#11
Instead to give lists whit the right religions ,is better for orthodox church gathering to give a law that bans persecution of heretics ,that condemn historical persecutions made by this church,that they will take a more humble place in politics(especialy in cases where is not their buisniess).
More dificult will be whit the saints that use persecution themselfs ,starting whit Constantine and other church fathers.What an orthodox can learn from their anti-heretic actions?
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