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Christian Subversion And Missionary Activities - 5
I stand corrected.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Shamu wrote:</b> Just to set facts straight. A K Antony was Kerala CM. CM of Karnataka must have been SM Krishna, a Hindu. Classic example of Hindus subjugating other Hindus for personal gains.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->I did first search IF for AK Anthony (since I'd remembered posting something from elsewhere that mentioned Anthony and Karnataka) and found the post:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Karnataka is virtually controlled by AK Anthony, whose secretaries are all from the Southern Christian association. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Guess I wrongly assumed that since AK Anthony was said to have controlled Karnataka, it meant he was therefore the CM of Karnataka (until then I had thought he had been lording it over Kerala). Apparently the person at Sulekha meant he was doing long-distance meddling?

Now I need to locate and correct where else I reposted the above mis-statement.
<b>ADDED:</b> And of course the very item that I pasted here <i>stated</i> that this SM Krishna was CM of Karnataka. Just one line below a statement I had made bold. Just classic.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Christian Sodomy in India: Targeting Orissa children!</b>

Just four months back, we read in papers that the Pope (can we say Pope fellow, with the courtesy of Omar Abdullah!) <b>Benedict XVI apologized on July 19, 2008 to the victims of child sex abuse by Roman Catholic clergy in Australia.

So it appears that the Australians have shifted their activities to Puri, now, the Indian press itself is ironically branded as “the city of sin"!</b>

<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Australian doctor detained in India for alleged paedophilia</b>
Nov 15, 2008

BHUBANESWAR, India (AFP) — Police in eastern India have arrested an Australian doctor working at an orphanage on suspicion of paedophilia, a police officer said. Police identified the accused as Paul Allen, 60, and said he was a volunteer at the Mary-Ellen Gerber (MEG) Children"s Village and was being held in custody after being denied bail. The community houses 85 orphans aged between five and 18 in Puri town, 65 kilometres (40 miles) east of Orissa state capital, Bhubaneswar. The international voluntary group, with offices in countries such as Canada, the United States and France, opened the Puri facility in 2000 to look after children left destitute or orphaned by the October 1999 supercyclone that devastated the state and killed tens of thousands of people.

Photo.1Tongueaul Allen at a police station in Puri on November 13, 2008

Photo.2: Renowned sand artist Sudarshan Patnaik creates a symbolic gesture during an HIV/AIDS awareness campaign at the Golden Beach in Puri, Orissa.

Photo.3: The Pope, who apologized for such sins of Christians!

Preliminary inquiries indicated that most of those who were allegedly sexually abused were “innocent boys," Debi Das, a senior police officer, told AFP by telephone from Puri. Allen"s detention followed complaints about his alleged behavior to MEG foundation authorities who informed the police."Following a complaint from the MEG foundation we nabbed Allen from the port town of Viskhapatnam (in neighbouring Andhra Pradesh state) and brought him back to Puri a couple days ago," Das said."The charges against him are serious. He was denied bail by the local court on Friday and is being held under judicial custody," Das said. A 2003 law provides for imprisonment of up to 10 years and a fine of 200,000 rupees (4,470 US dollars) for those found guilty of paedophilia. Allen, who has been associated with the orphanage since 2002, was staying on the premises.Das said Allen fled the Puri facility after he became aware that the police were looking for him. In recent years, cases of paedophilia have come to light in India — most of them in the western resort state of Goa. Last year, a Goa court handed 44 year-old Australian national Warner Wulf Ingo a 10-year prison sentence after finding him guilty of sodomy, sex with minors, abduction and criminal conspiracy.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Mary-Ellen Gerber (MEG) Children"s village: The Mary-Ellen Gerber (MEG) Children"s village was reportedly started for good cause, but the activities of the missionaries with the orphan children exposed these unimaginay (unimaginable?) activities. This is taken seriously, because, the Indians are unnecessarily taught about, even courts forced to accept and thus, the society accepting such imposed sins.
(I can't follow the last sentence.)

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Sodomy Ring Bared in Puri</b>

The Telegraph, Wednesday , November 19 , 2008




<b>Puri: City of sin</b>

Bhubaneswar, Nov. 18: “I am staying with Joseph (a French tourist) for the past five years. He says that he will take me with him. I have sex with him regularly.” This is a candid confession of Raju (name changed), a 12-year-old boy who lives in Pentakata slum in Puri. “Initially it was painful and I used to cry. Now it’s a daily routine. He has sex with other children also. Sometimes he wants to have sex with each other,” says Raju. “I am waiting for the day when Joseph will take me with him and so I agree with whatever he does to me,” says the slum boy.

Raju was one of the 13 boys under the age group of 6-18 from Puri, who had been interviewed by Equations, a Bangalore-based organisation, which conducted case studies on male child sexual abuse in some pilgrim sites of the country. All the children explained poverty as one of the factors responsible for their situation, said S. Vidya, the programme coordinator of Equations. Most children found themselves helpless against the forces that determine their destiny, she added. They have sex with a wide range of tourists who pay Rs 50 to Rs 200 per day, said the report released here today. However, building relationship with the foreign tourists is more “profitable” than domestic tourists as the former provide toys, chocolates, cycles, nice dresses and sometimes money to renovate or build their houses, said the children covered under the study.

Male children are primarily in demand as the families believe that there is less risk. Girls selling sex bear social stigma and also run the risk of getting pregnant.  Most of the boys subjected to sexual abuse are from lower income group who earn between Rs 1,500 and Rs 2,000 per month and their earnings fall to less than Rs 300 during March-August. They indulge in sex trade to protect their mothers from entering into prostitution, as there is no other source of income, said Vidya. Domestic tourists often make contacts with children through pimps or hotels, while foreign tourists approach the children and their families directly and provide money for their daily needs. Foreign tourists also come into contact with children in the guise of “English teacher” or “social worker”, said the study report.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->(The same has long been going on in Vietnam, Thailand and other tourist places for christowesterns.)

When the international media criedloud about the so-called anti-christian riots etc., they do not discuss about this christian sin of sexual abuse of innocent Indian children, of course Hindu.

Why the hypocrisy? Had their intention be service, why they indulge in such sexual abuses, that too with innocent children?

While sexually abused male-children are pushed to corner to become anti-socials, the female-ones are forced to prostitution.

<b>Is it their plan to spoil India?

To make the city of God to city of sins, as the shameless Indian press itself declares so?

Actully, the sin is committed by the christians themselves here, as it could noted in the modus operandi.</b>

Making the innocent children happy with choclates or sweets and exploiting them could be possible only by such sinners!

And it is not a solitary instance and startlingly, there were many violations of such sexual abuses in Orissa towns by the foreigners.

The earlier 2000 case shows that conversion to Christianity was used as a tool to achieve their ends.

(The following was also there in an entry at christianaggression which was reposted here at IFSmile
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->On November 11, 2000 Indian police arrested David Berry, a 51 year old British national for brutally sodomizing and perpetrating savage sexual abuse on at least 11 minor Hindu boys in the holy temple town of Puri, Orissa. Berry was assisted in his heinous crimes by Bijoy Behera, a local schoolteacher and recent convert to Christianity.  The police were forced to arrest the two Christians following a complaint lodged by a victim"s father, Shree Banamali Senapati.

Initially despite his lodging of the complaint, the police dismissed the case and refused to arrest the perpetrators, but were forced to act when an angry mob from the town besieged them and threatened dire consequences if the guilty were not punished.  Shree Senapati was in tears as he related how Berry had sodomized his traumatized 12-year-old son at least eight times in his hotel room and elsewhere.

The boy related to the police that Berry had forced him to have oral sex and kept him a virtual prisoner in the hotel room for hours.  He also revealed that the Briton had sodomized at least 10 other school children, all below the ages of 12.  The children were so traumatized by Berry"s threats and Behera"s beatings that they did not dare to confess to the horrors visited upon them until young master Senapati could take no more and broke down to his father.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Thus, the psychology of such incidences point to organized sex abuse carried on under the guise of social work, relief-camps, “English-teaching" and so on exploiting the children by the Christians..

The enquiry reveals that they do not commit such abuses just as Paedophilia or sodomy but with intention.</b><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
From the comments:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->2.  yahwehfraud  Says:
Posted on November 24th, 2008
மிஷநரியின் காமவெறியை மறைக்கும் ஊடகங்கள்
<b>Christian missionary arrested for pedophilia in Orissa orphanage.
Secular media silent as Christian missionary arrested for raping
many Children in Orissa Christian orphanages</b>

From: Rediff News date: 15.11.08

An Australian Christian missionary working in an orphanage in
Puri was arrested on the charges of sexually assaulting children
of the home, police said on Friday.

The accused, identified as 46-year-old Paul Allen, was tracked
down to Andhra Pradesh following complaint by the orphanage
authorities and brought here yesterday, they said adding that he
was remanded to 14 days judicial custody by a local court.
The arrest was made on the basis of a complaint lodged with the
police station in Puri by Marry Ellen, founder of Mary Ellen
Berger which runs the orphanage on the outskirts of the town,
police said.

Quoting the complaint, the police said Christian missionary Paul
had been working in the orphanage since its inception in 2002.
Mary regularly visits orphanages run by the foundation in Orissa
as well as Andhra Pradesh on inspection,they said.

During a visit to Puri last month, she was told that Christian
missionary Paul had been indulging in pedophilia with the inmates
of the orphanage threatening to remove from the home, they said
adding that Christian missionary Paul was staying in a guest
house in the premises of the orphanage, housing 85 children,
including 45 girls.

After getting complaints from the inmates, aged between five and
18 years, Mary lodged a First Information Report following which
police registered a case against Christian missionary Paul for
sexual assault, harassment and abuse.

A team was then deputed to Andhra Pradesh to nab the accused
Christian missionary, who was also facing similar case in the
neighbouring state, police added. Christian missionary Paul and
some of the inmates were sent for a medical examination.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->3.  yahwehfraud  Says:
Posted on November 24th, 2008

பாதிரியின் பாலின வேட்டைக்கு பலியாகும் தமிழக சிறுவர்கள்
<b>Australian national accused of exploiting orphanage inmates in Orissa police net</b>

DN Singh

Puri, Nov 14: Fear and grief boiled over into anger when a mentor was caught while committing a crime never expected of him. An Australian national has been arrested by the police in Puri on the charges of sexual exploitation of the little inmates of an orphanage home in the holy-city.

Allegedly, the accused Dr. Poul Ellan has been doing it, with <b>about 40 children of the home, for last six months but it came to light on November 13 when the matter was somehow leaked to the warden of the orphanage.</b> On a complaint from the warden, the local police have arrested Dr. Poul Ellan.

It never occurred to anybody in the MEG foundation home in Puri that a monster in the garb of a doctor was out to exploit the children sexually as and when he wanted to. However, on October 10 last when the founder of this trust <b>Marry Ellen Gerber came back to Puri, she was informed by one of her staff that, Dr. Poul was a paedophile. Gerber was stunned but she quietly conducted the inquiry and she was shell shocked when she found the allegations to be true.</b>

Ellen informed the local police and lodged an FIR but by then the culprit had fled from the home.

Quoting the complaint, the police said Paul had been working in the orphanage since its inception in 2002. Mary regularly visits orphanages, run by the foundation in Orissa as well as Andhra Pradesh, on inspection, they said.

However, police spread its net and Poul was apprehended from the Mary Ellen Berger (MEG) trust located in Vishakhapatnam and brought to Puri. Police has registered a case under Section 376 under IPC and sent Poul to court.

Dr Poul Ellan was a part and parcel of this home which Marry Ellan had opened here in 2000 to look after the children rendered orphan in the Super cyclone that had struck Orissa on October 29. 1999.

Paul was staying in a guest house in the premises of the orphanage, housing 85 children, including 45 girls.

A doctor by discipline, 60 year old Poul Ellan was associated with this trust which has its branches in India and abroad as well. <b>Besides Puri, MEG has its presence in Vishakhapatnam and Pondicherry where orphans are taken care of. Poul’s act of paedophilia was not only limited to Puri but he was doing the same things in the MEG homes in Vishakhapatnam & Pondichery. In total, he had preyed on 40 inmates of the three homes</b> for his beastly libido.

Paul and some of the inmates were sent for medical examination.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->4.  Ezhavendan  Says:
Posted on November 24th, 2008

<b>This fact is not going to be publicized, as the Indian media aided and abetted by the christian missionaries blackout.</b>

Even if it is publicized and the international good thinking people condemn such child-abuse, sex-torture etc., <b>the pope would only apologize.

But such apology would resore the honour of the girls rapped and boys tortured by the christian missionaries?</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->(Don't know that the MEG org and Paul Allen are catholics, so the pope may not feel involved.)
The following additionally shows that the ATTF is - like the NLFT - another christian terrorist organisation. And the ATTF stands for: All Tripura <b>Tiger</b> Force, not to be confused with the OTHER christoterrorist "Tiger" organisation called LTTE (Liberation <b>Tiger</b>s of Tamil Eelam or something, shortened to Tamil <b>Tiger</b>s) in Sri Lanka.

An event from some years back.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Christian Terrorists Massacre Eight Hindu Civilians in India</b>

Posted September 27, 2005
September 25, 2005
Brindabanghat village, Tripura state, India
Sources: BBC, Rediff, The Telegraph, Newindpress.com

A hysterical Sabita Debnath, a 14 year-old girl, slams her head repeatedly against the wall of her mud-built house and cries she does not live any more.

Sabita has been made an orphan in a matter of minutes as Christian terrorists of the National Liberation Front of Tripura (NLFT) gunned down and wiped all other members of her Hindu family in a matter of minutes and her sob reverberates across this sleepy village of West Tripura district.

�I do not want to live any more because my entire family was wiped out today. There is nobody to look after me", she scarcely puts in her words together to a team of visiting journalists. This picturesque Hindu village in West Tripura district turned into a killing field as the Christian insurgents trained their guns on the hapless Hindu inhabitants in the wee hours on Sunday.

�The terrorists entered our house at around 2 AM by breaking open the wooden door with sophisticated arms and gunned down my father before my eyes,� she sobs inconsolably. �I hid myself under a cot. My two younger brothers - Aurobindo (4) and Amar Chan (8) who woke up at the sound of firing were the next causalities. The attackers then turned to my mother (Niva) and shot her dead too.

�I saw my family wiped off in just about five minutes. Probably they missed me because I was hiding under the cot,� she says. Altogether, eight Hindus, including four women and two children, were killed in the attack. <b>The ultras did not spare even 102-year-old Premanandamoyee.</b>

The eight Hindu civilians who were killed in the attack were Amulya Debnath, Amar Chan Debnath (8), Aurobindo Debnath (4), Nirodh Debnath, Fulkumari Debnath, Niva Debnath, Chapala Debnath and Premanandamoyee Debnath (102).

Police say the terrorists dragged several Hindu men from their homes before shooting them.

In another dangerous development, two of the state most feared <span style='color:red'>Christian terrorist organizations, the National Liberation Front of Tripura (NLFT) and the All Tripura Tiger Force (ATTF) have joined hands and have agreed to conduct 'joint operations' against Hindu civilians and the Indian government.</span>

Till 2003, the two outfits were sworn enemies and often fought pitched battles to extend or preserve their hegemony in the hilly areas of the state. But a series of surrenders and desertions by a large number of lay cadre as well as top commanders have led to major depletion in the ranks of both groups.

After a secret meeting, the leaders of the two violent groups, including Ranjit Debbarma of the ATTF and Biswamohan Debbarma of the NLFT, reached an understanding last month over joint operations.

Sources in the Special Branch (intelligence wing), of the Tripura state police, said the terrorists� failure to strike hard on Indian security forces and Hindu civilians on August 15, when they had called a boycott of the Indian Independence Day, induced a rethink on the part of the leaders of the groups.

Sources said in order to make their presence felt, the ATTF and the NLFT have also reached an understanding with another terror group, the Kamtapur Liberation Organisation (KLO). �In Tripura, the ATTF and the NLFT are preparing to launch joint operations with the KLO in the run-up to October 15 which they propose to observe as a �black day�. However, the nature and implication of their understanding with the KLO is still not clear,� sources said.

The armed cadre of the Christian outfits, who have already infiltrated some of the interior areas of the state after crossing over from Bangladesh, have launched their decades-old terror campaign against Hindus in Tripura, both tribals and plainspeople.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

the following's from the comment section of a Youtube video link recently posted by Dhu.
It's from a person claiming to be 'Hindu' (with what looks more like a christian/western userhandle) doing christian apologetics, while feeling no such compunctions in arguing that christianists' ideological and behavioural brethren the islamics must be deported from India.

(The video is about who owns media in India)
Saudis and muslims need to take a hike. They should not own any companies or share profits from major corporations. However, we dont want to alienate ourselves from everyone. Yes, Christians have their own agenda, but I would rather ensure that muslims get the hell out of India first before starting with anyone else. Christians have had some positive contributions to communities, <!--emo&:o--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/ohmy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='ohmy.gif' /><!--endemo--> and I am Hindu, and I dont want to randomly hurt christians.
(What does that mean? <!--emo&:blink:--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blink.gif' /><!--endemo--> That he wants to randomly hurt muslims?)<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh, I see. So, compared to the muslims, who are solely to be universally condemned for genocidal mania, christians are benign. Yes, this is very much obvious from the previous post and this one: christian paedophilia besetting Hindu children, christian terrorists targeting Hindu families for massacre in the christian crusade=islamic jihad.
Clearly, islamism and christianism are entirely different things. Because on one hand there is genocide of Dharmics and on the other hand there is genocide of Dharmics.
Two <i>very</i> different consequences.

I mean, compare the death and refugee toll of the modern islamic jihad on Bharatam (say Kashmir) with the following from Yahoo News from 2nd October 2004. To any psecular, the difference is immediately apparent:
(The news item has expired at the link. But copies are at christian aggression, Stephen Knapp's site, conversionagenda blogspot )
"Christian Terrorists kill 44, Wound 118 in Attacks in Northeast India"
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->"The armed insurgency in Nagaland began soon after the much of the local population converted to Christianity. Many militant groups, seeking to secede from India to form an independent Christian state, are funded and armed by the Southern Baptist Church. Some of the groups such as the NLFT have been involved in a campaign of gunpoint conversions and ethnic cleansing of native non-Christians, which has left over <span style='color:red'>50,000 dead and many more refugees over the past two decades.</span>"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->That's "50,000 dead and many more refugees" DUE TO CHRISTIANISM in just this region in just the 20 years between 1984 and 2004 alone. That doesn't even include the massacre of Sabita Debnath's family and others mentioned above, which happened in 2005, or the victims of christian terrorism since. Or Hindu victims of christianism outside the region in question.

And about the refugees:
<b>Assam: Christian Conversions Behind Killing of 87 Hindus and</b> <span style='color:red'>50,000 Refugees</span> October 21, 2005

In 2003, the Hindu refugees who'd fled the christian terrorism in their Mizoram were at 45,000 and lodged in Tripura and Assam:
<b>Bomb attack by Christian terrorists to scare away Hindu Bru (Reang) tribal voters in Mizoram</b> November 20, 2003
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Large-scale conversions triggered a systematic ethnic cleansing campaign sponsored by the Church which lead to migration of Reangs and Brus from Mizoram to Tripura and Assam, who have since been languishing in different make-shift camps and demanding safe return and rehabilitation to their ancestral homeland. More shocking is that the refugees were also deprived of their voting rights in the last November Assembly elections in Mizoram. There are now 45,000 refugees in the two states - about 36,000 in Tripura and another 9,000 in Assam. They are uncertain of returning to their ancestral land and their only hope now seems to rest on the Centre to resolve the problem.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And as seen in the handful of links pasted just in this one post, neither Tripura nor Assam are safe from christian terrorism either.
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Apr 12 2009, 12:59 PM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Apr 12 2009, 12:59 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->I stand corrected.
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Shamu wrote:</b> Just to set facts straight. A K Antony was Kerala CM. CM of Karnataka must have been SM Krishna, a Hindu. Classic example of Hindus subjugating other Hindus for personal gains.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->I did first search IF for AK Anthony (since I'd remembered posting something from elsewhere that mentioned Anthony and Karnataka) and found the post:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Karnataka is virtually controlled by AK Anthony, whose secretaries are all from the Southern Christian association. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Guess I wrongly assumed that since AK Anthony was said to have controlled Karnataka, it meant he was therefore the CM of Karnataka (until then I had thought he had been lording it over Kerala). Apparently the person at Sulekha meant he was doing long-distance meddling?
The thing many people outside of Kerala is not aware of is that A K Antony has a very clean image, is not corrupt, and has refused to use his official power for personal gains. I have heard many times that church in Kerala prefers Hindu Karunakaran as CM over Antony because they could extract maximum concessions from Karunakaran, rather than from Antony. When Antony was Kerala CM, he had visited Matha Amritanandamayi's ashram and had said something like he gets more peace when he visits Ammachi, and many church members were unhappy about that.

One thing that is negative about him is that he is not capable to making strong position. This indicates there is no guarantee that his assistants or subordinates are clean. I have not analyzed if church uses his clean image to present one image and do somethng behind him.
An acquaintance who just took a medieval history course at a local junior college was quoted to me as saying something to the effect that "Anyone who knows anything about medieval history could never be a Christian." At least since Edward Gibbon's "Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire", it has been fashionable to trash Christianity in general and Catholicism in particular, blaming Christianity for every imaginable evil in the modern world.

While Christians have done their share of evil during history, Christianity (and Catholicism in particular) has done more than its share of good. In high school and college I learned that Greco-Roman Culture served as the cornerstone of Western Civilization, with the Jewish cult of Christianity serving as a religious veneer. Rodney Stark, in a trilogy of well researched, well reasoned books, turns that idea on its head. Christianity is the cornerstone of Western Civilization and Greco-Roman Culture is the veneer.

"The Victory of Reason" is the third in a series of books studying the influence of Christianity on Western Civilization, the first two being "For the Glory of God" and "One True God." Each of these books looks at different aspects of Western Civilization to determine how they were influenced by Christian theology. How were they influenced? Profoundly!

"The Victory of Reason" looks at the concepts of freedom and capitalism, and how they were natural outgrowths of both Christian theology and favorable economic conditions. Along they way, Stark makes some iconoclastic statements and backs them up with sound argument. e.g. The fall of the Roman Empire was a good thing. The Dark Ages were more progressive and enlightened than the Classical World.

Taken together, "The Victory of Reason," "For the Glory of God," and "One True God" make a very strong case for the proposition that were it not for Christianity (particularly the Catholic Church), we'd probably still be living in a pre-industrial, pre-scientific world dependent in large measure on slave labor.

Stark acknowledges the evil done in the name of religion, but unlike some of his fellow academics, he does not ignore the good. For a similar treatment of the influence of Christianity on Western Civilization, read Thomas Woods' "How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization."


In an essay that recently appeared in the Chronicle of Higher Education, author Rodney Stark explained the thesis of his book "The Victory of Reason" this way:

"A series of developments, in which reason won the day, gave unique shape to Western culture and institutions. And the most important of those victories occurred within Christianity. While the other world religions emphasized mystery and intuition, Christianity alone embraced reason and logic as the primary guides to religious truth. Christian faith in reason was influenced by Greek philosophy. But the more important fact is that Greek philosophy had little impact on Greek religions. Those remained typical mystery cults, in which ambiguity and logical contradictions were taken as hallmarks of sacred origins. Similar assumptions concerning the fundamental inexplicability of the gods and the intellectual superiority of introspection dominated all of the other major world religions."

Other reviewers, seemingly bogged down in the particulars of precisely when a "reason-friendly" breakthrough occurred, are missing the point; Christianity, specifically the Christianity long-protected by the Catholic Church, built the arena in which "the victory of reason" could take place. It *always* did. Like all things Catholic, this victory or development flowered over centuries, with collections of blooms gathering here and there to prove the point, e.g., the capitalistic and Catholic cities of twelfth and thirteenth century Northern Italy.

Stark's book continues a growing line of historical correction whose pace has accelerated in recent years. Michael Novak debunked Max Weber's unsupported "Protestant ethic" almost twenty years ago, while authors Thomas Woods ("How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization") and, just recently, Michael Foley ("Why Do Catholics Eat Fish on Friday?") have offered worthwhile contributions in recent months. May the trend continue.

Readers seeking a copy of Stark's Chronicles essay should perform a Google search of the words "How Christianity Led to Freedom, Capitalism, and the Success of the West".
<!--QuoteBegin-shamu+Apr 12 2009, 11:03 PM-->QUOTE(shamu @ Apr 12 2009, 11:03 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->The thing many people outside of Kerala is not aware of is that A K Antony has a very clean image, is not corrupt, and has refused to use his official power for personal gains. I have heard many times that church in Kerala prefers Hindu Karunakaran as CM over Antony because they could extract maximum concessions from Karunakaran, rather than from Antony. When Antony was Kerala CM, he had visited Matha Amritanandamayi's ashram and had said something like he gets more peace when he visits Ammachi, and many church members were unhappy about that.

One thing that is negative about him is that he is not capable to making strong position. This indicates there is no guarantee that his assistants or subordinates are clean. I have not analyzed if church uses his clean image to present one image and do somethng behind him.[right][snapback]96361[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->I just did a better search on him and the following sorts of things came up and support what you say:

1. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2005/12/fro...orest-loot.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Anonymous said...

    Toney Christist, you got nicely caught in that trap I set. I expected you to say exactly this and its ROTFLMAO time.

    So you Christists will take care of Chandy and Mani? How, by pouring Manorama and Muthoot money into getting them nice cushy jobs?

    But you Christists got rid of <b>AK Anthony. He is the only good Christist in Kerala, probably because he is an atheist.</b> You guys got rid of him, because he said "The minorities in Kerala have abused the system and become rich." This is the gospel truth. So you got rid of him.

    But the Hindus did get rid of the villian Karunakaran as promised. He is without a job, and so are his beloved son and daughter.

    Just goes to show, Toney Christist, that if there is a good person, you crucify him. Isn't that what you claim to have done to Jesus himself?
    12/09/2005 9:27 AM<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->A truly secular irreligious politician is naturally to be preferred to corrupt Hindu ones (goes without saying that such a politician would be preferable to subversive christian ones). Of course such a person's choice of associates would matter as well, and the degree to which (s)he - and not less secular others - are in charge.

2. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2006/10/uig...ression-of.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Ghost Writer said...

    @ drisyadrisya
    <i>A K Anthony as Defence Minister.. what do u think,...</i>
    <b>Anthony is much better than the Commies that Kerala now has</b> - and he certainly has a carefully cultivated 'Honest Man' image - but I can't help thinking- the last time we had a Keralite in the Defence Ministry - the Chinese whipped our ass! ......
    10/25/2006 4:54 PM<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just to clarify, the following statement was not written by sulekha's "arkabala" but was Francois Gautier's original statement which arkabala reposted:

Karnataka is virtually controlled by AK Anthony, whose secretaries are all from the Southern Christian association.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Christian America shrinking and expanding at the same time

Huddled with a half dozen little kids, Ken Miller Rieman, the young pastor at Olympic View Community Church of the Brethren, sat cross-legged on the floor in the sanctuary on Easter morning. With the adults of the north Seattle congregation looking on, he was attempting to introduce the little ones to the message of Christianity's most holy day.

Rieman asked them what Easter was all about. Eggs and candy came the answer. He talked about new life. The children talked about rabbits. Ever patient, the pastor pressed on.

"What do the eggs represent?" Rieman asked.

An older boy finally connected. "New life," he said. At which point a younger boy chimed in, "Or you can just eat 'em."

Passing along religious traditions is no simple task, especially when the competition from an increasingly alluring secular world (candy and bunnies are just the beginning) is so overwhelming and when so many of us are finding it quite easy to live a perfectly decent life without any religion at all. Just this past week, questions were being raised about whether America's traditional Christian identity is slipping away. The debate was kicked off in a Newsweek story bannered by a stark red and black cover with this provocative headline: The Decline and Fall of Christian America. The article, written by Jon Meacham, was inspired by fresh statistics on the religious affiliations of Americans:

According to the American Religious Identification Survey... the percentage of self-identified Christians has fallen 10 percentage points since 1990, from 86 to 76 percent. The Jewish population is 1.2 percent; the Muslim, 0.6 percent. A separate Pew Forum poll echoed the ARIS finding, reporting that the percentage of people who say they are unaffiliated with any particular faith has doubled in recent years, to 16 percent; in terms of voting, this group grew from 5 percent in 1988 to 12 percent in 2008--roughly the same percentage of the electorate as African-Americans. (Seventy-five percent of unaffiliated voters chose Barack Obama, a Christian.) Meanwhile, the number of people willing to describe themselves as atheist or agnostic has increased about fourfold from 1990 to 2009, from 1 million to about 3.6 million. (That is about double the number of, say, Episcopalians in the United States.)

The stats show that the Pacific Northwest, long the most un-churched section of the country, must now share that distinction with the Northeast where, four centuries ago, the Puritans brought their rigorous religion to a New World. According to Meacham, all these numbers have caused some Christian conservatives to worry and wonder if America will soon be like Europe, a place where believers are a shrinking minority and churches are historic relics filled only by gawking tourists.

Humans created gods to fulfill a need as psychologically deep as the need for shelter from the elements, fire to ward off the cold and dark of night, and a dog at the hearth to share a commonality in perspective. Humans gave their gods forms, personalities, purposes, and even ascribed to them directions and decrees for human order and behavior. The gods were not only were in control of the universe, they took personal interest in the outcome of human lives.

I commiserate completely with my fellow humans and their fearful requirement for the presence of gods in their life views. I simply hold truth to be more valuable than comfort. The theist position is irrational and, more often than not, nonsensical. There is nothing reasonable about a position that postulates the existence of gods, with no other foundation for the belief than the pitiful fact that so many other humans have shared the sentiment for so long. Gods, unicorns, and magic frogs cannot fill the gaps of knowledge where only ignorance abides. To ignore ignorance is to perpetuate ignorance.
<span style='color:red'>
Truth will gradually erode Christianity and all other superstition away.
Drink up, people! Truth is bitter but more easily swallowed than lies.

~ Ghoulslime
FWIW, the whole easter eggs / chicks & bunnies are not originally from the Christian Easter Holiday but in fact refer to Pagan Spring Equinox traditions that predate Christianity by hundreds if not thousands of years. The same can be said about Christmas (Evergreen) Trees or Mistletoe and Holly which were used in Winter Soltice Fertility Rites

Evangelistic Christianity is a pox upon your religion, and it is harmful. Zealots rightly inspire hatred and mistrust.

<img src='http://www.seattlepi.com/dayart/20090413/cartoon20090413.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Is secularism dead? An Andhra Pradesh CaseSheet</b>
Posted February 18, 2009
Samavedam Shanmukha Sarma
19 February, 2009

Source Link

The message was loud and clear, "To realize our dream of making every house � a Christian home in the state, we have to vote for a particular party". Thus spoke Pamphlets, during last elections in Andhra Pradesh. They were silently distributed at many places to certain communities.
Developing into a Christian State:

Four and half years past, their vision had come true. Today, Andhra Pradesh is a developing state, yes, certainly developing into a Christian State. It is good, if Christians prosper, but it is atrocious, if the so called development is at the cost of demoting Hindus-by decoying them through power traps and other means; demeaning Hindu sentiments and making every effort to, "Convert" them by augmenting the communal numbers of "their" so called community alone. Can you call this as, "Development"?

Why do our intellectuals and countrymen become blind to this blatant and brazen "crossing" of the State - throwing aside its secular vigor? Is this not the height of fanatical arrogance?

Came Christmas 2007 !, Whole world had sliced down its Christmas budget because of economic slowdown , yet in Andhra Pradesh , huge advertisements appeared on behalf the government-detailing millions and millions of funds ,being spent for the betterment, progress and prosperity of Christian community alone. It is an unabashed campaign stuffed with haughtiness and conceit. The surpluses showered therein shall certainly make the Santa Claus awestruck. Please do not forget views of François Gautier, (the renowned columnist � Indian express), how in this country important positions of important institutions are being "Christened" with their people.

Are they not building cemetery to the secularism in this country, by their shameless acts? Or is it our fault that we are not realizing that we are being ruled by communal forces? Have we become impotent and indifferent to their open declarations? Or are we tolerating and accumulating all Insults? What is happening?

In the name and disguise of "minority protection", their dreams are being realized by working for the welfare of "their" people through "their" government. Is this situation acceptable to democracy, if it becomes for "their" people and by "their" people, when all people voted for them to come to power.
(Why do Hindus incredibly expect christianism to be reasonable and look after the welfare of all? When christianism/islamism is in power, secularism is dead. Hindus can whine and point to secular values - like the Romans pointed to edicts of toleration - but it's More Fool You if Hindus won't actually take the trouble to learn about and understand what they have allowed into power.)

Christianized governance is making a demonic dance in the entire state of Andhra Pradesh, insulting Hindu sentiments and values.

<b>Rulers' Hypocrisy and Their Evangelic Relatives:</b>

By making political visits to the Hindu Temples and thus troubling the thousands of ardent Hindu devotees during their visits and simultaneously grabbing every opportunity to adore their shining bald heads with Muslim caps - these imposters and hypocrites are making a mockery of secularism, when their cajolers and cronies including intellectuals waste no time in singing welcome songs to them and are offering a grand red carpet reception with ritualistic pompousness.

During December 2007, even the gleeful posters of a preacher - "ruler's" most near and dear relative, aided by political funds and support, adored every nook and corner of the State, calling a clarion Christian call. Hindu name with a brother prefix, wishing a Christmas greeting, aiming for conversion, a face that had even wiped away the Jesus Christ photograph in these posters and banners became ubiquitous in their presence, through out the state displaying the rulers' superciliousness and their disdain for secular values.

In some cities, the radius of its spread is up to ten kilometers; on every electric pole and on every tree, the message was displayed blatantly as "Jesus the only savior" (without Jesus Christ's Photo). What does this mean? What should be tolerance level for other religious faiths of state for this kind of propaganda?

Why, are we not reacting ?, Why are we not protesting, to this crystal clear message from the rulers of Andhra Pradesh, that it is their "CE"- Christian era and others are just subjects and have to fall in line with them.

<b>Majority Community's Funds being diverted for Christian Subsidies :</b>

It is Majority community's exchequer that is being used to dole out subsidies to the Christian minority and allocate funds to build churches. Millions and millions of rupees are being spent from government treasury and even bonanzas and packages are being promised for this so called "Nobel - Gobel cause", by tempting and ensnaring gullible people into conversion trap. The politics of religious number game is multiplying at the speed of light in Andhra Pradesh.

The Government subsidies to this particular religious community are something like adding fuel to the burning fire. Earlier missionaries spent only foreign funds for conversion. Today the government fund at their disposal is making their task easier.

Why people are not realizing that offering special incentives to a single religious community alone by the government tantamount to religious fundamentalism?. Is it ruler's dad's property to give out doles like this?

Government of Andhra Pradesh is spending millions of rupees and is sending Christians to visit Jerusalem. Have we vanquished Poverty to offer such communal sops? The government advertisements project it as a bold initiative being taken in the country for the first time. God save us, which country in the world can really take this drastically daring step? What moral right this government has to call it self as a secular government, if it is communalizing the state in the name of minority pampering.

In spite of having a Hindu name and caste suffix, the rulers continue to practice Christian Faith and Doctrines, none to question them. <b>Shall the Jesus Christ, the personification of truth, pardon them?</b> Our leaders like Swami Vivekananda, Mahatma Gandhi and Dr. Ambedkar had univocally condemned the religious conversions and had foretold that they are dangerous to nation's peace and progress.
(Hindus insist on remaining ignorant. Sigh. How IS it that Hindus keep making room for jeebus and christianism and expecting christianism to drop all proselytisation. That is impossible. It is the commandment of the babble's NT. And it is even there in the very 1st commandment of the OT. Hindu naivete and willful ignorance is beyond belief.)

<b>According to certain biblical texts, Jesus Christ had even warned his disciples not to go towards east and not to resort to religious conversions.</b> Though it is evident that is a clear ploy of westerners to rule India through religion, yet the majority community of this land are becoming mute spectators and stooges in their gambit.
(And none of those are canonical. There's no point appealing to texts not officially recognised as having divine sanction in christianism.)

<b>If the government pronounces that, it is their solemn duty to safeguard Christian's property, what else can be said about this brazen utterance? Is it not the secular government's duty to protect every Indian's property, not just the Christian properties? Then what intentions prompt the government to make such appalling statements?</b>
(Oh look! It's one of the anti-pagan, pro-christian laws that was also implemented in Rome. More proof that christianism will NEVER change. Hindus can keep pointing to psecularism and jeebus' "true" teachings (as if Hindus would know) until they turn blue in the face or christianism wipes them out.)

<b>Jerusalem Trip Bonanzas:</b>

Is any government worth its name in any foreign country, is offering to its minority community, the tax payers' money, to visit their holy land situated in other countries? Why then does the government encourage this communal tourism to foreign countries? Are the churches in this country are becoming less <b>holy</b> and attractive? What message goes to the Christian converts living in this country? Is it not silently telling them that their religious roots do lie not in this country but in the foreign lands?
(Hindus are confused if they imagine that churches have the same meaning to christians as Temples do to Hindus.)

<b>Hindu religious places are situated in this country and it implies that this country belongs to Hindus. This remains to be the eternal truth, in spite of painting the land with many pseudo secular colours.</b>
(Finally, something I agree with.)

Does this government offer any sops to Hindu pilgrimages? Which government in this country is offering subsidies to Hindus for their pilgrimage to "Manasasarovar", situated in China? Leave aside these subsidies and grants, during Hindu festivals, the state owned Transport Corporation hikes the bus ticket charges to holy places situated in the state of Andhra Pradesh-special buses with special fares and poor Hindus pay them all.

This kind of discrimination by the government only confirms their hidden agenda to frustrate the majority community mindset and to lure them to claim minority status for sops.

Not a single political party in the state raises its voice against this injustice being meted out to the majority community. Vote bank politics make the opposition to offer more promises to the minorities and seek the vote shamelessly.

<b>Where is Secularism Today ?</b>

So it is crystal clear that majority community is at the receiving end of deprivation and discrimination. The more the parties try to lure minorities, all the more the majority community of this so called secular country is being denied of its basic rights.

Everyone in this country has equal rights and should live harmoniously with others. But our opposition is towards the policy of political parties which try to divide the majority and offer sops to minority for sake of holding the power.

We respect Jesus Christ and the holy Bible. Hindus are culturally tuned in their minds to accept Bible as a sacred text of Dharma Sastra. Living harmoniously with other religions is the very nature of Hindus. But this goodness is being viewed as its weakness and is being exploited for converting the whole Hindu community into Christianity. How long do these treacherous game plans have to be tolerated by the Hindus? Even the iota of the Humanistic principles cannot advocate this kind of exploitation for achieving numerical supremacy.

India is the land of Hindus for Eternity. The invaders of this country had established their respective religions by forcefully converting the people of this country by luring them with money and position and threatening them with sword. Yet the majority community had accepted the converted minority and is living peacefully with them, unlike many other countries. We all had become Indian citizens. We all had accepted secularism and secular values.
(Why? Why should we become psecular and accommodate terrorist ideologies that only keep repeating they will never co-exist - and only modify their tune somewhat whenever they attack us and are afraid of a reprisal.)

We cannot change our parents. Nobody wants to change his mother and father. Similarly about the religion one is born into. It is our righteousness rather ethical responsibility to adhere to the religious path in which we are born in.
(Person is repeating the idea of Natural Traditions. Christoislamism, like communism,  is an ideology - a meme in fact. It is MOST DEFINITELY meant to be transferrable. And it most certainly wants the right to transfer onto those following Natural Traditions so it can infect them and so that they will then continue to pass it on to others.
It is not enough for Hindus to know their own traditions, their own way of life. The situation is such that they must study their enemy: the parasitic meme, the terrorist ideology of christoislamicommunism. Only then will Hindus be able to consider formulating the right course of action with respect to the meme.)

In the countries like America and England, people of all religions are living together. There, we don't find government offering special sops to minorities. Here at India, politicians create a fear complex about the safety of minorities only to plunder the votes of minorities. It is high time, that all the citizens representing all religious communities of this country should come forward and teach a befitting lesson to these power grabbers who divide the country on the communal lines in name of secularism. But, will that happen in this country? Poor citizens are getting trapped into sops being offered by the politicians and are not in a position to resist them and are in fact "parasite-ing" on them.

<b>What is the Future of Tomorrow's Hindu Minority ?</b>

If the situation continues like this where shall Hindus migrate? How long should they tolerate and compromise? Hindu Temples were destroyed in the past, yet they tolerated every drastic act. Their mothers, sisters and wives were raped before their very eyes, yet they kept quiet. Their kith and kin's heads were hacked and chopped, yet they uttered not a word. Their religion was suppressed in everyway, yet they endured. Hindus were not free citizens at that time, when these acrostics were heaped on them.

Today, being the citizens of Sovereign, Socialist, Secular and Democratic Republic, are we to accept and sit stoic to the same kind of treatment being meted by today's rulers? Do our thick skinned bodies and our karmic mindsets, which blame everything on destiny and Kaliyuga's pollution, make us live an enslaved life again?

Your future is at stake,. The day is not far away, when Hindus of this country become a minority. On that day, no separate ministries shall be carved out for minority welfare; no vote bank political sops and promises to make you grow; no special subsides; no special protection for your temples; every moment of your life shall become full with fear and threat from other religious bigots.

If you keep quiet today, your tomorrow is a big hell. If you tolerate these selfish politicians today, tomorrow our children shall be left with bleak and dreadful future.
(If Hindus realise this much, then why are they still PR-ing for jeebus? I don't understand. Every bit of positivity or even neutrality given by Hindus to that "artifice for aggression" is another strike on behalf of the terrorist meme. You can't change an ideology whose fundamental tenet is intolerance. Hindus ought to stop deluding themselves.)

<b>Today's Convert is Tomorrow's Enemy:</b>

In a village, the organizers of a Rama Temple lamented that "In the past, when we organize a procession of Lord's Idols for Sri Rama Navami Celebrations, every house and every street used to participate in the festival. Today, we don't see the same people turning up in the same streets. If we volunteer ourselves to their houses and inform them to come and receive the Prasad, they indifferently reply to us that they got converted and cannot take the Prasad."

Yesterday's devotees are today's enemies. How to tackle this kind of situation? What should we do now? What can we do, expect cursing, crying and howling?

Christian festivals are celebrated in month of December all over the world. But in India, they happen with every throw of a cap- no timing and no logic. Very evangelistic preacher invents a new timing and a Christian festival is celebrated. These festivals are fabricated to be on par with Hindu festivals, be it Sankranti, Sivarathri or Navaratri. The invented Christian festivals happen at the proximity of famous Hindu temples in name of "Krupa Festival", "Daya Festival", " Health Festivals "and grand conversions happen.
(Same as in Rome. That's what you get with a christian=terrorist in charge.)

Now these programs have taken a new avatar, imitating horror serials like "Mystry after death", "Death takes you to grave or hell".

Conversions or religious propagation, what exactly is happening and what is the truth? There is a sea of difference between preaching religion and baiting conversions. <b>All these days, the knife of conversion was smeared with words of honey like Love, Peace and Service. But today, we hear aggressive slogans like "yahovah shall fight"; "we want, economic, social and political rights", being uttered by Christian fronts.</b>

<b>Hindus!, Arise!,Awake! :</b>

How can one religion enjoy special status and special rights in a secular country? How far is it legal and ethical if one religion resolves that it should rule and subdue others in a democracy?

"This is Hindu country and Hindus alone should rule". Have we ever heard such kind of words uttered in India? Don't we deserve a ruler who is above communal mindset? When shall we have a polity that gives equal status to every religious community without pampering minorities?
(I'd say even the time for that is over. Dharmic goal should be to reduce the spread of christoislamism through education. The poison must not only be prevented from spreading, its trend must also be reversed until the stain disappears entirely and the affected populace is safe again. And with that, the unconverted populace can be safe again as well.)

Whether, Christians or Muslims, they had enjoyed their hay days, during foreign rule in the past. They were never subjected to sorrow in their past. Why then, they require special status on the basis of religion today? Is idiocy and ignorance overpowering Hindus that they deter from answering the hypocritical zealots? Do they fear the terror mongers and their bosses in neighboring countries?

Religion is a matter of faith, it is a not a political ideology. Why is support required from the government to make a person follow his faith sincerely? Why then governments declare sops and subsidies based on the religion? What does it means if Government proclaims, that "Government supports all Christians in the state in every way". Can the gesture of the government be interpreted as the open support to religious conversion that is happening at alarming levels for the past four years?

Recently, an opposition leader in the state was exhorting people to revolt against the rulers, as the government was grabbing the lands of poor and was distributing them to the most favored industrialists. Can Hindus take clue from it and revolt, applying the same logic to themselves?

Hindus!, Arise!,Awake!, No foreign country in world comes to your rescue, when matters go worse and your human rights become denied. Yet, even to a small discomfort to minorities in this country, the whole world becomes hyped with words of injustice being done to the minorities and human rights violation.

These are the heart burns expressed with concern, yet there can be certain political minds which give saffron coloring to the above words. This voice remains independent of political sides and tunes. This expression has nothing to do with any Political Parties and Parivars. As a true inheritor of this country's Hindu heritage and legacy ,every letter of the every word , had evolved and shaped from the depths of the Heart, which is eternally soaked in Hindu dharma.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Hindus need to fight for their right to exist. Like survival, the competition between memes is a war too, it is a struggle of ideas. If people don't put up resistance to belligerent ideologies - proper resistance, mind, not that of preaching more psecularism and accommodation and pleading with grand futility for an end to conversions - they Lose by default and then they can cry all they want but Game Over. Permanently.

Christoislamicommunism will NEVER accommodate other ways of life, never allow coexistence. It is their very intention, in their very nature, to seek-and-destroy all ways of life that are not the same. If Hindus would only try to realise this, they will stop having impossible expectations of the terrorist ideology and stop putting up with it. Then they can start thinking about how to prevent christianism from EVER getting into power - because once it's in power for long enough, then Too Late. And start thinking of methods to reduce the spread of the christian meme: i.e. ways of encouraging deconversion and reversion to one of the Dharmic traditions.

Instead of considering this path, Hindus forever-and-a-day are still stuck on accepting the status quo: that we 'have to' (for some mystical reason) continue to coexist with the terrorist ideologies. But when those ideologies <i>will</i> not allow for coexistence (because they cannot: non-coexistence IS christoislamism), then it makes any relationship impossible - i.e. there is no such thing as One-Way Co-existence. Hence Hindus can stop trying too, stop wasting time. Stop dreaming. Reality is ugly, unpleasant, downright horrid. Need to accept that, and then think how to change the situation, instead of repeatedly coming to terms with the next blow dealt by christoislamicommunism. As I see it, this pathetic and utterly ineffective 'battle' tactic of Rolling Over that Hindus have been using on the terrorist meme has only been acceding more ground to it. Hindus will have only themselves to blame if they won't realise and face the ground truths about christoislamicommunism.

Conversion’ rankles here

Sidharth Mishra | Ranchi

The only concession that the Naxals allowed during Sunday’s bandh call was the Easter congregation in churches, which exist in the Jharkhand countryside in large numbers. From huge crowds outside the Ranchi Club to gatherings around smaller prayer houses in the countryside, the mood is celebratory. The day Jesus came back to life, is also the day of awakening in poll season.

The Congress candidate from Lohardagga, Union Minister for Tribal Affairs Rameshwar Oraon, cannot let the opportunity slip by. He ensured that local newspapers here on Sunday carried his statement that local Bishop Cardinal Thelspore Toppo has not extended support to his independent rival Chamra Linda. A statement on Toppo’s letterhead supporting Linda has been doing rounds in the countryside, putting the Congress candidate in a fix.

Today, the Congress survival is totally dependent on support from tribal Christians. Toppo’s certificate to Madhu Koda that he was a gentleman ensured that the Independent-led UPA Government survived for more than a year despite the Congress incharge of the State Ajay Maken crying foul and recommending every fortnight to the party high command that support to the Government be withdrawn.

Toppo, though never directly, often makes it clear where his preferences lie. Or let’s put it this way: He never minces words in his addresses about the harassment of Christians at the hands of RSS cadre, who too are present now in large numbers through organisations like Vikas Bharati and Bharatiya Vanvasi Parishad.

In seeking the blessings of the proselytising missionaries, the Congress has handed over its legacy of fighting conversions to the RSS. This has allowed spread of influence of the Hinduvta forces among non-Christian tribals.

The movement for resisting conversion was started by Congress veteran Kartik Oraon. He even persuaded his party to bring a Bill in Parliament to counter the influence of missionaries by withdrawing benefits of Scheduled Tribes from tribal Christians. But he did not live long. He was a three-term MP and his wife Sumati made it to the LS for two terms. From him, the mantle to counter missionaries fell on Lalit Oraon, who became the first tribal MP from Jharkhand to represent the BJP. Lalit’s victory showed a definite trend in the BJP network shifting to the countryside.

Kartik Oraon was no fundamentalist. Born in a tribal family but possessing extra-ordinary intellect, he completed his Bachelor’s degree from the Patna College of Engineering around the time of Independence. He went to England for higher education and came back with a deep understanding of the Christian interests in Jharkhand. Before his death in 1981, he became the Minister for Aviation and Communications in the Indira Gandhi Cabinet.

Today, Kartik’s legacy has been effectively adopted by the BJP. With abject poverty and lack of appropriate development, the cause of conversion could be as trivial — by urban standards — as getting a good bucket for drawing water from fast-drying wells. The cause for re-conversion could be the failure of the proselytising agencies to replace the bucket when it became old.

In the time of polls, conversions and re-conversions also become a tool for scoring political points. On the occasion of Good Friday last week, several instances of Christian tribals reconverting to Sarna (traditional tribal religion) worship were reported. It’s a way of expressing political sinews. Today, the Congress in Jharkhand — which Gandhi saw as the crucible of his ideas — is beholden to missionary benevolence. Politics of religion indeed has a different connotation here.
Holy See
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Holy See is the episcopal jurisdiction of the Bishop of Rome, commonly known as the Pope, and is the preeminent episcopal see of the Roman Catholic Church, forming the central government of the Church. As such, diplomatically, and in other spheres the Holy See acts and speaks for the whole Catholic Church. It is also recognized by other subjects of international law as a sovereign entity, headed by the Pope, with which diplomatic relations can be maintained.

The Holy See should not be confused with the Vatican City State, which came into existence only in 1929, while the Holy See dates back to early Christian times. <b>Ambassadors are officially accredited not to the Vatican City State but to "the Holy See", and papal representatives to states and international organizations are recognized as representing the Holy See, not the Vatican City State.</b>
Basically, they monitor almost everything that happens in this world.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>International organizations</b>
The Holy See is especially active in international organizations and is a member of the following groups:

International Grains Council (IGC)
International Committee for Military Medicine (ICMM)
International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA)
International Telecommunication Union (ITU)
International Telecommunications Satellite Organization (ITSO)
Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW)
Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE)
Preparatory Commission for the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty Organization (CTBTO)*
Universal Postal Union (UPU)
International Institute for the Unification of Private Law (UNIDROIT)
United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR)
United Nations Conference on Trade and Development (UNCTAD)
World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO)
* Note: In 1971, the Holy See announced the decision to adhere to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty in order to "give its moral support to the principles that form the base of the treaty itself".

The Holy See is also a permanent observer of the following international organizations:

Council of Europe in Strasbourg
International Organization for Migration (IOM)
International Labour Organization (ILO)
International Fund for Agricultural Development (IFAD)
Latin Union (LU)
Organization of American States (OAS) in Washington
Organisation of African Unity (OAU)
United Nations
UNESCO (United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization)
United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP)
United Nations International Drug Control Programme (UNDCP)
United Nations Centre for Human Settlements (UNCHS)
Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO)
World Tourism Organization (WToO)
World Trade Organization (WTO)
World Health Organization (WHO)
World Food Programme (WFP)
* Note: the Holy See has been a permanent observer in the United Nations since 1964 and, in July 2004, gained all the rights of full membership except voting.[6] According to Archbishop Celestino Migliore, Holy See Permanent Observer, "We have no vote because this is our choice." He added that the Holy See considers that its current status "is a fundamental step that does not close any path for the future. The Holy See has the requirements defined by the UN statute to be a member state and, if in the future it wished to be so, this resolution would not impede it from requesting it."

The Holy See is an observer on an informal basis of the following groups:

Asian-African Legal Consultative Organization (AALCO)
International Decade for Natural Disaster Reduction (ISDR, 1990s)
International Maritime Organization (IMO)
International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO)
United Nations Committee on the Peaceful Uses of Outer Space (UNCOPUOS)
World Meteorological Organization in Geneva (WMO)
The Holy See sends a delegate to the Arab League in Cairo. It is also a guest of honour to the Parliamentary Assembly of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I didn't know this.

1. Telegraph article
Also at http://www.hvk.org/articles/1200/26.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Militants raid Hindu ashram in Tripura</b>
December 6, 2000, The Telegraph

AGARTALA, December 5: Barely 24 hours after desecrating an ashram set up by slain religious leader Shanti Kumar Tripura, militants of the National Liberation Front of Twipra raided another ashram at Jirania Khola yesterday and asked the inmates to stop all Hindu rituals and practices. Police sources said a group of seven armed NLFT militants barged into the ashram at 4.30 pm and asked for Badal Debbarma, who heads all institutions set up by Shanti Kumar Tripura. When they were told that Debbarma had gone out, the rebels threatened the 150 tribal inmates with dire consequences if they continued to perform Hindu rites at the ashram. The militants fled only after a large group of locals rushed to the ashram. The militant raid triggered panic among inmates of the ashram, particularly because it was the second such incident in two days. On Sunday, a group of militants had raided Shanti Kumar Tripura’s ashram at Chachu Bazar under Sidhai police station. The rebels destroyed a photograph of the slain religious leader - revered by both Hindu tribals and Bengalis - and assaulted four persons, including two female devotees who had come to the ashram for puja. A delegation from the Jirania Khola ashram met West Tripura district superintendent of police Anurag Dhankar on October 31 and demanded that a police post be set up in the area. However, the SP reportedly turned down the proposal and instead promised to intensify patrolling in the area. A source in the ashram today said the police official’s promise was yet to be implemented. He said virtually nothing had been done to make the inmates of the ashram feel more secure since the killing of Shanti Kumar Tripura on August 27. Altogether 11 ashrams, schools and orphanages set up by the slain religious leader in various parts of the state have been closed down by the NLFT. Exodus of tribals: <b>At least 35 Jamatya families have fled their homes in the remote Teiharchong village to take shelter in areas close to south Maharani market since the killing of Jaulushmoni Jamatya, a member of the Jamatya hoda (community council), on Saturday.</b> Sources said NLFT militants had warned the Jamatyas of dire consequences if they did not disassociate themselves from the anti-NLFT movement launched by Bikram Bahadur Jamatya, the Hoda Okra.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

2. http://www.hvk.org/specialrepo/hate/ann2.html
Original at Sulekha:
May 2002 (before Staines - illegal presence in India - went up in flames and hogged the headlines):
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>NLFT - The Christian Al-Qaeda
I came to bring not peace but a sword – Jesus Christ</b>

For seven-year-old Shreema, 13th Jan 2002 was a special Sunday. All through the year, the girl had awaited the dawn of this day. For, that was the day one goes out and purchases new clothes, new toys and sweets, as the next day would be Makar Sankranthi -- the harvest festival celebrated throughout India. The Singicherra Bazar was bustling with activity. Like Shreema's family there were many people looking forward to a happy Makar Sankranthi. But they didn't realise that they were violating a fatwa issued by the Baptist Church-created Christian Al-Qaeda, the National Liberation Front of Tripura (NLFT). Nor did they know that they would pay with their lives for celebrating a heathen festival of their motherland.

<b>Shreema would never again celebrate Makar Sankranthi. She died, along with sixteen others, on the spot as 13 terrorists of the NLFT encircled the people shopping for the festival and fired indiscriminately1. The soldiers of Christ have done again in Tripura what they have been doing for centuries to heathens throughout the world.</b>

The Baptist Church of Tripura is not just the ideological mentor of the NLFT; it also supplies the NLFT with arms and ammunition for the soldiers of the holy crusade2. Never mind that the holy war involves killing infants and torching the huts of 'heathen Hindoos'. <b>The NLFT does all these to bring to the infidels the peace and love of Christ.</b> So, when <b>Nagmanlal Halam, secretary of the Noapara Baptist Church</b> in Tripura, was arrested by the Tripura police he had rather curious tools for evangelisation, which included along with the gospel 50 gelatin sticks, 5 kg of potassium and 2 kg of sulphur and other ingredients for making explosives. Mr. Halam confessed that his activities for the saving the heathen souls involved buying and supplying explosives to the NLFT over the past two years. <b>Another church official, Jatna Koloi</b>, who was also arrested, admitted that he received training in guerrilla warfare at an NLFT base last year. Surely, gelatin and AK-47s have more efficiency when it comes to bringing the light of the only revealed truth to the disbelievers suffering in 'spiritual darkness'. Those who are in doubt can check it out with another great light-bearer of the other 'only true book', Osama bin Laden (that is, when and if the prophet of terror is captured).

The Baptist Church of Tripura was initially set up by proselytizers from New Zealand 60 years ago. Despite their efforts, even until 1980, only a few thousand people in Tripura had converted to Christianity. Then the Church used one of its most efficient and time-tested weapons of evangelisation -- creating racial and ethnic divide among the people. In the aftermath of one of the worst ethnic riots, engineered by the Church3, the NLFT was born -- but not without the midwife role of the Baptist Church. From its very inception, the NLFT has been advancing the cause of Christianity through armed persuasion. Every trace of indigenous culture is being eliminated through violent means. Every resisting group is made to bleed its way to extinction.

The case of Jamatya tribals provides a telling example. These tribals have strong spiritual leaders and a network of social service organisations headed by their religious leaders. These indigenous sects are neither exclusive nor expansionist. The Baptist Church has always failed miserably in its conversion efforts with regard to this well-knit community. Hence, it is no wonder that the NLFT has made Jamatya institutions and their religious leaders the targets of their attacks. I<b>n the August of 2000, religious leaders of the Jamatya community like Jaulushmoni Jamatya and Shanti Kumar Tripura were killed by the NLFT, and Jamatya families were uprooted from their homelands and made refugees.</b> The death threats issued by the NLFT to the inmates of these institutions have already forced the closure of 11 Jamatya institutions like schools and orphanages, set up by the slain religious leaders in various parts of Tripura4. Interestingly, <b>these tribals</b> are not close-minded fanatics. For one thing, they <b>do not mind teaching the theory of evolution in their schools.</b>

The greatest challenge to the Bible inspired mission of the NLFT comes from the Sangh Parivar's <b>Banbasi Kalyan Kendra.</b> The dedicated life workers of RSS have started empowering the tribals by running many educational institutions which while empowering them through imparting secular technical education also retain their tribal cultural and spiritual identity. Rather than making them disown their roots, the Kendra made the tribals feel proud of their culture. It even conducts national level tribal sports festivals. If the NLFT is to carve out a kingdom for Christ out of the secular republic of India, it has to make sure that the Kendra activities are stopped at all costs. <b>In July 2000, armed NLFT militants torched a residential school and students hostel run by the Seva Mission in the remote Ananda Bazar area of North Tripura5. They had also taken hostage four RSS life workers. These RSS workers were all in their sixties. The crime committed by these old men was that they had dared to run educational institutions for tribals while preserving the tribals' culture. Later, all four were killed by the NLFT.</b>

The NLFT has been an active partner of the Baptist Church in winning converts to the Christian creed. They have killed tribal priests to threaten communities and effect mass conversions. But those tactics have obviously backfired. <b>In 2001 alone, the NLFT killed more than 20 Hindus who refused to 'accept the love of Christ'. They also torched to death a Hindu family sleeping in a hut6.</b>
<span style='color:purple'>(Note that this was well before before the missionary and would-be-rapist Graham Staines was torched.)
In 2001, community chiefs and religious heads of 19 tribes formed the 'Tribal Culture Protection Committee' to counter the threat posed by the NLFT7. Despite the NLFT taking all possible steps to enforce conversions, the conversions are still slow. Frustrated, the NLFT has now begun an all out war against Hindu tribals. They have issued fatwas against infidel activities. These fatwas prohibit people from celebrating festivals like Durga Pooja and Makar Sankranthi, listening to Indian music, watching Indian TV channels and films, and prohibit women from wearing bangles or sporting bindis, etc. Just a year before the NLFT started all these atrocities in India, the Southern Baptist Church of the United States of America had given a clarion call to bring the light of the gospel to “millions of Hindus and Jews lost in the darkness” of their religions8.

<b>Shreema, the seven-year-old girl from Tripura, died with bullets pumped into her tender body.</b></span> Her crime was that she violated the Christian fatwa which prohibited her from celebrating an Indian festival. She was not just a victim of barbaric terrorism but she is also a martyr for Indian culture, a culture that has preserved thousands of tribal customs from barbaric persecution. Yet, she will not make it to the glossy covers of the weekly magazines of English speaking Indian media. Unsubstantiated, fabricated stories of Hindu fundamentalists (an oxymoron) killing Christian priests have been making their headlines. However, these fabrications have their use. They do help in the covering up of such acts of Christian love like killing in cold blood a seven-year-old girl or burning a family to death.


1. 16 shot dead by NLFT in Tripura – PTI, January 13, 2002.
2. Church backing Tripura rebels – BBC, April 18, 2000.
3. India's North-East Resurgence: Ethnicity, Insurgency and Governance, Development by B.G. Vargheese, 1996, p.175.
4. Militants raid Hindu Ashram – The Telegraph, December 5, 2000.
5. NLFT curb on Hindu institutions – The Telegraph, September 14, 2000.
6. Three killed by Tripura rebels – BBC, April 14, 2000.
7. Tribals unite against conversions in Tripura, Syed Zarir Hussain, www.rediff.com/news/2001/aug/02trip.htm
8. Southern Baptists target Hindus, Julia Lieblich, The Associated Press, October 21, 1999.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Christianism is the only true religion. One can see how it became the ONLY 'true' religion.
<span style='color:red'>Crucified nun dies in 'exorcism' </span>

A Romanian nun has died after being bound to a cross, gagged and left alone for three days in a cold room in a convent, Romanian police have said.

Members of the convent in north-east Romania claim Maricica Irina Cornici was possessed and that the crucifixion had been part of an exorcism ritual.

Cornici was found dead on the cross on Wednesday after fellow nuns called an ambulance, according to police.

A priest and four nuns were charged with imprisonment leading to death.

Police say the 23-year-old nun, who was denied food and drink throughout her ordeal, had been tied and chained to the cross and a towel pushed into her mouth to smother any sounds.

A post-mortem is to be carried out, although initial reports say that Cornici died from asphyxiation.

I don't understand why journalists are making such a fuss about this Father Daniel

Local media reports that the young woman had arrived at the remote convent three months before, having initially gone there to visit a friend and opted to stay.

She grew up in an orphanage in Arad, in the west of Romania.

Mediafax news agency said Cornici suffered from schizophrenia and the symptoms of her condition caused the priest at the convent and other nuns to believe she was possessed by the devil.

"They all said she was possessed and they were trying to cast out the evil spirits," police spokeswoman Michaela Straub said.

Father Daniel who is accused of orchestrating the crime is said to be unrepentant.

"God has performed a miracle for her, finally Irina is delivered from evil," AFP quoted the priest as saying.

"I don't understand why journalists are making such a fuss about this. Exorcism is a common practice in the heart of the Romanian Orthodox church and my methods are not at all unknown to other priests," Father Daniel added.

If found guilty of killing Cornici, Father Daniel and the accused nuns could face 20 years in jail.

^ Just add the date (2005) as a qualifier. I saw the picture and recognised the priest (on seeing it initially I thought the authorities had allowed the same exorcise-to-death priest go scottfree from the 'last' murder to commit this one).
2 more items related to this revolting topic:
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Apr 12 2009, 12:59 PM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Apr 12 2009, 12:59 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->http://mnachiappan.indiainteracts.com/2008...rissa-children/
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Christian Sodomy in India: Targeting Orissa children!</b>
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Australian doctor detained in India for alleged paedophilia</b>
Nov 15, 2008

<b>In recent years, cases of paedophilia have come to light in India — most of them in the western resort state of Goa. Last year, a Goa court handed 44 year-old Australian national Warner Wulf Ingo a 10-year prison sentence after finding him guilty of sodomy, sex with minors, abduction and criminal conspiracy.</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

When the international media criedloud about the so-called anti-christian riots etc., they do not discuss about this christian sin of sexual abuse of innocent Indian children, of course Hindu.

<b>Is it their plan to spoil India?

[b]Thus, the psychology of such incidences point to organized sex abuse carried on under the guise of social work, relief-camps, “English-teaching" and so on exploiting the children by the Christians..

The enquiry reveals that they do not commit such abuses just as Paedophilia or sodomy but with intention.</b><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->[right][snapback]96347[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

It is NOT secular, though it is meant to look that way. They are trying to create a generational cycle of paedophilia by creating the first generation of victims who are meant to become offenders (as per news from 2 or 3 years ago, this christianism-created cycle became a big problem among some Australian Aboriginal townships).

1. Look how the following crypto-christoterrorist uses a Hindu name for his christian paedophile org (the choice of name is deliberate):
GOA, christowestern paedophile ring "orphanage"/"shelter for street children"
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->July 22, 2002
<b>Two foreign paedophiles sentenced to 7 years RI</b>
Sandesh Prabhudesai in Panjim

<b>Two foreigners - Freddy Peats and Eoghan Colm McBride - were on Saturday sentenced to seven years rigorous imprisonment each by Second Additional Sessions Judge Afonso Araujo in the district court in Panjim for running a child prostitution racket in Goa.</b>

Peats is already undergoing a life imprisonment sentence since 1996 after the decade-long racket came to light in 1991.

<b>Under the guise of running an orphanage called Gurukul in a village near Colva beach in south Goa, Peats was sexually exploiting destitute children and selling them to other paedophiles.</b>

The Goa police's lackadaisical attitude was exposed when one of the accused French man Dominique Sabire jumped bail and fled the country in 2000 after being arrested in Delhi in 1996.

If this was an aberration, the disappearance of another paedophile German national Brinkman Helmut, who was arrested in yet another case after an NGO compelled the police to act, left no doubt about the local police's reluctance to book paedophiles.
(Christian murders of and sexual assaults on Hindus also makes the 'police' react in a similar manner. See for instance how they appointed an inept person to look after Swami Lakshmanananda after the christian attack on him in 2007, and how there was no security for the Hindus after christians murdered Shanti Tripura.)

The case was handed over to the CBI by the high court after Mumbai-based child rights activist Sheela Barse complained that the Goa police were not serious about pursuing the case.

Subsequently, the <b>CBI chargesheeted altogether seven foreigners, including Peats.

While New Zealander McBride (63) was extradited to India in 2000, the others - Werner Wulf Ingo (Australia), Neels Oscar Johnson (Sweden), Raymond Varley (Thailand), Zell Jurgen Adreas alias Yogi (Germany) and Dominique Sabire (France) - are absconding.</b>

Peats and McBride have been convicted of criminal conspiracy, kidnapping, abducting, sodomy and of selling minors for prostitution.

<b>The state government as well as the police now admit that paedophiles do flock to Goa posing as tourists.</b>

But, despite several assurances, the state government is reluctant to bring a special legislation to deal with the menace even as paedophiles fearlessly continue to prey on young children.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

2. MUMBAI, christowestern paedophile ring "orphanage"/"shelter for street children"
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>British paedophile remanded to police custody till July 8</b>
Vijay Singh in Mumbai
June 30, 2005 16:05 IST

<b>British national Duncan Andrew Grant, an accused in a child abuse case, was arrested in Mumbai on Thursday and remanded to police custody till July 8 by a Mumbai court.</b>

Grant was booked for child sexual abuse by the Colaba police in south Mumbai in 2001.

Grant was taken to the police station from Chhatrapati Shivaji International Airport, Mumbai, on Wednesday night and was produced before the metropolitan court, sources said.

Earlier, Grant's advocate asked the court to allow him to surrender before the court, but the request was denied.

<b>Grant was accused of sexual abuse of minor street children at shelters for poor children founded by him in Mumbai and Murud. </b>

Raju Thakur, a 15-year-old inmate of the Mumbai shelter home, had complained about the abuse to the police and with the help of a social activist, a sexual abuse case was registered against Grant and his <b>accomplices William D'souza, an Indian</b> national and Allan Water (British) at the Colaba police station. D'Souza and Water have already been arrested.

During a survey on poor children, the social activist found that children in the shelter were <b>sexually and physically abused by Grant and his associates.</b>
(<b>ADDED:</b> The above William D'Souza is an Indian christian accomplice. Rather similar to christian paedophile David Berry and his Indian christian aid: "Berry was assisted in his heinous crimes by Bijoy Behera, a local schoolteacher and recent convert to Christianity. The police were forced to arrest the two Christians following a complaint lodged by a victim's father..." http://christianaggression.org/tactics_sexual_abuse.php )

Duncan has been absconding since the complaint was filed, and the police had to issue a red corner notice against him.

Recently, it was reported that he was running a similar kind of shelter at Tanzania, and that he had abused children there too.

<b>The police is interested in investigating how many such shelters Grant is associated with, in India as well as foreign countries.</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No child should ever end up in a christian or 'other' western orphanage in Bharatam or anywhere in the world.
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Apr 17 2009, 04:21 PM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Apr 17 2009, 04:21 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->^ Just add the date (2005) as a qualifier. I saw the picture and recognised the priest (on seeing it initially I thought the authorities had allowed the same exorcise-to-death priest go scottfree from the 'last' murder to commit this one).

hadn't realized it. But then such stuff from christists can be from any era, 1409 or 2009 matters little.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->But then such stuff from christists can be from any era, 1409 or 2009 matters little.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Absolutely.
Good to post the news. Not everyone may have had the educational misfortune of having read it before. People deserve to know. Shows how the term 'medieval' is a distraction.

About this:
<!--QuoteBegin-Husky+Apr 17 2009, 04:56 PM-->QUOTE(Husky @ Apr 17 2009, 04:56 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->It is NOT secular, though it is meant to look that way. They are trying to create a generational cycle of paedophilia by creating the first generation of victims who are meant to become offenders (as per news from 2 or 3 years ago, this christianism-created cycle became a big problem among some Australian Aboriginal townships).[right][snapback]96485[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

1. Where it started -
Parliament of Australia
Parliamentary Library
<b>Research Paper 27 1998-99
From Dispossession to Reconciliation </b>
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Inquiry estimated that <b>between 1910 and 1970 the number of indigenous children forcibly separated ranged from about one in ten children to one in three, depending on time and place, and that most indigenous families have been affected, in one or more generations, by the forced removal of one or more children.</b>
(I think this is a reference to the "Stolen Generation")
The majority of children removed were entirely separated from their indigenous community, were taught that indigenous culture was without value, were not allowed to use their language, suffered physically harsh living conditions and experienced multiple institutional and/or foster placements. Many were told they were unwanted, rejected or that their parents were dead. <b>Almost one in ten boys and just over one in ten girls allege they were sexually abused in children's institutions-and more allege such abuse in foster placements.</b> Extensive physical punishments were common. Education in the institutions was directed at preparing the children only for menial work. The Inquiry's report documents the effects not only on the children at the time (more than half of whom were removed during infancy) but also on those children later in life, on their children, on the families from which they were taken and on the foster carers when reunion is sought.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

2. Who did it -
via http://freetruth.50webs.org/D3.htm
<b>CNN news: Apologize to Aborigines, says new Labor head, November 22, 2001:</b>
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><i>The pontiff's message was not well-received by all Australian Aborigines.</i>

<b>Churches key to policy</b>
Chairman of the Croker Island Stolen Generation Aboriginal Corporation, Maurie Ryan-Japarta said John Paul should back his apology with financial compensation. <b>Ryan-Japarta said Christian churches played a crucial role in implementing the assimilation policies of Australian state and federal governments.</b>
While members of the stolen generation had fought the federal government in the courts for compensation, they have not yet focused on churches. <b>"That's the next step I would like to do with the rest of the stolen generation -- say you (the church) had an enormous part to play in this whole policy</b> since you were paid by the government to look after us," he told AP.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->http://freetruth.50webs.org/D3.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->On spreading to Australia, the Salvation Army claimed the country's indigenous people as
"its spiritual property.

The Salvation Army ran missions to Christianise aborigines and helped steal indigenous children from their parents so they could be placed in the homes of god-fearing white Christians ...
-- The Starvation Army: 12 Reasons to Reject the Salvation Army"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

3. What is the result -
Saturday June 30, 03:46 PM
NSW 'improving plight of Aborigines' (2007)

NSW election promises to improve the plight of Aboriginal communities continue to roll out across regional and rural areas of NSW, Acting Premier John Watkins says.

The state and commonwealth governments have copped relentless bashing from opposition parties over reports of rampant child sex abuse in Aboriginal communities.

The recent findings of the report, Little Children are Sacred, have prompted the federal government to take over 60 Aboriginal communities in the Northern Territory.

But the NSW opposition on Saturday said the state government report - Breaking the Silence - documented one year ago that Aboriginal children are four times more likely to be victims of sex abuse.

Mr Watkins hit back and said the problems continue in Aboriginal communities in NSW but the state government is delivering on its election promises to curb the problems.

"It's a bit hard to cop from the NSW opposition which went to the last election with no Aboriginal policy and with a tradition of just slicing into community services over the last six to eight years," Mr Watkins told reporters in Sydney.

In contrast, he said the number of community case workers will rise from 237 to over 300 in western NSW by the end of the financial year.

"But as the premier (Morris Iemma) made very clear through this past week, none of us, state or federal, Liberal or Labor can be proud of the outcome across Australia for Aboriginal people and we need to do better," he said.

Mr Watkins said the state government welcomes any discussions with the federal government to bring about a faster response to the problems in NSW.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

4. Result is the cause of a cycle -
<b>Child abuse in Indigenous communities a pressing concern</b>
AM - Wednesday, 17 May , 2006 08:08:00
Reporter: Gillian Bradford
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->GILLIAN BRADFORD: Give me some of those reasons why child sexual abuse is just so much more prevalent in Aboriginal remote communities.

LYLA COOREY: They are numerous. Where do you start?

You look at perhaps the social environment that they're growing up in. They're surrounded by neglect, parents who are involved in heavy substance abuse. And I think that in itself is a major issue.

And I think if you attempt to examine why that is the case you will find that a number of adults, Indigenous adults, are still suffering and still reeling from their own experiences of child sexual abuse.

GILLIAN BRADFORD: Did you get any understanding of how many Indigenous children's lives were being in some way touched by sexual abuse?

LYLA COOREY: Nearly everybody I spoke to knew of several people who'd been sexually abused as children. I think the scope of this problem is so widespread it is almost beyond belief.

TONY EASTLEY: Domestic violence researcher Lyla Coorey, speaking there with Gillian Bradford.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

6. Specifically NOT indigenous tradition to blame -

IIRC, other news related to the above that I read at the time, was about perpetrators getting children addicted to some substance for the purposes of paedophilia. In fact even infants were attacked. I think I also recall there was a brief interview with an elderly indigenous Australian who said all this had nothing to do with traditional indigenous culture.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Indigenous groups warn violence worsening</b>

Posted Tue May 16, 2006 7:49pm AEST
Updated Tue May 16, 2006 8:15pm AEST

Indigenous groups say appalling details of the sexual abuse of women, children and babies in central Australian Aboriginal communities are not only accurate, but getting worse.

The Northern Territory Chief Minister says she did not know about cases where children and a seven-month-old baby had been sexually assaulted.

The Federal Indigenous Affairs Minister has questioned whether the Northern Territory Government is taking the problem seriously.

Last night, the ABC's Lateline program revealed graphic descriptions of the sexual abuse from the files collected by Alice Springs Crown prosecutor Nannette Rogers over more than a decade.

"The volume is huge. I don't have any single file in my room that's not related to violence at the present time," she said.

The horrific revelations came as no surprise to many in the Territory, including traditional owner Betty Pearce.

"Anger is so great because this is not an Aboriginal culture," she said.

"Even 20 years ago, 22 years ago, had an Aboriginal person done that he'd have been killed, had he raped a child," she said.

Sharon Payne from the North Australian Aboriginal Justice Agency is alarmed at the revelations of an alcohol-soaked culture of violence where children and babies are raped and killed.

"I think it's desperate in terms that it has the capacity to wipe out whole societies, the whole of Aboriginal culture in this way," she said.
(Hmmm, I thought I read it was some two-bit drug abuse. Not real drugs but things like p or meth or something?)

Territory Chief Minister Clare Martin says other ministers in her government knew but she was unaware of the cases raised by Dr Rogers.

"Personally I didn't know," she said.

"Not specific cases. The information she was working from was provided by police to her.

"So in terms of police, operational police knew about these cases, in terms of the minister responsible for Child Protection Services, those ministers know."

She says she did not see the Lateline program but acknowledges there is a crisis.

"Can I just say that the Crown prosecutor was talking about cases over a 15-year period and she did very clearly say that she's seeing signs of improvement," she said.

But Territory Opposition Leader Jodeen Carney says Ms Martin is kidding herself.

"For the Chief Minister to say that things are getting better is delusional and stupid beyond belief and she should be ashamed of herself," she said.

Federal Indigenous Affairs Minister Mal Brough says he does not want to steamroll the Territory government but that he will do whatever it takes to tackle the abuse of Aboriginal children.

"I have highlighted this issue because I think it's important and I am not sure that it's been taken seriously enough by the Territory government to date," he said.

"The cards are on the table. Everyone knows where we stand. Let's see how they react over the next few weeks."

Community organisations say a culture of silence is fostering the problem, with claims health workers are often discouraged from reporting cases of abuse.

Jane Lloyd, chair of a domestic violence body that advises the Government, says staff at Alice Springs hospital are directed not to report serious injuries to police unless the patient asks them to.

"It's really disturbing because it's that silence, it's that lack of action that is going to contribute to the silence in communities and it's going to contribute to further abuse of children," she said.

Not so, according to the Chief Minister.

"If issues need to be reported, they will be reported and that's certainly this direction from government," Ms Martin said.

She says she is not walking away from the problem and that the Government has boosted spending on police child protection services and domestic violence legal services.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's a form of genocide. Akin christowest introducing casinos in native American territories and among other indigenous people with the expected result: disproportionate addiction to gambling. Similar to christowestern introduction of rampant alcoholism among such populations by deliberately opening huge numbers of liquor stores among Australian indigenous and native American communities. Similarly, creating a cycle of paedophilia is another christo bequest.

Result of unnatural levels of alcoholism and dependency, created by unnatural causes:
Monday February 12, 07:09 AM (2007)
<b>Alcohol 'killing indigenous Australians'</b>
Alcohol kills one indigenous Australian every 38 hours, landmark research has found.

The average age of those dying from alcohol-attributable causes - mostly suicide for men, or alcoholic liver cirrhosis for women - is about 35 years.

National Drug Research Institute (NDRI) Indigenous Australian Research team leader Dennis Gray said these were conservative estimates from a first-of-its-kind study of the problem which showed alcohol killed 1,145 indigenous Australians between 2000 and 2004.

He said Australia had a long way to go in dealing with the inequality between the health of indigenous and non-indigenous Australians.

"If we are serious about addressing this disparity and reducing death rates among indigenous Australians, we need to focus on the underlying social causes of that ill health," Professor Gray said.

"For instance, suicide is the most frequent alcohol-caused death among indigenous men, which reflects the despair that many indigenous people feel.

Senior Research Fellow Tanya Chikritzhs said she was shocked to discover indigenous women as young as 25 years were dying of haemorrhagic stroke due to heavy drinking.

"That is a disease of the elderly," Dr Chikritzhs said.

"Alcohol affects indigenous people in so many different ways. Governments need to take account of that, it needs to be dealt with at a local level.

"The bottom line is it is a massive problem for indigenous people and it is not getting any better."

Their research found that between 2000 and 2004, 19.4 per cent of all indigenous deaths, or 222, occurred in Western Australia.

Almost a quarter, 23.5 per cent, or 269, happened in the Northern Territory.

One in four of all these deaths occurred in Queensland, with 285 alcohol-attributable deaths among indigenous Australians in that state between 2000-2004.

South Australia recorded 78 alcohol-attributable deaths while 20 per cent, or 229 deaths occurred in NSW - which has the largest indigenous population of any state.

Alcoholic liver cirrhosis was the number one killer with suicide coming in second.

Haemorrhagic stroke, which is much more common among women than men, assault injury and road traffic injury each caused about one in 10 deaths.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

The cycle of terror and violence created by christianism:
Times Online August 19, 2005
<b>Paedophile sues Catholic Church over alleged abuse</b>
By Sam Knight, Times Online

A convicted paedophile is suing the Roman Catholic Church of England and Wales, claiming that he suffered sexual abuse at the hands of a priest more than thirty years ago.

The paedophile, who has not been named, claims that his life was ruined and his own crimes were shaped by the abuse that was inflicted on him by a Catholic priest, who he says is now a senior figure in the Catholic Church with responsibilities for child protection.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Where it began:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Dublin archbishop: Sex abuse report will shock (1,000's of children sexualy abused)</b>
apr 14th, 2009

i don't know if i can stand all this luuuuuuv by the RoL.

i hope the tab is in the billions of euro, so that local ratzy- pals get bankrupted in many countries in europe.

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Dublin archbishop: Sex abuse report will shock (1,000's of children sexualy abused)
He says it will show that thousands of youths were abused from 1975-2004

The Archbishop of Dublin said Thursday that an upcoming report on child sexual abuse involving Catholic priests will likely reveal that thousands of youngsters were abused from 1975 to 2004.

The report "will shock us all," said Diarmuid Martin, during Mass at Dublin's Pro-Cathedral.

The archbishop said the report, compiled by the Dublin Archdiocese Commission of Investigation, is expected to show that "thousands of children or young people across Ireland were abused by priests in the period under investigation and the horror of that abuse was not recognized for what it is."

The government-appointed commission was set up to investigate abuses within the Dublin archdiocese in 2006, the same year the diocese admitted that up to 102 of its priests were suspected of abusing children. The report is studying how complaints of child sexual abuse were handled.

The commission has also now begun an investigation into the Diocese of Cloyne, in County Cork. Commission member Ita Mangan said that could potentially delay the publication of the Dublin report which had been planned for this summer.

"The commission will be finishing the report in May; we then send it to the government, and they then decide when to publish it," Mangan said Thursday. "The government is obliged to publish it, but not necessarily the next day. It could be further complicated by the fact that we're also inquiring into the Cloyne diocese. It is possible the government would decide to publish the two reports together, which could then be September, October."

The Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform said Thursday that it could not confirm any planned date of publication.

Ireland, a predominantly Catholic country, has been rapidly secularizing in recent years, spurred by the outrage at the hidden abuses within the clergy. Archbishop Martin, a Vatican diplomat assigned in 2003 to address the problem, appeared to address that disillusionment Thursday in his homily.

"There is a dramatic and growing rift between the church and our younger generations and the blame does not lie principally with young people," he said.
Ireland archbishop admits child abuse report 'will shock us all'

One of Ireland's most senior clergyman admitted yesterday that an imminent report on the sexual abuse of children by clergy will shock the country and reveal that thousands of children were abused by priests.

In an unprecedented homily for Holy Thursday, Diarmuid Martin, the Archbishop of Dublin, warned that the depth of the abuse "will shock us all".

The report from the commission on child sexual abuse will be published in May, and according to Martin it will throw up challenges to the Catholic church in Ireland it has never experienced before.

At a mass in Dublin's Pro-Cathedral, Martin said: "It is likely that thousands of children or young people across Ireland were abused by priests in the period under investigation and the horror of that abuse was not recognised for what it is. The report will make each of us and the entire church in Dublin a humbler church."

Organisations representing the victims of clerical sex abuse in Ireland last night welcomed the archbishop's words.

Martin is seen as a reformer sent in by the Vatican to clean up a church rocked by a decade and a half of scandals. One of the most notorious, in the mid-1990s, involved priest Brendan Smyth and indirectly led to the collapse of Albert Reynolds's government.

Accusations that the Irish attorney general's office blocked moves to extradite Smyth to Northern Ireland led to the Irish Labour party pulling out of coalition with Reynolds's Fianna Fáil and the government falling.

"We have no time to waste," Martin said yesterday. "There is a dramatic and growing rift between the church and our younger generations, and the blame does not lie principally with young people. Our young people are generous and idealistic but such generosity and idealism does not seem to find a home in the church."

He also illuminated the recruitment crisis in Irish Catholicism, in a country that once used to export its priests and nuns all over the world. "In the [Dublin] diocese there are 10 times more priests over 70 than under 40. In just a few years we will only have a little over 200 diocesan priests to minister to our almost 200 parishes."

Maeve Lewis, executive director of the One in Four organisation, which campaigns for the victims of clerical sex abuse, welcomed Martin's remarks, saying he "has been at the forefront of addressing the issue of sexual abuse within the Catholic church. He has drawn up models for child care and protection in Dublin that can be followed anywhere in the world.

"From the viewpoint of those who have experienced clerical sexual violence I think his statement and his recognition of their abuse will probably be of some comfort. For the first time, a member of the hierarchy has accepted the depth of the abuse that took place over the years".

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