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Christian Subversion And Missionary Activities - 5
Hindu Forum of Britain document on link between caste and "dalit" discourse and British MPs

http://www.hfb.org.uk/FileServer.aspx?oID=409&lID=0
I happened to visit my cousin's home in Kerala. His wife works for a christian missionary run college as a lecturer. What shocked me was the presence of cross and picture of a christian saint in their conservative Hindu home. When asked about the presence of those christian symbols, they told me that the nuns of the college where the wife works, demanded them to install at home. The nuns from the college make occassional home visits to make sure that they are there.

The family lives on a financially tight budget and the income from the college is an important component. She is afraid that removing them would remove her from good books of college authorities.

Definitely, I am working on to get them removed. However, this tactic must be working succesfully on many other ignorant families, where they could inject christianity into the whole family slowly.
<b>Amen - Autobiography of a nun</b>
Startling revelations trigger a debate in Catholic church
By S Chandrasekhar

Amen - Autobiography of a nun penned by Sister Jesme, who quit the Congragate of Carmallite Church, after 33 years of nunhood and published by DC Books, Kottayam, is breaking news stands records earning lakhs for the penner and publisher. <b>Three editions of the book in Malayalam have already been sold out and the fourth is in print.</b> Owing to great demand from all over Bharat and the globe, <b>English, Hindi and Marati versions of the book are coming out shortly, with print order of each exceeding a lakh. This will certainly make the nun and DC Books millionaires. ‘A Harry Potter’ like aura is encircling the book and Sr. Jesme has acquired a JK Rowling halo.</b>

Sr. Jesme, a PhD in English literature, author of three books on poetry and Principal of St. Marys and Vimala College, Thrissur, was forced to resign from the convent as she had fought against evil tendencies like commercialisation of education, financial irregularities, etc. She was branded as a psychiatric and forced to take drugs. Fearing death, she resigned from the convent.

In the 183-page best-seller she has devoted five pages to lesbian and sexual acts perpetuated by nuns, mothers, brothers and fathers.

On page 54, she says how a fellow sister crept into her bed and did indecent things despite her protest. On page 89, she reveals how a father deputed to take care of her at Bangalore, misbehaved with her, molested her and indulged in body-exhibitionism.

In other pages she speaks about financial irregularities, corruption, nepotism, intrigue, patriarchy prevailing in church. She says churches maintained two sets of books, one for public consumption and the other for private consumption. She says the educational institutions, medical and engineering collages, hospitals are only for the rich and powerful. <b>The medical and engineering colleges are money-making factories with amount from Rs. 50 lakh to Rs. 100 lakh being charged for medical seats, affordable only to affluent NRI’s.

The bishops live in absolute luxury dining the richest food and partaking finest liquors. They travel in the latest and costliest cars.</b>

She says she left the convent since there was conspiracy to confine her to the dark corners of a nunnery citing psychiatric illness.

Sr. Abhaya and Sr. Anupa Mary and countless nuns through their mysterious deaths have revealed the lesbian and sexual perversions prevalent in the church. <b>Fathers and brothers who are ‘vultures personified’ are preying on hapless girls, who join as nuns, to escape from poverty in homes</b>.

<b>Despite 974 mysterious deaths being reported from the ‘Christian Divine Retreat Centre’ at Muringoor, Thrissur, despite billions of dollars coming to Pentecost Missions for conversion and anti-national activities, despite the Kerala Women’s Commission mooting minimum 18 years for nunnery and retention of family property in nun’s name (the Church usurps the nuns property) the CPM and Congress are not doing anything for fear of losing the 25 per cent Christian vote-bank of Kerala.</b>

The present Pope and John Paul II may have asked pardon for atrocities committed on nuns and sisters by brothers and priests, <b>but the fact remains that the Church spends billions of dollars every year as compensation for victims of sexual atrocities by priests</b>. Owing to dwindling number of churches and priests in Europe, those opting for priesthood are given two months holidays, every year, to freak out at any tourist resort in any corner of the world and enjoy material pleasures!

May the tribe of whistle blowers like Sr. Jesme increase! Amen!

http://www.organiser.org/dynamic/modules.p...pid=287&page=37




Manmohan wants White Christians to judge Hindus

Delhi allows scrutiny of religious freedom
K.P. Nayar
Washington, May 2: In its last days in office, the UPA government has broken with a long-standing policy of disallowing intrusive fact-finding visits from America and permitted a religious vigilante state body from the US to sit in judgement on the extent of India's religious freedom.

The US Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF), a statutory body created by the US Congress and funded by the US government, announced yesterday that its members will “travel to India for the first time in June 2009”.

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1090503/j ... 911531.jsp

“My Congress party works under pressure of Christian Missionaries”

“My Congress party works under pressure of Christian Missionaries”
By our correspondent
Bhuj, DeshGujarat, 6 May, 2009



Congress party’s Kutch district secretary J.P.Maheshwari on Tuesday, resigned from the party protesting party’s stand on providing reservation to backward class Dalits converted Christians.

Maheshwari said in his resignation letter said “My Congress party works under pressure of Christian Missioneries and that’s why it has decided to implement reservation for around one crore Christian dalits. This will boost Christian religious conversions and unity of this nation will be in danger. Congress is misusing goodwill generated by Gandhiji who served dalits.”

Mahshwari said he resigned from the party after election because it was morally correct.

http://deshgujarat.com/2009/05/06/my-congr...n-missioneries/

# Bharat Sachania Says:
May 6th, 2009 at 11:54 am

Mr.Maheshwari is right.Congress party always making vote bank thus the so many peopes is poorest.They now want to happy to Sonia Gandhi this is very bed in our loving country.Dalits peopes don’t known congress polices and they just lie to this peopes.Our dharm is our dharm no boudy can pressure to change our religious.This time last time for congress party in rules after 16th of may good bye to congress party.

Jay Jay Garvi Gujarat Vande mataram.
# KENT Says:
May 6th, 2009 at 12:31 pm

SEE, THIS IS WHAT THESE CONGREESS NETAS WANT AND STILL INDIANS WILL NOT WAKE UP, THEY ARE BUSY WATCHING IPL, ANS SILLY-STUPID MOVIES-SHOWS AND WONDER WHY OUR SOCIETY IS IN TROUBLE. JAGO, BHARTIYO JAGO.. NO, WE WILL NOT WAKE UP. WE WILL WAIT FOR AMERICA TO DO SOMETHING, INDIANS, REMEMBER BHAGVAN ONLY HELPS TO THOSE WHO HELP THEMSELVS… JAY SHREE KRISHNA…
# Manish Patel Says:
May 6th, 2009 at 3:46 pm

THIS IS SICKULAR CONGRESS (ITALIAN) PARTY. PEOPLE MUST KNOW THE VATICAN INFLUENCE IN ELECTIONS OF INDIA.
# Vijay Patel Says:
May 6th, 2009 at 5:08 pm

If only this news story gets attention from print media and gets front page before polling tomorrow. Only wishful thinking. Congress HAND is too curropt and they know how to buy media barons. Thanks to DeshGujarat.com.


<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The church authorities have best educational institutions in India.
There are about four to five per cent Christian population in India
but churches have hold on around twenty two per cent (22%) of
educational institutions and thirty per cent (30%) of health care.
Next to government, the churches are the biggest land owners in India.
In spite of having enough facilities with the church yet Dalit
Christians' condition is deteriorating. There are fifteen per cent
(15%) Dalit Christians in the cities and forty per cent (40%) Dalit
Christians in the rural areas are illiterate in spite of having best
convent schools in the church. Thousand of Tribal girls are forced to
do the work as Aaya in the rich families. These girls are coming from
Tribal areas where there are no job opportunities. These girls (Aayas)
are physically molested and mentally tortured.

Churches are not taking enough care of these girls. In Madhya Pradesh
(M.P.) alone, in spite of less Christians population, catholic church
have cores of rupees and enough means to provide better education and
job to Dalit Christians. In Madhya Pradesh the church have more then
one hundred and fifty (150) High schools and half of them are convent
schools. In Bhopal alone catholic church have the property, movable
and unmovable, worth of more than six hundred crores (600) yet
Christians' condition is not improved. The church property and money
are being used by the authorities as they wish.

The members of Poor Christian Liberation Movement, Rev. Fr. William
Predass Chaudhary and Mr. P.B. Lomio explained to the local Christians
about Mr, Anand Benard's, who is the only member of minority
commission of Madhay Pradesh government, suggestion to the M.P.
government to form like a Waqf bord. If the M. P. government forms
such kind of bord then we must welcome the government's step and the
Christians will have no loss at all. On August 27, 2004, Poor
Christian Liberation Movement had given a memorandum to the Honorable
Prime Minister, Dr. Manmohon Singh to form such kind of committee to
control the properties of churches.

Last year June 6, 2008, Poor Christian Liberation Movement had
organized a National Convention at India Islamic Cultural Centre,
87-88 Lodi Road, New Delhi-110003. From all over India there were
three hundred (300) representatives who repeated the demand to form
committees to look after church properties. The National President of
PCLM, Mr. R.L. Frances says that if the Waqf board has no credibility
or the Muslim community bearing any loss then the Muslim community
will not allow such king of board. But they are benefiting from Waqf
board. If such kind of board / committee is formed to safeguard the
properties of churches then Christian community should not oppose it.
There may be such kind of people who may oppose for their own sake.
Such kind of people astray the Christian community from the main
issue. The properties and money are being misused by leaders of
churches and rich people The educational institutions are being run by
the upper caste rather than Dalit Christians who are deprived from all
the facilities in the churches. Thus upper caste people are enjoying
both properties and educational facilities.

Poor Christian Liberation Movement regrets about the behavior of
church authorities who are collecting money from national and
international level in the name of poor Christians who are attacked by
the miscreants. The money is not reaching fully to the effected
people. Mr. R.L. Francis says that there are no problem between
Christians and Hindus. The problems come only when we interfere in the
lives of others and religions. We should follow sincerely our own
religion without criticizing. We must honor all the religions because
all religions give salvation. The National President of PCLM, Mr. R.
L. Francis appeals to the local and Dalit Christians to fight for
justice and equal right in churches and society. We need to struggle
to have our own position in the churches. The struggle is the key for
success.

The appointment of bishops by the Vatican must be opposed because when
bishops are appointed by Vatican then they ignore the local
Christians. The South Indian priests should not be appointed as
bishops for North Indian dioceses. North Indian priests should be
appointed as bishops for North Indian dioceses as other denominations
do. Local priests know the culture and traditions better and thus
local bishops will be more successful in evangelization in North
India.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>'Many Kandhmal victims alive'</b>

After Teesta's godhra lies now the Archbishop is exposed on Kandhamal lies the bleeding heart liberal project stands

So carried away the evangelists were in Orissa they included RSS names in list of victims some even alive
catholic morality
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LStcajxvb...re=channel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZO2u-jDN...re=channel
Vigil Online: The U.S And The USCIRF - There Is No End To Their Impertinence
Following items all related to:
<!--QuoteBegin-Viren+May 16 2009, 02:41 AM-->QUOTE(Viren @ May 16 2009, 02:41 AM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Vigil Online: The U.S And The USCIRF - There Is No End To Their Impertinence
[right][snapback]97245[/snapback][/right]<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Apparently India is a Vatican colony. Indian christogovt gets all its ideas on how to conduct the election from Vatican and US government. They probably invited themselves over and told their minions in India to issue a public invitation.


1. The recent email prologue to the above 2002 Vigil article at the Rajeev2004 blog:
http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/rad...f-in-india.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>radha rajan: The USCIRF in India</b>
may 11th, 2009

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Radha Rajan
Date: Sun, May 10, 2009 at 9:50 AM
Subject: The USCIRF in India
To:

The Italian Christian-led Congress-led UPA government has taken the unprecedented step of inviting the USCIRF to visit Gujarat and Orissa to write their officious reports on religious freedom. The padre from Gujarat Cedric Prakash has made the fooliosh remark that Narendra Modi must win the approval of western nations (read US) if he has to become the Prime Minister of India and that the visit by the USCIRF has been welcomed by Gujaratis in the US who want the US State Department to remove Modi from their anti-Christ list and give Modi a visa to the US. I have been brought up in a middle-class brahmin family and much as I am tempted to give expression to what I think of such officiousness, I will confine myself to sending you all what I wrote about the USCIRF in 2002. Like many things I said and wrote several years ago, nothing has changed. RR<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

2. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/upa...-with-long.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>UPA government has broken with a long-standing policy of disallowing intrusive fact-finding visits from America</b>
may 11th, 2009

yeah, let a bunch of busybody baptist bigots sit in judgment on us. of course, arch-liers like john dayal and cedric prakash will be the star witnesses.

then manmohan singh can be 'ashamed' all over again.

of course, he is not ashamed that hindus and sikhs are being forced to pay jaziya in taliban-controlled af-pak.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <info


In its last days in office, the UPA government has broken with a long-standing policy of disallowing intrusive fact-finding visits from America


<b>Delhi allows scrutiny of religious freedom</b>
K.P. Nayar
www.telegraphindia.com/1090503/jsp/nation/story_10911531.jsp

Washington, May 2: In its last days in office, the UPA government has broken with a long-standing policy of disallowing intrusive fact-finding visits from America and permitted a religious vigilante state body from the US to sit in judgement on the extent of India's religious freedom.

The US Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF), a statutory body created by the US Congress and funded by the US government, announced yesterday that its members will "travel to India for the first time in June 2009".

Pending this scrutiny of the extent of religious freedom in the country, the Commission has put off its annual report on conditions in India and promised that it will only "release its report on India during this summer" after its members assess the conditions first hand.

Ever since the US Congress passed an International Religious Freedom Act 1998 and created the USCIRF, it has been trying to visit India, but New Delhi has consistently told the Commission's members that they will not be given visas for an official visit if they applied for one.

... deleted


http://www.telegraphindia.com/1090503/jsp/...ry_10911531.jsp

Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/11/2009 10:12:00 AM 0 comments <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

3. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/pum...n-dasgupta.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Pumpkin republic- by Swapan Dasgupta</b>

may 11th, 2009

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <info@


Fr. Cedric Prakash, photographed here receiving the <b>Chevalier de la Legion d' Honneur Award</b> from the French Ambassador in New Delhi on 14th July 2006, is well known in some circles as a resolute defender of "human rights" in Gujarat.
(What, Ceddie wasn't made a most catholic Knight of Malta?)

In June, a delegation from the United States Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF) is scheduled to visit India. The team will travel to Gujarat and Orissa. Fr Prakash had testified before USCIRF in June 2002 after the Gujarat riots.

The idea of a US body investigating religious freedom in India is a bit disturbing. Fr Prakash's take on the subject is, however, fascinating.

<b>In the Mail Today of May 8, 2009, page 9, he is quoted as saying:</b>

    <!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>(Narendra) Modi cannot nurture prime ministerial dreams unless he is acceptable to the Western world.</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
(This is the US and Vatican talking through "good native" minion Father Cedric Procrass.)

Fr. Prakash does himself proud with such an honest articulation of his beliefs.

http://www.swapan55.com/2009/05/pumpkin-republic.html
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

4. http://www.vijayvaani.com/FrmPublicDisplay...cle.aspx?id=573
via
http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/hil...out-sister.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Tuesday, May 12, 2009
<b>hilda raja: will USCIRF check out sister abhaya's murder in a christist nunnery? of course not
</b>may 12th, 2009

or will it look into the case of the poor 'vampire of cochin' whose religious freedom has been violated? godman ratzy took this fellow, one bishop thattunkal, to the vatican and did not allow him to get 'spiritial nourishment' for a sexy 25-year-old woman who he was fraternizing with. down with religious oppression of christists! thattunkal, who is about 60, should have every right to get 'spritual nourishment' (or whatever) from a nubile 25-year-old!

or will it consider how hindu temples are being burned by christists?

let us also ask if there is a side trip by the USCIRF to Swat (after all, all yank dignitaries have to make a pak trip along with an india trip to be 'even-handed'). they can counsel their pals the taliban to stop killing hindus and sikhs.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <info

<b>USCIRF – will it visit convents where nuns are raped?  - By Hilda Raja

The UPA government's unprecedented step of inviting the United States Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF) to visit Gujarat and Orissa is not only disturbing, but also portents greater harm to the harmony and unity of the country.

It exposes India to international policing which has ramifications on the integrity and sovereignty of the nation. Today it can be a Commission; why not later an army for the purpose of protecting minorities? The basic premise is the same.</b>

Hypothetically, let's imagine that the Commission faults the government of both States for failure to protect minorities. Should Naveen Patnaik and Narendra Modi appear before this Commission and plead guilty - or plead innocent - and with all humility accept the penalty it will impose? Can there be a greater insult to democracy and to the sovereignty of this country?

It is invasion - be it territorial, social or religious. No matter which area, invasiveness of any kind cannot be accepted. What is the role of the Congress-led UPA government? Does it not stand indicted for impotency to curb violence? It cannot abdicate responsibility and obligation to protect minorities and rein in State governments. If this is logically followed, the accused is the Congress–Manmohan Singh - proof of his political weakness. Which country would tolerate such invasion and interference in its internal affairs? Are we bonded to the USA? No patriotic Indian, irrespective of religion, would accept the policing of this nation by outside agencies.

Can the Catholic Bishops Conference of India (CBCI) and the INDIAN Churches which objected to such invasiveness nine years ago now make a U-turn? In the course of five years, what is the persecution witnessed in India. Brahmin Pundits killed in hundreds and chased away from J&K under ethnic cleansing has not raised international concerns. The furore caused by wrongful reporting of the rape of five nuns in Jhabua was set right when the nuns themselves gave interviews stating it had nothing to do with religion. Indeed, the culprits were converted tribals.

In Orissa, the massacre of Swami Laxmanananda and his disciples led to clashes in which Christians and Hindus were equally victims.
('Equally' victims? How so? Hilda agrees that the christians indulged in the initiating orgy of murder which invited angry and violent reaction. And now she declares the unfortunate maths of affected human lives to be "equal". It is NOT equal. If I stomp on some IF member - pick one - and they beat me back out of indignation, suddenly I am equally a victim? <- Some really brave 'logic'. So we are entitled to equal recompense and/or equal punishment? Yet I am the one - in this hypothetical scenario - that is a threat to society: I go out of my way to hit out at someone while others are merely naturally reacting to the violence. No court of law would fine us equally.
But equality in christianism and islamism seems to forever have a meaning apart from what it does in basic algebra.
Moreover, the government is not treating these "equal" victims equally, is it: the christians have demanded special compensation and reparation for Orissa christians, for their claim of being the "most affected" victims on the "receiving-end".
Christian terrorism murders and insists on getting rewarded for it too.)

<b>The infamous Gujarat riots are being investigated by the Special Investigation Team, but earlier versions and gory stories of brutality, rape and massacres narrated by activist Teesta Setalvad were found faked, cooked up, witnesses and statements doctored; hence the Supreme Court rejected the bundle of lies.</b>

Against this backdrop, Congress allowing UNCIRF to enquire into violence against minorities is political in intent and has everything to do with further dividing the people on religious grounds. Will UNCIRF be allowed to enter Pakistan or any Islamic country where there is discrimination against minorities?

Congress and Christian churches seem to conspire against Hindus. This is evident when one looks at the pre-election scenario. In April, the Catholic Bishops Conference of India issued a 'Ten Commandments' type of list of dos and don'ts for Catholics. Sure, it did not specify which party to vote for. But this was followed by a number of churches scripting prayers for the 'flock,' couched in appeals to God to bring in a party which will allow religious freedom and uphold the same guaranteed in the Constitution. Across India, the entire Christian community was galvanized by such covert campaigning. In Karnataka, a priest had the audacity to openly tell the 'flock' not to vote for the BJP. Joining hands with Muslim leaders, Catholic leaders also issued a fatwa, overtly and covertly compelling the 'flock' to vote for Congress.

The Election Commission is unmindful of this religio-political mix; this blatant communalism. When Advani appeals to Hindu religious leaders, the EC becomes alert and people like John Dayal condemn it. It is only when Hindu organizations and BJP politicians appeal to people that the ire of the EC is provoked. Then the media comes out with secular advocacy and condemns the communalism of BJP and its allies.

<b>Church double-speak has exposed its ulterior motive - nine years ago (Sept 2000) CBCI described as "unwarranted" the proposed hearing on religious freedom in India by UNCIRF, and distanced itself from John Dayal, saying he was attending it in his individual capacity. It is relevant to recall what Christian MPs felt then.</b> They acknowledged the need to curb the influence of fundamentalists over the community and the Church. By deposing before the US panel, Dayal has given Hindu extremist groups valid reason to doubt the integrity of the community and 'we could just be inviting Hindu extremist backlash' rued Patty Ripple Kyndiah, who added that the antics of John Dayal is against national interest. Former Speaker P.A. Sangma endorsed Kyndiah, 'This is our internal problem. We are capable of solving it'.

What has changed in nine years? The number of churches built has increased more than hundred fold. Christian institutions are given all financial assistance, Christians have occupied hundreds and hundreds of acres of  promboke land on which they quickly erect a shack and a cross - for further constructing pucca buildings, both commercial and religious. Thus occupying the land, they acquire assets, evade tax, and even electricity charges.

It is in the national interest to survey the status of Churches property-wise and cash-wise. When in so-called Christian countries churches are closing down, here in India churches are annually increasing in number. Even in Italy, churches are empty but here churches are full every Sunday and <b>the pulpit is used even against the government, but goes unchallenged.</b>
(Like Fridays at the mosque where the imam calls for jihad against the Dar-ul-harb. Christianism=islamism.)

<b>From a poor country like ours, money flows to Rome, from congregations working for the poor and destitute in India, money flows to Vatican. Are these signs of a persecuted church? The flow of money to churches and church-allied 'development organizations' has trebled in the last five years, on Government of India records. Is this a sign of a church under duress?</b>

Why should money from here go to Rome/Vatican? The Cross is not a sign to camouflage lies and cover truth.
(Oh yes, yes it is. Christianism is indefensible. Hilda Raja should stop trying to cover for it.)
The church by its anti-national stand is crucifying Truth. Jesus was faithful to his Jewish traditions and to insult that he was crucified naked on the cross (no loin cloth), so the Bible states. Why should a people who proclaim that they stand for His values become anti-national and betray their own country and countrymen?
(1. Jesus never existed. Hilda pleading for christianism and jeebus while condemning 'christianism in practice'. They are one and the same thing. Heretics preaching to the unconverted again about a 'true christianism' versus the supposedly 'false christianism' we see in reality. But it is and has ever been the <i>only</i> christianism.
2. Christianism has always goaded its sheep to betray the pagan host nation it is festering in. Why this pretense of surprise? Why mislead the Hindu readers of VijayVaani and Rajeev 2004 blog by pretending that treasonous christians are an aberration or are acting non-conformant to christianism rather than admitting to the phenomenon being both historical reality and ground reality? <i>It is the way christianism operates in a large pagan nation under pagan rule.</i> Do I even need to name-drop Rome.)

<b>One is first an Indian - for one cannot change one's nationality but can change one's religion.</b>
(Says the heretic christian.
Any real catholic would say allegiance to the pope pre-empts all other 'priorities'. Hilda is painting a picture of a non-existent catholicism, her personal ideology. It is not the real christianism. Every heretic is unique in their heresy. Every christian is dogmatically the same on issues of the primary importance: like jeebus and loyalty to christianism.
Hilda's pretty picture of a 'could-be' alternative christianism is nothing more than trapping Hindus in a mirage. Such a christianism will never exist. ~1700 years and it does not exist.)
The CBCI and laity leaders cannot do greater harm to the community than participate in the UNCIRF sittings. In fact, they should have protested against this unprecedented move of the Congress under Ms. Sonia Gandhi.

The Christian community cannot be mortgaged for her ulterior political motives. Religion is an emotive issue and once people are permanently divided, national unity will be a thing of the past; at the drop of a hat the country can erupt into civil war. Every communal riot if objectively analyzed was a backlash, and the poor, irrespective of religion, were the victims. The power games of the powerful have torn nations apart by war followed by famines leading to total destruction and subjugation of people.

Interference in our internal affairs must be seen in wider perspective. Invasiveness of any kind in the affairs of a sovereign country means two things - the supervisory role of the invasive country/organization and the subjective, subservient level of the interfered country.

We have a democracy and a Constitution which has stood us well. Except for some aberrations brought by vest interests, the people have always been able to overcome this and to set the tone and tenure for harmonious unity.

India is the only country in the world which has opened its arms to all religions and all people and thus become the cradle of world religions. Fringe Christian churches have been misusing Freedom of Religion for proselytizing, poaching on other churches as well, and creating social tensions. One is not judged by one's religion, but will be judged by the measure of love one has lived with and the Truth one has upheld.

<b>PS: Would the Church permit UNCIRF to visit the convents which have reported rapes, sexual violations, murders and oppression of women (nuns).</b>

The author is a retired Professor from Stella Maris College, Chennai, and lives in Vadodara

http://www.vijayvaani.com/FrmPublicDisplay...cle.aspx?id=573

Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/12/2009 09:42:00 PM 0 comments<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

All the above IS christianism.
It has always invited invasion - also in Rome and many a later European nation that was slowly being christianised while ruled by unconverted leaders. Treason against the host unconverted nation is built into christianism. Can't understand why and how there can be any Hindus alive today that still sweet-talk about christianism and its unfortunate zombies. The 'nationalists' who denounce 'anti-nationalism' even as they shield christianism, are ensuring conditions favourable to the spread of the canker (actually, their psecularism is part of the canker; christo-conditioning being an extension of christianism). They enable the paralysis to spread by making sure no one identifies it or tries to do anything about christianism such as allowing the host body to attack the cause - the ideology - directly, by exposing it. Instead, the self-designated 'nationalists' (pseculars of a degree less) keep protecting the ideology by being defenders of the holy faith and being apologists for it. The apologists jump in at any time the unconverted point to christianism directly and try to steer the finger clear away from the real culprit in the Compendium of Centuries of Crime.
This protectionism of the terrorist ideology by so-called nationalists is extended treachery, brought about in them because of christo-conditioning. In this case, the form of christo-conditioning in the victim (the 'nationalist') is that they always labour to make christianism exempt from all scrutiny or objective appraisals.


<img src='http://www.hoministry.org/images/Apolog5.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
Minerva, Norway

A Post-Christian America



By HÃ¥vard Nyhus

Translated By Lars Erik Schou

11 May 2009

Edited by Louis Standish

Norway - Minerva - Original Article (Norwegian)

The number of non-believers has increased significantly in the last few years, and religion plays a smaller role in American politics. Has the U.S. under Obama started its post-religious phase?

Recently, Obama visited Turkey where he tackled the idea that America is a Judeo-Christian nation: "One of the great strengths of the United States," the president said, "is we do not consider ourselves a Christian nation or a Jewish nation or a Muslim nation. We consider ourselves a nation of citizens who are bound by ideals and a set of values."

The reaction was predictable. Frank Donatelli, head of the Republican think tank GOPAC raged: “Are we to apologize for being Christians?” on CNN. The week before, the Iowa Supreme Court ruled to overturn a ban on same-sex marriage. In other words, this was a tough few weeks for Christian conservatives. And it will get worse.

The first Americans were very strict. Church and state had to be kept separate. America consisted of people who had fled from religious persecution, so the last thing they wanted was a new version of that forced upon them. At his second inaugural speech in 1793, George Washington chose to exclude God completely. God was not saluted once. His successor John Adams would not be outdone, and put his hand on the Constitution instead of the Bible.

Change would soon come. First, through careful re-writing: "that Infinite Power which rules the destinies of the universe"? (Jefferson), “that Power whose providence mercifully protected our national infancy"? (Jackson) and “Him Who has not yet forsaken this favoured land”" (Lincoln). In the 1900s, it really surged: to leave out God would not only be unheard of, but politically impossible. At the last count, God has been mentioned in 43 of 55 inaugurational speeches. (It is worth noticing that Jesus has not been mentioned once.) All this must have seemed confusing for the aging John McCain: in an early phase of the 2007 presidential campaign, he claimed that the Constitution defines America “as a Christian nation.” Just for the record: no, it does not.

Unlike what the atheist or deist George Washington (what the first president believed or did not believe is still a hot potato) foresaw: the repulsion of the European churches did not make religion less popular. On the contrary, an attractive market of free, new church societies blossomed. Here was something for everyone. This surprised Alexis de Tocqueville when he came to America: “"the religious atmosphere of the country was the first thing that struck me on arrival in the United States." And it has been like this for a while. But something is emerging. Whether or not Obama is a Christian – he also supervises an America that is coming to terms with its diversity.

It was easy to miss, but in the fifth paragraph on page 17 in the comprehensive American Religious Identification Survey 2009 published in March, Albert Mohler, Jr. - president of one of the world's largest Baptist societies – found something that struck him with force. One of the survey's findings in particular was alarming: the number of Americans without any religious affiliation has doubled since 1990 – from 8 to 15 percent.
<b>
And even worst: whereas atheism historically was concentrated on the Northwestern coast, it has now spread to southern California, the eastern seaboard and Texas (!). For Mohler, it appeared that the historical foundation for American religious culture was cracking.</b> These were small pockets that could undermine the Christian-conservative agenda. As de Tocqueville also observed: side by side with God-fearing people lived people who had “a great depth of doubt and indifference to faith.”

As Mohler wrote on his blog: “the most basic contours of American culture have been radically altered. The so-called Judeo-Christian consensus of the last millennium has given way to a post-modern, post-Christian, post-Western cultural crisis which threatens the very heart of our culture."

At the same time, several of Mohlers compatriots had more or less come to terms with losing the battles over abortion, school prayer, the teaching of evolution, and same-sex marriage. What happened?

All of a sudden, it seemed so long ago that the American evangelist and church father Charles G. Finney argued that “the great business of the church is to reform the world - to put away every kind of sin.” Christians are bound by duty he claimed, “to exert their influence to secure a legislation that is in accordance with the law of God.” Ronald Reagan used partly the same rhetoric when he talked about America as the "shining city upon a hill."
<b>
Christian forces in America have thought this way for a long time. The sentiments of the church and the legislation of the state should be in sync, the ratio should be 1:1. Not only ideally, but actually. If the church feels it is a sin to drink alcohol, the government should ban alcohol. If the church feels Darwin's theory of evolution is in conflict with the Bible, the government should adjust education accordingly. If the church feels abortion should be banned, the state and the courts should do the same. It is not just a political program, it is about personal duty and religious fulfillment. In other words, there's a lot on the line when the gays are getting married.</b>

Strangely, peace still largely rules Obamaland. The anger that started when obligatory school prayer was overturned by the Supreme Court in 1962 and that was accentuated by the introduction of legal abortion eleven years layer, seems – maybe counterintuitively – to only shrink. Even the noise of the destruction of one gay marriage bulwark after the next is followed by nothing more than a shrug. A kind of resigned “well well, God's kingdom is not of this world.”

This new coming to terms with the imperfection of the state could mostly be the result of increasing “marginalization.” According to the same survey, the proportion of the population that identify themselves as Christians has fallen by 10 percent since 1990, from 86 to 76 percent. This development is also ominous from a Republican perspective: 75% of people who did not belong to any religious society voted for Obama.

A new survey by "Newsweek" shows the same trend: On being asked “Do you think of America as a Christian nation?" only 62 percent said “yes.” Only one year ago, 69 percent said the same thing. Two thirds of the population (68 percent) agree that religion is “losing influence” in American society. In addition, the proportion of people who thinks religion is an answer to all or most of today's problems is at a historic low – 48 percent. Under George W. Bush and Clinton, this number never fell below 58 percent.
<b>
America will still be a nation formed by religious (Christian) faith. We are not talking about Europe here. That fewer people are identifying themselves as Christians does not necessarily mean that the nation is in what Mohler called a “post-Christian phase.”</b> One-third of Americans speaks of themselves as born-again Christians and massive immigration from Latin America increases the number of Catholics.
<b>
The weakening of the Christian conservative movement could even be good news for religion per se – it can be taken back to its home turf instead of being deputizing as a political instrument.</b> Sidelined can be a good way of rediscovering the depths that made the Founding Fathers separate church and state initially. Religious arguments should be treated as one element among many in the larger political discourse – and not as trump cards. You should separate church and state, but separating religion and politics is like separating economy and politics.

And like what Obama touched upon in Turkey: America's greatness has never been connected to a single faith, but to freedom and order.
<!--QuoteBegin-G.Subramaniam+May 17 2009, 05:39 PM-->QUOTE(G.Subramaniam @ May 17 2009, 05:39 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->The lack of anti-incumbency against DMK

<b>What has happened is that 15% of the TN population has been converted
and the church gave a fatwa for the DMK</b>

expressbuzz

DMK may have the last laugh in Kumari


G Babu Jayakumar[right][snapback]97375[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->And that's not the sole effect of this christianisation.
(The second item below was already posted by G Sub in the elections thread.)

1. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/vid...rmented-by.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Video on Hindus being tormented by Christists in Kanyakumari</b>
may 16th, 2009

welcome to kanyakumari, which the christists maintain is,  kkkanyaka mariam, the alleged virgin mother of their alleged god.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: sri

Here are two videos showing on how Hindus in Kanyakumari are being tormented.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCafsC2xhbk&NR=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0gkD16-_...re=related

Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/16/2009 10:15:00 PM 0 comments<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
2. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/see...ularism-in.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>See how Kanyakumari voted: Secularism in full force</b>
may 16th, 2009

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: sri

http://www.expressbuzz.com/edition/story.a...MyXZKtxw==&SEO=

DMK may have the last laugh in Kumari


G Babu JayakumarFirst Published : 13 May 2009 04:03:00 AM ISTLast
Updated : 13 May 2009 06:56:08 AM ISTCHENNAI: In an eleventh hour
swing, DMK's Helen Davidson could emerge victorious from Kanyakumari
constituency as many churches in the district have identified her,
during Sunday worship, as the candidate for their congregations to
vote for.


Though Christian candidates traditionally had an edge in the
communally polarised district, BJP's Pon Radhakrishnan intitially had
a bright chance of cornering the seat as the Christian vote bank was
expected to split into three. Radhakrishnan's opponents were three
Christians - A V Bellarmine of the CPM, S Austin of the DMDK and Helen
Davidson.

But then, the Sunday service in the various churches across the
district seemed to have turned voters in favour of the DMK. While most
Catholic churches have openly declared Helen Davidson, who is also a
Catholic, as their favoured candidate - not the other Catholic,
Bellarmine - to clear the doubts of the community, some pentecostal
congregations were told by preachers to vote for her.

Besides that, directions were given from many protestant CSI church
pulpits, too, to the faithful to favour the candidate of the 'secular
front.' A few pastors are said to have named her and some have even
identified the DMK's election symbol- the 'rising sun.'  Till Sunday,
it was thought that since Helen Davidson is a Roman Catholic, the
dominant community of CSI Christian Nadars might favour Austin, who is
one of them and had been an MLA and Rajya Sabha MP. It was also
beleived that the resentment among Congress workers and the general
public over the constituency not being allotted to the Congress party
could turn voters against the DMK. Since Radhakrishnan, who was MP
between 1999 and 2004, had endeared himself to sections of Christians
through his 'soft nature,' many felt that a large section of CSI
Christians would vote for him.

On earlier occassions, too, candidates from the Christian community
had benefitted from such announcements.

Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/16/2009 10:16:00 PM 0 comments<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/beh...e-and-love.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>behold the future of india: peace and love break out on a beach in kerala</b>
may 17th, 2009

in a clash between the RoP and the RoL on the coast near <b>trivandrum</b>, four RoP people were killed and a few RoL houses were gutted. i guess this is a mini-crusade?

the communist government immediately announced grants of rs. 10 lakh to each of the RoP guys' next of kin. (but naturally.)

<b>this is the second time in a couple of years that RoL and RoP have engaged in this kind of lovefest.</b>

<b>the last time</b>, the RoL guys were quite upset at the alacrity with which the government rebuilt the RoP houses. apparently, then the provocation was some <b>overtures by some young men of peace to some young women of the love variety.</b>

not known what caused peace and love to break out this time. but i suspect the peace people are in shock that they too can die (from too much luuuuuv). normally their job is to kill, not die. i am sure that there will an enquiry by both ratzy and the USCIRF into this, or maybe they will keep quiet because the love people were clearly doing the loving.

enquiring minds might want to know <b>why no hindus were killed.</b>

well, isn't it obvious? the hindus have already been given their choice: convert, die or flee. there are no hindus left on the coast. the great 'saint' francis xavier converted the fishermen at gunpoint (but with great love) some centuries ago, and now the peaceful people, flush with arab money and pakistani counterfeit rupees, are buying up the coast, much to the chagrin of the the love guys.

<b>when your flight lands in trivandrum, you can see four or five pink or green mosques, some of them monstrously large and brand new, and six or seven churches, complete with red neon crosses on top, beckoning. the one old hindu temple there, a devi temple, has been given a present by the communists -- a giant 50-feet-long statue of a voluptuous, big-breasted, half-naked, obviously sexually aroused woman, which is placed strategically just in front of the temple.</b>

this is a sneak preview of india's future, now that the elections have been stolen. mughalistan, meet christiststan. and oh, i don't know why the christists are not pontificating about 'unity' as they usually do in this instance. what, no 'unity' with mohammedans, eh, christists?

Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/18/2009 08:49:00 AM 0 comments <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Still on that ^


http://haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx?P...706&SKIN=K
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>Christian- Muslim Riot - 5 Killed</b>
18/05/2009 12:32:55  HK

THIRUVANANTHAPURAM: Five persons were killed and about <b>35 injured in clashes between Muslims and Christians at Cheriyathura here on Sunday.Those who were killed all belong to Muslim community.</b> It is yet to be confirmed whether the deaths occurred owing to the attack from the opposing group or in police firing.Thirty- eight persons who were injured in the clashes have been admitted to the ThiruvananthapuramMedical College Hospital and several others were admitted to a private hospital.
(Let's play catholicism with the truth and do a Cedric Prakash: "It's a GENOCIDE! 2000 muslims killed by christians in Thiruvananthapuram! Call in the USCIRF!")


The Clashes were reported between thugs in Muslim dominated Beemapally area and Christian dominated Cheriyathura area.The recent clashes were a result of earlier clashes in the area between Christians and Muslims over sharing the fish captured from the sea. The Mafia gangs of Christians and Jihadi's involved in CD Piracy business had turned the area into a lawless region within the Capital city. Hindus in the area were evicted from the area years back by the highhandedness of these so called Minority groups. Church and fundamental Jihadi organisations are running parallel law and order in the area, No political parties or Police forces ever dare to question this mafia culture. The present flare up is the result of this attitude by authorities and Politicians.

<b>Within no time State Government declared 10 lakh Compensation for those killed in the riot and 1 lakh compensation for those injured.</b> It is worth recollecting to note here that State compensation to the families of 8 Hindus who were butchered in Maradu  by Jihadi terrorists were declared only after continuous protest by Hindu organisations.
(Compensation money for the christoislamiterrorists comes from Hindu Temple money looted from Hindus. The same Hindu money that would not be used to help our own people butchered by the same christoislamism.)<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Comments at the link:

http://haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx?P...706&SKIN=K
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Girish 19/05/2009 09:45:03  Funny</b>
I was going through various articles on the net about this..All the articles said clashes between two communities..None said Clash between Christians and Muslims!!!!

<b>Babu Menon 19/05/2009 07:37:35  Complacent BJP</b>
There is no mention of the Muslim X Christian angle of the incident in any media, print or electronic. The media is playing down the whole issue..If it had anything to do with even a single Hindu they would have started crying in full noise against communal Vs. secular etc..Oommen Chandy wasted no time to demand a judicial inquiry which will prevent all sorts of police action against the culprits till the inquiry is over.. Why our foolish BJP leaders of Kerala can't see through these games and atlease come out with some sensible statements..???

<b>Jawahar.P.Sekhar 18/05/2009 22:33:43  Appeasement</b>
It is not important whether the dead persons were thugs,mafia members or even terrorists. Only factor under consideration is whether they belong to the so called Minority community.Home minister Kodiyeri Balakrishnan lost no time in rushing From New Delhi to Thiruvananthapuram even cancelling his important scedule of attending Polit Bureau meeting. With out fully confirming whether they died because of Police firing or from the attack of the rival group( in this case the Christians)compensation of 10 lakhs each for the dead has been announced. What an efficiency and concern. As far as minority appeasement is concerned both UDF and LDF are always competing each other. LDF seems not learned from the recent past bitter experience of losing in 16 Lok Sabha constituencies in Kerala including Kannur, Kozhikode (payment seat by Haris Aboobaker ? )and Ponnani even with the support of PDP.
Appeasement will not work always as Mayavati learned and declared indirectly just after the election results by admitting that in many constituencies BSP lost because in those constituencies the Muslims did not vote for BSP because the candidates were non-Muslims.

<b>Ramkumar 18/05/2009 20:16:58  CPM has not learned anything from election result</b>
Communist lost the last election due to the minority appeasement policy. If they continue the minority appeasement policy they will exinct from the Kerala. Major votebank for communists are hindus because Muslims vote for Muslim League and christians to Kerala congress. Who is left are the hindus who normally vote for communists but communists are taking their support for granted.


<b>Sajith 18/05/2009 12:56:44  Government reaction</b>
Nobody knows how 5 people killed. May be killed by the rival gang or police fire.
(Actually, the christos and islamis tried to murder each other for the second time in that region, see the Rajeev2004 blog's summary of this in the post above.)
But how fast the Government declared about the finacial assistance for the relatives of the victims? That is vote bank power! They care only minorities. If the victims are Hindus, nobody care! What they gave Marad victims family? We, Hindus are slaves. Slaves of the minorities. Governments and its assistance only for the minorities. Those people ruling this country are enimies of Hindus. If we cant wake up now, Nobody can save Hindus.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Catholic Church shamed by Irish abuse report</b><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->DUBLIN – After a nine-year investigation, a commission published a damning report Wednesday on decades of rapes, humiliation and beatings at Catholic Church-run reform schools for Ireland's castaway children.

The 2,600-page report painted the most detailed and damning portrait yet of church-administered abuse in a country grown weary of <b>revelations about child molestation by priests</b>.

The investigation of the tax-supported schools uncovered previously secret Vatican records that demonstrated church knowledge of pedophiles in their ranks all the way back to the 1930s.

Wednesday's five-volume report on the probe — which was resisted by Catholic religious orders — concluded that church officials shielded their orders' pedophiles from arrest amid a culture of self-serving secrecy.

...............
<b>The Christian Brothers, which ran several boys' institutions deemed to have harbored serial child molesters and sadists on their staff, insisted it had cooperated fully with the probe</b>. The order successfully sued the commission in 2004 to keep the identities of all of its members, dead or alive, unnamed in the report. No real names, whether of victims or perpetrators, appear in the final document.

The Christian Brothers' leader in Ireland, Brother Kevin Mullan, said the organization had been right to keep names secret because "perhaps we had doubts about some of the allegations."
.....................
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
1. More on the matter of the posts #534-535:
http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/toi...kkkangress.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Thursday, May 21, 2009
<b>TOI's advice to BJP: be like kkkangress, create communal riots where only hindus are killed; and what christist media does when RoP and RoL 'luuuuuuv' each other</b>
may 20th, 2009

TOI's advice: be the kkkangress, that is the way to success in elections.

the unbiased observer can ask:
a) who says the kkkangress is successful in elections? in 2004, when the election was not rigged, they got just 7 more seats than the bjp
b) in 2009, when they rigged the EVMs, they got a lot of seats which nobody voted them in for.

TOI claims that in orissa, the bjp provoked communal riots. the fact that the christists assassinated an 84-year-old monk, a nun, and a small child with AK-47s somehow seems to have escaped the TOI's attention.

this is similar to the TOI claiming that the gujarat riots were, in effect, started by the bjp against innocent mohammedans, who if james astill were there to write purple prose would have been "sitting around wondering what was going on". the fact that they burned alive 59 women and children in a train is omitted.

there has been an amusing situation in the christist voice in kerala, the malayala manorama. there was a christist-mohammedan riot in the outskirts of trivandrum (not the first one there), at cheriyathura, a christist area, which i believe is in close proximity to beemapally, a mohammedan mosque area, where there has long been a thriving bazaar also in smuggled goods. (one would conclude that lots of boats are coming to the area, and not necessarily with fish in them).

<b>but the christists are scared of the mohammedans. so the manorama, which usually thunders about alleged attacks on christists, kept very quiet. so did john dayal and valson thampu. if you read the reporting in the malayala manorama, you would be hard-pressed to realize that christists had rioted which ended up in the deaths of 5 mohammedans. the impartial observer would conclude -- based on the discreet reports that did not mention christists at all -- that this was yet another hindu-mohammedan riot.</b>
(This is what goes into christoarchive. Aka what christoterrorism will call "history" in the future.)

extremely interesting. even though 5 mohammedans were killed in police firing, and several christist boats and fishing nets and houses were burned, nobody is asking for judge "spontaneous combustion" banerjee to give his report. nobody is ranting about the state government (even though it is communist, and the christists have been running a crusade against it) having murdered 5 mohammedans, or standing by while christist shacks (yeah, some of them must have been 'churches') were destroyed. the TOI, nor the Christist, nor NDTV, nor CNN-IBN reported heavily on this incident, nor did they condemn the extremists on both sides.
("The Christist" for "The Chindu"! Just priceless. Two words, and says it all.)

it appears that mohammedans were on the warpath (christist houses, boats, fishing nets) destroyed -- but they didn't manage to kill any christists. not yet, that is.

christists are terrified that, just like in maraad, kozhikode, the mohammedans are plotting bloody revenge. (if you forgot maraad, that is where there was a clash between hindus and mohammedans, 2 hindus and 3 mohammedans died. a year later, a bunch of armed mohammedans ambushed unarmed hindus on the beach and killed 9 of them, and then vanished by boat. just prior to this, all the mohammedans in the area had mysteriously vanished. when the police wanted to check the mosque for weapons, wailing burqa-clad mohammedan females appeared to prevent them from doing so. when the police anyway went in, they found blood-stained swords hidden there. can we say "malice aforethought", boys and girls? and oh, it is rumored that some very high up mohammedan ministers were fully involved in the conspiracy.)

i wonder what the TOI's advice would be to the mohammedans of
Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/21/2009 12:29:00 AM
0 comments:
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

2. Related to Mudy's post just above:
http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/luu...aten-raped.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>luuuuv in action: Thousands beaten, raped in christist schools in ireland</b>
may 20th, 2009

i once posted here a report about an irish film on the abuse and torure of girls in reform schools. i thought that was ancient history. but no, this has been going on until pretty recently.

i wonder when there will be a similar expose of what goes on today in numerous nunneries in kerala. you know, the place where sister abhaya was beaten over the head with an axe because she happened on a godwoman bonking two godmen simultaneously in the kitchen.

god's little brides. or something like that. yeah, right.

how about ratzy being charged with crimes against humanity? abuse of 30,000 people is pretty serious stuff.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/21/world/eu...ref=global-home

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <yashwini

<b>Thousands beaten, raped in Irish reform schools</b>
http://www.honestreports.co.cc/
Associated Press
May 20, 2009

DUBLIN – A fiercely debated, nine-year investigation into Ireland's Roman Catholic-run institutions says priests and nuns terrorized thousands of boys and girls in workhouse-style schools for decades — and government inspectors failed to stop the chronic beatings, rapes and humiliation.

High Court Justice Sean Ryan on Wednesday unveiled the 2,600-page final report of Ireland's Commission to Inquire Into Child Abuse, which is based on testimony from thousands of former students and officials from more than 250 church-run institutions.

More than 30,000 children deemed to be petty thieves, truants or from dysfunctional families — a category that often included unmarried mothers — were sent to Ireland's austere network of industrial schools, reformatories, orphanages and hostels from the 1930s until the last church-run facilities shut in the 1990s.

... deleted

Behind Locked Doors @ http://www.reformation.org/maria-monk.html

Do Nuns die Virgins @ http://honestreporting.wordpress.com/2008/...ns-die-virgins/

Ex-Nun's Confessions @ http://honestreporting.wordpress.com/2009/02/27/295/


Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/20/2009 09:09:00 AM 0 comments<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
X-post

Kerala. Christoterrorists' handiwork.

http://haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx?P...707&SKIN=C
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Sarppakavvu Vandalised by Pentacost Missionaries</b>
18/05/2009 14:32:39  HK

Kottarakara: Pallikkal Elappuram Nagaraja Temple (Sarppakavu) was under attack last day by a group of miscreants. <b>Centuries old idols of Nagaraja, Siva and Nagayakshi were destroyed.</b>

The frustration of Pentacost Missionaries who targeted the near by colony for conversion is said to be behind the attack on Temple. The residents of colony are staunch devotees of this sarpakavu- The temple which was a hindrance to their conversion attempts itself have been now destroyed by the cunning Missionaries who exploit the poor and naive.

<b>Police team under C I Pradeep Kumar registered case and started investigation. Hundreds of devotees assembled to protest against this attack on the temple.</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

And the comments:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Not ur kind
20/05/2009 07:17:33  Natural born Looser hindus
ha ha ha ha ha....natural born looser hindus......

Nice Story and Nice fake aggitations.... ha ha ha ha
(Ignore. Just another christian=terrorist.)

Wagamama
<b>19/05/2009 17:36:40  Bible promotes such heinous acts
HERE IS THE BIBLICAL VERSE WHEREIN CHRIST PROMOTES THE DESTRUCTION OF PAGAN WORSHIP PLACES!!
(Actually, Deuteronomy is OT, if I'm right. But then jeebus=gawd, so yeah, christ IS the one promoting the terrorism)

<i>You must demolish completely all the places where the nations whom you are about to dispossess served their gods, on the mountain heights, on the hills, and under every leafy tree. Break down their altars, smash their pillars, burn their sacred poles with fire, and hew down the idols of their gods, and thus blot out their name from their places. You shall not worship the Lord your God in such ways.(Deuteronomy 12:2-4)</i></b>
(Can be confirmed in any bible. But see for instance Google book.)

vinod
<b>19/05/2009 03:23:08  adishankara temple theft??
have we also started forgetting that ..no development so far..pity</b>

vinod
19/05/2009 00:35:56  reaction
RSS or VHP in Kerala cannot react they have no energy. Those who spoiled the naga, shiva idols will pay a huge price for what they have done!

Sanesh
18/05/2009 19:28:41  BJP and RSS to lead the protest
Being a pro hindu organization, BJP and RSS including the state level leaders should react to this issue. Bring it to nationl level media. stage a protest march at the district head quarters. Include all the people from the colony.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

This is what christianism does.

Repeat:
- Korea
http://www.buddhapia.com/eng/tedesco/pic1/list.html
http://www.buddhapia.com/eng/tedesco/2.html
http://www.buddhapia.com/eng/tedesco/3.html

Note how the timelines of christian terrorism against Korean Buddhism and its Temples shows the same pattern.

- Greece (and Rome):
http://ysee.gr/index-eng.php?type=english&f=lovestories
[right][snapback]97597[/snapback][/right]
^ More relevant: Christoterrorists desecrate Hindu Temple in Kerala (news from 18 May 2009).



Over 2 posts.

1. http://rajeev2004.blogspot.com/2009/05/dai...eriment-in.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->i do love this quote. so appropriate. reminds me of the hatchet-faced young 'father' kappan who was defrocked for buggering little boys at the school i went to.
(Naturally the christopriest=paedophile only got defrocked. Not excommunicated, of course. After all, priests will never be excommunicated for such things as paedophilia, as per the christo-rite of elevation to the priesthood - which states that once they are a catholic priest they are always a priest. See point 3 below.)

Alfred Hitchcock, the great movie director who specialised in frightening people, was once driving in Switzerland when he suddenly pointed out of the car window and said, "That is the most frightening sight I have ever seen." It was a priest in conversation with a little boy, his hand on the boy's shoulder.

Hitchcock leaned out of the car window and shouted, "Run, little boy! Run for your life!"

[...]
Posted by nizhal yoddha at 5/18/2009 09:57:00 PM 0 comments<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

2. Anyway, what I came to post:
http://haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx?P...712&SKIN=W
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--> 'The Catholic church failed me. I despised myself and lost all confidence'
20/05/2009 08:33:37 

  An inquiry into child abuse by Catholic priests is published today. Its impact will be seismic, says victim and author of new book, Colm O'Gorman.

Few men have made such an extraordinary personal journey. Raped and abused in his early teens by Father Sean Fortune, one of Ireland's most notorious paedophiles, Colm O'Gorman ran away from home when he was 17 and lived rough on the streets of Dublin. It was the Seventies, when both church and state were in full-blown denial that any priest could be guilty of sexually abusing a child, and Colm felt only shame and fear. His future could not have been bleaker.

Yet, with effort and determination he fought back, spoke out about the abuse, and in 2002 even tried to sue the Pope arguing that, by moving paedophile priests like Fortune to different parishes and deliberately concealing their actions from the local authorities, the Vatican had failed to protect children like him. He was outraged when the <span style='color:red'>Pope claimed diplomatic immunity</span> <b>but, undaunted, continued to campaign that the authority of the Irish church should not be above that of the State.</b>
(The Popes used to have unquestioned diplomatic immunity before. But of course they still get that now.)

Read Full Report at

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics...confidence.html<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Comment: 
Sanesh
20/05/2009 19:51:04  "Pope's damaging Africa" - says Runi
Go to 20th May 2009 Times of India news on page 20.
http://epaper.timesofindia.com/Archive/ski...W=1242873945265

One more news
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4081276.stm<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics...onfidence..html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>'The Catholic church failed me. I despised myself and lost all confidence'</b>
An inquiry into child abuse by Catholic priests is published today. Its impact will be seismic, says victim and author of new book, Colm O'Gorman.


By Angela Levin
Last Updated: 10:42AM BST 20 May 2009
Colm O'Gorman
In his autobiography, Colm O'Gorman courageously describes being abused by a Catholic priest Photo: ANDREW CROWLEY

Few men have made such an extraordinary personal journey. Raped and abused in his early teens by Father Sean Fortune, one of Ireland's most notorious paedophiles[/b], Colm O'Gorman ran away from home when he was 17 and lived rough on the streets of Dublin. It was the Seventies, when both church and state were in full-blown denial that any priest could be guilty of sexually abusing a child, and Colm felt only shame and fear. His future could not have been bleaker.

Yet, with effort and determination he fought back, spoke out about the abuse, and in 2002 even tried to sue the Pope arguing that, by moving paedophile priests like Fortune to different parishes and deliberately concealing their actions from the local authorities, the Vatican had failed to protect children like him. He was outraged when the Pope claimed diplomatic immunity but, undaunted, continued to campaign that the authority of the Irish church should not be above that of the State.

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      Vatican 'damaged' by row over rape victim aged 9

Today, nearly 30 years since he was abused, Colm's hour has finally come with the publication of a long-awaited inquiry into child abuse by Roman Catholic priests. [/B]The investigation has taken nine years, during which time it has heard the testimony of thousands of former residents of state schools and orphanages over more than 60 years in the Irish Republic.

A second report, due to be published in the summer, is expected to criticise the handling of <b>sex-abuse complaints in cases involving up to 500 priests.</b> Colm believes the result of the inquiry will be "seismic."

<b>"It will show that the state has an obligation of care to those who live in the country and can no longer declare that religion and politics don't mix, or that the abuse of children by Catholic priests was not a matter for the state."</b>
(Imagine a christian India. Catholic Ireland sounds like it was a medieval mainland Europe: one where catholic power was absolute and 'secular' power was subordinated to it.)

The report coincides to the day with the publication of his extraordinary autobiography, in which Colm courageously describes the lows and highs of his remarkable life – a life that has included founding a charity for victims of sexual abuse, becoming a Senator, making a documentary for the BBC called Suing the Pope, and being appointed Ireland's director of Amnesty International.

"At the centre of my book is my own dreadful experience and its impact," he says. "But I also wanted it to cover wider issues. I don't want people to assume that when they see someone in a doorway they know who they are, where they have come from and where they are headed. I also wanted to address the importance of the relationship between father and son and how redeeming it is."

Colm, the second of six children, had a distant relationship with his own father, Sean, a farmer turned councillor, when he was a boy, and the two men only became close a year or so before his father died of cancer in his early sixties.

I have interviewed several sufferers of systematic sexual abuse, but Colm, almost uniquely, doesn't come across as a victim. Nor is he self-conscious or bitter. He fixes you with his eyes as he speaks and seems totally at ease with himself as we talk in a smart central London café.

Did he make a conscious decision not to be a victim? "There wasn't a moment when I thought I won't allow this to happen," he replies. "But I didn't dare address my feelings until I was in my early thirties. Until then, I only reacted to the external world, not my internal one. I believe you are only a victim because you are powerless to be anything else, and that being a survivor of sexual abuse is a positive thing to be."

Colm grew up in Adamstown, County Wexford, and was 14 when he first met Father Sean Fortune, then in his late 20s. Fortune cynically groomed the former altar boy and his mother, Josie, now 72, flattering them both and asking Colm to help him with a youth group in his parish a few miles from the seaside resort of Fethard-on-Sea, in the south-west of the county.

When Colm agreed, he drove him to his home and raped him. Colm was too scared to tell anyone. "He made it seem as though it was my fault and I knew it would be my word against his," he says. Colm was then ruthlessly abused for almost two years. The effect was devastating.

"I despised myself, lost all my confidence and any plan I had for my life, such as university and a career, went out of the window. I remember on one occasion when I was 15 and Fortune came to collect me, trying desperately to tell my mother what was happening so that I didn't have to be with him. But I was unable to find the words and, not knowing the truth, she made me go. As I got into his car, I felt absolute hopelessness."

When Colm was 16, his mother decided to leave Ireland and moved to an ashram in India, taking three of her six children with her. Colm and two other siblings stayed with their father. The marriage was effectively over, and a few months later, in February 1984, Colm ran away to Dublin. He had no money and for seven months allowed men to have sex with him in return for a night's sleep in a bed and a hot shower.

Gradually he hauled himself out of the gutter by working first as a waiter, and then fund-raising for a charity. He was reunited with his family when he was 18, confiding then to his sister, Barbara, and his father about the abuse. "My father apologised to me for not knowing what was happening. It was a tremendous thing because I had spent all my life terrified of what would happen if he found out."

His shocked father had no idea what to do and Colm let the matter rest, moving to London in 1986 where he trained as a therapist.

It was only in 1995, however, that Colm found the courage to go to the police. "It was 14 years after I was first abused, but I couldn't have done it before. I went because I was concerned others might be suffering as I did, and that the Church was condoning it by not doing anything. My statement to the detective took me two days to make and was the first time that the truth of what Fortune had done to me began to emerge.

"In the months that followed, others came forward, which was both shocking and a comfort for me because it meant I wasn't alone. It took another 18 months before I began to realise that the Church had received earlier complaints about Fortune, and that they knew that he may have abused boys before he was even ordained. But that they did nothing."

The knowledge made Colm determined to bring the priest to justice. Fortune's trial was set for March 2, 1999 when he faced 66 charges of abusing children. Eleven days into the trial, he killed himself with whisky and prescription drugs, denying his many victims their first chance to be heard.

Colm is neither vindictive, nor forgiving. "Forgiving him isn't in my gift," he says. "My understanding of forgiveness is based on a Catholic model of confession and absolution and I can't absolve him. But I have forgiven myself."

<b>Colm went on successfully to sue the Catholic Church and received a payment of 300,000 euros and a historic public apology in court. "As for the Pope ducking out," he says, "I think it is an obscenity and I remain outraged by the failure of the Vatican. They are not responsible for what (Father Sean) Fortune did but they should take responsibility for what they did, in concealing the issue.

"With the stroke of a pen, Benedict XVI could make a law demanding high standards of child protection across the Catholic world and do more to protect the welfare of children than any other human being, but he hasn't done it."</b>

Meanwhile Colm's life has moved on. He has returned to Ireland and for the past 10 years has lived with Paul Fyffe, an IT teacher. They are joint guardians of two children aged 12 and 10, whose mother has died, and who live with them.

"I love family life," he says. "I am now a very happy man personally, but also <b>delighted that there is a major change in Ireland and that people are no longer reluctant to question the authority of the Church."</b>

<b>Beyond Belie' (Beyond belief?)</b> by Colm O'Gorman (Hodder & Stoughton) is available from Telegraph Books for £11.99 + £1.25 p&p. To order, call 0844 871 1515 or visit books.telegraph.co.uk
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

3. On: Why there's no excommunication of christopriests for their paedophilia. (Do christo-nuns get excommunicated for their paedophilia though? Don't know.)

http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/excom.html
via http://freetruth.50webs.org/D1.htm
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->    Crimen Sollicitationes was quietly approved on March 16, 1962, by the so-called "good pope" John XXIII (Angelo Roncalli), revered for bringing together the Second Vatican Council which for better or worse has opened the Church to the light. Issued by the Supreme and Holy Congregation of the Holy Office — now known as the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, and formerly known as the Holy Inquisition — it contains the procedures to be used in the cases of priests accused of soliciting sex while hearing private confessions.
    This is not a new problem, but one with which the Church has struggled since confession became a private ritual.

    Everything is spelled out in technical language with rigorous detail and absolutely all testimony is to be kept as a "secret of the Holy Office." Oaths are to be taken from all involved under the pain of automatic excommunication which the Pope alone can forgive. Likewise any person propositioned by a priest in confession who "knowingly" did not denounce that priest to the bishop within a month of the incident, was likewise automatically excommunicated.

    <b>Unlike such dire offenses as scattering pieces of the consecrated Host upon the ground or striking the Pope himself, none of these crimes merit excommunication. And indeed, as far as I know, not one, not a single priestly predator has ever been excommunicated for their crimes.</b> No matter how notorious, they may have been laicized under pressure but still only at their own request. Yet laicization only removes the legal right, but not the power or ability, to perform the sacraments. <b>Removing the priestly power, like the "indelible mark on the soul" made by baptism, cannot be done according to Catholic doctrine. "Thou art a priest forever, according to the order of Melchizedek," the ordination ritual proclaims, and the clerics take it seriously.</b>

    Apologists for the Church claim that Crimen Sollicitationes is not a "smoking gun" demonstrating a church-wide cover-up of clergy abuse. Rather, they declare that the concern over secrecy is related to the all-important secrecy of the confessional. Further, they say that these laws are only the laws of the Church, that these procedures in no way forbid seeking civil and legal remedies before going to the Church.

    Further, the document itself is secret. There is some question, in fact, if most bishops even knew of it, though canon lawyers certainly did as they continued to discuss its provisions until recently, when it was superceded by new norms.
    <b>Since all was to be kept secret, victims who speak out later give scandal to the Church, and should be thus automatically excommunicated as well. No wonder they have been treated so poorly. Victims are treated as enemies by the Roman Church</b> because that is how the hierarchy sees them. ...Moreover, the bishops were required to keep the policy secret as well under the pain of excommunication. So they have lied, and lied, and continue to lie, under the direct orders of the Vatican.

Link http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/excom.html<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Paedophile priests don't get excommunicated, but victims who come forth will:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>The World Uncovered: Sex crimes and the Vatican - BBC, October 21, 2006</b>
http://www.bbcworld.com/content/template_c...asp?pageid=2892

<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->    A secret document which sets out a procedure for dealing with child sex abuse scandals within the Catholic Church is examined by Panorama.
    .... Crimen Sollicitationis was written in 1962 in Latin and given to Catholic bishops worldwide who are ordered to keep it locked away in the church safe. It instructs them how to deal with priests who solicit sex from the confessional. It also deals with "any obscene external act ... with youths of either sex." It imposes an oath of secrecy on the child victim, the priest dealing with the allegation and any witnesses. Breaking that oath means excommunication from the Catholic Church.
    Reporting for Panorama, Colm O'Gorman finds seven priests with child abuse allegations made against them living in and around the Vatican City.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

See the translated document <b>Crimen Sollicitationes</b>. http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/CrimenS...tiones.pdf

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->    This [the document Crimen Sollicitationes] shows that the Church considered itself above secular law even well into modern times. <b>In order to keep these cases secret, excommunication could be invoked on victims, witnesses, participants and the accused.</b>
    At last, there may be an explanation of why bishops have so consistently lied — they were just obeying orders from Rome, under penalty of eternal damnation.

Link http://www.priestsofdarkness.com/pd-index.html#archive<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Post 538 far more important (christoterrorists desecrate Hindu Temple in Kerala - news from 18 May 2009).



Continued from previous (#539).

4. Now, who will get excommunicated? Since the Pope is a mirror of the character of jeebusjehovallah (representative of christ/gawd on earth; the 'vicar of christ'), his behaviour answers the central christian questions:
- those who are <i>not</i> excommunicated, don't go to hell;
- those who are excommunicated.... (are finally free from christo-paedophilia)

A look at those who <i>do</i> get excommunicated (vs those who don't, whom we were already acquainted with, like in the examples in the previous post):

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...ape-victim.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Vatican 'damaged' by row over rape victim aged 9</b>
A senior archbishop has said the Vatican was wrong to condemn two doctors who carried out an abortion on a nine-year-old girl who fell pregnant after being raped.


By Nick Squires In Rome
Last Updated: 9:15PM GMT 16 Mar 2009

He admitted the Church's "credibility" had been hurt by the bitter row over the termination in Brazil, a month after the rehabilitation of a Holocaust-denying British Catholic bishop raised questions about the Pope's judgment.

<b>In the second public relations controversy to hit the Catholic Church in weeks, the Pope's advisers appeared to be at loggerheads over the excommunication of medics who performed an abortion on Brazilian girl made pregnant with twins by her stepfather.</b>


<b>The girl's mother was also excommunicated for authorising the termination of the pregnancy, which was discovered when the girl complained of stomach pains and told officials she had been abused since the age of six.</b>

Archbishop Rino Fisichella, who heads the Vatican's Pontifical Academy for Life, criticised the move and said the Church should have showed a greater sense of mercy to the child.

While upholding the Church's implacable opposition to abortion, he said the decision to excommunicate the doctors, taken by a Brazilian archbishop, "hurts the credibility of our teaching, which appears in the eyes of many as insensitive, incomprehensible and lacking mercy".

The doctors did not deserve to be excommunicated for the "arduous decision" they had made to perform the abortion, because the girl's life would have been in danger if the pregnancy had continued, he said.

Archbishop Fisichella's opinion, carried prominently in the Vatican's semi-official newspaper, L'Osservatore Romano, put him at odds with another highly ranked Vatican official.

Cardinal Giovanni Battista Re, the head of the Congregation for Bishops, has insisted that the twins should have been allowed to live and that the attacks on the Brazilian archbishop who announced the excommunications were "unjustified".

"It is a sad case but the real problem is that the twins conceived were two innocent persons, who had the right to live and could not be eliminated," he said. "Life must always be protected."

The row over the girl's abortion, which was carried out last week, has stretched from the corridors of the Vatican to the streets of Brazil, where it prompted a huge public debate over the Church's lack of compassion.

In response to public anger, Brazilian bishops last week said that the excommunications were wrong and would not be applied.

The split within the Vatican comes a few days after the Pope released an unusually candid letter in which he admitted that mistakes were made over the decision to rehabilitate Richard Williamson, a maverick British bishop who questioned the Holocaust.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


5. Another example of someone very catholic who didn't get excommunicated when he was paedophiling. The vatican is finally investigating him! But not for what you think: they're after him for .... having a wife and child. (Eeewwww. It was probably rape. Can you imagine anyone willingly marrying this guy? Save the kid!!!)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...olic-order.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>The Pope investigates hardline Catholic order</b>
The Pope has taken the unusual step of ordering an investigation into an ultra-conservative Roman Catholic order after it revealed that its late founder had a mistress and fathered a child.


By Nick Squires in Rome
Last Updated: 6:08PM BST 31 Mar 2009

<b>The Legionaries of Christ revealed in February that its Mexican founder, Rev Marcial Maciel, who died last year at the age of 87, had a daughter who is now in her twenties.

For decades he was also faced allegations that he sexually abused seminarians, and was disciplined by the Vatican on the charges in 2006.</b>
(Reference to Maciel's rampant paedophilia: ABC news report of Priestly Sin, Cover-Up: Powerful Cardinal in Vatican Accused of Sexual Abuse Cover-Up - by Brian Ross for ABC news, April 26, 2002. It describes His Most Catholic Eminence, the Reverend Maciel AKA the Arch-Paedophile as the Vatican knows him.
Disgusting read. DO NOT READ IT.)

Pope Benedict XVI will now send senior clerics to all the institutions run by the influential order, one of the fastest-growing in the Church.

Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, the Vatican secretary of state, wrote to the head of the Legion saying that the Pontiff was intervening to help "overcome the present difficulties."

<b>The Legionaries of Christ was much admired by the late Pope John Paul II for its conservative views, strict loyalty to Vatican teaching and success in enrolling recruits.

It was founded by Rev Maciel in Mexico in 1941 and now operates in around 20 countries, enjoying particularly rapid growth in Latin America. It has 1,300 seminarians, 700 priests and runs a pontifical university in Rome.

But the revelations about its founder having a sexual relationship with a woman, and fathering a daughter who now lives in Spain, have tarnished its reputation.</b>

Its current head, Rev Alvaro Corcuera, said the Legionaries welcomed the Vatican visitation "with deep gratitude".

He said the Pope had offered his support as the order faces "our present vicissitudes related to the grave facts in our father founder's life."
(<i>Of course</i> they were not troubled by the founder's long-outed paedophilia, which the Vatican covered for. Again, ref: Priestly Sin, Cover-Up: Powerful Cardinal in Vatican Accused of Sexual Abuse Cover-Up - by Brian Ross for ABC news, April 26, 2002.
They're only bothered when a catholic priest breaks a CATHOLIC law like getting married and having kids. But when catholic priests abuse children - that's not against christianism, so it's not a worry to them.)

The Vatican spokesman, Rev Federico Lombardi, said the inspection was the process by which the Church obtained firsthand knowledge about a problem in an order, diocese or parish.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, one can say it. "Christianism: one <i>SICK</i> ideology."


6. Final for now.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/...a-disaster.html
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Vatican insiders declare the Pope a 'disaster'</b>
Pope Benedict's repeated gaffes and the Vatican's inability to manage his message in the internet era are <b>threatening to undermine his papacy, Vatican insiders have said.</b>
(He drilled a hole himself of course. The Vatican didn't know how to save face after the catholic 'truths' he spouted. He did the catholic thing. The world however is no longer impressed by christian/catholic 'truths.')


By Nick Squires in Rome
Last Updated: 8:20PM GMT 19 Mar 2009
Pope Benedict: Vatican insiders declare the Pope a 'disaster'
Pope Benedict

The Holy See is struggling to contain international anger over the Pope's claim on his first official visit to Africa that Aids "cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".

<b>The Pope's remarks about condoms, and a recent furore over his lifting of the 20-year excommunication of a British bishop who has questioned the Holocaust,</b> has left him looking isolated and out of touch, prompting <b>calls for a radical shake-up of the way the Holy See delivers its message.</b>
(Note how christoterrorists are only getting uncomfortable about the *way* he said it. Not about the content. The content/message/command was proper christianism after all. And hence it is the same as what the evangelicals since the Bush Jr admin were implementing in Africa as well.)

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      <b>Facebook group attacks the Vatican with condom campaign</b> <!--emo&Big Grin--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
(Where is that christoterrorist Nisha Susan now? For once her lame campaigning could be put to some helpful use. Oh wait. Nothing useful to expect from people bitten by christoism. They're only good for terrorising heathens and breaking temples.)

The Pope is isolated and fails to adequately consult his advisers, said a Vatican source with 20 years' knowledge of the Holy See.

Another Vatican insider described Pope Benedict's four-year-old papacy as "a disaster", recalling the pontiff's previous inflammatory remarks on Islam and homosexuality.

"He's out of touch with the real world," the Italian insider said. "On the condom issue, for example, there are priests and bishops in Africa who accept that condoms are a key part of the fight against Aids, and yet the pope adheres to this very conservative line that they encourage promiscuity. The Vatican is far removed from the reality on the ground."
("Inquisition the Italian insider!" He is saying the pope is wrong and that mere priests and bishops are right. Catholic rule of papal infallibility: The POPE IS ALWAYS RIGHT. "Off to the inquision with this Italian. And with the rebel African priests." <Sounds of dominican monks sharpening torture instruments. Torture. Death. No more heretical priests.>)
[...]
Cardinals and archbishops within the Curia, the Holy See's administration, often appear to be at odds with each other, most recently over the excommunication in Brazil of doctors who performed an abortion on a nine-year-old girl who had fallen pregnant after being raped by her stepfather.

<b>A senior Vatican figure, Cardinal Giovanni Battista Re, spoke out in favour of the Brazilian archbishop who announced the excommunication, only to be contradicted a few days later by Archbishop Rino Fisichella, who heads the Vatican's Pontifical Academy for Life.</b>
(Now now, Archbishop Rino Fisichella. Don't start getting ideas about changing the fundamentals of catholicism. Or you'll be defrocked and inquisitioned.)<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


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