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As per the modern christian credo, their "jesus" is supposed to have died when he was either 33 or 38 years of age (the christians can't agree), or even somewhere in between.
But bear in mind that that's what modern christians - removed by over a millennium from their fable - claim.
Now here is what *famous* early christians (closer to jeebus' purported time) claimed about when jeebus was born and when he died:
http://jesusneverexisted.com/orthodoxy.html
What DID the Early Christians Believe?
Actually, there's a more logical reason than "miracles" behind how modern christianism came to that figure: bishop Irenaeus knew well christian 'tradition' - but only as it existed up to that point (and as was being peddled in his area). In the 2nd century, his was the opinion/imagination of the somewhat more 'established' christian beliefs of his time. (Or rather: as a bishop, he was contributing to/inventing opinion on jeebus in his time.)
It was *after* Irenaeus that a lot of the other jeebus-historizing fable, as this is known today, came to be. So it is that one hears the later bishop Epiphanius, in the 4th century, parroting his own contemporary version of jeebus' fable: that jeebus' birth predated Herod.
It was thereafter that the sheep were told to believe jeebus' birth to be somewhere near the end of BCE (rounded to 0).
So whenever entities bring up "Jeebus' death", don't forget to quote the "very expert 2nd century bishop Irenaeus" as to when that was. Don't forget to stress how he was obviously more expert than later christian bishops, *because* he lived closer to jeebus' own time than others.
Stress further, how his pronouncement is indeed vital. Because it sounds pretty much like the same 2nd century bishop Irenaeus who was, after all, the first christian to (allegedly) document - in ~180 CE - the names of all 4 alleged authors of the canonical gospels (the collective names were unknown to all christian 'authorities' writing before him, and indeed some prominent early fathers of the church didn't know the name of a single gospel author):
http://freetruth.50webs.org/Overview2.htm
There's one more reason why Hindus want to remember the 2nd century bishop Irenaeus, famous witness in his time for christianism (via his purported writings):
[color="#0000FF"]Let's see, Irenaeus says that Jeebus was alive in Roman Emperor Trajan's reign (note that Trajan ruled between 98 and 117 CE, he wasn't born in 98 CE). So even if Irenaeus believed jeebus to have kicked the bucket just at the very moment after Trajan was made Emperor, jeebus would have lasted to 98 CE.
At the same time, remember also that that Apostle (and jeebus twin) Thomas can't have been peddling jeebusism in India in 57 CE or anywhere thereabouts even as per christian reckoning, despite modern claims by "Syrian" christian liars on this - and here I quote Irenaeus - since jeebus wasn't even dead yet in 57 CE, so there *was* no christianism ("jeebus died for your sins, accept him") to peddle yet. Also, Thomas needed to be there at "jeebus' resurrection" (of course the resurrection was a later invention in christianism) in order to "doubt" it - you know, for the Doubting Thomas episode.
But then, Irenaeus' testimony already declared that Thomas didn't die in India but in Edessa. And he certainly couldn't have come to India in the 1st century either (because jeebus wasn't dead yet until 98 CE).[/color]
Why write all the above, when obviously all people on IF would be aware that the "Apostle Thomas in India"/"Syrian christianism came early to India" (and "Hindus killed Thomas") is a big christian lie? Well, because next time anyone here sees some Indian christian liar make a comment anywhere about "Apostle Thomas came to India in 57 CE" or wherever, just quote those 3 'authoritative' (damning) statements by bishop Irenaeus, famous for writing christian 'history' as it was known in the 2nd century CE (he was closer to jeebus' supposed geography than India is to it, and would know more accurately the 'date' of alleged jeebus' death than syrian christians in India would). To recap, the 3 predicates he gives us are:
1. jeebus was alive during Roman Emperor Trajan's reign, who reigned from 98 - 117 CE
2. apostle thomas died in Edessa (and Irenaeus is only aware of 4 apostles' graves anyway)
3. Irenaeus' authority IS important, since until him no christian church father had even heard of the names of the alleged authors of *all* 4 gospels. The later church fathers quoted *him* on who the 4 gospel authors are.
4. Therefore, even as per early and 'authoritative' claims on jeebus and gospel and apostle historicity, exactly how could apostle thomas have died in India when he was to have died in Edessa, let alone have come to India before the non-existent jeebus' death (which at its earliest must have been in 98 CE)?
(5. Etc. Can Q.E.D. here, proving Syrian christian lying.)
' /> As per the modern christian credo, their "jesus" is supposed to have died when he was either 33 or 38 years of age (the christians can't agree), or even somewhere in between.
But bear in mind that that's what modern christians - removed by over a millennium from their fable - claim.
Now here is what *famous* early christians (closer to jeebus' purported time) claimed about when jeebus was born and when he died:
http://jesusneverexisted.com/orthodoxy.html
What DID the Early Christians Believe?
Quote:[color="#0000FF"]"Jesus still alive in the reign of Trajan" ââ¬â said 2nd century bishop Irenaeus. [Trajan[/color] [color="#800080"]reigned[/color] [color="#0000FF"]98-117 AD]Obviously, heathens reading the above can instantly work out that something's not adding up... But Christians had banned mathematics since it was "evil paganism" (i.e. Hellenistic). Being utter strangers to maths, they thus somehow (=miraculously, act of faith) arrived at "jeebus was therefore 33 to 38 years old when he died".
"Jesus born before Herod the Great" ââ¬â said 4th century bishop Epiphanius. [Herod 73-4 BC][/color]
Actually, there's a more logical reason than "miracles" behind how modern christianism came to that figure: bishop Irenaeus knew well christian 'tradition' - but only as it existed up to that point (and as was being peddled in his area). In the 2nd century, his was the opinion/imagination of the somewhat more 'established' christian beliefs of his time. (Or rather: as a bishop, he was contributing to/inventing opinion on jeebus in his time.)
It was *after* Irenaeus that a lot of the other jeebus-historizing fable, as this is known today, came to be. So it is that one hears the later bishop Epiphanius, in the 4th century, parroting his own contemporary version of jeebus' fable: that jeebus' birth predated Herod.
It was thereafter that the sheep were told to believe jeebus' birth to be somewhere near the end of BCE (rounded to 0).
So whenever entities bring up "Jeebus' death", don't forget to quote the "very expert 2nd century bishop Irenaeus" as to when that was. Don't forget to stress how he was obviously more expert than later christian bishops, *because* he lived closer to jeebus' own time than others.
Stress further, how his pronouncement is indeed vital. Because it sounds pretty much like the same 2nd century bishop Irenaeus who was, after all, the first christian to (allegedly) document - in ~180 CE - the names of all 4 alleged authors of the canonical gospels (the collective names were unknown to all christian 'authorities' writing before him, and indeed some prominent early fathers of the church didn't know the name of a single gospel author):
http://freetruth.50webs.org/Overview2.htm
Quote:The names Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were not added to the Gospels
until late in the second century.
+ Thus, although Papias ca. 140 CE knows all the gospels but has only heard of Matthew and Mark, Justin Martyr (ca. 150 CE) knows of none of the four supposed authors.
+ It is only in 180 CE, with Irenæus of Lyons, that we learn who wrote the four "canonical" gospels, and why:
"There are four principle winds, four pillars that hold up the sky, and four corners of the universe; therefore, it is only right that there be four gospels."
-- Church father Irenaeus
[Link] http://atheists.org/Did_Jesus_Exist%3F [color="#800080"](Did Jesus Even Exist? - by Frank Zindler of American Atheists and of babble scholarship)[/color]
There's one more reason why Hindus want to remember the 2nd century bishop Irenaeus, famous witness in his time for christianism (via his purported writings):
Quote:Writing towards the end of the second century of our era, Irenaeus says that there existed then only four genuine graves of the Apostles, namely, those of Peter and Paul at Rome, that of John at Ephesus, and that of [color="#FF0000"]Thomas at Edessa in Mesopotamia[/color].Da hast du.
-- The Twelve Apostles, published by Thomas Scott
[color="#0000FF"]Let's see, Irenaeus says that Jeebus was alive in Roman Emperor Trajan's reign (note that Trajan ruled between 98 and 117 CE, he wasn't born in 98 CE). So even if Irenaeus believed jeebus to have kicked the bucket just at the very moment after Trajan was made Emperor, jeebus would have lasted to 98 CE.
At the same time, remember also that that Apostle (and jeebus twin) Thomas can't have been peddling jeebusism in India in 57 CE or anywhere thereabouts even as per christian reckoning, despite modern claims by "Syrian" christian liars on this - and here I quote Irenaeus - since jeebus wasn't even dead yet in 57 CE, so there *was* no christianism ("jeebus died for your sins, accept him") to peddle yet. Also, Thomas needed to be there at "jeebus' resurrection" (of course the resurrection was a later invention in christianism) in order to "doubt" it - you know, for the Doubting Thomas episode.
But then, Irenaeus' testimony already declared that Thomas didn't die in India but in Edessa. And he certainly couldn't have come to India in the 1st century either (because jeebus wasn't dead yet until 98 CE).[/color]
Why write all the above, when obviously all people on IF would be aware that the "Apostle Thomas in India"/"Syrian christianism came early to India" (and "Hindus killed Thomas") is a big christian lie? Well, because next time anyone here sees some Indian christian liar make a comment anywhere about "Apostle Thomas came to India in 57 CE" or wherever, just quote those 3 'authoritative' (damning) statements by bishop Irenaeus, famous for writing christian 'history' as it was known in the 2nd century CE (he was closer to jeebus' supposed geography than India is to it, and would know more accurately the 'date' of alleged jeebus' death than syrian christians in India would). To recap, the 3 predicates he gives us are:
1. jeebus was alive during Roman Emperor Trajan's reign, who reigned from 98 - 117 CE
2. apostle thomas died in Edessa (and Irenaeus is only aware of 4 apostles' graves anyway)
3. Irenaeus' authority IS important, since until him no christian church father had even heard of the names of the alleged authors of *all* 4 gospels. The later church fathers quoted *him* on who the 4 gospel authors are.
4. Therefore, even as per early and 'authoritative' claims on jeebus and gospel and apostle historicity, exactly how could apostle thomas have died in India when he was to have died in Edessa, let alone have come to India before the non-existent jeebus' death (which at its earliest must have been in 98 CE)?
(5. Etc. Can Q.E.D. here, proving Syrian christian lying.)