MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
MyBB Internal: One or more warnings occurred. Please contact your administrator for assistance.
Other Natural Religions

  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Other Natural Religions
#2
Typed out from: http://www.erm.ee/pdf/pro18/chuvyurov.pdf (Honsol provided link)

The below-mentioned "Finno-Ugric peoples" refer to the Finnish and Sami of Scandinavia, Siberians, Estonians of the Baltic(?) and others.
The first paragraph below is from an 18th century christian view of how their santa destroyed a Sacred Tree. In subsequent paras some of the traditional beliefs associated with the trees are described.


<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Trees in Komi (Zyrian) Rituals and Beliefs</b>
Alexander Chuvyurov
In the worldview of the Finno-Ugric peoples, there exists a varied range of animistic and totemistic conceptions related to worshipping of trees. The material on Komi-Zyrians, found in literature and collected by researchers during recent years, can be divided into the following groups.

<b>Holy groves and worshipped trees</b>
Until Christianization, the birch, the spruce, the mountain ash and the bird cherry tree were the main species that were worshipped by the Komi-Zyrians (Belitser 1958: 322). In the hagiography of St. Stephen of Perm[1] it is mentioned that in Ust-Vym, on the bank of the Vym River, there stood a big birch tree especially worshipped by local people. As the author of the hagiography says, this tree was so big that three people were hardly able to encircle its trunk with their arms (Povest... 1996:68). According to the same source, the Permians (Komi-Zyrians) took sacrificial animals and hides to this tree. The Komi-Zyrians worshipped this tree as a deity, maintaining that any disrespectful act towards it threatened people with all kinds of troubles (Povest... 1996: 69).
<i>[1] <b>An earlier copy of this source dates back to the 18th century</b> (Vlasov 1996: 16-17).</i>
Several legends have been passed down describing how St. Stephen of Perm chopped tis birch tree down. The aforementioned story, about St. Stephen of Perm, presents a colourful description of this event. According to this source, St. Stephen as chopping this birch for three days, and in the course of this process the birch, like a living creature, uttered cries of pain reminding people of hte voices of men, women and children. During chopping, blood streamed out of the tree (Povest... 1996: 69). As the birch was so big, the saint was not able to chop it down on the first day. He drove his axe into the tree and went to have a rest. When morning came and he returned ot the tree, he saw that it was standing undamaged, but his axe, which he had left stuck in the trunk, was lying on the ground, next to the birch tree (Povest,,, 1996:69). And it was only on the third day that the saint, according to the source, was able to chop down the birch tree, worshipped by the Komi-Zyrians, and it fell on the ground, crying and groaning loudly. The tree was burnt right after it had been chopped down. Later on, St. Stephen of Perm had a church erected on the site of this birch tree in the honour of hte holy archistrateges Michael and Gabriel (Gavriil) (Povest... 1996: 70).

Even as late as at hte beginning of the 20th century, birch groves, which were considered to be holy, were carefully preserved outside many Komi villages (Belitser 1958: 322). According to A. Sidorov, in a number of Lower-Vychegda communes (Aikinsk, Kokvitsk) birch groves were carefully preserved in the 1920s. In the village of Iovdin, Turinsk commune, there was a big pine tree standing on the bank at the confluence of the Vym and Iolva Rivers, which was especially worshipped in the 1920s. Local women used to come to this pine tree, light candles on its branches and pray there (Sidorov 1924: 48). Ethnographers A. Sidorov and V. Belitser mentioned that there existed a belief among the Komi-Zyrians that each person had a counterpart among trees. So Sidorov claims that "each person, according to Zyrians, has a twin tree, which, when chopped down, speaks in a human language with its twin-human, bleeds and has a miracle-working power after it has been chopped down. If you make a table from this wood, it will never be short of food supplies; if you make skis, they will carry you to the destination if you merely think about the journey. According to a Komi legend, the famous Sindorsk hero-hunter Iirkap possessed these kinds of skis" (Sidorov 1924: 48).

Images of animated trees can also be found in various hunting stories and beliefs. When making preparations for staying overnight under a tree, hunters first asked for the latter's permission to do so. Without asking permission, according to Komi beliefs, the hunter was going to encounter serious trouble. And, on the contrary, if the hunters observed all the confidential hunting regulations and norms, they gained favour with the tree who had put them up for the night (Komi legendy... 1984: 14). So, in the story "I Am Not Ready Yet" a hunter stays overnight under a spruce, prior to asking for her permission to do that. In the morning, when he is getting ready to leave, he hears someone's voice saying "I am not ready yet". When the hunter has already moved away from the tree, there comes a gust and knocks down the tree, and its top is right behind the hunter's back (Komi legendy... 1984: 92-93).<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<b>Some points of comparison:</b>
- us Hindus have got the sacred Asvattha tree (or something). Next to that we have Tulsi Devi, the Devi of our healing sacred Tulsi plant. There's a beautiful traditional shloka to Tulsi Devi that I will try to locate and put up.
- The Shinto of Japan have sacred Garden Spirits. In fact, in Shinto, everything is animated and has a spirit.
- The Chinese also appear to have tree spirits. They can have rather human characters: some of them are apparently even power-greedy/evil. From a Singaporean CGI movie I watched, there was an evil female she-tree.
- The Greeks have the Driads/Dryads: spirits of trees who can take on human form.
- The sacred fir/evergreen tree of the Northern countries ("christmas" tree) which the people used to decorate for Winter Solstice.
<b>ADDED:</b> - Bodhi tree is sacred to and well-respected by Dharmics. Buddha attained enlightenment under a Bodhi tree.
- The Dharmic Nepalese (can't make out if the ones in question are Hindu or Buddhist) also have sacred trees they worship, as documented here:
http://freetruth.50webs.org/D4h.htm#Nepal
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Cursing a tree sacred to the Nepalese, in imitation of Jesus</b><!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->A Nepali pastor identifying himself as Bharat Bhattrai, writing to the Nepali evangelical newsletter The Good News of Nepal made the following observations:
"Three years ago when I came to pioneer a church in Banasthali, which is an area of Kathmandu, I came across a tree which was being worshipped by the local people. This challenged me to proclaim that Jesus is lord of all the earth. Every time I walked by that tree, I would say, "Jesus is Lord" and I would then pray in tongues. In four months time about 15 people were converted to Christ. Together, we began cursing the tree in Jesus’ name. Gradually, we noticed that the tree was beginning to die and the people stopped worshipping it. Now that the tree is completely withered, people are saying that the Christians did it. No; Christians did not do it but Jesus did it in response to our prayers" (Good News of Nepal, ND: 7). When this particular story was shown to a Nepali Buddhist, his response was "why would Jesus want to destroy a tree?"<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Buddhists obviously haven't read the Bible - Jesus had already set a precedent by having cursed a fig tree and made it wither (Matthew 21:18-19). Why did Jesus want to destroy that tree? For the same reason as that which inspired his devout followers in this case.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->the fact that it was reported in an evangelical newsletter under the name of a pastor with a photograph of a withered tree clearly suggest that it is considered an important item to be talked about.
... the fact that there seems to be a tacit approval of such actions as 'heroic' (as indicative of the language used in the Nepali example above, and the very fact that it was written about in the first place) also encourage individuals and organizations to engage in such activity. These activities become a measurement of faith and commitment to the evangelical cause. Thus for example, when an American evangelical worker active in Nepal was asked about the incident involving the tree reported above, he observed:
<i>"It was a situation of a man leading by example. Particularly because he is Nepali, he can do it with authority."</i>
For him and many others like him, there were no problems related to this incident. It was merely a proclamation of faith.
Link: http://www.rcss.org/policy_studies/ps_5_5.html
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd--><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
  Reply


Messages In This Thread
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-27-2007, 04:23 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-27-2007, 04:31 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-27-2007, 05:08 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-27-2007, 05:15 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-27-2007, 05:33 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-27-2007, 06:55 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 11-28-2007, 12:23 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 01-27-2008, 10:27 AM
Other Natural Religions - by dhu - 01-27-2008, 11:27 AM
Other Natural Religions - by shamu - 01-27-2008, 12:42 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-27-2008, 06:23 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-27-2008, 06:38 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 03-11-2008, 02:27 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 06-08-2008, 11:18 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Pandyan - 06-08-2008, 02:19 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 06-08-2008, 06:34 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 06-10-2008, 04:07 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh - 06-27-2008, 07:11 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Capt M Kumar - 07-13-2008, 06:53 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Pandyan - 08-13-2008, 06:34 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-07-2008, 11:25 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Hauma Hamiddha - 09-08-2008, 02:50 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-08-2008, 03:52 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-28-2008, 01:54 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-28-2008, 03:57 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-28-2008, 05:19 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Pandyan - 09-28-2008, 06:37 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-28-2008, 08:00 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-29-2008, 07:39 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-29-2008, 07:53 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-10-2008, 01:16 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-10-2008, 03:52 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-09-2008, 05:42 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-27-2008, 03:49 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-29-2008, 12:07 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Pandyan - 12-29-2008, 12:44 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-29-2008, 02:06 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-30-2008, 05:59 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-05-2009, 03:41 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-05-2009, 04:58 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-07-2009, 05:49 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-31-2009, 10:48 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Pandyan - 02-01-2009, 02:14 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 03-03-2009, 11:26 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Shambhu - 03-03-2009, 08:24 PM
Other Natural Religions - by dhu - 03-05-2009, 02:59 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 03-06-2009, 08:01 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh - 05-17-2009, 02:03 AM
Other Natural Religions - by HareKrishna - 07-08-2009, 11:56 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 07-08-2009, 08:43 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-21-2009, 10:10 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 03-27-2010, 07:55 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 04-21-2010, 07:22 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 04-21-2010, 06:51 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 04-22-2010, 02:47 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 04-22-2010, 02:51 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-29-2010, 06:06 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 04-29-2010, 08:08 PM
Other Natural Religions - by HareKrishna - 04-29-2010, 09:06 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-02-2010, 06:13 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 05-02-2010, 08:06 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Guest - 05-02-2010, 10:28 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-10-2010, 05:28 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 05-13-2010, 05:55 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-15-2010, 06:36 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-15-2010, 06:49 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-15-2010, 08:06 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-16-2010, 07:38 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-16-2010, 12:50 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-18-2010, 07:07 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-19-2010, 08:29 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bodhi - 05-20-2010, 08:05 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 05-20-2010, 08:59 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-20-2010, 09:24 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 05-20-2010, 11:50 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-21-2010, 07:13 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 05-21-2010, 07:30 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-21-2010, 09:40 PM
Other Natural Religions - by agnivayu - 05-22-2010, 09:25 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 05-23-2010, 06:59 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-23-2010, 08:02 AM
Other Natural Religions - by HareKrishna - 05-23-2010, 05:45 PM
Other Natural Religions - by HareKrishna - 05-24-2010, 05:24 PM
Other Natural Religions - by agnivayu - 05-24-2010, 06:43 PM
Other Natural Religions - by HareKrishna - 05-24-2010, 06:56 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-24-2010, 07:27 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 08-08-2010, 04:08 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 08-21-2010, 01:40 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 08-26-2010, 02:05 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-30-2010, 09:04 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-03-2010, 05:43 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 11-04-2010, 02:00 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 12-09-2010, 01:34 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 02-18-2011, 09:43 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 03-04-2011, 09:46 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 03-09-2011, 11:44 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Capt M Kumar - 03-25-2011, 07:06 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-27-2011, 09:07 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Lalitaditya - 05-28-2011, 10:25 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 07-15-2012, 10:02 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 07-15-2012, 10:04 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 07-15-2012, 10:07 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-02-2013, 07:25 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-02-2013, 09:18 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 02-23-2013, 05:03 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-25-2013, 11:20 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 08-04-2013, 06:34 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 08-05-2013, 07:09 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-10-2013, 12:22 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-10-2014, 07:49 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-11-2014, 07:13 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-11-2014, 09:56 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-12-2014, 09:02 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-01-2014, 02:35 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-01-2014, 07:24 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-03-2014, 08:46 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-04-2014, 11:36 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 09-22-2014, 11:24 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-01-2014, 08:33 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-02-2014, 08:46 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-02-2014, 09:09 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-14-2014, 10:22 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-15-2014, 04:26 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-15-2014, 04:38 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-15-2014, 04:51 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-15-2014, 05:01 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 10-16-2014, 09:38 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-24-2014, 09:48 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-25-2014, 05:02 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 10-27-2014, 03:36 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-27-2014, 01:09 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Bharatvarsh2 - 10-27-2014, 07:39 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 10-28-2014, 07:18 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-06-2014, 06:30 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-08-2014, 09:58 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-23-2014, 08:54 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-26-2014, 12:21 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-26-2014, 12:27 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 11-26-2014, 12:37 PM
Other Natural Religions - by rhytha - 11-28-2014, 07:46 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-14-2014, 06:36 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-14-2014, 09:41 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-28-2014, 10:29 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 12-30-2014, 11:44 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-01-2015, 03:16 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-01-2015, 03:22 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-01-2015, 03:32 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-03-2015, 08:44 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-16-2015, 07:32 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 01-16-2015, 09:23 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-01-2015, 08:44 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-23-2015, 03:45 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 05-27-2015, 08:32 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 06-12-2015, 07:38 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-06-2016, 04:48 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-23-2016, 04:54 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-23-2016, 05:53 AM
Other Natural Religions - by Husky - 04-28-2016, 05:00 PM
Other Natural Religions - by Pandyan - 12-30-2008, 12:10 AM

Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 3 Guest(s)