bR^ihadAraNyaka upaniShad
i.e. part of shruti. Admitted to be a core/ancient upaniShad (certainly when IE-ists want to use this text to encroach on something.)
At the end of this upaniShad, there are some mantras with tantra instructions for special use/purposes.*
Among them those, for the begetting of children. (Presumably rites for use by brahmanas, since it speaks of children being versed in the Veda.)
* I'm not sure if any was ever used, since some seem really special purpose and unlikely to ever need to be used and for others it seems unlikely anyone would care to resort to them, but in any case: a set of rites for specific ends are collected together at the end of the UpaniShad.
About the above-mentioned specific rites in this text for having children:
In case it's not apparent why the above is brought up in this thread:
What's interesting is the wished for offspring's skintone associated with knowledge of the Veda. Essentially the association made (where skintone is mentioned) is darker babies <-> know more Vedas.
The reason it's worth mentioning at all is that this is something white supremacists/oryanists conveniently don't mention (or perhaps, don't want to know) when they pretend to the world that the ancient Vedic Hindus were supposedly Euro-looking. Or that ancient Hindus necessarily preferred fairer skintones or associated it with superiority in any way.** In fact, to play it the way IE-ists would have chosen to do had it been the inverse: it can be argued that where skintone is specified in these rites, the darkest skintone is considered superior as it's associated with knowledge of more Vedas.
Clearly the skintone range enumerated
1. seems to be limited to a human range, and hence can't be dismissed as 'merely symbolic' (<- stating this pre-emptively) and
2. is that seen among ethnic Hindus, not among Europeans aka the 'oryan' type (as IE-ists like to project about the Kurgan kultur etc).
* The "red eyes" may seem fanciful but shyamaH + red eyes seems a commonly mentioned combination and the "red eyes" may be considered auspicious. (Perhaps -here- it refers merely to the pink of the eye-lid portions that are visible. These may stand out more against darker skintones?) In any case, when oryanists fasten upon any mention of anything fair or red or golden-coloured in the the Vedic religio or in Taoism - let alone where the latter concerns the hair (or can be interpreted as yellow/red colour hair) - they never insist it is a proper red or yellow let alone symbolic, though in their examples it concerns the Gods whose colours are not limited to the human skin and hair tone range at all (and where the coloured hair is frequently described along with their body as being the same colour: e.g. the deity being red all over, golden all over, blue-black all over, etc. Not to mention the same deity being different colours in different manifestations. <-Some of the things the oryanists/alien demons conveniently choose to overlook to make their oryan argumentation). Whereas the above example clearly concerns skintones of human babies, are all in the Hindoo human range (the shuklaH colour is limited to a fair-complexioned ethnic Hindu baby, as are the mid-range browns and the shyAmaH dark-complexion). That range is a ethnic Hindoo skintone range.
Further, the final 2 rites for having babies - for having a girl and a boy respectively, both learned and accomplished in their own way - do not specify skintone at all, which seems to either imply that in the category of "most-learned in the Veda and accomplished" for the boy-child and in the category of "most-learned and accomplished" for the girl-child, the baby is not associated with any particular skin-colour (and can turn out to be anything at random maybe, like a pleasant surprise). One can argue that this last implies that Hindu parents didn't ever choose to 'control' the skintone of their kids (<- stating this pre-emptively, in case anti-Hindus will try to argue so next).
** And as these rites seem to concern offspring of brahmanas (commonly, but perhaps not necessarily exclusively/specifically) it becomes more telling. Because it is interesting to note here that the alien demons - who like to project brahmanas, and most especially the brahmanas of Vaidika texts/Vedic era, as the allegedly "most Euro-looking" (most purely Oryan etc) and as being those who would most be into being "white" and "preserving whiteness" (=the hangup of white supremacists/IE-ists aka oryanists, not of Hindus) - again: it is interesting to note here that the following seems to give the lie to the alien demons' faces.
And note that when, as per the above, the brahmanas from the Vaidika era even are exonerated from white supremacism, then that means every other Hindu is exonerated too. I didn't make these rules, but I'm glad how they work out for my argument now.
Quick someone/any alien demon IE-ist: make it so that the bRihadAraNyakopaniShad was only a "late Vedic, deteriorated text, from after such a time as miscegenation had set in".
i.e. part of shruti. Admitted to be a core/ancient upaniShad (certainly when IE-ists want to use this text to encroach on something.)
At the end of this upaniShad, there are some mantras with tantra instructions for special use/purposes.*
Among them those, for the begetting of children. (Presumably rites for use by brahmanas, since it speaks of children being versed in the Veda.)
* I'm not sure if any was ever used, since some seem really special purpose and unlikely to ever need to be used and for others it seems unlikely anyone would care to resort to them, but in any case: a set of rites for specific ends are collected together at the end of the UpaniShad.
About the above-mentioned specific rites in this text for having children:
Quote:He who wishes, 'May a fair-complexioned [shuklaH] son be born to me, who will be versed in one Veda and attain full longevity', should have rice cooked in....
He who wishes, 'May a son be born to me with a tawny [kapilaH] or brown [pi~NgalaH] complexion, who will be versed in two Vedas and attain full longevity', should have rice cooked in....
He who wishes, 'May a son be born to me with a dark [shyAmaH] complexion and red eyes, who will be versed in three Vedas and attain full longevity', should have rice cooked in....
He who wishes, 'May a daughter be born to me, who will be a scholar and attain full longevity', should have rice and...
He who wishes, 'May a son be born to me, who will be a reputed scholar, attend assemblies, speak words that one likes to hear, be versed in all the Vedas and attain full longevity', should have rice cooked with... [Note, IndiaFacts concealed an important detail regarding this one - important to the very topic they were discussing. Question remains: Why did they so?]
(bRihadAraNyaka upaniShad, 6.4.14 - 6.4.18)
In case it's not apparent why the above is brought up in this thread:
What's interesting is the wished for offspring's skintone associated with knowledge of the Veda. Essentially the association made (where skintone is mentioned) is darker babies <-> know more Vedas.
The reason it's worth mentioning at all is that this is something white supremacists/oryanists conveniently don't mention (or perhaps, don't want to know) when they pretend to the world that the ancient Vedic Hindus were supposedly Euro-looking. Or that ancient Hindus necessarily preferred fairer skintones or associated it with superiority in any way.** In fact, to play it the way IE-ists would have chosen to do had it been the inverse: it can be argued that where skintone is specified in these rites, the darkest skintone is considered superior as it's associated with knowledge of more Vedas.
Clearly the skintone range enumerated
1. seems to be limited to a human range, and hence can't be dismissed as 'merely symbolic' (<- stating this pre-emptively) and
2. is that seen among ethnic Hindus, not among Europeans aka the 'oryan' type (as IE-ists like to project about the Kurgan kultur etc).
* The "red eyes" may seem fanciful but shyamaH + red eyes seems a commonly mentioned combination and the "red eyes" may be considered auspicious. (Perhaps -here- it refers merely to the pink of the eye-lid portions that are visible. These may stand out more against darker skintones?) In any case, when oryanists fasten upon any mention of anything fair or red or golden-coloured in the the Vedic religio or in Taoism - let alone where the latter concerns the hair (or can be interpreted as yellow/red colour hair) - they never insist it is a proper red or yellow let alone symbolic, though in their examples it concerns the Gods whose colours are not limited to the human skin and hair tone range at all (and where the coloured hair is frequently described along with their body as being the same colour: e.g. the deity being red all over, golden all over, blue-black all over, etc. Not to mention the same deity being different colours in different manifestations. <-Some of the things the oryanists/alien demons conveniently choose to overlook to make their oryan argumentation). Whereas the above example clearly concerns skintones of human babies, are all in the Hindoo human range (the shuklaH colour is limited to a fair-complexioned ethnic Hindu baby, as are the mid-range browns and the shyAmaH dark-complexion). That range is a ethnic Hindoo skintone range.
Further, the final 2 rites for having babies - for having a girl and a boy respectively, both learned and accomplished in their own way - do not specify skintone at all, which seems to either imply that in the category of "most-learned in the Veda and accomplished" for the boy-child and in the category of "most-learned and accomplished" for the girl-child, the baby is not associated with any particular skin-colour (and can turn out to be anything at random maybe, like a pleasant surprise). One can argue that this last implies that Hindu parents didn't ever choose to 'control' the skintone of their kids (<- stating this pre-emptively, in case anti-Hindus will try to argue so next).
** And as these rites seem to concern offspring of brahmanas (commonly, but perhaps not necessarily exclusively/specifically) it becomes more telling. Because it is interesting to note here that the alien demons - who like to project brahmanas, and most especially the brahmanas of Vaidika texts/Vedic era, as the allegedly "most Euro-looking" (most purely Oryan etc) and as being those who would most be into being "white" and "preserving whiteness" (=the hangup of white supremacists/IE-ists aka oryanists, not of Hindus) - again: it is interesting to note here that the following seems to give the lie to the alien demons' faces.
And note that when, as per the above, the brahmanas from the Vaidika era even are exonerated from white supremacism, then that means every other Hindu is exonerated too. I didn't make these rules, but I'm glad how they work out for my argument now.
Quick someone/any alien demon IE-ist: make it so that the bRihadAraNyakopaniShad was only a "late Vedic, deteriorated text, from after such a time as miscegenation had set in".