Radicalisation Of Indian Muslims

[ramana]

There is a method in Arjun Singh's madness. He is getting ready for the elections. INC will not let a non-INC UPA govt be formed.

[Guest]

Does Indian Jews and Christians have problem singing Vande mataram? Any news articles dealing with such stuff...?

Jews and Christians also worship the same god (atleast theoretically!! by their book!!)...

[Guest]

In every KV school daily prayer is in Sanskrit for ma/Devi Gayatri/ Saraswati.
[OM
Asto ma sad gamaya
Tamso ma jyotir gamya
Mrityor ma amritam gamya
OM]
It starts with OM and ends with OM and shanti path. KV is truly a secular school in every term. Never heard or saw anyone complaining about prayer decades back. It was compulsory to know or sing National song. Why suddenly these mullahs are creating such a noise?
Only reason I can see Mullah's connection with pan-Islamic agenda and communist in power.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Does Indian Jews and Christians have problem singing Vande mataram? Any news articles dealing with such stuff...?
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think 15-20 years back in Kerala, some Christian sects were against.

[Bharatvarsh]

The story of how Vande Mataram was throttled:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->"Vande Mataram partitioned"
8/21/2006 6:57:59 AM  Bala
A HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE AGAINST THE SINGING OF 'VANDE MATARAM'

EXTRACTS FROM SHRI H.V.SESHADRI'S "THE TRAGIC STORY OF PARTITION"
"A most telling instance in point is the one relating to Vande Mataram.That celebrated song first appeared in the historical novel Ananda Math of Bankim Chandra Chatterjee. It was a hymn of love of motherland sublimated into an ecstatic devotion to the divine mother –Bharath.In that exalted vision was manifesting the trinity of Saraswathi(The goddess of knowledge and culture), Lakshmi (The Godess of beauty and wealth) and Durga(The Godess of Strength and Energy).

When Bengal was partitioned in 1905, Vande Mataram became the battle song of the entire Nation. Congress too, thereafter,adopted it as the National Anthem and it was Rabindranath Tagore who sang it for the first time in the Congress session. To the British imperialists the very utterance of that simple expression VANDE MATARAM became the proverbial red rag to the bull. The Lt.Governor of East Bengal had ordained that no one should utter that word; it was a 'crime’. Thousands of young men had mocked that order and braved the British lathis and boots in the streets of Barisal by their thunderous roar of VANDE MATARAM.They had shed their blood and sanctified that word into a potent and holy 'RASHTRA-MANTRA’. It soon became the joyful and inspiring chant playing on the lips of the literate as well as the illiterate, the rich and the poor, the urban and the rural, the old and the young-in fact of one and the-men, women and children. Hundreds of revolutionary heroes ascended the gallows with that final obeisance to the Mother. Gandhiji would often extol the grandeur of the song. At Comilla,in 1927,he said that the song held up before one's mind the picture of the whole BHARAT-ONE AND INDIVISIBLE. These two simple words had,indeed,wrought miracle which even thousands of speeches and articles could not have acheived.It became the cry of the awakened and resurgent national soul. 

It was at the Kakinada session of the Congress in 1923,That at the first blow was struck at this National Anthem. During those years, the reputed singer and patriot Vishnu Digambar Paluskar of Maharashtra used to fill the inaugural session of Congress with his deep and resonant music of Vande Mataram.However,when he came on the dais this time he was stopped by the President-Maulana Mohammed Ali.The Maulana exclaimed that singing of music was taboo in Islam and as such he would not permit it.The entire assembly was stunned;everyone,including the high-ups and stalwarts adorning the Dias, sat dumbstruck, unable to think out a reply to the President. Paluskar, however struck to his post. In a voice of righteous indignation he retorted to the Maulana,'The Indian National Congress is not the monopoly of any one particular sect nor is this place a mosque, where singing could be prohibited. You have therefore no authority to prevent me from singing Vande Mataram.Moreover,if singing in this place is against your particular religion, How is it you could tolerate music in your presidential procession?The Maulana of course had no answer to this challenging question,but left the dias while Paluskar went through the singing.

The Congress was now beset with a fresh anxiety.VANDE MATARAM was proving an 'irritation' in the path of 'winning over Muslims'.Congress,as we know, had remained unruffled in the face of the mighty assault, and even banning of the VANDE MATARAM,by the British. It had, after passing through that fire, even adopted it as its National Anthem. But now in the face of Muslim opposition, it began to waver. In 1922,it had already adopted Mohammed Iqbal's Sare jahan se accha, Hindusthan hamara  as the associate National Anthem just to satisfy the Muslims.

The real test for the Congress regarding Vande Mataram did not materialise till 1937-when elections to the Provincial Assemblies were held and the Congress was returned to power in seven Provinces. The Congress Government,in line with past Congress tradition ,began commencing the Assembly proceedings with with Vande Mataram.The Muslim League, equally true to its tradition, declared a war against it. The League Members in the Assembly raised a storm of protest and staged walk-outs. The Congress Working Committee(CWC) was scheduled to meet in October 1937 at Calcutta. The Muslim League conducted its session earlier and denounced Congress-ruled States as 'Hindu States'.And the most weighty testimony it adduced was the singing of the VANDE MATARAM in Assemblies !!

The League condemned the Congress for 'Vandemataram as the national anthen upon the country’ and termed it as 'callous, positively anti-Islamic, Idolatrous in its inspiration and ideas and definitely Subversive of the growth of genuine nationalism in India’. The League further called upon 'Muslim members of various legislatures and public bodies in the country not to associate themselves in any manner with this highly objectionable song’

When the CWC met a few days later, it was haunted by the spectre of the League's opposition and formulated its policy on ‘Minority Rights’.If Hindu-Muslim unity-without which the British would not part with power-was to be acheived,the Muslims should not,at any cost ,be allowed to feel displeased. Their sentiments should never be injured,for what ever reason .Accordingly,the congress decided to  'CUT OUT' those portions of VandeMataram 'Which were likely to offend the Muslim susceptibilities  as indicated in the League's resolution. Only the first two stanzas of the song depicting  the physical picture of the mother land were retained and the rest dropped'.Indeed,it was in those subsequent stanzas that the real essence of our nationalism and the spirit of the Freedom Struggle were enshrined .

However,the Congres considered these stanzas as 'Containing certain allusions and religious ideology which may not be in keeping with the ideology of other religious groups in India’. and upheld 'The validity of objection raised by Muslim friends to certain parts of the song’. The Congress further gave its organizers 'Freedom to sing any other song of an unobjectionable character in addition to,or in the place of Vande Mataram’

The last sentence clearly indicated that the Congress had even taken away the unique position of VANDE MATARAM as the National Anthem and 'Placed it on par with other National songs”

http://www.haindavakeralam.org/PageModule....eID=1670&SKIN=B<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
We might as well give up the concept of national anthem altogether, who knows how much it is offending the minorities right now.

[Guest]

They should change national flag because it contains wheel of Dharma.
National seal - Ashoka seal is a symbol of Hindustan. Inscription is in Sanskrit, language of Vedic scripture. Urdu or Arabic or latin is missing from seal.

[Guest]

15% population is blackmailing India PERIOD.

These rascals in power are willing to destroy country to stay in power. That is why I am saying Sonia is a foreigners, she had no affection for India or its culture. Fools still vote her and promote her.

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->National seal - Ashoka seal is a symbol of Hindustan. Inscription is in Sanskrit, language of Vedic scripture. Urdu or Arabic or latin is missing from seal.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Yes. No doubt Islamists will complain about that next.

Besides, Latin is not a Christian language by any stretch of the imagination but a 'pagan' one par excellence. All the most meaningful and beautiful prose and poetry written in Latin are pagan, writtten by ancient pagan authors (including emperors). Pagans created Latin centuries before the invention of Christianity. That the Catholic Church stole Latin will never make it Christian, no amount of their pretending is going to change that.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->That is why I am saying Sonia is a foreigners, she had no affection for India or its culture.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->She is a foreigner exactly for the reasons you've specified, and because she has no respect for the indigenous spiritual traditions of India.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Indian Jews and Christians have problem singing Vande mataram.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->If Jews did have difficulty with it in religious terms (I don't know that they do, this is a supposition) they would definitely not be making a public statement trying to communalise the issue like ChristoIslamists always happily do; most likely they'll sing the song except for the Goddess parts and keep the issue to themselves.
Some Christos are against Vande Mataram, including some Goan Christos. Other Goan Christians have no problems with it. I recently looked at the Goanet forums, and it appears that those Christians who don't mind Vande Mataram think it should also replace Jana Gana Mana (they wrongly think Jana Gana Mana was written to honour the British raj, when in fact Tagore wrote it in such a way as to make it <i>appear</i> flattering to the British, whilst in reality his composition was referring solely to Paramapurusha).

[Guest]

Husky:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->it appears that those Christians who don't mind Vande Mataram <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
A lot of Goan Christians have retained their original last name - for over 400 years after the Protugeuese inquistion of Goa.

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Vande Mataram (in Bangla:Bônde Matorom) is the national song of India.
The song was composed by Bankim Chandra Chatterjee in a highly
Sanskritized form of the Bengali language. The song first appeared in
his book Anandamatha, published in 1882 amid fears of a ban by British
Raj, though the song itself was actually written six years prior in
1876. "Vande Mataram" was the national cry for freedom from British
oppression during the freedom movement. Large rallies, fermenting
initially in West Bengal, in the major metropolis of Calcutta
(Kolkata), would work themselves up into a patriotic fever by shouting
the slogan "Vande Mataram," or "Hail to the Mother(land)!". The
British, fearful of the potential danger of an incited Indian
populace, at one point banned the utterance of the motto in public
forums and jailed many freedom fighters for disobeying the
proscription. To this day, "Vande Mataram" is seen as a national
mantra describing the love of patriots for the country of India.
Rabindranath Tagore sang 'Vande Mataram' in 1896 at the Calcutta
(Kolkata) Congress Session. Poet Sarala Devi Chaudurani sang 'Vande
Mataram' in the Benares Congress Session in 1905. Lala Lajpat Rai
started a journal called Vande Mataram from Lahore.

Though a major aspirant for being the national anthem of India, Vande
Mataram was eventually overtaken by Jana Gana Mana, which was
ultimately chosen. The choice was slightly controversial, since the
Vande Mataram was the one song that truly depicted the
pre-independence national fervour. The song was rejected on the
grounds that Muslims felt offended by its depiction of the nation as
"Ma Durga"—a Hindu goddess— thus equating the nation with the Hindu
conception of shakti, divine feminine dynamic force; and by its origin
as part of Anandamatha, a novel they felt had an anti-Muslim message
(see External links below). There is some controversy with Jana Gana
Mana also as it mentions some areas as part of India which are now no
longer with India. However, in recent times, there has been more
acceptance of the song since famous music composer A. R. Rahman
released a successful album with the same title.

Dr Rajendra Prasad, who was presiding the Constituent Assembly on
January 24, 1950, made the following statement which was also adopted
as the final decision on the issue:

The composition consisting of words and music known as Jana Gana Mana
is the National Anthem of India, subject to such alterations as the
Government may authorise as occasion arises, and the song Vande
Mataram, which has played a historic part in the struggle for Indian
freedom, shall be honored equally with Jana Gana Mana and shall have
equal status with it. (Applause) I hope this will satisfy members.
(Constituent Assembly of India, Vol. XII, 24-1-1950)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vande_Mataram

http://boson.bose.res.in/~shashank/vande.html

Listen to Vande Mataram:
http://boson.bose.res.in/~shashank/vandemataram.mp3

Mother, I bow to thee!
Rich with thy hurrying streams,
bright with orchard gleams,
Cool with thy winds of delight,
Green fields waving Mother of might,
Mother free.

Glory of moonlight dreams,
Over thy branches and lordly streams,
Clad in thy blossoming trees,
Mother, giver of ease
Laughing low and sweet!
Mother I kiss thy feet,
Speaker sweet and low!
Mother, to thee I bow.

Who hath said thou art weak in thy lands
When the sword flesh out in the seventy million hands
And seventy million voices roar
Thy dreadful name from shore to shore?
With many strengths who art mighty and stored,
To thee I call Mother and Lord!
Though who savest, arise and save!
To her I cry who ever her foeman drove
Back from plain and Sea
And shook herself free.

Thou art wisdom, thou art law,
Thou art heart, our soul, our breath
Though art love divine, the awe
In our hearts that conquers death.
Thine the strength that nervs the arm,
Thine the beauty, thine the charm.
Every image made divine
In our temples is but thine.

Thou art Durga, Lady and Queen,
With her hands that strike and her
swords of sheen,
Thou art Lakshmi lotus-throned,
And the Muse a hundred-toned,
Pure and perfect without peer,
Mother lend thine ear,
Rich with thy hurrying streams,
Bright with thy orchard gleems,
Dark of hue O candid-fair

In thy soul, with jewelled hair
And thy glorious smile divine,
Loveliest of all earthly lands,
Showering wealth from well-stored hands!
Mother, mother mine!
Mother sweet, I bow to thee,
Mother great and free!

translated by Sri Aurobindo


http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/us/features/topten/ Notes Vande
Matarm was in the second position, among the world's top ten songs;
Listen to it:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/us/featu...audio/vande.ram
'A
patriotic Hindi song, the lyrics from a very famous poem written by
Bankim Chandra Chatarji. Regarded by many as India's national song.
Performed in the 50's film "Anand Math". '

The Congress Working Committee, which met in Calcutta on October 26,
1937, under the presidentship of Nehru, adopted a long statement on
the subject.6 It asked that the song should "be considered apart from
the book." Recalling its use in the preceding 30 years, the resolution
said:

"The song and the words thus became symbols of national resistance to
British Imperialism in Bengal especially, and generally in other parts
of India. The words 'Bande Mataram' became a slogan of power which
inspired our people and a greeting which ever remind us of our
struggle for national freedom.

"Gradually the use of the first two stanzas of the song spread to
other provinces and a certain national significance began to attach to
them. The rest of the song was very seldom used, and is even now known
by few persons. These two stanzas described in tender language the
beauty of (the) motherland and the abundance of her gifts. There was
absolutely nothing in them to which objection could be from the
religious or any other point of view... The other stanzas of the song
are little known and hardly ever sung. They contain certain allusions
and a religious ideology which may not be in keeping with the ideology
of other religious groups in India.

"The Committee recognise the validity of the objection raised by
Muslim friends to certain parts of the song. While the Committee have
taken note of such objection insofar as it has intrinsic value, the
Committee wish to point out that the modern evolution of the use of
the song as part of National life is of infinitely greater importance
than its setting in a historical novel before the national movement
had taken shape. Taking all things into consideration, therefore, the
Committee recommend that, wherever Bande Mataram is sung at national
gatherings, only the first two stanzas should be sung, with perfect
freedom to the organisers to sing any other song of an unobjectionable
character, in addition to, or in the place of, the Bande Mataram
song."

'National' songs do not need political surgery; the songs which do, do
not win national acceptance. Against this was the fact of history
that, however ill-advised, the song had come to be associated with the
struggle for freedom. Gandhi advised Muslims to appreciate its
historic association but counselled against any imposition. "No doubt,
every act... must be purely voluntary on the part of either partner,"
he said at Alipore on August 23, 1947.

THE Government of India acquired this emotion-charged legacy. Its
stand was defined in a statement by Prime Minister Nehru to the
Constituent Assembly (Legislative) on August 25, 1948:7 Nehru said:

"The question of having a national anthem tune, to be played by
orchestras and bands became an urgent one for us immediately after
15th August 1947. It was as important as that of having a national
flag. The 'Jana Gana Mana' tune, slightly varied, had been adopted as
a national anthem by the Indian National Army in South-East Asia, and
had subsequently attained a degree of popularity in India also... I
wrote to all the provincial Governors and asked their views about our
adopting 'Jana Gana Mana' or any other song as the national anthem. I
asked them to consult their Premiers before replying... Every one of
these Governors, except one (the Governor of the Central Provinces),
signified their approval of 'Jana Gana Mana'. Thereupon the Cabinet
considered the matter and came to the decision that provisionally
'Jana Gana Mana' should be used as the tune for the national anthem,
till such time as the Constituent Assembly came to a final decision.
Instructions were issued accordingly to the provincial governments...

''It is unfortunate that some kind of argument has arisen as between
'Vande Mataram' and 'Jana Gana Mana'. 'Vande Mataram' is obviously and
indisputably the premier national song of India, with a great
historical tradition, and intimately connected with our struggle for
freedom. That position it is bound to retain and no other song can
displace it. It represents the position and poignancy of that
struggle, but perhaps not so much the culmination of it. In regard to
the national anthem tune, it was felt that the tune was more important
than the words... It seemed therefore that while 'Vande Mataram'
should continue to be the national song par excellence in India, the
national anthem tune should be that of 'Jana Gana Mana', the wording
of 'Jana Gana Mana' to be suitably altered to fit in with the existing
circumstances.

"The question has to be considered by the Constituent Assembly, and it
is open to that Assembly to decide as it chooses. It may decide on a
completely new song or tune, if such is available."

A MORE definitive statement was made by the President of the
Constituent Assembly, Rajendra Prasad, on January 24, 1950. He said:
"There is one matter which has been pending for discussion, namely,
the question of the national anthem. At one time it was thought that
the matter might be brought up before the House, and a decision taken
by the House by way of a resolution. But it has been felt that,
instead of taking a formal decision by means of a resolution, it is
better if I make a statement with regard to the national anthem.
Accordingly, I make this statement... The composition consisting of
the words and music known as 'Jana Gana Mana' is the national anthem
of India, subject to such alterations in the words as the Government
may authorise as occasion arises; and the song 'Vande Mataram', which
has played a historic part in the struggle for Indian freedom, shall
be honoured equally with Jana Gana Mana and shall have equal status
with it. (Applause) I hope that will satisfy the Members."8

6. Indian Annual Register, 1937, Volume II, p. 327.

7. Official Report on "Constituent Assembly Debates"; Third session,
Part I, Volume VI, August 9-31, 1948.

8. Constituent Assembly Debates, Volume XII; January 24, 1950.

http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl1601/16010940.htm

`Vande Mataram': BJP wants Arjun to explain

Special Correspondent

Centenary of the song is being celebrated this year

NEW DELHI: A statement reported to be made by Human Resource
Development Minister Arjun Singh that singing of the national song
Vande Mataram in every school in the country was not mandatory has
started a political controversy, with the Bharatiya Janata Party
demanding an explanation from the Prime Minister.

This year September 7 is being celebrated as the national song year
with the centenary of Vande Mataram falling on that date. Congress
spokesperson Abhishek Singhvi said the song had played a role in the
freedom movement by infusing energy into the struggle. An order was
passed by the Government that in every school the national song should
be sung at 11 a.m.

However, in view of ``certain objections'' from ``some quarters,'' Mr.
Singh has now clarified that singing Vande Mataram was ``not
mandatory," Mr. Singhvi said, while preferring not to disagree with
the Minister.

Bharatiya Janata Party spokesperson V.K. Malhotra said it was highly
objectionable that some `ulemas' had issued a `fatwa' against the
singing of Vande Mataram. This, he said, was an insult to the national
song. ``Those who object to its singing can go,'' he said, meaning
they were free to leave the country.

He felt that on September 7 the centenary should be observed in the
manner in which the anniversary of the Salt Satyagraha was celebrated.
Vande Mataram was one of the symbols of the freedom struggle and
adopted as the national song through a parliamentary resolution.

Criticising Mr. Singh for surrendering to the ``fundamentalists," Mr.
Malhotra said only those who believed in the two-nation theory — that
Hindus and Muslims constitute two separate nations — can give such
`fatwas.'

Mr. Malhotra added that the BJP would make this an election issue in
the polls in Uttar Pradesh due in February 2007.

http://www.hindu.com/2006/08/22/stories/...451000.htm

CONSTITUENT ASSEMBLY OF INDIA - VOLUME XII

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tuesday, the 24th January 1950
The Constituent Assembly met in the Constitution Hall, New Delhi, at
Eleven of the Clock, Mr. President (The Honourable Dr. Rajendra
Prasad), in the Chair.

TAKING THE PLEDGE AND SIGNING THE REGISTER

The following Members took the Pledge and signed the Register :-

Shri Ratnappa Bharmappa Kurnbhar (Bombay States).

Dr. Y. S. Parmar (Himachal Pradesh).

STATEMENT RE: NATIONAL ANTHEM

Mr. President: There is one matter which has been pending for
discussion, namely the question of the National Anthem. At one time it
was thought that the matter might be brought up before the House and a
decision taken by the House by way of a resolution. But it has been
felt that, instead of taking a formal decision by means of a
resolution, it is better if I make a statement with regard to the
National Anthem. Accordingly I make this statement.

The composition consisting of the words and music known as Jana Gana
Mana is the National Anthem of India, subject to such alterations in
the words as the Government may authorise as occasion arises; and the
song Vande Mataram, which has played a historic part in the struggle
for Indian freedom, shall be honoured equally with Jana Gana Mana and
shall have equal status with it. (Applause). I hope this will satisfy
the Members.

http://parliamentofindia.nic.in/ls/debates/vol12p1.htm

<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The clerics judgement - woman to marry 70 years old man
By Reuters
Monday August 21, 03:35 PM
KOLKATA (Reuters) - <b>Islamic clerics in Orissa have ruled that a woman divorced by her husband in a fit of drunkenness can remarry him only after she takes another husband for one day, </b>police said on Monday.

Ershad, a rickshaw puller, uttered the word "talaq", or divorce, three times earlier this month while he was drunk, and when news leaked out in their village in Orissa, the clerics said they must separate.

<b>"The couple had kept it under wraps and continued to stay together but the clerics ruled that since Ershad uttered the word talaq three times, it constituted a divorce,"</b> district police chief Shatrughan Parida said over telephone.

Under the rules, the woman, who is a mother of three, must marry another man and obtain a divorce from him before she can be reunited with Ershad, the clerics in the local mosque said.

<b>The clerics have said the man the woman marries temporarily must be 70 years of age,</b> Parida said.

Muslims, who constitute more than 13 percent of India's mainly Hindu population, are governed by special personal laws including marriage laws. But in many remote rural areas, it is the local clerics who pass diktats on social issues before they reach the courts.

Earlier this year, another Muslim couple in neighbouring West Bengal was told by local religious leaders they must separate after the man uttered "talaq" thrice in his sleep. They refused the order and continue to live together.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Same old story, no action by government. No PIL against Muslim.
Where are women who were filing PIL for woman Rights in Sabrimala. They are dead quiet on plight of muslim women in Orrisa. What a double standard by Madam Karkat and close friends? especially Roys and Chatterjees from SF to Bengal.

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Odd opposition to the ode</b>
S Gurumurthy, Pioneer, August 24, 2006
<i>How is it that Islamic leaders don't feel as threatened by terrorism
as by the National Song?</i>
Last week, the All India Muslim Personal Law Board vowed not to allow Muslim children to sing the National Song Vande Mataram as required by none other than the 'secular' UPA Government's most 'secular' Minister, Mr Arjun Singh. But the AIMPLB made a generous concession in favour of Jana Gana Mana saying Muslims had "no problem" in singing the National Anthem.

Soon other Islamists joined to oppose Vande Mataram. The reason: The song, which hails Bharat Mata, is against Islamic principles, they said. Vande Mataram, which so offends them, is no ordinary song but the very soul of our freedom movement. Post-freedom, 'secular' politics had hidden the role of Vande Mataram from most young Indians. So some recall of the history of this song is necessary.

When the Constituent Assembly discussed whether Vande Mataram or Jana Gana Mana should be the National Anthem, Nehru described the argument as unfortunate. He said that Vande Mataram was "obviously and indisputably the premier national song of India" with "a great historical tradition, and intimately connected with our struggle for freedom." "That position," he said, "it was bound to retain and no other song can displace it." He declared Vande Mataram will continue to be "the national song par excellence". Muslim representatives in the Constituent Assembly agreed on this.

The history of this great song dates back to 19th century. Rabindranath Tagore first sang this song in the Calcutta Congress session of 1896. Later, in 1920s, Muslim separatists began opposing the song. Still, the Congress Working Committee, which met at Calcutta on October 26, 1937, under Nehru's leadership, recalled that "the song and the words thus became symbols of national resistance to British imperialism" and asserted that they "ever remind us of our struggle for national freedom". The present opposition to Vande Mataram is a tragic replay of the Islamic separatist ideology that emerged in the 1920s, graduated as anti-national movement in 1930s and led to partition in 1940s, with the nationalists compromising with separatists at every stage.

But see the frightening contrast now. The Islamist clergy sees danger to Islam in a song that was central to our freedom movement. But, horrifyingly, it sees no danger in the emergence of Islamic terror, particularly the home grown one. The clergy - even those claiming to be liberal among Islamists - do not view the rise of Islamist terror as a danger to Islam. They do not see, for instance, a terror outfit like the Students Islamic Movement of India (SIMI) as a danger to Islam. Heard of a single recognised Muslim voice speaking a word against SIMI or SIMI like jihadi outfits mushrooming in the country?

If fatwa could be issued against Muslim children singing a patriotic song, why is it not issued against anti-national Islamist terrorists who hurl bombs and kill innocents? If they could ban a nationalist song, why not bombs and bomb-throwing SIMIs? Why are they deafeningly silent? The benevolent reason in their favour could only be that they are as much afraid of terror. And that they are also frightened to say that they are so afraid!

It is surprising, therefore, that the Islamic leadership in India is worried about the suffix 'terror' that has got added to Islam in public discourse. So, worried, a few of them rushed to Ms Sonia Gandhi and Mr Manmohan Singh the other day, pleading that the entire Islamic community should not be linked to terror. Little do they realise that it is not the Indian Government that links Islam to terror, which is characterised as Islamic in global discourse.

It does not require a seer to find why the world sees a link between terror and Islam and why Ms Sonia Gandhi and Mr Manmohan Singh cannot delink the two.

First, the Islamist leadership sidesteps and escapes what should worry them more than it worries others. That is, it is not just that all terrorists are, by accident, Muslims, but that terror originates in some interpretation of the Islamic faith that inspires the terrorists to turn jihadis and mass-kill others.

Not a single Islamic school has challenged the terror outfits for a debate on Islam, which the leaders claim as a religion of peace and which the terrorists claim as sanctioning terror, to establish that the terrorists are anti-Islamic!

On the other hand, the Islamist leadership escapes this stark reality - of the terrorists claiming inspiration from the Islamic faith - by pleading that it is the Islamic tag to terror that harms Islam and Muslims, not the Islamic face of terror itself. Next, the worlds sees and so do most Indians - the Islamist leaders condemning terror but not condemn the terror outfits that perpetrate terror.

The question is: When Islamic leaders call terror un-Islamic, why can't they name SIMI or LeT or sundry jihadi outfits anti-Islamic? Or understand why the terror tag is attached to Islam? The sooner the Islamist leaders realise that danger to Islam comes from not such innocuous things as Vande Mataram, but from the deafening silence of the community when SIMIs and jihadis do death dance in the name of Islam, the better for them and the country.

http://dailypioneer.com/indexn12.asp?main_...t&counter_img=1<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[Bharatvarsh]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>40 held for stone pelting </b>
Hyderabad, Aug. 23: About 40 muslim youth were taken into police custody for indulging in stone throwing, damaging public and private property besides violating traffic norms on city roads Tuesday night.

Several youth, who took to the streets on their two-wheelers on Tuesday night on the occasion of Shab-e-Meiraj (Night of Vigil, when Muslims offer prayers through the night) smashed up glass windows, streetlights and hoardings on Necklace road, Imax theatre  road, Khairatabad, Liberty crossroads, Warasiguda and Secunderabad.

The incidents occurred past midnight and continued till 5 am when the youth went berserk. They pelted stones to damage streetlights, window panes of Imax theatre and pushed aside the barricades put up by police on various roads restricting vehicular traffic in view of the ongoing Assembly session.According to Saifabad police, it all started past midnight when police blocked their entry to Necklace road by putting up barricades.

The youth pushed aside the cops and barricades and hit the Necklace road on their two wheelers. On being chased by the police, they pelted stones right along Imax Theatre, Khairatabad, Liberty crossroads, Basheerbagh crossoads, Chilkalguda, Warasiguda, Secunderabad, Banjara Hills and Kukatpally. At Kukatpally, they also damaged an idol of Lord Ganesha which was being taken in a trailer to be installed. At Khairatabad, they threw stones at Perika Bhavan and Vysya Bank ATM centre before damaging the streetlights on various stretches of roads.
http://www.deccan.com/City/CityNews.asp?#4...stone%20pelting<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[Guest]

What is Shab-e-Meiraj?

[Guest]

Shab-i-Miraj
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Shab-i-Miraj means the night of Ascent. It is the blessed night when the Holy Prophet of Islam was spiritually transported to heaven and he reached a high stage of nearness to God Almighty which is beyond ordinary human comprehension. The Ascent took place on 27th day or Rajab, 2 years before Hijra
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Supposed to have been at Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem.

Believe this attachment is one of the key reasons the Wye river accord that Clinton was trying to push through in his last days fell through.

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-Viren+Aug 24 2006, 01:03 PM-->QUOTE(Viren @ Aug 24 2006, 01:03 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Shab-i-Miraj
<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Shab-i-Miraj means the night of Ascent. It is the blessed night when the Holy Prophet of Islam was spiritually transported to heaven and he reached a high stage of nearness to God Almighty which is beyond ordinary human comprehension. The Ascent took place on 27th day or Rajab, 2 years before Hijra
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Supposed to have been at Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem.

Believe this attachment is one of the key reasons the Wye river accord that Clinton was trying to push through in his last days fell through.
[right][snapback]56157[/snapback][/right]
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

After he met God and the other prophets such as Adam, Abraham, Jesus etc, Gabriel cut open Muhammad's chest and pore wisdom and other goodies. The Muhammad cartoons in faithfreedom.org says Gabriel washed Muhammad's internal organs with zam-zam water and filled his chest with vials containing wisdom and faith!

http://www.faithfreedom.org/comics/23.htm

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>UP court stays subsidy to Haj pilgrims</b>
Sharat Pradhan in Lucknow | August 26, 2006 15:03 IST
Rediff.com
http://ia.rediff.com/news/2006/aug/26subsi...?q=np&file=.htm

The Lucknow bench of the Allahabad High Court on Friday ordered a blanket ban on the subsidy given by the central and state governments to Haj pilgrims.

The order came on a petition moved 11 years ago by <b>advocate Hari Shankar Jain on behalf of Vishwa Hindu Parishad  activist B N Shukla, who also owns a chain of petrol pumps in the city.</b>

While announcing their verdict, a division bench comprising Justuice A K Yog and O N Khandelwal, ruled that no subsidy should be given by the state or central governments for any kin of pilrgrimage.

The court however, sought to clarify that it did not intend to impose any restriction on the other facilities extended by the governments in the larger interest of safety and well-being of pilgrims of any community.

The order further adds, <b>'This would include security measures for pilgrimages like the annual Amarnath yatra as well'.</b>

While issuing the order, the court has given six weeks time to the state and central governments to file their respective counter-affidavits in this regard.

The order has already created ripples in both political and religious circles. While political parties eyeing the Muslim vote were critical of it, the parties closely wedded to Hindutva welcomed the order .
Lawyer Hari Shankar Jain, who argued the petition was in a victorious mood.<b> "We have succeeded in driving home our point. My contention was plain and simple -  being a secular nation, the central or state governments had no business to grant special concessions for pilgrimage by members of a particular community," </b>he said. "The practice is  unconstitutional," he told IANS over telephone from Allahabad.

However, the ruling Samajwadi Party and the opposition Congress were clearly unhappy with the order.

<b>"The order is not the end of the world; it will be challenged in the Apex court," said Congress spokesman Akhilesh Singh</b>.

State SP chief Ram Saran Das told this correspondent, "How can you withdraw a facility that been available to members of a community for decades? Members of the Muslim community deserved such a subsidy because they were economically weaker than other communities."

Well-known Islamic scholar and cleric Maulana Khalid Rasheed, the head of Firangi Mahal, one of India's leading Islamic institutions, was of the view that the order was 'prejudicial'.

He wondered, <b>"What is wrong with subsidy to Hajis? After all it was out of the state exchequer, which also spends on religious festivals like the Kumbh Mela."</b>

The Maulana was confident that Muslims would get relief against the order from the country's Apex court.
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[G.Subramaniam]

http://www.haindavakeralam.org/PageModule....eID=1724&SKIN=K

Suicide of harrassed Hindu girl,Faisal gets 7 yrs RI
8/28/2006 12:20:20 PM HK


Kozhikode:Kozhikode fast track court awarded seven years rigorous imprisonment to a Muslim youth Faisal here, who was found guilty for the suicide of Saranya.

According to prosecution Faizal, in a pre-planned attempt, molested the girl in a public place abetting her to take the extreme step on June 19, 2005.She was going to a Temple in Vilooni near Vadagara.

The court also ordered the accused to pay Rs 25,000, by way of penalty to the next of kin of the dead.


--

This islamic behavior of raping kafir women is very common in the secular paradise of kerala and west bengal

BTW, Kozhikode is a hindu majority district and muslims are 36% here
So even in a minority, muslims indulge in their favorite pastime of raping kafir women

The secular press has been silent on this incident

The choice is between Modi and the Mullah
My choice is Modi

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Muslims in India are violating Shariat every day </b>8/29/2006 9:04:32 AM
P. Deivamuthu, Editor, Hindu Voice. (Email: hinduvoice@mtnl.net.in)
Zafaryab Jilani, a member of the All India Muslim Personal Law Board (AIMPLB), is reported to have said in Lucknow, “Reciting Vande Mataram is against the tenets of the Shariat (Islamic law). There are some lines in Vande Mataram which go against our religion.”

Whether it is Saraswati Vandana earlier or Vande Mataram now or even Jana Gana Mana, fanatic Muslims make a lot of hue and cry about violation of Shariat. Therefore, I wish to point out some of the un-Islamic acts every Muslim in India does, almost every day. Since these acts are against the tenets of the Shariat, will he advise all Muslims to leave India, the Darul Harab, and settle in one of the Darul Islams like Pakistan or Bangladesh? Even then, they will have to violate some of the tenets of Shariat for their bare survival.

1. Living in a country where the majority are all Kafirs is against the tenets of the Shariat. Either you have to convert them to Islam or declare jihad on them. While some of the true followers of Shariat are already on the job, what would the enlightened and peace-loving Muslims like to do?.

2. Haj pilgrimage has to be undertaken spending the hard-earned money of a Muslim. Then how do they accept the Haj subsidy which is offered by the Indian Government? There are nearly 57 Muslim countries and none of them, truly sticking to the tenets of Shariat, offer subsidy to Haj. It is only the Indian government, run mostly by non-Muslims, i.e. Kafirs, that offer Haj subsidy out of the tax money collected from Hindus (Kafirs), which Muslims are enjoying without any compunction. Is accepting Haj subsidy not against the tenets of the Shariat?

3. Every Muslim in India is eating rice and wheat which is produced by Hindu farmers. A Hindu farmer performs Bhoomi Pooja before ploughing his field. He performs pooja of his Plough/tractor and all other implements. He performs pooja of his Bullocks. Once the harvest is made, he is first offering the produce to the Sun God. Pongal in Tamil Nadu, Pedda Panduga in Andhra Pradesh, Onam in Kerala, Lohri and Baishaki in Punjab, Bhogali Bihu in Assam/WB, Til Good in Maharashtra, etc. and Makar Shankaranti all over India are all festivals connoting the harvest of grains/rice/wheat being offered to Sun God. After all these poojas and celebrations, the grain is released in the market. So the rice/wheat we buy from a shop is in a way the Prasad offered to Hindu Gods and Goddesses. All Indians, including Muslims, buy them. Is eating the Prasad not against the tenets of the Shariat?

4. Islam is against acting, singing, dancing, painting and photography. It is totally against entertainment. So, according to Shariat, our Khans in the film industry are doing an un-Islamic act. MF Hussain, who derives vicarious pleasure in painting Hindu gods in nude, is doing an un-Islamic act and should be unequivocally told that he has to give up either painting or Islam. He cannot eat the ladoo and have it too. Since all these Khans and Hussains are acting against the tenets of Shariat, will the Maulvis issue a Fatwa against all of them?

5. Islam is against democracy and voting. All Muslims who cast their votes are violating Quran. Since Islam does not believe in nationalism, democracy and man-made laws, electing Law Makers is un-Islamic. When Muslims are supposed to obey only Shariat laws, how can they vote for electing Law Makers? Is it not contradictory? When Shariat is supreme, what is the purpose of electing MPs and MLAs who will make laws - a man-made one at that - which Muslims are not supposed to obey. Is voting, and for that matter standing for election, not against the tenets of the Shariat?

6. Any Muslim who considers himself an ‘intellectual’ is insulting Quran. Only a free thinker can be an intellectual. A Muslim is prohibited from thinking freely. Prophet Mohammed has thought of everything and has reduced them to writing in Quran. Any Muslim having any doubt about anything has to just look into the Quran for a solution. He has no right to think. The moment he thinks freely, he is violating Quran and insulting Prophet Mohammed. So, is not the word “intellectual Muslim” against the tenets of the Shariat?

7. Islam does not support modern science and development. Quran was revealed nearly 1400 years ago. Muslims claim it to be a complete and perfect code for living, suitable for all occasions and times, and therefore are against any change or reform in it. All the scientific developments, such as computers, mobile phones, information technology, internet, etc. were of recent developments. Since all these could not have been mentioned in Quran revealed nearly 1400 years ago, Muslims should not take advantage of these modern business tools. In fact, in some parts of India, Maulvis have issued Fatwa against viewing Television. Even in Mumbai in some buildings occupied solely by Muslims, there is no TV cable connection. Therefore, the question is: Is the use of modern communication technologies by Muslims not against the tenets of the Shariat?

8. According to Quran, Idol worship is a curse. But what is surprising is that Mullahs and Maulvis with beard and skull cap are saying this. The very fact that they are growing beard and wearing skull cap is proof enough of Idol worship. After all, what is idol. You visualise something in your mind and then give a shape to it. Mullahs and Maulvis visualise Prophet Mohammed in a particular fashion and give a shape to his appearance, by growing beard and wearing skull cap. It is nothing but Murthy pooja. Are the beard and skull cap, tantamounting to idol worship, not against the tenets of the Shariat?

9. There are many famous Dargarhs in India. Will Mr. Jilani explain what is the sanctity of Dargarh in Quran and Hadith? A worship in a Dargarh is against Islam, although crores of Muslims and Hindus frequent all major Dargarhs in India. Islamic countries do not have Dargarhs. Is worshipping at a Dargarh by a Muslim not against the tenets of the Shariat?

10. Above all, what is Namaaz? Is it not practising Yoga - an ascetic Hindu practice? Moulvis have declared fatwa against Yoga, but they practise it 5 times a day!

In support of each violation of Shariat by Muslims as mentioned above, I can quote many verses from the Quran and Hadith. The point I want to make is that one cannot exist in the 21st century and still claim 100 per cent adherence to Quran and Hadith. Those who claim so are charlatans.

Thus, all Indian Muslims are practically Hindus, since they are peace-loving, Prasad-eating, acting, singing, painting, movie-going, voting, idol-worshipping and TV-viewing, as also are using computers, mobile phones, internet, etc.- all un-Islamic acts. Those who proclaim themselves to be Muslims should be told that either unwittingly or out of sheer necessity they have become Hindus.

Therefore, every Hindu should tell his Muslim brethren that since he is already acting against the tenets of the Shariat (otherwise, he cannot survive in the 21st century), one more act of violating the Shariat (i.e. singing Vande Mataram) is not going to make much of a difference for them. On the contrary, it will lead to communal harmony and strengthen national integration<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

[Guest]

<b>Deoband's latest fatwa: Muslims can't insure</b><!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->
The Darul Ifta of Deoband, the body authorised to issue fatwas, issued a fatwa saying that interest earned on bank deposits as well as insurance of life is illegal as per the Shariat, the supreme law for Muslims. <span style='color:red'>And that Muslims should not go in for insurance or assurance of life which has been given to them by Allah.</span>  <!--emo&--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->

The fatwa, issued by Mohammad Zafeeruddin non August 7, in consultation with the two muftis of Darul Uloom, Deoband says: “Life insurance is not permissible because there is interest income in it as well as gambling, which are illegal under Shariat.”

The fatwa was issued in response to a question from one Saleem Chisti from Lucknow who was approached by an insurance company to buy a policy and become an agent.

<b> “It is najayaz as per the Shariat,”</b> said vice-president of All India Muslim Personal Law Board (AIMPLB) Maulana Khaleed Rashid. It amounts to not believing in the supreme status of Allah, he said. But his colleague and noted Shia cleric Maulana Kalbe Sadiq disagreed: “There is nothing wrong in taking an insurance policy. I can say it in the light of the laws followed by the Shia sect. But if another sect has views against it, one should respect that too.”

<b>The chairman of the All India Shia Personal Law Board, Maulana Mirza Mohammad Athar, too, said such fatwas are not binding on Shias. </b>

Support for the fatwa among Sunnis, however, was strong. Said Rukhsana Lari, a member of AIMPLB: <b>“Insurance is illegal as per the Shariat. Those who are covered under group insurance in their jobs should donate the interest and the maturity benefits. </b>Mufti of Nadwa College too has said that if under certain circumstances one has to take life insurance policy, the interest should not be accepted
<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is good. Now they want to screw muslims. <!--emo&--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
For Sunni its bad and for Shia it is Okay.

[Guest]

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>Ali Akbar's son claims to be Hindu </b>
Priyanka Dasgupta
RSS Feeds| SMS NEWS to 8888 for latest updates

KOLKATA: Aasish Khan, the son of sarod maestro Ustad Ali Akbar Khan, has embraced Hinduism, sparking off a raging debate and heartache to the 84-year-old father who has told TOI his son was besmirching his illustrious family’s name.

Aasish, who has already changed his surname to Debsharma through affidavit on August 19, claims his family was never really Muslim. "We were originally Brahmins and used the surname Debsharma. My great-grandfather Sadananda Debsharma took the title of Khan, which is not a surname and is used by Hindus and Christians... due to compulsions. We never converted to Islam."

His dad is distraught. In an email to TOI from the US, where Ali Akbar has settled down, he said: "I do not support his (Aasish’s) choice. Unfortunately, many statements made by my son in the newspaper regarding the history of my family are incorrect. My family has been Muslims for many generations, and we will remain Muslims. It is a shame that he is trying to reinvent the history of our family and in turn hurting the past generation of our family."

Aasish's 'reinvention' is that his ancestors were Hindus. He claims his family even prayed to goddesses Kali and Saraswati. He said he was never asked to follow Islamic rituals or offer namaz and his grandfather had given Hindu names to him and his siblings — Dhyanesh, Pranesh and Amaresh.

"Staunch Muslims have opposed my decision," he said. "They did not realise we were never converted to Islam. I would like to make it clear that the only religion our family believes in is music," said the 60-something Aasish.

Ali Akbar Khan, who juggles his classes at Ali Akbar College of Music and three dialysis sessions a week with his rare concerts across the world, is hurt and the music fraternity stunned by Aasish’s claim.

The Ali Akbar family is not an ordinary family — his father Allaudin Khan is the founder of the Maihar gharana and his disciples, including Ravi Shankar, Nikhil Banerjee and Ali Akbar, have dominated the Hindustani classical music world for years.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/artic...945418.cms

<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

A refreshing reading. I'm willing to bet that this news particularly upset the so-called marxist and secular groups in India, more than it did other Indian muslims. These groups will be at loss to explain why Ali Akba Khan reverted to hinduism, when there was more money and more glory to be made being anti-hindu.

I hope all the Indian muslims would revert back to their original faith, hinduism, from where many were forcefully converted to islam by the muslim invaders.

Now, if only the Indian christians would see light, and understand that they too have been driven to christianity, either forcefully through aggression and violence, or with the church taking advantage of their economic vulnerability and using it as weapon to convert them to christianity under the pretext of voluntary conversion.