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Ancient Indian History
<!--QuoteBegin-dhu+Apr 8 2006, 10:08 PM-->QUOTE(dhu @ Apr 8 2006, 10:08 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->I was able to download it just now.  use the "free download links" then click on "file factory FTP".

Kindly upload the harappan seals pdf

The link is now dead
Wikipedia's main page on India has a history section which states:-<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Stone Age rock shelters with paintings at Bhimbetka in the state of Madhya Pradesh are the earliest known traces of human life in India.<b> The first known permanent settlements appeared over 9,000 years ago and gradually developed into the Indus Valley Civilization, dating back to 3300 BCE in western India. It was followed by the Vedic Civilization which laid the foundations of Hinduism and other cultural aspects of early Indian society.</b> From around 550 BCE, many independent kingdoms and republics known as the Mahajanapadas were established across the country laying the foundations of ancient India.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->But in their section of Indus valley civilization they show the picture of Indus valley seals in which there is Swsatika.If foundations of Hinduism were laid by later Vedic civilization how come the earlier Indus valley ppl use Swastika.?Or is that the later Vedic civilization "adopted" the Swastika?


<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->When did the Roma leave India? The answer may be lost forever, but most likely the Roma have been emigrating out of India for thousands of years. Major movements, however, have been established. One such movement was in 1308 when the Lohar caste was defeated defending their ancestral city in Rajasthan; The Lohars have been documented as arriving in Eastern Europe around 1320. This is an important date in the history of the Kosovar Gypsies because the Lohars are the blacksmith caste of India. They became nomadic after their defeat and were known to roam in highly decorated wagons pulled by either black water buffalo or small Punjabi ponies, both of which can be found in Kosova today. <b>The largest Roma caste in Kosova is the Kovachi, which is the Serbian translation for blacksmith. </b>link<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

"serbian" kovachi is from kavach
gypsy ethonyms
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Zotti (pl. Zott)

Zott is Arabicised form of Jat, an Indian tribal name; Persian name for 'gypsy' (6.35); and also for all Indus-valley peoples (6.36)link<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Kashmir's Vedic past preserved in Hari Parbat rocks</b> <!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Men do not make their history in isolation from the past. The memories of dead generations hang like a millstone around the necks of present generations”, said Karl Marx long years ago. This is true of Srinagar. Founded originally by Emperor Ashok in the third century B C, the city might have lost much of its resplendence, because of militancy, but a lot of its pre-historic grandeur, hovering around Vedic period, remains preserved in Hariparbat, a hillock in the heart of the old city.
The abode of Goddess Durga, Hariparbat, over which a fort was built by Emperor Akbar in 1592, is a saga of the ancient history, which finds mention in Kalhana’s Rajtarangani (chronicle of kings) and the Mahabharata.

<b>The 12th century historian, Kalhana, in his Sanskrit chronicle, has described Hariparbat as “the epicentre of spiritualism in Kashmir”. Mahabharata and other religious scriptures refer to Hariparbat as the ‘principal’ seat (Pradhumna Peeetha) of the Goddess, worshipped locally as ‘Sharika’. </b>

<b>Till militancy made its presence felt, circumambulation of the hillock was a ritual for devout Hindus. It is believed that Hariparbat represents the abode of nine crore (90 million) manifestations of the Goddess. </b>
<b>Each and every rock is regarded very sacred by the local Hindu community, or Kashmiri Pandits, who have been exiled by the Pakistan-backed terrorists. The Pandits, now scattered all over the country, are the original aborigines of Kashmir. </b>They pine to see Hariparbat, which used to be the centre of cultural and religious activities.

<b>Although very few authentic documents have survived various invasions of Kashmir, much of the 5000-year-old Vedic period has been preserved in the hillock. Sadly enough, the hillock has been neglected and it is facing extinction. People who live in its vicinity have been damaging the image-bearing rocks, because of ignorance. They have been using stones for house construction and other purposes.

According to Kashmiri litterateur and Sanskrit scholar, Ghulam Rasool Santosh, there exists no less than 30 million of ‘Trikuti’ Gods on Hariparbat”. He extensively studied Hariparbat rocks till his death in the mid-nineties. Santosh was among the early targets of militants for his scholastic qualities and deep knowledge of Vedic philosophy. </b>
Said Santosh at a well attended lecture, “So far my findings and observations go I have been able to locate all the rocks and stones on the hill. They are chiselled and shaped as if by human hands; and carved images are produced there from. This fully supports the ancient tradition”.

About the parikrima (going around) of the hill, he used to say, it leads “one to truth”. Why? Because all ‘mantras’ are alive and vibrant in the hillock. However, in his view, ‘mantras’ are not written or carved on any rock. The very visual images on the hillock represent the sound images as produced by the mantras, according to him.

<b>Santosh claimed to have decoded the images and “derived thereof both ‘mantras’ and ‘yantras’. Every mantra as a pure sound must correspondingly have a pure image, he believed. Geometry is a pure image, which is a ‘yantra’ and ‘Mantra’ as a composite sound must have a correspondingly composite image. All the carved images on the hill are of a composite nature, he contended.

Kashmir has been the seat of ancient learning, which is attested by an account left by the fifth century Chinese traveller Fa-Yong. Kashmir, known as ‘Rishivar’, was the abode of Rishis (sages). The Rishi lineage goes upto Maharishi Kashayapa. Goddess Sharika had appeared before him in the form of ‘Haer’ (bird) Sarika.

The Kashmiri proverb “satan sendran tal (hidden under seven sindoors (vermilion)”, denotes the vow to preserve ‘the secret’. “ Literally, it refers to the seven sindoor-smeared rocks enshrining the ancient secrets of the Rishis, discernible only through their visual and sound-bearing images”, Santosh said in an article, which appeared in ‘Shiraz’, a journal published by the Jammu and Kashmir Academy of Art, Culture and Languages in 1987.

These smeared rocks represent: Mahaganesh, Zala (the Goddess of the volcano), Sapth Rishi, Mahakali, Chakreshwari, Sheetla and Haer, known as Sedda, All of these are located to the north-east of the hillock. “The primeval ‘roopa’ (manifestation) of Mother Sarika---‘Haer’--- crowns the hillock right up to the fort”, said Santosh in the article.

Geologists believe that the land reclaimed as ‘Kashmir’, is between three lakh years to four lakh years old. It is a legend that water of the vast mountain lake called ‘Satisara’ got drained out due to the penance of Maharishi Kashyap, who had got this boon from Lord Shiva.

There is a reference to it in the Neelmatpurana (this is an additional Purana for Kashmir) that when Sati (consort of Lord Shiva) burnt herself in the ‘yagnya’ performed by her father Dakshiprajapata (father-in-law of Lord Shiva), Shiva brought the burnt corpse of Sati and immersed it in the Satisar. The existing remnants of this dead-water lake are the water bodies of Wular lake, Dal lake, Anchar lake, Hokarsar and many other lakes in the Kashmir Himalayas. </b>
Kashyap Rishi had devoted his entire spiritual life in fighting the water demon Jaladabhava, because he had obstructed the flow of the lake water down the gorge, near the north-western end of the lake. The demon was finally killed by the Goddess Sharika, who had appeared in the form of the bird ‘Haer’.

The death of the demon later led to the speedy flow of the water and the lake turned into a heaven-like vale, which late came to be called as Cashmere or Kashmir.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Recently scholars have attempted to study ancient Indian history in relation to texts like veda and others. I am not aware of any article or book based on this study. The superimposition of these texts on the civilization raises some question which I hope experts on this forum will help counter. Also I would request for a right up on pre-history based on texts and archeological proof by you people. Id also like to state that I am a layman trying to understand Indian history and wrong statements should be forgiven and corrected.
Q1 rig veda dates to 5000 bc and scholars say that hymns were composed on river sarsvati where indo-iranians resided , the presence of asur’s as different from composers of ved indicate a small disparity like say any two sects of morden day Hinduism(Iranians also pray to sarasvati and call it xyz.) But ramayan dated to 5000 bc talks of ravan as asur and daev asur war.(this would put ram’s date to after indo-iranian split. Unless we assume Iranians are as yet not classified as asurs.
Again dating RV to 5000 bc (to3000bc) requires presence of preharappa sites on the sarasvati.
RV belongs to pro harrapa period, so when sarasvati stops being a sea going river (prior to 3000 bc) the population moves east ,S and west (wets movement indicating a split and not nnecc a fight between indo Iranians) this time period of east movement can successfully explain the 3000 bc central-India Mahabharat war.(does RV mention eastern rivers and habitations?) also this east movement of civilization will be termed as the FIRST MIGRATION , because the second migration occurs after the disappearance of sarasvati~1900’s (again presence of a high civilization on the still mighty sarasvati in 2500 BC and lack of regular mention of the river in mahabharat will put MB dates in jeopardy and it will have to be dated after desiccation of the river.
Q2. scholars claims that in rigveda asuras are kept in high regard , also is present along the Indus garbhand dated 2500 bc proving presence of Iranians,they also pray to sarasvati but at the same time we have bactria site daing 3000 bc , with coencentric buildings ,indicating an asur tripura like structure indicating a daev-asur split.etc.. yet hittie treaty dated 1400’s calls on indra who is suppose to be the leader in the dev-asur war and he has as yet not been declared a daev(demon) by the Iranians.
In all this medely of dates , on which dated should the indo –iranian split be dated?? and such a late presence of indra still in high regard will bring down the dates of text which talk of dev-asur war
Q4 what do our text say about harappa civilization ?? which tribe rules in indus-sarasvati area at the time of mahabharat?? Who does balram meet on the banks of sarasvati when goes for a pilgrimage?? Why are the texts silent on such an advanced civilization , they should mention either with envy or pride the great-ruler of this area
Q5 coming to harappa itself ait propogators claim that it was a utopian society quite contarary to vedic society… so how do harrapan ruins explain the society that is supposed to exsist in post mahabharat times??
Q6 assumin IE developed in northen India…how do we reconcile the north and south divide /or unity. A) did the southerners habitate the north as per manu the Dravidian king and survivor of the flood b) did a northen group habitate the south a la rishi agastya and parsuram who moved south ,,or did they just spread the teachings south (like missionaries) and thus uniting the north and south which had developed separately??(considering south is not mentioned in indian texts.initially)
The question is how and when did the north and south become one ,and if they were already one how is the exsistence of two different language families explained
q7 there is no information available on archeology of mahabharat sites , i have just read that such an excavation was carrier out by mr b b lal in 1950's , and the other information available(subhash kak) is that hastinapur had pillars dating to 3000 bc..is their any further information ??
I was glad to find a ebook that answered many of the questions troubling me. http://voi.org/books/rig
the author rightly points out that,The trouble starts when we try to describe the Rig veda as religious text of all…north indian people.the author states that:<i>The Vedic Aryans were not the ultimate ancestors of the different tribes and peoples found in the Sanskrit texts: they were in fact just one of these tribes and peoples. They have a definite historical identity: the Vedic Aryans were the PUrus of the ancient texts</i>
the few question answered are

Q1 rig veda dates to 5000 bc and scholars say that hymns were composed on river sarsvati where indo-iranians resided , the presence of asur’s as different from composers of ved indicate a small disparity like say any two sects of morden day Hinduism(Iranians also pray to sarasvati and call it xyz.) But ramayan dated to 5000 bc talks of ravan as asur and daev asur war.(this would put ram’s date to after indo-iranian split. Unless we assume Iranians are as yet not classified as asurs.
The book answers this question by proclaiming that writers of veda’s were just the puru tribe. Then this animosity and describing as asur of any non puru tribe be it yadu or proto Iranians (which the author identifies as Anu tribe) can be successfully explained.
Again dating RV to 5000 bc (to3000bc) requires presence of preharappa sites on the sarasvati. So are there any pre-harappa sites there??
RV belongs to pro harrapa period, so when sarasvati stops being a sea going river (prior to 3000 bc) the population moves east ,S and west (wets movement indicating a split and not nnecc a fight between indo Iranians) this time period of east movement can successfully explain the 3000 bc central-India Mahabharat war.(does RV mention eastern rivers and habitations?) also this east movement of civilization will be termed as the FIRST MIGRATION , because the second migration occurs after the disappearance of sarasvati~1900’s (again presence of a high civilization on the still mighty sarasvati in 2500 BC and lack of regular mention of the river in mahabharat will put MB dates in jeopardy and it will have to be dated after desiccation of the river.
The author ,by putting the various chapters of the rig veda , in a correct chronological order,shows us that earlier society was spread from sarasvati to ganga and later they become of Indus and .thus various tribes were already in their respective regions, for the geographical locations required for mahabharat
<b>Sarasvati River</b>

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Indian mosques: From vandalism to architectural marvels<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->New Delhi, Nov 19 : <b>India's earliest mosques were often built on material pillaged from Hindu and Jain shrines </b>but before long Islamic rulers injected their stamp of architectural excellence.

In the process, the Indian subcontinent, mainly India, have come to house several mosques that are counted among the best in the world. And these include Delhi's 17th-century Jama Masjid, constructed by Mughal emperor Shahjahan.

The story of the Indian mosques, along with those of mosques across the world, is summarized in Razia Grover's eye-catching coffee table book "Mosques" (Lustre Press, Roli Books).

The first mosque in present day India came up courtesy Turkish slave turned ruler Qutub ud-din Aibak who raised the Quwwat ul-Islam (Power of Islam) mosque in AD 1193 within south Delhi's fortified city of Qila Rai Pithora.

Planning for the mosque was easy, but the task of building it proved difficult due to lack of artisans and masons.

"Thus, right at the inception of Islamic building activity in India, a joint venture between the Hindu builders and Islamic overseers became inevitable," the book says.

"In India, because of the need for speedy construction of the first congregational mosque, <b><span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>the warriors of the faith had perforce to look for building materials in the temple destroyed in their iconoclastic zeal. </b></span>
"These had been assembled out of meticulously cut structural elements such as beams, columns and lintels and put together without mortar... <b>They were easy to dismantle but profusely carved with images of the pantheon of Hindu deities...

"Moreover, the existing foundations of the Hindu sanctuary were made use of, with the western verandah being enlarged into a more spacious pillared hall."

Similar vandalism also took place outside Delhi.</b>
Of the Jami Mosque at Daulatabad and the Deval Mosque at Bodhan, while the former "was produced entirely with materials from temples in its vicinity, the one at Bodhan was merely a Jaina temple converted to a mosque through a few structural additions made to it".

The author says since the mosques in southern India (Bidar, Bijapur and Golconda) were not built around live and thriving centres of Hindu culture, "so the spoil in the form of ready made Hindu building materials were not easily available in fashioning new structures".

<span style='color:red'><b>Another of the earliest mosques in northern India was the Atala Mosque, built in 1408. "Its name derives from a temple to the goddess Atala Devi, which stood on the site and was destroyed to make way for the mosque."</b></span>But as time passed, the Mughal rulers used original building materials for their grand Islamic shrines.

The book describes Delhi's Jama Masjid, India's largest mosque, as "an appropriate climax to a tradition of mosque building that began with the Quwwat-ul-Islam, about 500 years earlier, and saw the erection of subsequent mosques of a uniquely Indian character".

The Jama Masjid, the author says, "is an architecturally lucid composition that has an air of grandeur more spectacular than any of its predecessors". <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The Mahabharata and the Sindhu-Sarasvati Tradition
- Subhash Kak
Article is interesting read.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Concluding Remarks

The material from the Mahabharata and the Puranas provides us many tangled hints. Given the extensive nature of the king-lists and the teacher-lists it is impossible that the origin of the Mahabharata-Purana tradition could be brought down to the beginning of the second millennium BC as espoused by the proponents of the theories of Aryan invasion and migration. The Mahabharata War occurs at the 94th generation in these lists, and even if one were to assign just 20 years for each generation and assume that the lists were exhaustive, one would have to account for nearly 2,000 years before the War which, even in the most conservative dating for the War, takes us square into the beginnings of the Integration Era of the SS Tradition.

The Epic and Puranic evidence on the geographical situation supports the notion of the shifting of the centre of the Vedic world from the Sarasvati to the Ganga region in early second millennium BC. O.P. Bharadwaj’s excellent study of the Vedic Sarasvati using textual evidence12 supports the theory that the Rgveda is to be dated about 3000 BC and the Mahabharata War must have occurred about that time.

The Mahabharata clearly belongs to a heroic age, prior to the rise of the complexity of urban life. The weapons used are mythical or clubs. The narrative of chariots could be a later gloss added in the first millennium BC. The pre-urban core events of the Epic would fit the 3137 BC date much better than the 1924 BC. But this would suggest that the Puranic tradition at a later time conflated earlier events with the destructive earthquakes of 1924 BC and remembered the later event accurately using the centennial Saptarsi calendar. The Indic kings of West Asia are descendents of Vedic people who moved West after the catastrophe of 1924 BC
about chariots, i think we should look at ramayan for an answer. if horses and chariots have also been introduced and used in ramayan (which is older than mb) then we can assume they would have done the same in mhb, other wise we should not give up on chariot evidence so soon. also its sad that scholars now are undermining the need for chariots ,what will they say if we discover a whole colony of horse and chariots?? the need for horses should not change with the availabilty of evidence!
AIT is a virus and we should not let it effect us so that we keeps changing the obvious meaning of our texts and evidence under pressure to fight it.
Viren and Min, In Ramayana, Indra sends his chariot for Lord Sri Ram for the final battle with Ravana. And there are earlier refs to chariots like Queen Kaikeyi drives the chariot for Maharaja Dasharath whose name itself means Ten chariots. So definitely Ramayana had chariots.

Offcourse Witzelians will call that a later insertion!
Ramana: And didn't Luv & Kush stop Rama's horse and read the challenge on horse's forehead.

There's hundreds of references to horses in Mahabharata and Ramayana. Example:
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The swift monkey, Angada struck his chariot, having a variegated body of gold, along with horses and the charioteer in the battle. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Valmiki Ramayana - Yuddha Kanda in Prose Sarga 43

Plenty references to Bhalika horses

Has such references been documented to debunk Indo Euro Racists club?

<!--QuoteBegin-ramana+Nov 26 2006, 03:58 PM-->QUOTE(ramana @ Nov 26 2006, 03:58 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Offcourse Witzelians will call that a later insertion!
Witzel's on record in some Indian publication (Frontline or Outlook or Hindu) where he stated that it's hard to differentiate between a donkey and a horse. Must be true since Harvard's bet on a donkey <!--emo&Wink--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
thanks a lot for reply but i am confused now ! it would be logical if mhb is to be dated to 3000 bc it can have horses and chariots. and as scholars put ramayan one millenium before that..i wouldnt expect horses and chariots being used. so should we take both to be later additions or ramayan a bit earlier, or both to correspond to a period of sufficient use of horses n chariots
<b>Farming in India began Mesolithic period (6-7,000 BC)</b>, much before the Neolithic period (4000 BC) as is generally believed
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Farming in India started much before than is generally believed. Experts in the fields of archaeology and history said this while shedding light on earliest history of India, Indian culture and other aspects at the annual joint conference of the Indian Archaeological Society, Indian Society for Prehistoric and Quaternary Studies and the Indian History and Culture Society, which was organised here at Jiwaji University on Sunday.
<b>Professor VD Mishra said that new researches have revealed that agricultural practices in India started in Mesolithic period (6-7,000 BC), much before the Neolithic period (4000 BC) as is generally believed.</b>

This discovery has proved that agriculture in India started simultaneously with other parts of the world. He said that Sativa rice, discovered from excavations at Chopni in Belan valley, has proved that India did not lag behind in agriculture.

I am sure that the above study will be refuted by "eminient" historians including some linguists for whom such news is always bad <!--emo&Smile--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Sonugn: These "eminient" historians including some linguist are irrelevant now. The tsunami of scientific, archealogical, DNA and other data that's coming in will render their profession obselete. Hence they are fighting tooth and nail against 6th grade kids in places like California! <!--emo&:rock--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rock.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='rock.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The O'Odham: Native-Americans By Gene D. Matlock, BA, M.A.

Very interesting article
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Hindu scholars have always claimed that in remotest times, their ancestors visited every part of the globe, mapping it accurately, and mining gold and copper in such places as Michigan, Colorado, Arizona, England, Ireland, Peru, and Bolivia. Known to us as "Indo-Europeans," they lost their grip on the world in about 1500 BC., retreating to what are now Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Northern India. However, they continued to visit the Americas in their large teakwood ships, many of them 250 feet long and five- to six-masted, until about 1200 A.D. After that, the sectarian fanaticism and territorialism of their religious leaders, rebellions among their conquered subjects, constant internecine rivalries, and troubles with Moslem invaders forced them into isolation.

No Westerner naively accepts India's claims of having once dominated the world. Right? Well, some of us do.

In an essay entitled On Egypt from the <b>Ancient Book of the Hindus </b>(Asiatic Researchers Vol. III, 1792), British Lt. Colonel Francis Wilford gave abundant evidence proving that ancient Indians colonized and settled in Egypt. The British explorer John Hanning Speke, who in 1862 discovered the source of the Nile in Lake Victoria, acknowledged that the Egyptians themselves didn't have the slightest knowledge of where the Nile's source was. However, Lt. Colonel Wilford's description of the Hindu's intimate acquaintance with ancient Egypt led Speke to Ripon Falls, at the edge of Lake Victoria.

<!--QuoteBegin-aruni+Sep 27 2006, 05:21 PM-->QUOTE(aruni @ Sep 27 2006, 05:21 PM)<!--QuoteEBegin-->Reclaiming the Chronology of Bharatam
B. N. Narahari Achar

Date of the Mah˜bh˜rata War based on Simulations using Planetarium Software

On related subject (came in email):

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->There are two issues here: one is astronomical observation; the other is astronomical computation.

It is clear that Veda Vyasa was recording observed celestial events using them as his day's clock and calendar to realte events on the earth. There is little evidence of astronomical computation in the Great Epic, the Mahabharata which contains over 150 very specific astronomical observations and events such as the sequence of lunar-solar-lunar eclipses occurring within 13 tithi-s each, Bhishma waiting for the arrival of the uttarayana punyakaala to leave his mortal body, the starting and arrival nakshatra of the 42-day pariyatra by Shri Balarama along River Sarasvati and the celestial position of planets on each day of the 18-day war, apart from astronomical discussions during Krishna-Karna samvaada and the references to comets as demonstrated by Narahari Achar.

Remarkable work is ongoing to relate astronomical information contained in ancient texts of Bharatam to scientifically falsifiable geological events such as the formation of a rann, incursions of the sea or earthquakes or impacts of meteorites.

We have miles to go. The work is outside of itihaasa. It is related to time, more specifically, to kaala, mahaakaala in the bharatiya perceptions of the time as a cyclical continuum, an inexorable cosmic rhythm. These explorations will take us into realms beyond physics or astronomy into relating individual consciousness to cosmic consciousness, aatman to paramaatman.

We run into problems of semantics with critical terms such as graha. When does a graha refer to a planet and when does it refer to a comet in the ancient texts? Surely, unraveling of historical time (aha, chronology) cannot be performed by historians alone but has to be a collaboration between those who can fathom the mysteries of technical terms in the Veda and in Samskrtam, Jaina, Bauddha texts and those who can see parallels with the observations of scientists of a variety of disciplines ranging from mathematics and astronomy to atoms/strings and the big bang (or collapse, or whatever). Very ancient history has to be written by scientists and language scholars in a new collaborative enterprise which has to emerge. We have the bharata nidhi, the treasure of texts; we need the young nation to take up the challenge of reading this nidhi and conveying the contents to the present and future generations.

How do we explain the metaphor of Mahaakaala of Ujjain?

<!--QuoteBegin--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->
<b>Astronomical calculations in ancient India based on scientific research</b>
HTC, Dec. 7, 2006

"THE ASTRONOMICAL calculations made in ancient India and recorded in Puranas and other texts were not mythical but were based on scientific research which is corroborated even by the modern science", said eminent historian and epigraphist, Prof. TP Verma.
He was delivering a lecture on "The Science of Manvantara" organised by the Jnana-Pravaha, Centre For Cultural Studies and Research in Samne Ghat area here on Wednesday.

Prof. Verma, former head of the Ancient Indian History, Culture and Archaeology Department in Banaras Hindu University (BHU), said that 'manvantara' represented by an intelligent being called Manu, is an astronomical unit of time denoting one cycle of life on earth, which is equivalent to 30,84,48,000 years.

"During this period, the Sun with its planets completes one circle of our galaxy, which is termed as Parameshthi-Mandala in our ancient literature. A period of 14 such cycles of 'manvantaras' is estimated as whole life of the earth", he said, adding, "Notably, modern science believes the earth to have come into existence 4.5 billion years ago, which is endorsed by the Atharva-Veda".

"Such complicated and precise astronomical calculations also establish that script and art of writing in ancient India was in vogue long before it is now believed to have been", he said. Prof. Verma further informed that according to ancient Indian calculations, Shri Krishna was born in 3210 BC, which was the junction period of Dvapara and Kali Yugas.

Presiding over the lecture, renowned Sanskrit scholar, Prof. KD Tripathi observed, "It is the high-time when we should again revert back to our ancient tradition and try to make deeper probing of our rich and vast knowledge recorded in our literature and which has now become mysterious for us". "We are deeply impressed by the researches done in the western world and accept blindly, but we are unaware of the fact that we already possessed such knowledge, which unfortunately we lost due to our ignorance", he said.       

'India's Pompeii' uncovered

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->when Ashoka the Great was founding the first Indian empire, when Julius Caesar reigned over Rome, when traders from the Mediterranean found their way to what is now an obscure Maharastra village.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--> dusty village museum houses a treasure-trove of 23,852 pieces of stone and terracotta sculptures, replicas of Roman coins and lamps, miniature inkpots, jewellery and household vessels and ivory.

There are uncounted thousands more in Ter's sands of time, civilizations layered over one another. A highly skilled people lived here: bricks excavated from the site are light enough to float on water.

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Ter's ascent came after trade with the Roman Empire under the Satavahana dynasty that ruled Dakshinapatha or the Deccan. A 1st century Greek navigation document <i>The Periplus of the Erythrean Sea</i> is history's earliest reference to Tagara or Ter. It calls it a great emporium where merchants brought goods like muslin and carnelian, which were traded with the Romans.

Ter then acquired a religious aura as successive Southern dynasties — from the Vatakatas, Chalukyas and Yadavas — came and went. We know that from its range of Buddhist caves, stupas, and Hindu and Jain temples in brick, stone, or hewn out of rock, built from donations and royal patronage. Maharashtra's 13th century saint-poet Gora Kumbhar lived here, with the town playing host to saint conventions. Experts call Ter a 'citadel city'. Limited excavations have revealed remains of a wooden rampart.

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