12-01-2008, 11:40 AM
hnair wrote:<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Sanjay wrote:
None of you have confronted anything like this. Not even in your worst scenarios. The fact is our army has fought and won major wars against an equally well armed and trained adversary. Our IS forces have a slew of tactical successes in COIN ops from J&K to the North East.
...
As an aside and as a message to those in the Western media, anyone who doubts India's proof on Pakistan's involvement and questions India's evidence should remember that they invaded two countries on less of a pretext and the Israelis launch airstrikes against undefended civilian targets anytime one of their civilians gets hit with a stone. India and Indians are sick and tired of self-appointed experts and critics and the supercilious windbags of the Western media and political establishment who sneer at our allegations of Pakistani involvment in terror attacks in India.
By the actions of your so-called experts and the patronizing condescension of your media, you have provided psychological aid and succor to the terrorists who have hurt my people time and time again.
Enough is Enough.
Thanks Sanjay for putting it clearly. There is not a word that I dont agree with 8)
Disclaimer: I do not support any gang violence by any ethnicity, but am interested in the "root causes", that the west's favored ally, Musharraf keeps saying through their own media.
I suspect that this extreme publicity by the western media to Mumbai is to inoculate their population about an impending carnage in their own cities. All western cities have huge pile of arms, sleazy underground mafias that can be made to do false flag operations and an easily scared general public. Add to that, the abundance of socially disadvantaged and pissed off people of color/ethnicity and you really dont need an islamic group to start off such stunts. When I pointed out how MS-13's LA edition started off, Johann has once condescendingly mentioned how MS13 type gangs kill "more latinos than others" and that he travels on both sides of the border of US/Mexico to figure that out. What he forgot to mention is what the latino (or african-american) community elders talk. They are clear on this bullshit of "more <insert a colored race> are killed by the <colored gang> than others" bilge that is fed via the US establishment/media. Let me explain what I heard:
This "they kill you more than they kill us" is a typical gora suggestive campaign, to demoralize these minorities and make them turn against each other. The advantage is that this minority community, in its desperate struggle for survival in gora-territory, will snuff out the violent ones as well as anyone who has decided to says enough is enough in a peaceful way. This is a new version of that good old classic, "divide and rule", aided and abetted by the media. What happens in most western cities is the gora-run establishment will make life hell for an ethnic minority that hurts goras physically or destabilizes their own sweet, idyllic, suburban "Desperate Housewives" ambiance. Such a minority is forced, coerced, socially boycotted and sometimes jailed to submission. Their members are encouraged to rat/snitch on *anyone*, including people who are peacefully protesting injustices. Finally the community is split into dhimmis and rebels. The dhimmis say "let us listen to gora,he is right". The rebels gets pissed, suspect a sellout and starts killing the dhimmis. And the minority community will see an upsurge in cops recruitment, to um, "diversify". Shootouts will be between rebels and these new cops. Gora smiles at this, puts one more feather in his cap and moves on with life. That minority community will see a lot of unwanted violence/deaths because gora cannot tame the rebels to agree to his terms nor do they want to uplift these minorities out of their social disadvantages in a systemic way. Gora finds it a lot more cost-effective to let the minorities kill each other and solve his problems. Good business sense in a way.
Any crimes committed *against* these minorities will not make any headlines, but crimes against goras are bloated beyond belief. Witness the difference in coverage between a no-name Natalie Holloway to a hip-hop legend like Tupac Shakur. This common resentment against "divide and rule" amongst the african-american community was expressed eloquently by Chris Rock during his standup routines. Dave Chapelle is another comedienne who made some really scathing skits based on this angst of African-american community elders.
A minority that challenges the "Desperate Housewives" ambiance with their own music, dressing, social customs or force are made to go through this "they hurt you more than they hurt us" ritual. Look at the initial attempts at suppressing hip-hop culture: denigration of their baggy dresses(a symbolic statement by the hip-hop community about Thrift store wardrobes that they could afford), drug running (ironically, most of the meth labs are run by whites) and apparent laziness to work (from social coercion). A rather amusing spectacle happens when the community still doesnt give up, but instead captures the gora public's imagination: gora establishment goes on overdrive to make money out of the whole "minority-chic". Obama is a shrewd person who actually turned the tables using this minority-chic sentiment, at the same time capturing the gora-public imagination. Quite a sad spectacle to behold for us Indians, who has escaped colonialism of the worst kind.
Where am I going with this? The Mumbai attack will give ideas to a lot of people who are pissed. The west will have a tough time if Bradford, Paris suburbs or the innercities of US decides to stop believing "you are hurting yourselves more than us" and emulate these crazed pakis. The difference is that they dont have to land there in boats with the guns. It is already there in the 2nd amendment and in the Walmarts. So those of them who sneer at the Battle of Mumbai, they are actually wetting their pants. IMO, only France (yes, the surrender monkeys) **might** have the tenacity and grit to fight out a prolonged urban war and yet come out stronger as a nation like India. The rest are not going to have it easy. Based on past performances (right from colonial times), their public are not as discerning as Indians, who know the difference between a "war for profits" and a "war that is thrust on us". Even the humblest voter in India knows the dos and donts. Come elections, sometimes we punish our leaders for the deaths of Indians. And then sometimes we dont, because we know that some things were out of these politicians hands. Bhagavad Geetha 101.
Israelis should realize that they are fast running out of options - their enemy is adapting to smarter techniques (witness the egypt border opening incident) and their allies are shrinking fast. Add to that the fact that their military is being challenged regularly. And sometimes successfully too.
Only Pakistani elites are idiotic enough to support the violent terrorists at a society level and then later on believe "You have to fight them for your own good" words of wisdom of gora. Only they will bitch about predator attacks, get their soldiers killed in their own territory, while still foolishly supporting terrorism. But then they never had a clue about rights and wrong.
Johann, stop trying to convince us that India should turn into a police state like those in the west or a huge barrack like Israel. I know your postings were highly critical of the Pakis, but a lot of us die because of your country and its big brothers' direct and indirect help. Stop trying to turn us against our own Govt by saying "Indians hurt more than others due to other Indians". We are not going to do that. Thanks.
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None of you have confronted anything like this. Not even in your worst scenarios. The fact is our army has fought and won major wars against an equally well armed and trained adversary. Our IS forces have a slew of tactical successes in COIN ops from J&K to the North East.
...
As an aside and as a message to those in the Western media, anyone who doubts India's proof on Pakistan's involvement and questions India's evidence should remember that they invaded two countries on less of a pretext and the Israelis launch airstrikes against undefended civilian targets anytime one of their civilians gets hit with a stone. India and Indians are sick and tired of self-appointed experts and critics and the supercilious windbags of the Western media and political establishment who sneer at our allegations of Pakistani involvment in terror attacks in India.
By the actions of your so-called experts and the patronizing condescension of your media, you have provided psychological aid and succor to the terrorists who have hurt my people time and time again.
Enough is Enough.
Thanks Sanjay for putting it clearly. There is not a word that I dont agree with 8)
Disclaimer: I do not support any gang violence by any ethnicity, but am interested in the "root causes", that the west's favored ally, Musharraf keeps saying through their own media.
I suspect that this extreme publicity by the western media to Mumbai is to inoculate their population about an impending carnage in their own cities. All western cities have huge pile of arms, sleazy underground mafias that can be made to do false flag operations and an easily scared general public. Add to that, the abundance of socially disadvantaged and pissed off people of color/ethnicity and you really dont need an islamic group to start off such stunts. When I pointed out how MS-13's LA edition started off, Johann has once condescendingly mentioned how MS13 type gangs kill "more latinos than others" and that he travels on both sides of the border of US/Mexico to figure that out. What he forgot to mention is what the latino (or african-american) community elders talk. They are clear on this bullshit of "more <insert a colored race> are killed by the <colored gang> than others" bilge that is fed via the US establishment/media. Let me explain what I heard:
This "they kill you more than they kill us" is a typical gora suggestive campaign, to demoralize these minorities and make them turn against each other. The advantage is that this minority community, in its desperate struggle for survival in gora-territory, will snuff out the violent ones as well as anyone who has decided to says enough is enough in a peaceful way. This is a new version of that good old classic, "divide and rule", aided and abetted by the media. What happens in most western cities is the gora-run establishment will make life hell for an ethnic minority that hurts goras physically or destabilizes their own sweet, idyllic, suburban "Desperate Housewives" ambiance. Such a minority is forced, coerced, socially boycotted and sometimes jailed to submission. Their members are encouraged to rat/snitch on *anyone*, including people who are peacefully protesting injustices. Finally the community is split into dhimmis and rebels. The dhimmis say "let us listen to gora,he is right". The rebels gets pissed, suspect a sellout and starts killing the dhimmis. And the minority community will see an upsurge in cops recruitment, to um, "diversify". Shootouts will be between rebels and these new cops. Gora smiles at this, puts one more feather in his cap and moves on with life. That minority community will see a lot of unwanted violence/deaths because gora cannot tame the rebels to agree to his terms nor do they want to uplift these minorities out of their social disadvantages in a systemic way. Gora finds it a lot more cost-effective to let the minorities kill each other and solve his problems. Good business sense in a way.
Any crimes committed *against* these minorities will not make any headlines, but crimes against goras are bloated beyond belief. Witness the difference in coverage between a no-name Natalie Holloway to a hip-hop legend like Tupac Shakur. This common resentment against "divide and rule" amongst the african-american community was expressed eloquently by Chris Rock during his standup routines. Dave Chapelle is another comedienne who made some really scathing skits based on this angst of African-american community elders.
A minority that challenges the "Desperate Housewives" ambiance with their own music, dressing, social customs or force are made to go through this "they hurt you more than they hurt us" ritual. Look at the initial attempts at suppressing hip-hop culture: denigration of their baggy dresses(a symbolic statement by the hip-hop community about Thrift store wardrobes that they could afford), drug running (ironically, most of the meth labs are run by whites) and apparent laziness to work (from social coercion). A rather amusing spectacle happens when the community still doesnt give up, but instead captures the gora public's imagination: gora establishment goes on overdrive to make money out of the whole "minority-chic". Obama is a shrewd person who actually turned the tables using this minority-chic sentiment, at the same time capturing the gora-public imagination. Quite a sad spectacle to behold for us Indians, who has escaped colonialism of the worst kind.
Where am I going with this? The Mumbai attack will give ideas to a lot of people who are pissed. The west will have a tough time if Bradford, Paris suburbs or the innercities of US decides to stop believing "you are hurting yourselves more than us" and emulate these crazed pakis. The difference is that they dont have to land there in boats with the guns. It is already there in the 2nd amendment and in the Walmarts. So those of them who sneer at the Battle of Mumbai, they are actually wetting their pants. IMO, only France (yes, the surrender monkeys) **might** have the tenacity and grit to fight out a prolonged urban war and yet come out stronger as a nation like India. The rest are not going to have it easy. Based on past performances (right from colonial times), their public are not as discerning as Indians, who know the difference between a "war for profits" and a "war that is thrust on us". Even the humblest voter in India knows the dos and donts. Come elections, sometimes we punish our leaders for the deaths of Indians. And then sometimes we dont, because we know that some things were out of these politicians hands. Bhagavad Geetha 101.
Israelis should realize that they are fast running out of options - their enemy is adapting to smarter techniques (witness the egypt border opening incident) and their allies are shrinking fast. Add to that the fact that their military is being challenged regularly. And sometimes successfully too.
Only Pakistani elites are idiotic enough to support the violent terrorists at a society level and then later on believe "You have to fight them for your own good" words of wisdom of gora. Only they will bitch about predator attacks, get their soldiers killed in their own territory, while still foolishly supporting terrorism. But then they never had a clue about rights and wrong.
Johann, stop trying to convince us that India should turn into a police state like those in the west or a huge barrack like Israel. I know your postings were highly critical of the Pakis, but a lot of us die because of your country and its big brothers' direct and indirect help. Stop trying to turn us against our own Govt by saying "Indians hurt more than others due to other Indians". We are not going to do that. Thanks.
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