This is cut and paste from post #1 on sulekha newshopper..
[url="http://www.sulekha.com/hoppercomments.asp?cid=318924"]Worry on Arab Street[/url]
When a Pakistan-sponsored anti-India resolution is passed at the Islamic countries' summit in Kuala Lumpur on October 12, India will be watching closely. Not so much for Pakistan's antics, which are a foregone conclusion, but to see whether the Arab and other Muslim countries that claim close relations with India pose any opposition.
The summit will also be an opportunity for India to call to account Arab and Muslim countries that had publicly expressed shock and dismay over the visit of Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon to India in September and over the change in India's foreign policy in the Middle East, from a blindly pro-Arab stance to an intensified engagement with Israel. They were anxious about losing India after half a century of support to the Palestine cause. "What really worried us was not the visit itself, but the euphoria with which Sharon was greeted, making Israel out to be a 'normal' state and Sharon just any other prime minister," said a visibly distressed Arab ambassador. "We felt terribly out of place," said another. According to Arab diplomats, Prime Minister A.B. Vajpayee's recent visit to Turkey only added fuel to conspiracy theories of an India-Israel-Turkey axis on the Arab street.
In turn, Delhi points to a growing body of anti-India resolutions sponsored by Pakistan at the Organisation of Islamic Countries (OIC) every year, which the Arab countries agree to. It smacks of Arab indifference to Pakistan-sponsored terrorism and is the surest sign of faultlines between the Arab-Muslim world and India. Says former foreign secretary J.N. Dixit: "Most Arab countries have ties with Israel and are allied with the US, which is Israel's greatest friend. India's relations with Israel are a response to new political realities."
For years, the Arab countries took India's support for granted. India supplied cheap labour and received oil and expatriate labour remittances that helped its economy. In return, it supported the Arab cause in Palestine and swallowed anti-India resolutions on Kashmir year after year. From Sudan to Iran, India's interests in the Arab world encompassed these key issues.
Then in 2000, the Sheikh Zayed Centre in Abu Dhabi suggested ways in which Arab countries could deal with an India that had defence relations with Israel. Since then, Indian officials say, the Arabs have more or less followed these ideas, ensuring India is kept on the defensive. Sharon's visit, coming even as peace collapsed in the Middle East, was India's way of saying it refused to apologise for its relations with Israel, say top-level Indian sources. The Arab governments backed down in the face of Indian determination, saying they were "satisfied" with India's criticism of Israel's treatment of Yasser Arafat, made immediately after the visit.
But differences persist. While some Gulf states like Kuwait, Qatar and Oman are improving ties with India, Saudi Arabia and Egypt remain problem areas. As the Arab countries grapple with India's overt policy turnaround, there seems to be a renewed determination on both sides to chart out a better India-Arab relationship. Several factors need to be considered here. First, there is a definite Arab-weariness in India that is hard to miss by these countries. It is visible in India's harangue on the OIC resolutions that Pakistan seems to breeze through the Islamic body. The Arab "explanations" that OIC resolutions don't reflect Muslim countries' ties with India "do not wash", say senior Indian officials. The OIC's refusal to acknowledge India's huge Muslim population also rankles. So while Russia is set to get an observer status in the OIC this year, India's turn appears light years away.
Both sides feel the India-Arab ties have slipped into dormancy, with the two talking past each other. There are four million Indians in Arab countries remitting about $8 billion (Rs 37,000 crore) annually back home. Yet, when was the last time India showed such enthusiasm for a visiting Arab leader? ask Arab diplomats. Indian officials retort, "When was the last time a major Arab leader visited India?"
Things are about to change. India is ready to increase its engagement with the Arab world, beginning with a first-ever visit by a Saudi business delegation on October 12, and ending with a Gulf Cooperation Council-India trade summit in February. Among others expected to visit India are the prime minister of Bahrain and Prince Talal bin Abdelaziz al Saud, the brother of the Saudi King Fahd. Vajpayee will stop over in Syria en route to Russia during Ramadan, while President A.P.J. Abdul Kalam will visit the UAE and Sudan in October. Last week, Foreign Minister Yashwant Sinha conducted the first political dialogue with the GCC on the margins of the un General Assembly, and India and Oman will have a hush-hush meeting of a "strategic consultative group" on October 17. In December, Finance Minister Jaswant Singh might travel to Saudi Arabia to revive a joint commission that last met in 1994.
That's the good news. There remain irritants that have potentially destabilising consequences. The Saudi support to Wahabbi groups, some of which indulge in anti-India terrorism, is a big issue, as is its support to Pakistan and silence on terrorism in Kashmir. Last year, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan protested loudly when Qatar proposed India's entry in the OIC as an observer. Nevertheless, fresh winds are blowing there too. The kingdom publicly condemned the recent Mumbai blasts-a first. On Gujarat too, the Saudis and others maintained a studied silence, refusing to pressure India with criticism. Over the past few years, the Gulf states say they have taken several steps sensitive to non-Muslims. The UAE has earmarked cremation grounds for Hindus and Sikhs, while Oman has allowed construction of Hindu temples, while several Sikh gurdwaras pepper other Arab states.
In 2002, Sudan told Jaswant Singh, the then foreign minister, that it wanted to support India in the OIC. But it was Qatar which stole the show by proposing India's nomination as observer. This year, India is encouraged by Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad's proposal to lift the OIC out of its "moribund, irrelevant" state. The bet in South Block is on whether Qatar performs an encore.
[url="http://www.sulekha.com/redirectnh.asp?cid=318948"]Driving from India to Thailand via Myanmar - but when? [/url]
[url="http://archives.mybangkokpost.com/bkkarchives/frontstore/news_detail.html?aid=133610&textcat=General%20News&type=a&key=india&year=&click_page=1&search_cat=text&from=text_search"]Vajpayee focuses gaze on east [/url]
The India Today article is to the point. For too long Arab states have taken India for granted while turning a blind eye to the terrorism practiced by Pakistan. I am reminded of a remark by a Syrian friend in Graduate school. I asked him why the Arab world takes a predominantly anti Indian stance while at the same time saying nothing about the invasions by Pakistan. He told me very simply that it was because Pakistan is a muslim country. Then the Arab world must understand that if they wish to be lumped together as one entity then the world will treat them as one entity and make no distinctions between the 9-11 hijackers and the rest.
Finally India has woken up to the fact that it cannot be a one way street. One cannot expect as the Arabs do that India will support them unequivocally as she has done for the past 50 years and expect nothing in return. IOW no tikki, no washy. It is not clear that the Arab worldhas woken up to this reality, but it is high time that they did.
But regardless of the way that events pan out , India is not going to sacrifice its national interests any longer just to please the Arabs.
The oil these Arabs so fondly cherish won't last forever, maybe for another 25 / 50 / 100 years. What after that? You would need skills, technology, capital and capability to influence other to survive. Arabs lack in all of these. Now is the time for them to decide their future. (Khali religion religion bolne se kuch nahi hota. Peth bhar khane ne ke liye paise chahiye. Religion ko dhoke nahi pi saktey.)
India is here to stay, and would only become more powerful in the coming days. It's upto the Arabs to decide, 'Are they with us or against us.
You are correct Krishna. It is up to the Arabs and India to decide 'are you with us or not with us' It cannot be a one way street, where India takes up the Arab causes,as she has done more or less faithfully for 50 years, only t o be treated like a doormat (in Rabat, Morocco, they unceremoniously turned away Fakhruddin Ali Ahmed at theinauguration of the first OIC meeting) and humiliated. There must be reciprocity and support on Kashmir (the litmus test). If they unequivocally agree Kashmir is an integral part of India then we can begin a mutually beneficial dialog.
As far as oil is concerned Indians forget we are one of the biggest customers for oil and gas in the world. Oil is not in short supply as many believe. and natural gas is flared in many ME oil fields. I dont understand why in the case of oil the customer is not treated like a ... customer.
[url="http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/00111150066.htm"]East Asia Economic Summit to enhance India's ties[/url]
Putrajaya, Malaysia, Oct. 11. (PTI): Having set a new agenda for closer ties with East Asia at the recent India-ASEAN Summit in Bali, Indonesia, India now gets another chance to present itself as a close ally to the grouping at the East Asia Economic Summit.
Organised by the World Economic Forum (WEF), the three-day event beginning in Singapore tomorrow, includes a session to review the progress and future of India's economic ties with the 10-member grouping and its three extended partners.
The session on `India-ASEAN: Partners for Progress' will assess cooperation efforts from both sides in enhancing trade, investment and technology ties.
While viewing the achievements, participants are also to present the path for future cooperation. The session will present an exclusive report from the ASEAN meeting of heads of state recently concluded in Bali.
It will also evaluate ASEAN's progress in building trading partnership with China and other non-member countries and what should be the agenda in terms of geopolitics and international relations.
I think as far as Indian ME policy goes India did the right thing for the last few decades by supporting the Arabs. I'm not talking about right or wrong, but reality. In the past, India didn't had the power, influence which she has now. During the last few decades our Arab policy was realistic. But as we are growing, instead of choosing sides, instead of deciding whose side we are on......we are getting into the mode of letting the other SOB choose sides. Bottom-line is who needs who. The way I see it, Arabs need some support from a big, powerful non-muslim state. And no one else other than India, with a population of 1 billion can fill this role.
As far as we are concerned, just give us the oil - we pay u dollahs......n' u can live in the 7 century for all we care. Arabs are on thin ice on this one.......and our giving Sharon the red carpet welcome is a signal to the Arbas, "The ball's in your court."
Why ABV can't put BAN on hurriyat conference? <img src='http://www.india-forum.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/huh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' />
Why we have such PM who feel burden of pressure from unkle ? :thumbdown
And the Arabs are upset with India for giving a warm welcome to Sharon. I say full speed ahead and damn the torpedoes as far as advancing relations with Israel are concerned. :beer
Observers Research Foundation (ORF) is a strategic think-tank initiative started by Reliance Group with branches in all capital cities of the country. Regular Saturday 11 AM to 1 PM meetings are held in Chennai. The ORF coordinator in Chennai is B. Raman, Vice-coordinator R. Suryanarayana (the guy who writes in THE HINDU and was a Prof. in Madras Univ. on Asian Studies, specialises on Srilanka Tamil issues). The Secretary is R. Sathiyamurthy. The ORF unit is Chennai is generally attended by retired police officers (including ex DG of BSF). On one of the Saturday meets, I was asked to talk on a topic which I considered important: I chose this Asian Economic Community (AEC) initiative. Some summaries of ORF deliberations are made and passed on to Min. of Ext. Affairs and to other ORF chapters.
IF should definitely take a lead role on this subject. We have a role model : EEC which has been achieved after intense deliberations. Now that free trade is the attractive buzz-word, AEC can be put in place in much shorter time than was possible with EEC.
As Kaushal rightly notes, we have a head start because between 8th and 18th century, we had a number of Hindu states in South East Asia. They call themselves Hindus and proudly so. Bali Governor wanted to strengthen the Hindu state; you know what was the response of Min. of Ext. Affairs? Don't call it Hindu state, because India is secular! We have to deal with such nit-wits in the bureaucracy. We have to by pass them and start an Indian Ocean Academy and establish direct contacts and exchanges among Bharatiya and Asian scholars and promote Hindu and Dhamma studies, to start with. We can donate a ratha to Angkor Wat so that they can have an annual ratha yatra. We can send priest trainers through Tirupati Institute or Sankara Matha-s and train priests to conduct daily puja in Angkor Wat and other Hindu temples. Every Cambodian has a temple in his or her house and he starts his daily chores only after offering his prayers in this mandira of vinayaka or sarasvati.
IF scholars have to prepare position papers on a multi-disciplinary framework -- e.g., tourism, trade exchanges, information exchanges, agricultural commodities exchanges including exchanges of agronomists/scientists, transfer of India's FBRTechnology, Ayurveda formulations, herbal fragrances manufacture and world-wide trade -- for promoting AEC and bringing it to fruition.
Is this the same B Raman (fromer RAW chief) who writes at saag.org?
Quote:IF scholars have to prepare position papers on a multi-disciplinary framework -- e.g., tourism, trade exchanges, information exchanges, agricultural commodities exchanges including exchanges of agronomists/scientists, transfer of India's FBRTechnology, Ayurveda formulations, herbal fragrances manufacture and world-wide trade -- for promoting AEC and bringing it to fruition.
Dr. K: I'm sure members of IF would be glad to help in this effort. I suggest you taking a lead or atleast give some kind of directions. Not every member (read me) are experts in areas listed above - but we can help in any kind of research or spread the word kind of efforts. Suggest you start threads in appropriate forums to solicit papers or any other misc help.
Yes, B. Raman is the same retired RAW guy who also has a regular internet column. [url="http://saag.org/"]http://saag.org/[/url]
For the last 2 or 3 meetings, the venue has been: ORF Conference Hall
> Third Floor
> Reliance Infocomm Buildings
> Opp Shastri Bhavan
> Haddows Road
> Chennai 600 006
>N Sathiya Moorthy
>Honorary Director orfchennai@orfonline.org
The next Saturday interaction: ORF-Chennai: 18/10/03 Interaction: LTTE & Lanka Peace Process: M R Narayanaswamy
The attendance is only by invitation. Any IF member interested in participating should write to N. Sathiya Moorthy with a brief CV and area of interest. If you want me to pitch in and recommend your being invited, let me know (kalyan97@yahoo.com)
On Viren's suggestion. I will follow up on the excellent suggestion.
This thread is as good as any to proceed further.
Let us see how AEC can be projected as a win-win situation for all countries of Asia.
First, let us define what Asia is and who are likely members of AEC.
Let me pose the first three questions while underscoring that this AEC is intended to be a socio-cultural-economic community (unlike EEC which is only an economic community, now with a currency called Euro):
1. ASEAN member countries are the obvious choice to become founding members of AEC; can this ASEAN group be expanded further into an Asian Economic Community (AEC)?
2. Why is SAARC a failure in not taking the lead on AEC?
3. Any problems in defining AEC as a socio-cultural-economic community?
Quote:Why is SAARC a failure in not taking the lead on AEC?
That is an easy one. SAARC is a failure, even by itself primarily because of the presence of Pakistan, which does not want SAARC to succeed, because it would give (in their eyes) tacit approval to the regionally dominant role of India in SA. I would not exactly be crushed with disappointment if SAARC were to disappear in oblivion. As long as Pakistan is a member of any grouping it is bound to be a failure. Furthermore i was never enamored of the concept of South Asia in the first place. If India finds it profitable to dance with ASEAN as the core group of an AEC, so be it. They have been in general far more friendlier than the our immediate neighbors who have let India's bigness get in the way of a healthy relationship.
It would be useful to have a synopsis of topics discussed at these meetings. If rytha can attend also (since he is based in Chennai) it would be beneficial. I wont be in Chennai during my upcoming visit to India, but on my next visit i plan to be there. Maybe i can coordinate my timing to meet some members of ORF at one of their meetings.
10-14-2003, 12:31 PM (This post was last modified: 10-14-2003, 12:34 PM by rhytha.)
Quote:The attendance is only by invitation. Any IF member interested in participating should write to N. Sathiya Moorthy with a brief CV and area of interest. If you want me to pitch in and recommend your being invited, let me know (kalyan97@yahoo.com)
Prof.K
Iam very much intrested in attending <img src='http://www.india-forum.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> , I will mail my brief CV to shri.SM with a cc to you. hope you can pitch in for me on an invitation Graduate .
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' /> , I will mail my brief CV to shri.SM with a cc to you. hope you can pitch in for me on an invitation Graduate .