This thread is to track all large scale social engineering done in the name of revolution and other causes.

Look for the wierd world view and anticipation of their victory



--
THE PRIVILEGED CLASSES.

The town-worker is the aristocrat the Union of Socialist Soviet Republics. He sits in the forefront of the Opera House. He gets the first place in the queue when meat is short. He alone is sent to a Rest Home or a sanatorium. It is he who prides himself most upon his birth. To be able to boast of a working-class origin is far more important to a Russian than the possession of Norman blood ever was in England. This domination by one small class, the town proletariat, was the feature, which struck me most during a. recent visit to Soviet Russia. where a knowledge of Russian helped me to get beneath the surface.
THE BADGE OF RANK.

“What is your father? Is he a worker or a bourgeois?” How many Russians asked me that question! A fat Red Army officer who promised to visit me in London when the World Revolution broke out, was exceedingly anxious to find out whether I was tainted with Capitalism or not. When I disclosed that I was bourgeois he treated me with pity. He foresaw a grim future for me when the World Union of Socialist Soviet Republics came into being. Still he said, since I was an “intellectual” rather than a “capitalist” my fate might not be so bad.

The new aristocracy of Russia has many privileges. The greatest of these is the trade union card. British trade unionists will find it hard to realise what a precious possession this is; so precious, indeed, that a roaring business has been carried on in the forging and illicit sale of these cards. If you have a worker’s trade union card, you receive a far larger share of bread or meat or butter (if there is any!) than the poor bank clerk or post office assistant or waitress or shop-girl! You have reduced prices in cinemas, theatre, concerts, gardens and restaurants. You only pay two-pence to visit the Anti-Religious Museum or the Museum of Revolution, whereas the common herd has to pay four-pence!
FAUX PAS.

There is a complete reversal of values in the esteem in which one’s occupation is held, and, of course, in one’s social position. This is reflected in the language of today. The pre-revolutionary equivalents of “Monsieur” or “Mademoiselle” are now taboo, and have been replaced by “Comrade” or “Citizen.” A small incident in a chemist’s shop in Moscow will illustrate the change in the forms of address. A girl who stood next to me, and was probably from the provinces, made the great faux pas of shouting to the shop-assistant “Baryshnia” (Mademoiselle) instead of saying “Comrade” or “Citizen.” I shall never forget the shocked faces of the customers who heard her, nor her blushes when she realised that she had given away her bourgeois origin. An East End costermonger’s wife would not be more embarrassed in a Bond-street jeweller’s shop than was this middle-class or maybe noble girl in the Communist co-operative chemist’s store.
BLUE BLOOD COUNTS.

One evening I went to a Moscow theatre, and was struck by the snobbishness, which the play revealed. The impression, which the performance left on me was that in Russia far more stress is laid on what your father was than on what you are yourself. The heroine of the drama was an energetic Communist girl, who inspired all her companions in the factory with enthusiasm for the Five-Years’ Plan. When things were going badly and output was low, it was she who rallied the workers and saved the situation. Then came a bombshell. A drunken man disclosed the disgraceful fact that her father had been nothing else than a Tsarist policeman! Sensation. “Throw her out of the Party,” was the cry. And out she had to go.

Often Soviet snobbery degenerates into real cruelty. I was chatting with a Russian caretaker and his wife and watching some dirty little children at play. “Look at those children,” said the woman. “They have been born to misfortune, because the fathers are not workers. They will never get on in life. When they grow up they will not be able to go to a university, and now they cannot have food until the workers’ children have had their fill, poor, unhappy ones!”

Of all kinds of snobbishness the Communist is the worst, for it is not a superficial airing of class superiority, as in England, that wrecks the lives of many Russians, whose only sin is to have been born of other than working-class parents.

http://www.garethjones.org/soviet_articles...et_snobbery.htm

Filmmakers’ favourites

<img src='http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/fr/2007/07/13/images/2007071350330101.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />


From October 31, 1931, when the first talkie ‘Kalidas,’ was released, Tamil cinema has come a long way. Different directors, different styles... it has been a rich fare. Eight directors list their best ten and explain what makes the first three superior.

Sridhar: ‘Sindhu Bairavi,’ ‘Roja,’ ‘Vedam Puthidhu,’ ‘Thillana Mohanambal,’ ‘Nayagan,’ ‘16 Vayathinile,’ ‘Udhiripookkal,’ ‘Thiruvilaiyadal,’ ; ‘Servar Sundaram’ and ‘Saraswathi Sabadam.’

‘Sindhu Bairavi’ is a masterpiece in its own way. The screenplay and the actors’ performances make it the best. I choose ‘Roja’ for its patriotism. ‘Vedam Puthidhu’ appeals because of its message that all humans are the same.

K. Balachander: ‘Andha Naal,’ ‘Chandralekha,’ ‘Kalyana Parisu,’ ‘Thillana Mohanambal,’ ‘Pasamalar,’ ‘Ulagam Sutrum Valiban,’ ‘16 Vayathinile,’ R 16;Mullum Malarum,’ ‘Kadhal Kottai’ and ‘Kathal.’

‘Andha Naal’ was released in 1954 starring Sivaji Ganesan and Pandaribai. It was the first talkie in India without song or dance. I like the way director S. Balachander tackles this experimental film, an unusual attempt at that time. Just like ‘Sivaji’ today, people talked about ‘Chandralekha’ in the past. Produced at a cost of Rs 30 lakhs (a huge sum at that time), it has grand sets. I have seen it 12 times. ‘Kalyanaparisu,’ a love story, is the first of its kind. I became director Sridhar’s fan after watching it.

<img src='http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/fr/2007/07/13/images/2007071350330102.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />


J. Mahendran: ‘Chandralekha,’ ‘Ratha Kaneer,’ ‘Thillana Mohanambal,’ ‘Nenjil Oru Aalayam,’ ‘16 Vayathinile,’ ‘Veedu,’ ‘Kadhal,’ ‘Imsai Arasan 23r d Pulikesi,’ ‘Paruthi Veeran’ and ‘Mozhi.’

I choose ‘Chandralekha,’ a remarkable film, because of its grandeur in all departments of filmmaking. There are no graphics or special effects. If anybody tries to remake this black and white film, they will make a mockery of it. ‘Ratha Kaneer,’ made in 1954, has progressive ideas and great acting by M.R.Radha. ‘Thillana Mohanambal’ must make all Tamils proud. It not only fuses Bharatnatyam and nagaswaram, but has an outstanding screenplay and a great cast.

Balu Mahendra: ‘Parasakthi,’ ‘Devadas,’ ‘Ratha Kaneer,’ ‘Pasamalar,’ ‘Silanerangalil Silamanidargal,’ ‘Unnaipol Oruvan,’ ‘Aval Appadithan,’ ‘ Kalyana Parisu,’ ‘Nenjil Or Aalayam,’ and ‘Thanneer Thanneer.’

<img src='http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/fr/2007/07/13/images/2007071350330103.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

‘Parasakthi’s’ heavy dialogue (written in chaste Tamil by the current Chief Minister M. Karunanidhi) coupled with a stunning performance by newcomer, Sivaji Ganesan, make it a favourite. ‘Devadas’ has superb lighting by B.S.Ranga, excellent performance by A. Nageswara Rao and Savithri and haunting music by C.R.Subbaraman. As a teenager, I saw it 40 times. As a filmmaker, I saw it for the 50th time a couple of years ago. It still captivates me now as it did, when I was a teenager.

‘Ratha Kaneer’ has brilliant dialogue and inimitable performance by M.R.Radha.

K. Bhagyaraj: ‘Adutha Veettupenn,’ ‘Parasakthi,’ ‘Nadodi Mannan,’ ‘Uthama Puthiran,’ ‘Kalyana Parisu’ ‘Thillana Mohanambal,’ ‘Ulagam Suttrum Valiban,’ ‘Aval Oru Thodarkathai,’ ‘Mullum Malarum’ and ‘16 Vayathinile.’

I like ‘Adutha Veettupenn’ for the natural acting, ‘Parasakthi’ for its message of social awareness, reform and powerful dialogue. In ‘Nadodi Mannan’ and ‘Uthama Puthiran,’ I enjoyed the way both heroes combine acting prowess with entertainment.

Mani Ratnam: ‘Udhiripookal,’ ‘16 Vayathinile,’ ‘Aval Oru Thodarkathai,’ ‘Andha Naal,’ ‘Mullum Malarum,’ ‘Uthama Puthiran,’ ‘Anbe Vaa,’ ‘Pitha Mag an,’ ‘Moondram Pirai’ and ‘Pasa Malar.’

I had just stepped into the industry and Mahendran’s ‘Udhiripookal’ just bowled me over. It was a breakthrough film in commercial cinema. The negative character in it and the way it ends make it outstanding. ‘16 Vayathinile’ is memorable for its script, high standard and realism. K.Balachandar has done some of the best films before and after ‘Aval Oru Thodar Kathai.’ But I choose it mainly for its storyline. It is not the plot or the story, but the character that carries the film through. Although it was released about 25 years ago, the character remains fresh in one’s memory. That is the greatness of the film.




K.S.Ravi Kumar: ‘Pasamalar,’ ‘Nenjil Or Aalayam’, ‘Aval Oru Thodar Kathai’, ‘Kadhalikka Neramillai,’ ‘16 Vayathinile,’ ‘Mullum Malarum,’ ‘Nayagan,’  216;Deivamagan,’ ‘Ulagam Suttrum Valiban’ and ‘Puthu Vasantham.’

As a kid I saw ‘Pasamalar’ and cried. As an adult, each time I have seen it I was moved to tears. Recently when I saw it, the film left a lump in my throat. That is the power of the script and the performance of lead players. Sridhar’s ‘Nenjil Or Aalayam’ depicts the supremacy of love. Through his script and direction, Balachandar brings out the tender core of his middle-class heroine, assailed by problems, in ‘Aval Oru Thodarkathai.’

Ameer: ‘Andha Naal,’ ‘Nenjam Marappadhillai,’ ‘Thiruvilaiyadal,’ ‘Ulagam Suttrum Valiban,’ ‘Moondru Mudichu,’ ‘Aval Appadithan,’ ‘Udhiri Pookal,’ ̵6;16 Vayathinile,’ ‘Moondram Pirai’ and ‘Sethu.’

‘Andha Naal’ by S. Balachander was a trendsetter. When songs were the mainstay those days, this film was a bold attempt as it did not have any. Each camera angle makes watching it worthwhile. In fact one can say that this film changed the sound concept in Tamil cinema. ‘Nenjam Marappadhillai’ not only breaks free from the formulaic screenplay but director Sridhar does something revolutionary by introducing new faces in it. Recently I read in a paper that the film has been remade in Hindi. This is the power of Sridhar’s script. Director A.P. Nagarajan’s ‘Thiruvilaiyadal’ is imaginative. It treats a mythological subject in an interesting way. It is one of the best films in the annals of Tamil cinema.

A very good interview on the basis of the East India Company. The movie Mangal Pandey alludes to this but Indian history books hardly menion it or gloss over it as a minor fact. It is because of this that most Chinese have lot of resentment towards India. THey know its the Brits who did it but Indina merchants and sepoys were part of the trade Note I said sepoys of the East India Company. Most of the Indian trading companies of the 19th century were prosperous because of this trade. This is a blot and needs catharisis for rapproachment with the Chinese.
I came to know this in college when a junior told us he was from Neemuch, MP and his father, a chemist, was the mgr of the govt opium factory! We wondered what was the govt doing that for and found out the history of it all. Its used for medicinal precursor products.


Pioneer, 19 June 2008
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>'India was the biggest opium producing region in the world' </b>

<b>Sea of Poppies, the latest novel by Amitav Ghosh based on the cultivation of poppy along the Ganga in the Bhojpur region to feed East India Company's opium factories and sustain Britain's illicit opium trade with China that left the imperial coffers in London overflowing with wealth, has just been published.</b> It is a fascinating story that unfolds in the 1830s, centred around Deeti, and reminds us of the journey undertaken by 'girmitiyas' -- indentured workers who signed an agreement or 'girmit' -- across the forbidden kala paani to foreign shores to work in sugar plantations. <b>It is about disinherited nobility, disempowered peasantry, caste, community and kin -- the many identities that make up the Indian identity at home and abroad</b>. The following are excerpts from a conversation between Kanchan Gupta and the celebrated writer that took place on a rain-drenched afternoon in Delhi --

Kanchan Gupta: I am sure it feels great to have your tenth book published. Sea of Poppies has made a big entry and been received with rave reviews. The British newspapers have lavished praise on the book, especially The Times. <b>And this is only the first of a trilogy...</b>

Amitav Ghosh: A trilogy, yes...

KG: So, how do you plan to carry forward the story of Sea of Poppies?

AG: You know, I think my approach to it is going to be like driving a car at night. You can't see very far ahead of what you can see in your headlight. You keep driving slowly down the road so someday you will get there. I don't think that one can have a sense of what it is going to be like at the end of it. The interest and pleasure of it will really lie in the writing.

KG: But surely there's a big picture... there could be various routes to reaching the final destination. Even if you are driving at night you do know where you want to go...

AG: Yes, there are various routes, various options. But you know, two or three years down the line I may decide to take a different route... It's impossible to talk about something that's not written yet.

KG: In a recent article you have mentioned how one of your ancestors travelled from East Bengal to Chapra and although there's no conclusive evidence, most probably he was involved in the opium trade... Is that what triggered your interest or is it that you wanted to build a story up to 1857 since it is very much there in our conscience now?

AG: No, it's nothing like that. You know my interest really began while I was writing the Glass Palace. <b>I became very interested in the whole business of indentured workers. The process of indenture and how it happened.</b>

It's a curious thing about indenture... <b>the children of the indentured workers, I mean the great, great grand children, you know, there are some very great writers among them... VS Naipaul, Shiva Naipaul... some of our greatest contemporary writers... and they have given us a very vivid picture of what it was for the descendents of these people to grow up wherever they happened to be.</b>

<b>But from our end, from the Indian end, we really never had any sense of what happened</b>. How those processes came into being, how the indentured labourers left, what was the mechanism by which they left. <b>And for me this had a very personal connection simply because of my family having lived in the Bhojpur region for a long time.</b>

I wanted to write about the early years, when indenture first started, which is actually in the 1830s. Once I started looking into it and researching it, it became pretty inescapable because, <b>I mean, it's a strange thing that we have so completely forgotten it now, but this was the biggest opium-producing region the world has ever known.</b>

<b>KG: Michael Binyon, in his review of Sea of Poppies in The Times, begins his article with a very telling line, "The British version of history glosses over the time when this country was the world's biggest drug pusher." That was 200 years ago...

AG: Not even 200 years, until the 1920s it was the biggest drug pusher in the world.</b>

KG: And now you have Afghanistan growing the poppies and feeding Europe's hunger for heroin!

AG: You know, we can take no pleasure in that, this is one of those stories. <b>The whole business of drugs is quite an incredibly grim and hideous thing. I mean, I don't think it's a pleasurable irony in that sense. You don't want this scourge inflicted upon any nation. It's good to remind ourselves of this history. You know, really it was these drugs grown in India that brought about the downfall of China.</b>

KG: Some Indian authors have written about indentured labour, or mentioned it in their novels. Sunil Gangopadhyay...

AG: Aachchha? I didn't know about this...

KG: <b>Why did you choose poppy cultivation and the opium trade? It could have been indigo</b>. After all, indigo cultivation and the entire process was equally dehumanising and fed imperial coffers, it was equally devastating.

AG: <b>Indigo and opium are not quite similar, you know. Indigo was a plantation crop, opium was not a plantation crop.</b> There was some idea of converting opium into a plantation crop. So, <b>we must resist the temptation of assimilating them, although they were similar in the sense of imposing a monoculture. But the mechanism was quite different.</b>

<b>These (poppy cultivators) were peasant farmer who basically were given advances to work on the land and it was through this mechanism of credit that things intensified.</b>

KG: How did you think up Deeti?

AG: You know, the difference between writing history and writing novels is that history scholars are there already while in novels sometimes you just have an idea or you have an image. All my novels have begun with certain images, certain pictorial or visual images. And that's how it happened with Deeti.

As much as Deeti sees Zachary (who steers Ibis, the ship carrying indentured labourers to Mauritius, in the book) while she is standing in the Ganga, I similarly had a sense of actually being able to see her. She became for me the centre of the book around whom the story unfolds or anchors itself.

It happens like that. You know, you can't plan a book the nuts and bolts way.

I knew Deeti would be an important character right from the start -- all my characters are important -- but I didn't really expect she would become the central figure the way she has. She did become for me, how shall I say, she became the mast...

KG: She carries the book forward, linking the various strands and layers or the story...

AG: That's right.

KG: And then you built the other characters keeping her in mind or they just happened?

AG: No, no. They are completely individual and separate characters.

KG: Kalua, the 'untouchable' bullock cart driver who rescues Deeti, for instance...

AG: Kalua, too. He is a completely individual and separate character. You know what happened with Kalua (laughs) was when <b>I went to the Mahatma Gandhi Institute in Mauritius -- which is a truly marvellous archive and they have preserved all the earliest papers of the indenture, including the immigration sli</b>ps - I looked through the papers carefully and I came upon one which had this name Kalua!

It's a strange thing, a lot has been written about these indentured labourers and immigration certificates that they took, but I discovered something which I have never seen anyone comment upon. I will tell you what it is.

See the immigration slips are like this (draws a rectangle in the air) and they have a few printed lines for name, age, caste, appearance, weight. Later they began attaching photographs but on the earlier ones there were no photographs.

All of this is written in English. <b>If you turn the thing over, in the corner it's written in Bangla, you know, little notations are written in Bangla.</b> And that was what really caught my attention. <b>The things that were noted on the back of the slips tell a peculiar history. Each of the notations ended with a Dafadar - for example, Ismail Dafadar, Rafiq Dafadar or Lallu Dafadar and so on</b>.

That's one thing you would see on the back of the slips. And also in Bangla you would see a version of the name of the indentured labourer. <b>So, clearly what happened is that these dafadars were the ones who recruited the indentured labourers and brought them to Kolkata. There he went to some gomusta or serishta, a Bengali babu, to whom he would hand over the slips and he would be told to bring his gang. The gomusta or serishta would ask for the names of those seeking indenture, scribble them on the back of the slips and then put down the dafadar's name who would be paid per head. This would be the initial notation.</b>

<b>The slips were then passed on to another gomusta or serishta, also a Bengali clerk, who would then translate the names into English. So, on the back of the slip in Bangla it is written 'Kalua', on the other side it is 'Colver'! When you see that piece of paper you already see such an enormous journey.</b>

KG: <b>In Trinidad I was told that the corruption of names took place when the indentured labourers got off their ships and English clerks entered their names in ledgers. So Basudev became Basdeo ...</b>

AG: This is the mythology. They had to have the migration certificates before they left. The corruption of names was done by Bengalis sitting in Kolkata! That was to me a real discovery.

KG: Why Mauritius and not Trinidad? After all, Trinidad symbolises everything about indentured labour.

AG: Well, the Trinidad indenture began much later. <b>Mauritius indenture is the first. In proportion of numbers, it's the biggest. Also, it is the only place in the world where the descendents of indentured labourers are a numerically preponderant group.</b>

So, in many ways the Mauritius indenture is the most interesting because it establishes the patterns for all the subsequent indentures. <b>Among the girmitya communities around the world, they look upon the Mauritians as the aristocrats!</b>

KG: We have forgotten that Mauritius was also a penal colony where people were despatched as punishment. People only refer to Andaman islands...

AG: Yes, and prisoners would be stripped and photographed. <b>In a way, the penal colony in Mauritius was the original Abu Ghraib. Photographing them naked was an assertion of control and served the purpose of humiliating the prisoners. It remains the metaphor of the imperial experience.</b>

KG: You have used words that we don't come across every day... a language that was spoken during the East India Company days by the sahibs. The reviewer in The Times could not comprehend most of the stuff. He has written, "But the clothes -- zerbaft brocade, shanbaff dhoti, alliballie kurta, jooties and nayansukh -- or the ranks and offices -- dasturi, sirdar, maharir, serishtas and burkundaz -- are frankly incomprehensible. And that is Ghosh's trick: We clutch at what we can, but swaths of narrative wash over us, just as they did over those caught up in a colonial history they could neither control nor understand."

AG: It's all about assimilation of words. I have used words from the Oxford English Dictionary. <b>Today we hear that English is more absorptive and assimilative, that it has become global. But in the 19th century the role played by Asian languages in English was much, much greater than today. In the 20th century what happened, without being stated, is a purification of English where Asian words were dropped or treated as marginal to English language.</b>  <i>{Decolonization of English started in 1900s just as assimilation started with the arrival of Sir Thomas Roe in 1600s! Thats why I say the study of humanities is a strategic necessity for it gives precursor or indicators of trends!}</i>

When you read this book, you will find many words that have crept in so completely that they are not even recognised to be foreign. <b>But there's a category of words that even though they are English, appear in the guise of something alien.</b> If they go and look at the Oxford English Dictionary and find these words there, what is The Times going to say? <b>Why are these words any more foreign to English than the other words they are accustomed to? </b> <i>{Because the misson of England has changed. So its suitable for Times to refuse to understand these words which were earlier acquired as part of the colonization project}</i>

We are taught there's a standard English and these are the words that can be used. So, if it's a gun, you can't call it a bandook, although it is in the Oxford English Dictionary. Take for instance balti. If you look up the Oxford English Dictionary, balti is defined as north Indian style of cooking. But actually balti is a Portuguese word which was introduced to Indian languages by the laskars, it meant a ship's bucket. Which Indian will believe balti is not an Indian word?

<b>Languages, for me, are like water, they flow into each other and cannot be distinguished from one another.</b>

KG: You deserve to be complimented for the effortless ease with which you introduce entire phrases and sentences in Bangla and then continue in English. Do you do this because you just take it for granted that the readers will get the hang of it, even if they do not understand Bangla?

AG: Look, when we were kids, we were reading books in English, books which had things like 'potted meat'. I had no idea what potted meat meant, but that didn't stop me from reading the book! You can't expect to understand every word of a book, and why should you? In any book that you are reading there will be things that will elude you, that are going to be outside your comprehensive understanding.

KG: It was a pleasure speaking to you.

AG: We had a very interesting conversation.

<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->



I plan to read this book to learn more about that phase of Indian history.

Khoon Pasina (1977)

Ram alias Tiger is the local criminal don in his part of the town where he lives with his mother. His mother wants him to marry and settle down, and give up his criminal activities. Ram meets with Rekha and both are attracted to each other, and soon get married. Rekha is appalled at the way Ram leads his life, with everyone around petrified of him. She asks Ram to give up his criminal activities, and get a job. Ram agrees, but the question is will he keep to his promise or will he just pretend to be honest in front of Rekha. And on the other hand is Shera, a dacait with a good heart. Both Ram and Shera are rivals. When Shera hears of Ram attemtping to go straight, he decides to move in on Ram's territory, with results that will change their lives forever. Written by rAjOo (gunwanti@hotmail.com)

At the time of Partition, two boyhood friends Aslam (a Muslim) and Shiva (a Hindu) are taught by their fathers to abhor lies and injustice and fight for the communal good. Their fathers, Rahim and Ram, stand up to gangster boss Zalim Singh who has them murdered by stirring up religious hatred. The boys are separated in the chaos. Aslam is presumed dead and Shiva is brought up by Aslam's mother. Shiva becomes "Tiger" a vigilante who battles villains and the oppressors of the poor. Aslam becomes "Shera" a respected and feared figure living on the fringes of society, earning his living protecting merchants from thieves. He uses his wealth to help the poor but cannot get over the loss of his boyhood friend. When Tiger is (falsely) accused of killing a poor farmer, Shera sets out to track him down and confront him, not knowing that the man he seeks to kill is none other than his long lost friend... Written by van Goethem

Is Bobby Jindal -- Who May Be On McCain's Veep Shortlist -- An Exorcist?
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->As others noted during his 2003 and 2007 gubernatorial campaigns (see update), in an essay Jindal wrote in 1994 for the New Oxford Review, a serious right-wing Catholic journal, Jindal narrated a bizarre story of a personal encounter with a demon, in which he participated in an exorcism with a group of college friends. And not only did they cast out the supernatural spirit that had possessed his friend, Jindal wrote that he believes that their ritual may well have cured her cancer.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Jindal - exorcism is just tip, this practice is more common in West than it's portrayed. It's something your local friendly missionary won't tell you while he passes judgment your beliefs.

Hi, this possibly qualifies as the unlikeliest of all possible conversions - but I have recently become fascinated by the entire world of Indian culture, religion and music. (By recently I mean probably over the last 18 months or so). Indeed the more I learn, the more fascinated and engrossed I become.

I was originally drawn into the subject by a guy I met on the street who was a practitioner of the Hare Krishna faith - who was handing out some leaflets. The craziest thing was these 'leaflets' had nothing on them except some incredibly colourful and beautiful artwork. He didn't ask me for anything and all he said was that he hoped I would have a nice day.

Well anyway, maybe it was psychology - but it worked. I became intrigued. Not so much about the Hare Krishna religion - but about what the image was about and why this small incident seemed so significant.

From then on I found out more about the image - and this led me to reading more about Indian art - and also as a result of this, about Indian Hindu gods - and from there I moved on to Indian reverential music - popular dance, literature and so on - and - well, I guess the story is a pretty familiar one to many of you from there on.

The only slight departure is that I seem to have come to this a little late in my life (I'm 41), at a time when I'm certain I really should probably be concerning myself with more serious matters.

At this stage however I am at a point where I am very much interested in finding out more about the Hindu religion.

The difficulty is that I have done enough reading about it - and I want if I can to take it to the next level and physically talk to and meet members of the Hindu faith.

Right now I feel very lost and alone - and am drifting without direction, because I have literally no one I can speak to about my interest. I know no-one who knows anything about Hinduism - and I am concerned that right now all of this is something that exists purely in my head.

I would very much like to change this if I can and meet and speak with other members of the Hindu religion.

I am not saying that I am quite ready yet to fully convert to Hinduism - but I do feel that I am at least ready to begin to attempt to move in that direction - providing I can have appropriate support and guidance.

I am also interested in meeting and speaking with other novices, or people who have recently converted to the Hindu religion - but again I have no idea where to start?

I feel one can only go so far in a spiritual journey by reading books and posting messages on forums such as these - and that it is important that such and interest should have some kind of physical manifestation, preferably in the form of being able to meet with and speak to other similarly interested people.

Can anyone here please help?

If it is of any help to know this, I live in Newcastle upon Tyne in the North East of England in the UK.

<b>Pak leader links terror to madarsas</b>
http://www.telegraphindia.com//1080602/jsp...ory_9351779.jsp
NISHIT DHOLABHAI
New Delhi, June 1: A politician whose party is a partner in Pakistan’s ruling coalition today <b>surprised a conference on terrorism here by declaring that madarsas in his country were “breeding grounds” of terror.</b>

Hasham Baber, additional secretary-general of the Awami National Party, said political sermons, not just lectures on Islam, were delivered in such institutions in the federally administered tribal areas, bordering Afghanistan.

<b>“The breeding grounds should be removed because on Fridays, it isn’t Islam that is taught but political sermons. Both Afghanistan and India will benefit,”</b> he told the conference organised by Jama Masjid United Forum. The Speaker of Afghanistan’s senate, Safghadullah Mojaddedi, was also present.

<b>Most reacted cautiously to the comments. </b>The Jama Masjid’s imam, Syed Ahmed Bukhari, made it clear that Baber had only expressed his “own views” about affairs in Pakistan.

<b>Assam chief minister Tarun Gogoi disagreed with Baber</b>, saying madarsas in his state weren’t teaching terror.<b>Social activist Teesta Setalvad spoke of the threat from “Right-wing Hindu schools in tribal areas” and about the kind of “mob terrorism” seen during the Gujarat riots</b>. <!--emo&:roll--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/ROTFL.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='ROTFL.gif' /><!--endemo-->

<!--emo&:unsure:--><img src='style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='unsure.gif' /><!--endemo-->
What we know as Indian democracy, it's house in Chaos.

But there is ray of hope in the form of Election Commission which is trying to convert election process at least, in order.

As compared to this, US democracy is organised democracy.

What do you think are the other ways to convert disorder into order?

<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Swayamsevaks involved in Jaipur emergency relief, removed during Sonia's visit</b>

Jaipur:RSS swayamsevaks who manned the SMS ( Sawai Madho Singh ) hospital in  Jaipur was removed by the cops before the scheduled visit of SoniaGnadhi to visit the injured.

The irony was that our de facto PM wanted them removed even when major newspapers and television in India has acknowledged the services of the RSS volunteers that swung into action immediately after the blast.

She probably saw the effect it would have all over the country when the photos and live TV coverage would be telecast with her visiting the hospitals with the place swarming with RSS cadre around the patients.

The SMS hospital saw over 200 cadre of the RSS do 8 hour round the clock shifts in military precision taking care of the injured and their families. They virtually took over from the hospitals

Most political outfits in the state have been caught by surprise at the speed of implementing the emergency action plan of the RSS.

The Sangh has been active in the front of fighting terrorism for a long time. The Mumbai blasts saw the sangh later taking up seminars and study classes to study the effects of terrorism on the public and training of the cadre on how to face emergency situations like this in the future.

http://www.haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx...eID=6288&SKIN=B<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->


Another stage appearance by Antonia, after everyone else has done all the unpleasant work. By the way, where's the dull-witted sprog, Rahul? Or did his mummy forget to drop chocolate mints along the way, so he can find his way to the place?

Letter to Shri Ghulam Nabi Azad, Chief Minister, Jammu & Kashmir State

THE HINDU JAGRAN FORUM-USA
3145 Gilbert Avenue, Roseburg , OR ( USA ) 97470

<i>Subject: Sale of DAV School in Srinagar and Massive destruction of temples in J&K amounts to state sponsored Talibanization of the state: Hindu religious and educational infrastructure must be protected by the state and a Waqf like Hindu Board be formed for their upkeep, development and governance.</i>


Hon'ble Chief Minister Azad,

It is abundantly clear that the unwarranted sale of one of the leading DAV High Schools in Srinagar, against which the teachers and the students had to march in streets to register their protest, did not have the approval of the community who are the real owners of this infrastructure (attachment A). This represents another example of deliberate yet a “tactical failure” by the J&K Govt. in protecting the Hindu community of Kashmir . It also further strengthens the case of the Kashmiri Hindus as a minority community for a change in the political set up to protect their community, culture, educational institutions and religion. The systematic elimination of minorities from the Islamic domain of Kashmir says volumes about the contradictory nature of the Islamic political culture when compared to India 's secular system.

If the Kashmir Govt. is sincere in its commitment to enforcing the proclaimed goals of equal protection of citizens under a system of political secularism, it must without any excuses issue an executive order, similar to the recent one issued by it for protecting religious shrines, to cover the sale of the DAV School in Srinagar as well as other sales of educational institutions (attachment B). All such deals involving the religious and educational institution and their estates after 1989 must be declared null and void and accounts of the trusts engaged in these extra legal transactions under duress must be sealed.

It is hardly difficult to understand that all these criminal activities by the Islamists represent the extension of their foreign inspired “civilizational war” undertaken to remove all traces of the historical Hindu past in the vale of Kashmir . Massive protests by the remaining less than 5,000 Kashmiri Pandits in the valley against criminally altering the socio-cultural complexion of Kashmir has been of no avail. On the contrary these extremely vulnerable non-Muslim Kashmiris have been exposed to serious intimidation and threats by a very powerful “Islamic Land Mafia” that if they do not stop protesting they would face dire consequences like the rest of the exiled Pandit community.

Disregarding the massive fatal attacks and life ending injuries inflicted upon non-Muslims i.e., Hindus and Sikhs during the past two decades, which consumed thousands of lives, the police establishment of the J&K Govt. two weeks ago, based on manufactured yet concealed evidence, shamelessly boasted that since 1989 only 209 Pandits lost their lives at the hands of the militants.

What a bald faced lie in an attempt to cover up and inadvertently aid the Islamic conspiracy against non-Muslims and India by a Govt. maintained with the Indian taxpayers funds. This politically motivated fabrication of a police report utterly failed to acknowledge dozens of massacres that took place in Kashmir - among them the carnages that bloodied the mother earth at Sangrampora, Gool, Wandhama, Talwani, Brariangan, Pethibug, and Nandigam. It did not make even a casual mention of the Pandit lives lost in bomb blasts, cross fires, deliberate violence, arson, harshness imposed by refugee life, heat, lack of resources, sunstrokes, hypertension, cancer, skin & other diseases, snake and scorpion bites, abnormally high heart attacks and heart failures etc.

1) Hindu Institutions being destroyed at an unprecedented Scale:

The process of desecration, loot, vandalizing and destruction of temples has continued in J&K under the anti-Hindu Islamic rule through generations with intent to wipe out all traces of religious and cultural symbols of Hindus. These targets besides the temples included libraries, schools, universities and ashrams. After country became free and Kashmir acceded to the Union of India in 1947 the destruction and desecration of temples under the new Islamic regimes wearing secular turbans received added impetus and acceleration.

Temple lands, cremation grounds and other such entities belonging to Hindus were usurped and utilized for expansion of the Islamic populace. The famous Bhairavnath temple of Chattabal , Srinagar was locked up by the police. The judicial case pending in court concerning this temple was never allowed to be decided. Precious lands around Hari Parbat hill, Durganag temple of Srinagar and lands at several Hindu places of worship in the Valley were slowly and steadily turned into lands under occupation of the Muslim trusts (Maqboozai-Ahali- Islam).


2) The law and order situation in the Valley since 1986 deteriorated progressively and temple desecration became the order of the day. The Islamic fundamentalist conspiracy against Hindus received unqualified support from the Pan Islamic Movement and from across the border. Here are some of the glaring examples that defy and shred into a million pieces the tall claims made by the Muslim leaders of Kashmir about their dedication and adherence to nationalism, multiculturalism, secularism, Kashmiriyat and religious freedom.

In 1967, Shivala temple, Chotta Nazar, Srinagar was desecrated. Again in 1984 Shri Hanuman temple at Hari Singh High Street was damaged and in the same year Arya Samaj temple of Wazir Bagh , Srinagar was burnt down.

3) Temples desecrated and damaged in Kashmir from 1990 to December 1992

1. DASHNAMI AKHARA, SRINAGAR
2. GANPATYAR TEMPLE
3. RAGHUNATH MANDIR, SRINAGAR
4. SHIVA TEMPLE , JAWAHAR NAGAR, SRINAGAR
5. HANUMAN MANDIR, SRINAGAR
6. SHIVA TEMPLE , BARBAR SHAH, SRINAGAR
7. JAI DEVI TEMPLE , BIJBEHARA
8. VIJESHWAR TEMPLE , BIJBEHARA
9. SHIVA MANDIR, BIJBEHARA
10. RAGHUNATH TEMPLE , ANANTNAG
11. GAUTAM NAG TEMPLE , ANANTNAG
12. THREE TEMPLES OF LUKHBHAVAN, LARKIPURA, ANANTNAG
13. WANPOH MANDIR, ANANTNAG
14. SHAILPUTRI TEMPLE , BARAMULLA
15. DAYALGAM MANDIR, ANANTNAG
16. BHAIRAVANATH MANDIR, BARAMULLA
17. BHAIRAVANATH MANDIR, SOPORE
18. RUPABHAVANI MANDIR, VASAKURA
19. KHIRBHAVANI MANDIR, GANDERBAL
20. SHIVA TEMPLE , GANDERBAL
21. MATTAN TEMPLE , ANANTNAG

There have been reports of further destruction of some 39 temples in Kashmir after December 6, 1992 for which FIR were filed. Please note that FIRs on all destruction cases were not filed with the authorities in view of the complicity of the administration and warnings of retaliation against the complainants by the Islamic terrorists. According to local eye witnesses accounts there were additional 38 temples that were vandalized after December 6, 1992.

These examples represent only a fraction of the systematic mass destruction of thousands of temples in J&K after independence of India when the Islamists assumed the total and unfettered control of the state. These examples are listed in details in our letter of February 21, 2008 (may be seen on website: http://www.bharatja gran.com/ under the heading - “Massive destruction of temples in J&K and Talibanization of the state”).

4) What is difficult to understand is that when the Govt. re-built Cherar-e-Shareef why can’t it re-build Hindu temples destroyed in the wake of ethnic cleansing unleashed by the local and foreign Jihadists? The Indian Parliament adopted a law in 1991 specifically requiring that –“the status of religious places, as on August 15, 1947 shall be retained". Under the present circumstances it is obligatory upon the Govt. as envisaged by the above referred law to maintain the integrity of religious entities as it stood in 1947. The J&K Government while flouting the law of the national legislature very conveniently divorced itself from this commitment. As always, the Indian authorities looked the other way.

Hon'ble Chief Minister, government's indifference towards the temple security and their functioning can only be termed as its support to persecution of Hindus and denial of their freedom of religion: Govt. must realize that the temples and their endowments have been built over the centuries by our forefathers and therefore, it is the community which is their real owner. Therefore, it is the community which must have the final say in the management and utilization of temple resources and management of educational institution.

5) Given the militant exposition and expansionist designs of the majority community - the Hindus as a minority in J&K need & must get special protection: Your government’s recent order making it mandatory to obtain its approval for the sale and purchase of properties held by Hindu shrines and religious places is right on the mark. However, this is only an initial step to correct the situation that has been wronged over many decades. It must be followed by other appropriate administrative measures like formation of a Waqf- like Hindu Board for their protection, preservation, administration and development.

For maintaining the real religious autonomy the Hindu community must retain power to decide the future of its educational and religious institutions and not the antagonistic work force of the biased J&K Govt. Clearly under estimating the possibility of the prevailing anti-Hindu policies coming into play in their dealings, particularly when their personal faith teaches them that Hindus are the infidels and kafirs, will be a grievous mistake.

6) Formation of a Waqf like autonomous Hindu Board for Hindu institutions' governance under the Hindu community’s guidance is essential: Hon'ble Chief Minister, we strongly believe that for social, religious, educational and community affairs and services and temple administration there must be a representative but autonomous Hindu Board with full jurisdiction over temple governance and management. Since the right of freedom to manage religious places is available to the Muslim community which constitutes the majority in your state, where is the justification to deny this right to Hindus?

7) The Govt. must restore community’s vital role in temple and educational institutions management through Hindu Advisory Councils: Such Councils representing the community and its leaders could play an important role in oversight, day to day administration and decision making process of the endowments department and temple Trusts . Additionally these Councils should have full authority for asking the Govt. to take swift measures for stopping desecration and decimation of the Hindu religious and educational infrastructure and for bringing the culprits to book.

8) Chief Minister Azad, we hereby urge you to take prompt action for protecting Hindu educational institutions, temples and Hindu community properties from illegal sales and annul all such sales that took place after 1988 by declaring them as “sales under duress.” This will be in keeping with the norms and practices in all open and democratic societies; and the secular Constitution of India. Restoration of the DAV High School in Srinagar to community management should be a priority, before the School campus is demolished by its new but unlawful owners.

If this double standard and extremely discriminatory policy against Hindus in Kashmir is not reversed, you can be sure that it will eventually transcend the state boundaries and impact adversely the privileges enjoyed by the Muslims as a minority community in India . In that case they will have nobody to blame except their fellow religionists and the Muslim Govt. of Kashmir. It is also relevant to point out that almost all of the budgetary expenditures in the J&K state are gifted by the Indian Govt. with taxes mostly paid by Hindus. Surely these taxpayers do not fund the Kashmir Govt. so it could destroy the age old Hinduism and its infrastructure for realizing the forced talibanization of the state.

Thank you Mr. Chief Minister. We shall be looking forward to your response and prompt action towards resolving this highly explosive but easily solvable situation.

Sincerely,

Dr. Jagan Kaul
Krishan Bhatnagar
Hindu Jagran Forum ( USA )

email: krishan.kb@verizon. net
May 11, 2008

Note: This letter will soon be posted on website: http://www.bharatja gran.com/

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Attachment A

School building sold; students, teachers take to streets

The Tribune, Chandigarh

Friday, May 2, 2008,

Srinagar, May 1 : Traffic on the Srinagar airport road was today affected for an hour after students and teaching staff of DAV High School protested against the sale of school. The students and teaching staff of more than 60-year-old school today took to streets and blocked the main road at Magarmal Bagh.

Raising slogans against the school management, the students and teachers said the sale of the school building and its ground was illegal.

"Give us our school back," they demanded and appealed to authorities to intervene and save their future. They alleged that Kashmiri Pandit management without taking the parents and teaching staff into confidence had reportedly sold the school property. However, one person, who removed the school boards, said they have purchased the entire complex from the management. We have legal documents, including the sale deed, he said.

Hundreds of vehicles remained stranded for an hour as there was no police official. However, the traffic was allowed after a group of police personnel from Shergrahi police station reached the spot and assured the agitators that they would take the matter with the higher authorities. The DAV school was one of the leading schools before the Pandit management migrated from here after the eruption of militancy.

-- UNI

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Attachment B



Valley temple trusts now need Govt OK to sell their property
by Toufiq Rashid( Indian Express- May 01,2008)

SRINAGAR, MAY 1: In order to safeguard the religious institutions and shrines of Kashmiri Pandits in the Valley, the J&K Government has passed an order which makes it mandatory to seek the Government’s approval for the sale and purchase of such property.

The Government is also likely to investigate the deals so far and take action in three months.

The April 16, 2008 order has come following an inquiry report which reveals violations in the process of sale and purchase of land belonging to Pandit religious institutions in the Valley.

In most of the cases, the shrine managers have been found guilty. The properties include shops and land belonging to temple trusts.

“We had ordered an inquiry by the Settlement Commissioner of Jammu and Kashmir in February and found that there have been many cases where land and property of temples and other religious institutions of Kashmiri Pandits were sold by the mahants or temple managers. The order has been issued to safeguard these properties and put some checks and balances in place,” said Masaud Samoon, Secretary, Revenue, Jammu and Kashmir .

The J&K government passed an order stating that Deputy Commissioner of the area will be responsible for shrine properties. No sale deal can be registered without prior approval of the Deputy Commissioner of the concerned area. The order says that no revenue records should be issued to the mahants or managers of the shrine without the permission of the Deputy Commissioner.

The order states that any deal executed by any mahant or manager shall have to be attested by a Tehsildar after getting clearance from the Deputy Commissioner.

The issue was highlighted by a pressure group of Kashmiri Pandits who stayed back in the Valley after 1990. The group, Kashmiri Pandit Sangarsh Samiti, had even filed a case in the Jammu and Kashmir High Court demanding that all deals involving the temple properties after 1990 be cancelled and accounts of the trusts be sealed.